List Mgmt. 2018 St Kilda Trade Thread Part 2

[pebblesofsand]

My wife was listening to some psych podcast that had some stuff on self motivation and how controlling partners can rewire partners brains to be less self motivated and so I imagine leaders are similar. BJ probably wouldn't be a good leader for that reason. Perhaps our leaders were dominators not enablers?

Nail - head.

There's not much use in setting an example if you can't inspire the players to follow it.

Roo set exacting standards to get the best out of himself but you only had to watch his response to say a poor delivery to know he wasn't a classic leader like Hodgey.

So before anyone bags me for taking potshots at Roo - think back through your working life/have a look at our political sphere for the last 20 years - how many great (even good) leaders have you seen - I'll guess not very many - like I said - leadership is a tough gig.

 

[Mikka84]

Imo lycett is a significant upgrade on both hickey and longer. The biggest risk is his continuity of games but he's played all this year.

A Wet toast guy i speak to reckons he's ready to explode next year. They dont want to see him go i can assure you

It would come down to Gaff staying or going you’d think?

 

[bird_man]

I can't believe we're going to pay big for yet another ruckman. Gonna keep chasing that dragon all the way down.

He's a FA mate, he won't cost a thing on the trade table.

We've got money to burn so we'd be stupid not to go after him.

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[chris_h_11]

Here’s what we do....

Sign Lycett as a FA.

Trade Longer or Hickey back to WC for their 2nd rounder.

And the comeuppance for screwing us with Jamie Cripps is complete....

 

[pebblesofsand]

Lycett is a gun who doesn't get a lot of screen time or media exposure given he plays out West.
He is streets ahead of Hickey and Longer.
Get Lycett.
Trade one or both of Hickey, Longer.
Retain Pierce.

And above all, keep Pick 4

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Yeah Lycett is an interesting one. Clearly we are chasing him so what's the ruck structure going to look like next year. If Lewie plays like he played on Friday night what's the chances they try and trade both Hickey and Longer and go with just Lycett, Pierce and Marshall?

Lycett's main advantage is that he does also offer some offensive threat. Longer provides absolutely zilch and Hicks let himself down with his kicking.

 

[Yawkey way]

He's a FA mate, he won't cost a thing on the trade table.

We've got money to burn so we'd be stupid not to go after him.

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Personally I don’t think the saints should be making promises to anyone at present and I doubt they are.

Incoming staff may see things completely differently and there hasn’t been one player mentioned that’s a must have imo.

These guys also come at a cost if Hannebery, lycett and Menzel all came across on the figures being thrown around that’s a 2 million plus hit against our cap. With a hard cap nobody has money to burn.

If and it’s a big if I’ll grant you we’re in a bidding war next year I’d hate to have three plonkers cost us a jet.

We must sort out our off field situation first and then move on to the list imo.

 

[gringo2011]

Yes release your inner gringo2011 , gringo2011

He's pointing to the whole place being taken apart and a start again from a challenge.....if that isn't cause for any kind of concern we've been conditioned well through our history.

It doesn't sound bad really but the humiliation that comes with it and the turmoil sounds like a worry. I'm actually pretty non plussed about it, I'd like to know when it will happen though.

 

[gringo2011]

The Hanners deal reeks of desperation.
Good player but fmd really?

Lycett isn't a spud but he's in the same ground grown vegetable family.

Turnip?

 

[gringo2011]

Yeah Lycett is an interesting one. Clearly we are chasing him so what's the ruck structure going to look like next year. If Lewie plays like he played on Friday night what's the chances they try and trade both Hickey and Longer and go with just Lycett, Pierce and Marshall?

Lycett's main advantage is that he does also offer some offensive threat. Longer provides absolutely zilch and Hicks let himself down with his kicking.

Knowing our luck no one will want our 2 bananas and we will have 5 rucks on the books and get King who ends up there like Boyd did.

 

[gringo2011]

If we dont give away Pick4 for him i want.

Or a future first.

 

[The Enemy Within]

Imo lycett is a significant upgrade on both hickey and longer. The biggest risk is his continuity of games but he's played all this year.

A Wet toast guy i speak to reckons he's ready to explode next year. They dont want to see him go i can assure you

I think he will excel at being the number 1 ruck.

 

[gringo2011]

I can’t believe the negativity towards players we are chasing, we are sitting 15th on the ladder & were chasing players from better sides our supporter base never seems satisfied.

Hickey & Longer aren’t up to it & Pierse has had 1 good game in 5 years.

I for one just want to see change & an upgrade on players is a start.


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He's not elite though, I want an upgrade but it's a shame we won't be getting a Max Gawn or Brody Grundy. Rucks are about the most boring position on the ground unless they have a real dominance or other strings to their bow. Lycett is capable forward and capable in the ruck. He's kind of like a GOP to slightly above average rather than a star but I'd do it just to trade out our others. I can perfectly understand the lack of excitement for some, he's not Fyfe or Dusty. Gives us options though.

 

[The Enemy Within]

Personally I don’t think the saints should be making promises to anyone at present and I doubt they are.

Incoming staff may see things completely differently and there hasn’t been one player mentioned that’s a must have imo.

These guys also come at a cost if Hannebery, lycett and Menzel all came across on the figures being thrown around that’s a 2 million plus hit against our cap. With a hard cap nobody has money to burn.

If and it’s a big if I’ll grant you we’re in a bidding war next year I’d hate to have three plonkers cost us a jet.

We must sort out our off field situation first and then move on to the list imo.

What not talk to any managers at all fair enough we'll keep our list intact & draft 1 kid at number 4 ... yeah that improvement

 

[Diehard Saint]

I can’t believe the negativity towards players we are chasing, we are sitting 15th on the ladder & were chasing players from better sides our supporter base never seems satisfied.

Hickey & Longer aren’t up to it & Pierse has had 1 good game in 5 years.

I for one just want to see change & an upgrade on players is a start.


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We only want absolute A graders....you know all those players knocking the door down to come to us

As long as incoming players improve our side, without costing too much pick-wise we need to do it. We saw what happened last year, relying on “natural progression”.

 

[The Enemy Within]

He's not elite though, I want an upgrade but it's a shame we won't be getting a Max Gawn or Brody Grundy. Rucks are about the most boring position on the ground unless they have a real dominance or other strings to their bow. Lycett is capable forward and capable in the ruck. He's kind of like a GOP to slightly above average rather than a star but I'd do it just to trade out our others. I can perfectly understand the lack of excitement for some, he's not Fyfe or Dusty. Gives us options though.

Max Gawn was a spud for 5 season or more & has come good in the last 2 years he has been on Melb list for near on 10 years .

 

[gringo2011]

Personally I don’t think the saints should be making promises to anyone at present and I doubt they are.

Incoming staff may see things completely differently and there hasn’t been one player mentioned that’s a must have imo.

These guys also come at a cost if Hannebery, lycett and Menzel all came across on the figures being thrown around that’s a 2 million plus hit against our cap. With a hard cap nobody has money to burn.

If and it’s a big if I’ll grant you we’re in a bidding war next year I’d hate to have three plonkers cost us a jet.

We must sort out our off field situation first and then move on to the list imo.

Yeah I get that, still probably better to have some fingers in pies though. Lycett would be good if nothing else, Menzel okay. FA is a free hit really and we aren't really going to be attractive enough for superstars until we start playing finals. GWS are the only real issue, they have a heap coming out of contract next year and would be good to have money lying around.

 

[gringo2011]

Max Gawn was a spud for 5 season or more & has come good in the last 2 years he has been on Melb list for near on 10 years .

We've been waiting for our 2 to come good as well. I think Longer is quite a bit younger. Anyway, I'm not against it, more can see why people don't get excited. He's no marquee player, he's like swapping the Commodore for a Commodore with racing stripes.

 

[holllywood]

We won’t be getting a second for Hickey or Longer.

Ruckman trades in the past two years:

Lobbe for 93
Nankervis for 46
Witts for 44 and 62
Vardy for 72

Best we can hope for is a third for either of them.

 

[Yawkey way]

What not talk to any managers at all fair enough we'll keep our list intact & draft 1 kid at number 4 ... yeah that improvement

I didn’t say that, I said we shouldn’t be making promises.

With the very real possibility of major changes at st Kilda it would be a disaster if they are. You want to get managers offside then make promises and then have the club break them.

We need to just cool our jets there’s plenty of time between now and the trade period. People will be surprised as always by who ends up being available imo.

 

[pebblesofsand]

Personally I don’t think the saints should be making promises to anyone at present and I doubt they are.

Incoming staff may see things completely differently and there hasn’t been one player mentioned that’s a must have imo.

These guys also come at a cost if Hannebery, lycett and Menzel all came across on the figures being thrown around that’s a 2 million plus hit against our cap. With a hard cap nobody has money to burn.

If and it’s a big if I’ll grant you we’re in a bidding war next year I’d hate to have three plonkers cost us a jet.

We must sort out our off field situation first and then move on to the list imo.

Take your point but we have to spend some money and in reality it would only cost us the upgrade costs on the players we trade/delist. ($200K per player?)

Shouldn't adversely impact on our ability for a massive offer next year to some GWS star.

 

[kernelT]

I think people are going to be sorely disappointed in Lycett judging by their descriptions of him on here like "gun" and "huge upgrade on hickey"

45 goals in 70 matches, playing mainly forward is ordinary, 10 goals from 20 games this year in a very good side is rubbish.

Hard to judge his overall ruck numbers as he's been second fiddle but:

Percentage of hitouts won is 46% - average, made worse by the fact he has been rucking against 2nd ruck/fwds and midfielders.

Hitouts to advantage - 24% is putrid - Hickey goes at 34%

Lycett, Hanners & Menzel all with major durability concerns would cost us 2 million per year, I'm not convinced we would be a significantly better side.

 

[Yawkey way]

Take your point but we have to spend some money and in reality it would only cost us the upgrade costs on the players we trade/delist. ($200K per player?)

Shouldn't adversely impact on our ability for a massive offer next year to some GWS star.

Exactly it’s who’s going out and who’s coming in.

 

[Sir Skid]

We won’t be getting a second for Hickey or Longer.

Ruckman trades in the past two years:

Lobbe for 93
Nankervis for 46
Witts for 44 and 62
Vardy for 72

Best we can hope for is a third for either of them.

Stanley 21

 

[Yawkey way]

Turnip?

Kohlrabi same family as a cabbage.

 

[majortinkle]

He's not elite though, I want an upgrade but it's a shame we won't be getting a Max Gawn or Brody Grundy. Rucks are about the most boring position on the ground unless they have a real dominance or other strings to their bow. Lycett is capable forward and capable in the ruck. He's kind of like a GOP to slightly above average rather than a star but I'd do it just to trade out our others. I can perfectly understand the lack of excitement for some, he's not Fyfe or Dusty. Gives us options though.

I bet Tiger fans were saying the same with Nankervis - he's at the right age to make a big step with increased opportunity.

If we could turn our two rucks into a single second rounder I'd be happy. That our PP and pick 4 means we stand a decent chance of drafting talent without doing anything drastic with our list that we might regret.