List Mgmt. 2021 List Management
- Thread starter The Old Dark Navy's
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- Sep 19, 2019
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And the least ability to defend tall forwards given our dearth of KPDs.
- Sep 25, 2013
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Oscar is fine KPD backup. Doesn’t have to distribute like Weiters or fly over packs like Jones. He’s good enough to break even with the second best tall for 3-4 weeks at a time. Anything longer and most clubs are struggling.
This also allows Casboult to cover Charlie and still gives us a second ruck option instead of plonking him at FB where he cannot be moved.
I’m on the McDonald bandwagon. Maher a close second because I like his upside but happier to cover needs first.
This also allows Casboult to cover Charlie and still gives us a second ruck option instead of plonking him at FB where he cannot be moved.
I’m on the McDonald bandwagon. Maher a close second because I like his upside but happier to cover needs first.
Wickzki
Definitely Sam MacLure.
- Oct 1, 2010
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Who we going to replace at midyear if the hope is for Charlie and Kemp to comeback?
Thinking someone will be out for the year by then?
Do you contingency plan on the worst-case scenario?
If this a 2 year deal I wait mid year for best available
1 year deal ime fifty fifty
Interesting thought but what’s the chances the recruiting team recruited they way they did with the knowledge the game was going to go this way.
quick half backs with good disposal may become highly sort After with the new rule changes...makes key forwards and good defensive interceptors more valuable aswell.
quick half backs with good disposal may become highly sort After with the new rule changes...makes key forwards and good defensive interceptors more valuable aswell.
Right now we need spine cover, especially down back, that's a non negotiable for me.
There will always be LTI's and if not we can address our spine further, end of year
- Aug 22, 2014
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It's a "this season only" deal with first right of refusal to add the player to our list for next season.
I'm not as convinced on keeping a spot for the mid-season draft and expecting to get a bolter. If we perform the way we're expecting to, we could have a pick somewhere in the 8-12 range in that mid-season draft. Assume a few clubs don't have spots, maybe pick 6-10.
Do we really think there are going to be 6-10+ kids who didn't get drafted who somehow become absolute jets in the reserves leagues? Doubtful. Maybe two or three, and even then I doubt they'll be the kind of quality people seem to be dreaming about unearthing.
The club has shifted in mindset, from development and stockpiling of talent to winning enough games of footy to make finals, and then start winning finals.
An 18 or 19yo who was rated behind 59 National Draft picks, 20 Rookie Draft picks (26 actual rookie picks, but a few Gibbs/Goldsack outliers), however many preseason SSP picks, and then 6-10 mid-season draft picks? That player does not help us win games, and they're going to have an incredibly slim chance of making the cut in the long term given our list in a few years is already potentially going to be filled by:
Plowman, Weitering, Docherty
Saad, Kemp, SPS
Setterfield, Walsh, Williamson
TDK, Cripps, Williams
Martin, Curnow, Fisher
XXXXX, McKay, XXXXX
I/C: Dow, Stocker, XXXXX, XXXXX
I've got 4 spots in out future 22. And names like JSOS, LOB, Fogarty, McGovern, Carroll, Marchbank, Newman, Parks, Cuningham, Durdin, Newnes, Ramsay, Philp, Honey, Gibbons and Cottrell being the pool we're drawing from.
We do need to keep cycling some kids in over the years, sure. But do that from the pointier end of the draft as much as possible and use the SSP and mid-season drafts to plug gaps in the depth profile of our list to insure us against injury.
Weiters goes down in the first month of the season and we're swinging Casboult back? That leaves McKay one-out in the forward line. Leave Casboult forward and elevate Marchbank to play on a KPF? That KPF is going to have fun, assuming Marchy is even fit.
McDonald isn't a sexy pick. He's not meant to be. He's positional coverage and has reasonable exposed form at the top level. We can't park a Harris Andrews or a young Harry Taylor in the reserves just in case.
Metalcrusher
A God Amongst The People
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Ffs just the thumbs up would have done ....
- Aug 22, 2014
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Writing it up helps me self-critique it
Won't lie, there have been times I've been writing a post and then convinced myself I was actually wrong in the process
Being flexible in your thoughts keeps you young in a good wayWriting it up helps me self-critique it
Won't lie, there have been times I've been writing a post and then convinced myself I was actually wrong in the process
If all of our 3 ruck options are out I would rather see Jones ruck and McDonald play KPD than Moore ruck.
People say Marchy isn't a KPD but I don't think we have seen enough of him to know what he is. I don't think his size is an issue as plenty of backs are the same size (Rance,Grimes)
- Aug 22, 2014
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The more relevant question for Marchbank isn't whether he is or is not a KPP, it's whether he is or is not available for selection. Think he's going to have to put together a month or more of full games at reserves level before we can trust him to run out a senior game.
- May 1, 2016
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- #214
Makes me wonder how Brad Johnson would've gone these days, if he'd have gotten drafted.
TheKITC
Cancelled
I think it's a very interesting debate that's going on here regarding our last list spot.
Moore would be the "Mr. Fix It" option if s**t hits the fan in a number of spots. I don't see him being good enough long term as a KP or 3rd tall at either end, although I don't mind what I've seen from him as that Shaun Grigg ruck/inside mid option; both in ressies matches last year (kicked 6 goals from the ruck?) and against Essendon. McDonald is clearly break glass in case of KPD emergency, with the consensus seemingly that is he not really AFL standard (I agree). Maher is the young bloke with upside, albeit wasn't drafted. Personally, I do not see the sense is giving it to Crocker, just seems to be a bog average battler who has deficiencies and plays position(s) we don't really need depth in. Was delisted from the worst side in the comp a year after he was chopped by another side. VFL A grader, AFL D grader.
Then there is the thought that the mid-season draft could have plenty of options regarding 19 year olds who "fell through the cracks" because of COVID interruptions. I am brewing a serious case of FOMO regarding this if we don't have a list spot. I don't actually expect us to have a great pick in the MSD (fingers crossed) but I genuinely think there could be a handful + of players out there that will come on very strongly that weren't given the normal path to being drafted due to the shitstorm that was 2020. I'm not suggesting there will be a Bontempelli or Oliver type who just comes from the clouds in their last season of underage footy still left on the shelf, but I'm also not ruling it out either. Seriously.
I know I've banged on about it in the past, but Oliver's rise was truly amazing and he would still be out there if 2020 was his draft year. The imbeciles at the Bendigo Pioneers gave him the chop and if it wasn't for his own gumption and going to play for the Bushrangers, he would probably be a chunky bloke playing for the Shepparton Swans right now. He was not even an outside chance before his final underage season. Bontempelli would have been drafted I believe, but it would have been late in the draft from memory. There will be players out there... To muddy the waters even further, maybe we already have one training with us now in Maher.
Moore would be the "Mr. Fix It" option if s**t hits the fan in a number of spots. I don't see him being good enough long term as a KP or 3rd tall at either end, although I don't mind what I've seen from him as that Shaun Grigg ruck/inside mid option; both in ressies matches last year (kicked 6 goals from the ruck?) and against Essendon. McDonald is clearly break glass in case of KPD emergency, with the consensus seemingly that is he not really AFL standard (I agree). Maher is the young bloke with upside, albeit wasn't drafted. Personally, I do not see the sense is giving it to Crocker, just seems to be a bog average battler who has deficiencies and plays position(s) we don't really need depth in. Was delisted from the worst side in the comp a year after he was chopped by another side. VFL A grader, AFL D grader.
Then there is the thought that the mid-season draft could have plenty of options regarding 19 year olds who "fell through the cracks" because of COVID interruptions. I am brewing a serious case of FOMO regarding this if we don't have a list spot. I don't actually expect us to have a great pick in the MSD (fingers crossed) but I genuinely think there could be a handful + of players out there that will come on very strongly that weren't given the normal path to being drafted due to the shitstorm that was 2020. I'm not suggesting there will be a Bontempelli or Oliver type who just comes from the clouds in their last season of underage footy still left on the shelf, but I'm also not ruling it out either. Seriously.
I know I've banged on about it in the past, but Oliver's rise was truly amazing and he would still be out there if 2020 was his draft year. The imbeciles at the Bendigo Pioneers gave him the chop and if it wasn't for his own gumption and going to play for the Bushrangers, he would probably be a chunky bloke playing for the Shepparton Swans right now. He was not even an outside chance before his final underage season. Bontempelli would have been drafted I believe, but it would have been late in the draft from memory. There will be players out there... To muddy the waters even further, maybe we already have one training with us now in Maher.
The issue we have is that we cut 4 talls from our list last year and we have 3 that haven't played in the last 12 months and are likely to be out for another 3. We desperately need a boost to our tall stocks.
Unlike previous years we have more mids than we need on the list. We don't need to add another as promising as Maher may be. Hopefully the lists will return to previous levels next year
Lost count how many times this has come up. It's not so much Marchbank's height, he doesn't have the burst or the natural aggression of a Grimes type.
Will only ever be a 3rd tall interceptor
Than is a pretty definite opinion based on where Marchy was at as a 22yr old that hadn't been asked to play as 1st or 2nd KPD.
Marchbank would be quicker than Weitering and Grimes, at 22 wasn't a regular in the Tigers side (established himself in 2014).
I think if he can get on the park, Marchy can be much more than just a 3rd tall defender.
He is not quicker than Grimes, nor does he have the aggressiveness, JMO of course
- Aug 22, 2014
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I think the main problem I have with this line of thought is that it is based very strongly on hope and FOMO, and this dream of a Clayton Oliver type kid having gone undrafted last year and then somehow lasting to our first pick in the mid season draft. It seems to me that it is the longest of long shots.
It would have to be a player who was so far down the list as to have been overlooked at 80ish picks last year, who in the space of half a season develops into a first-round quality selection. And we probably need more than half a dozen kids to do it for one of them to be available at our pick. And these kids weren't just hidden away last year, they missed an entire year of footy. The most committed, professional and hard working kids, who stuck to their own personal programs during lockdown, will have already risen to the higher end of last years draft crop. I think it's more likely the ones who didn't get picked up are the ones who simply aren't good enough, or didn't work hard enough, and ergo aren't likely to see a meteoric rise in the next 3 months.
2019 it was Kyle Dunkley - if I remember right there were folks talking him up as though he was basically an early Christmas present. "Take him now cause he'd be a first rounder next year as an over-ager" type stuff. How's that panned out? Delisted a season and a half later and picked up as a reserves player by Essendon.
This idea of picking up the next Oliver or Bont in the mid season draft is a pipe dream. It'll happen at some point as the exception that proves the rule, but if we have an opportunity to improve our list for the now then that is the percentage play, not sitting on our hands and hoping that a miracle occurs.
- Aug 22, 2014
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You only think that cause you haven't seen him in his new motorized scooter.
- Moderator
- #222
Carlton set to play Oscar McDonald against Saints as he vies for spot
Former Melbourne defender Oscar McDonald is expected to line up for Carlton against St Kilda in Thursday night’s Community Series match as he vies for a spot on the Blues’ list
TheKITC
Cancelled
I'm not saying I totally disagree with your post, because there is some merit in what you say. What I think you are doing though is overlooking the fact that 2020 will be a totally unique year. The Kyle Dunkley example is not really relevant because he didn't miss a year along with his whole crop; his form was exposed form and the recruiters knew more about him and his peers. This will be a really unique situation, one that will probably never happen again (let's bloody hope).
I will reiterate though that I feel there will be a handful of kids who may have got drafted if they were given their top-age year, perhaps more. We have seen it time and time again that 17 years old is when some blokes can really come on from out of nowhere and stop being outperformed by the 'man childs' or existing guns in their age group. Perhaps using the elite examples of Oliver and Bont was a bit of a mistake, I do agree someone of that quality at our likely pick could be remote but not wildly out of the question.
Will Powell is perhaps a more 'realistic' example. He was basically off the map and ended up being a late first rounder and is tracking along nicely in his career. There is almost 0% chance he gets drafted without his top-age year. Tom Doedee is another good one, same story. Mitch Georgiades (unproven) Jayden Hunt (school footy, didn't make TAC cup) Nakia Cockatoo (injuries leave him unproven) all fit the bill, as do probably countless ruckman. Brodie Grundy was largely unthought of as a good prospect, our very own Patrick Cripps probably goes quite late-rookie if not for his last year where he grew significantly which is well documented. Who knows what happens to the latter two guns if they miss their top-age year?
I get what you're saying, but I don't think it's as big of a stretch as you may think it is that there will be really good players found in the MSD.
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Mid-season draft preferred for mine.
A player similar to Parks or Highmore, a league footballer with promise that could be added to the list and plug some holes on list management side of things in advance of the draft.
A player similar to Parks or Highmore, a league footballer with promise that could be added to the list and plug some holes on list management side of things in advance of the draft.
- Nov 27, 2016
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Could be anything
