Coach 2022 Coaching

[Klaatu]

Can't see on TV, but it seemed our wingers weren't coming in off the square or running to where they thought we would win it. Every time they won the ball they fed it out to an extra that had come from outside the square.
When we did win it in the second half, our outside runners were under much more pressure.

Spot on our wingers played defensive side of the centre , were as Collingwoods played direct of the centre and got in there faster, also Grundy was better at ground level when it become contested he alone dished out many a handballs to his mids in there.

Ro played ok but he was gassed in the last Qtr.

 

[Saintbloke]

Our flaws were so bloody obvious against Collingwood, that when the football dept watch the replay, they should be embarrassed. Badly planned, poorly executed game.

 

[Mowman]

The context was within the next 2-4 years.
I think Nas, Owens and Windy look good prospects that can have a positive effect within that timeframe and l don't see scope for wholesale changes to the list again. That would be suicide for the club and isn't necessary anyway.
My biggest concern right now is the coaching. We just don't look like a professional outfit on the field and rarely have.

Agree
We just don’t seem a professional outfit we fumble our way from one thing to another

 

[Klaatu]

Owens wasn't ready either not his fault but he does need more development in the 2's was lost at centre clearance.

I still think it's attitude and application that's the issue & that comes down to coaches getting that side of it right, you should never underestimate your opponent & Ratts uses this excuse time & time again.

 

[gringo2011]

The small forward is probably Snags.

Bytel, Clark, Owens, Windy, Sincs bolster the midfield albeit a mature A grader is highly desirable.

Agree we need an old fashioned KPD, I'd like to see Joyce given a go to just to see the overall effect, not that he's the answer going forward.

Sincs is the only immediate upgrade, the others are all speculative maybes. Clark probably the exception.

I think Joyce is a good player. I'd happily play him in that role. He can play tall but still handy below his knees.

Snags worry is he's probably a bit in-between. He's not a slippery or defensive small forward. He more a cross between Stevie J and Membrey. He ideally develops a bit of a midfield game because he is a bit one dimensional if not and it would let us rest Gresham in the forward line.

 

[stavro#4]

Can't see on TV, but it seemed our wingers weren't coming in off the square or running to where they thought we would win it. Every time they won the ball they fed it out to an extra that had come from outside the square.
When we did win it in the second half, our outside runners were under much more pressure.

I saw us doing a lot of this on TV. Just inviting collingwood to have its way with us.

 

[plugger66]

It gets Sharman back in at least.

So we move a genuine B plus player just so you get in a guy who ewasnt rated good enough this week but at least he is in. The biggest certainty ever is not playing a 7th defender. It’s old fashioned rubbish footy and isn’t needed because every sides has six mids at every contest bar the centre bounce now

 

[gringo2011]

So we move a genuine B plus player just so you get in a guy who ewasnt rated good enough this week but at least he is in. The biggest certainty ever is not playing a 7th defender. It’s old fashioned rubbish footy and isn’t needed because every sides has six mids at every contest bar the centre bounce now

To be fair Ratts is a simple man trying to make a simple game more complex. His selecting sides to take on a bottom 4 side and over-plan for them was comical. You've said yourself that there were some mistakes in the side picked. You get rid of a guy that's 3 goals might have made the difference to plan for Collingwood who had their way with us anyway.

We bombed crap all over the forwards and the way Sharman plays would have suited exactly the way the ball came in. It wasn't like our smalls held the ball in anyway.

 

[ScrappyDo]

Sincs is the only immediate upgrade, the others are all speculative maybes. Clark probably the exception.

I think Joyce is a good player. I'd happily play him in that role. He can play tall but still handy below his knees.

Snags worry is he's probably a bit in-between. He's not a slippery or defensive small forward. He more a cross between Stevie J and Membrey. He ideally develops a bit of a midfield game because he is a bit one dimensional if not and it would let us rest Gresham in the forward line.

Nothings going to make a major difference over night unless we get some players back. We NEED Jones, Clark and Bytel in the side for structure and balance. Otherwise we're a very naff bottom 4 midfield.

 

[gringo2011]

Nothings going to make a major difference over night unless we get some players back. We NEED Jones, Clark and Bytel in the side for structure and balance. Otherwise we're a very naff bottom 4 midfield.

Jones is still the only proven best 22 mid there. The others are still in development but at least Hunts had a very good last game there.

 

[stavro#4]

Jones is still the only proven best 22 mid there. The others are still in development but at least Hunts had a very good last game there.

Hunter is clearly a best 22 mid.

His best is match winning good.

 

[ScrappyDo]

Jones is still the only proven best 22 mid there. The others are still in development but at least Hunts had a very good last game there.

Yes that's a given, but what else you gonna do for this season.
Clark and Bytel are the two most talented young mids we have so there's not much alternative but to put games in to them, though more than happy to give Owens another crack. I thought he was closer than his stats would suggest.

I'd be putting Sinclair in there too and moving Hill back to his wing then filling the defense holes with actual defenders since we have Leo, Lienert, Pato, Jweb and Highmore to choose from. Having rebounders is important, but not as important as being able to defend or win in the middle.

You've mentioned a few times lately that you think Ratts has been trying to be too clever and I reckon there's definitely an element of that in it.

 

[plugger66]

To be fair Ratts is a simple man trying to make a simple game more complex. His selecting sides to take on a bottom 4 side and over-plan for them was comical. You've said yourself that there were some mistakes in the side picked. You get rid of a guy that's 3 goals might have made the difference to plan for Collingwood who had their way with us anyway.

We bombed crap all over the forwards and the way Sharman plays would have suited exactly the way the ball came in. It wasn't like our smalls held the ball in anyway.

To be fair that is a pathetic comment about our coach. Let’s face you know nothing about him and all of us here I reckon we wouldn’t have a clue about game plan or style. Yes I said he made a mistake in selection but that is just hindsight rubbish by me. If you want to mention posters as having some credibility to an argument then more wanted owens picked than Hayes. How did that go. Just out of interest do you honestly want membery back? Completely crazy stuff

 

[Premium]

To be fair that is a pathetic comment about our coach. Let’s face you know nothing about him and all of us here I reckon we wouldn’t have a clue about game plan or style. Yes I said he made a mistake in selection but that is just hindsight rubbish by me. If you want to mention posters as having some credibility to an argument then more wanted owens picked than Hayes. How did that go. Just out of interest do you honestly want membery back? Completely crazy stuff

Usually when you get hammered in the middle you have little chance of winning , at least Ratten attempted to fix that up and with some luck got us into the game.

Also when a team loses the heat gets put onto the coach but really the players are meant to play to a system and the were out played meaning we were unable to play to our game plan meaning the coach had to make adjustments which he did.
So to me the coach did his job.
Not until we start winning the ball more from the middle from the other team will we see the full potential of the team.
Hopefully we can improve our midfield and from there we have a chance.
The positives are Marshall looks to be getting back to his best , Gresham improved as the game went on and will only be better for the run , Sinclair gave us momentum , Steele and Crouch put in there usual solid efforts - though Crouch was beaten on the day.
I would like to know where Bytel is and hopefully Jones comes good soon.

A coach is as only good as his cattle and that game the cattle didn't play to there best of there ability.

 

[Premium]

Yes that's a given, but what else you gonna do for this season.
Clark and Bytel are the two most talented young mids we have so there's not much alternative but to put games in to them, though more than happy to give Owens another crack. I thought he was closer than his stats would suggest.

I'd be putting Sinclair in there too and moving Hill back to his wing then filling the defense holes with actual defenders since we have Leo, Lienert, Pato, Jweb and Highmore to choose from. Having rebounders is important, but not as important as being able to defend or win in the middle.

You've mentioned a few times lately that you think Ratts has been trying to be too clever and I reckon there's definitely an element of that in it.

To me if Highmore is ready to play he should be the intercept defender , he has the marking ability to do it.
Let Sinclair rotate through the middle from halfback and get Hill back on the wing.
With Highmore , Battle , Sinclair , Webster across halfback we should be fine.
Hill looks like a player when we are winning but when the backline is under pressure he is hopeless.
Get him back to the position he has played his whole career and if he doesn't perform let him play at Sandringham until he does.

 

[ScrappyDo]

To me if Highmore is ready to play he should be the intercept defender , he has the marking ability to do it.
Let Sinclair rotate through the middle from halfback and get Hill back on the wing.
With Highmore , Battle , Sinclair , Webster across halfback we should be fine.
Hill looks like a player when we are winning but when the backline is under pressure he is hopeless.
Get him back to the position he has played his whole career and if he doesn't perform let him play at Sandringham until he does.

Agreed. It all still keeps coming back to Hill messing up the defense selections.

 

[Premium]

Agreed. It all still keeps coming back to Hill messing up the defense selections.

I know Ratten has close ties to Hill through the Hawks and they invested a lot to get him but if he doesn't get his act together he needs be dropped and show everyone if you play seniors you have to perform.
Last year we didn't have replacements , this year we do.
Hill has a couple more games to show his worth and it needs to be on a wing.
I should not just pick out Hill because he is not the only one however we also have to give the team a few games to get there act together and then have a good look who isn't contributing.

 

[gringo2011]

Hunter is clearly a best 22 mid.

His best is match winning good.

He's probably played less than 6 matches as a full time mid. If he's a set in stone best 22 mid then we have heaps.

 

[chris_h_11]

A coach is as only good as his cattle and that game the cattle didn't play to there best of there ability.

There comes a point where "not playing to their ability" is a coach problem.

IMO one of the main jobs of the coach is to create a team that is more than the sum of it's parts. This relates to structure, game plan, effort and the "buy-in". 2020 we made some progress here, but on Friday I didn't see anything to suggest 2022 is going to be any better than 2021. Personnel-wise, pretty much all of our best 22 now were at the club in 2020 (only Higgins & Crouch have joined since), but Ratts isn't delivering the rest of what makes a successful team.

 

[Premium]

There comes a point where "not playing to their ability" is a coach problem.

IMO one of the main jobs of the coach is to create a team that is more than the sum of it's parts. This relates to structure, game plan, effort and the "buy-in". 2020 we made some progress here, but on Friday I didn't see anything to suggest 2022 is going to be any better than 2021. Personnel-wise, pretty much all of our best 22 now were at the club in 2020 (only Higgins & Crouch have joined since), but Ratts isn't delivering the rest of what makes a successful team.

After one game this season you have written him off - 1st season he made finals - last season with massive amount of players unavailable we only just missed the 8 - we lose the first game and the coach is the problem.
Also structure gets thrown out the door when the midfield is getting flogged at least he made changes to get us back into the game.
No coach is perfect , but I'd rather him than a lot of others.

 

[stavro#4]

After one game this season you have written him off - 1st season he made finals - last season with massive amount of players unavailable we only just missed the 8 - we lose the first game and the coach is the problem.
Also structure gets thrown out the door when the midfield is getting flogged at least he made changes to get us back into the game.
No coach is perfect , but I'd rather him than a lot of others.

If we miss finals this season. Which is our stated aim according to the club president.

What are the reasons to keep him on?

Because you can’t argue we are improving. The benchmark was set in his first season. He now has a better list.

So it is only fair to judge him on outcomes.

 

[Premium]

He's probably played less than 6 matches as a full time mid. If he's a set in stone best 22 mid then we have heaps.

Clark is not a proven mid and will have to play way more games to prove he is and atm he is battling to stay uninjured.
Playing well as a halfback has not proved he is a midfielder.
Carlton recruited Zac Williams to be a midfielder off the back of a good finals game and he proved he far from a good midfielder on a constant basis.
Hopefully Clark can get a few games in to prove he is , Gresham is only starting to show he is a mid now after a long time and he still needs more time at it.
We miss Jones and Bytel needs to starting playing - I don't know if he even played for Sandringham the other day.
We know one thing Sinclair improved the midfield.

 

[Premium]

If we miss finals this season. Which is our stated aim according to the club president.

What are the reasons to keep him on?

Because you can’t argue we are improving. The benchmark was set in his first season. He now has a better list.

So it is only fair to judge him on outcomes.

Totally agree , if we don't make finals for sure look for a replacement and even he would know that.
A top 4 position would only make him safe.
But after one game get real.
The Cats lost last year the the previous years woodenspooner's in the first game
Lions lost there first game against the Swans in the first game.
Both these teams made the 4 last year.

 

[borderbarry]

Clark would be our most promising young mid. Now it ia up to the coaches to bring him on, they can only do this by playing him in the midfield. The same with Sharman, he is a forward for heavens sake, stop trying to make him into a defender or ruck.

 

[stavro#4]

Totally agree , if we don't make finals for sure look for a replacement and even he would know that.
A top 4 position would only make him safe.
But after one game get real.
The Cats lost last year the the previous years woodenspooner's in the first game
Lions lost there first game against the Swans in the first game.
Both these teams made the 4 last year.

I guess people judge the season in blocks.

3-1 is kinda of where we need to be by round 4. The 5/6 that follow are tough.

Freo in Freo.
Richmond in a similar boat to us.
Then the Hawks at the G.

You don’t want to be too far back by the mid season point. But it isn’t like we are about to walk into any easier games then Friday night was.