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Coach 2022 Coaching

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plugger66 said:
To be fair that is a pathetic comment about our coach. Let’s face you know nothing about him and all of us here I reckon we wouldn’t have a clue about game plan or style. Yes I said he made a mistake in selection but that is just hindsight rubbish by me. If you want to mention posters as having some credibility to an argument then more wanted owens picked than Hayes. How did that go. Just out of interest do you honestly want membery back? Completely crazy stuff
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I get vibes about people and I think those that go in to bat for the simple are probably sensitive about it for a reason my friend.

I don't want Membrey back but if we are trying a few new things I'm not against it. One thing that Richo taught us was that doing the same thing over and over for the same result isn't going to create momentum.
 
stavro#4 said:
If we miss finals this season. Which is our stated aim according to the club president.

What are the reasons to keep him on?

Because you can’t argue we are improving. The benchmark was set in his first season. He now has a better list.

So it is only fair to judge him on outcomes.
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agree 100% with this
But he shouldn't be the only one looked at
instead the man who has made a lot of these calls ( Ratts - Hannabury - Hill ) has been promoted SL
 
borderbarry said:
Clark would be our most promising young mid. Now it ia up to the coaches to bring him on, they can only do this by playing him in the midfield.
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Yeah this is the year Clark should dominate, he's not so young anymore. 23 in a few days time. Make or break time as a midfielder.
 
gringo2011 said:
I get vibes about people and I think those that go in to bat for the simple are probably sensitive about it for a reason my friend.

I don't want Membrey back but if we are trying a few new things I'm not against it. One thing that Richo taught us was that doing the same thing over and over for the same result isn't going to create momentum.
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Richardson had no chance as a coach , he came in to a team with aging stars and a lot of very average players and just about every trade period they had the never found a star - even though we did pick up some good players but not enough.
The difference between Richo and Ratten is Ratten has be helped in culling the list and bringing a younger squad with upgrades to some senior members.
Bruce / King
Brown / Howard
Longer / Ryder
Newnes / Hill
Acres / Butler
Weller / Higgins
Dunstan / Crouch
Carlisle / Wilkie

This is only a small sample but you can see it is quite a big upgrade and then add on the kids we picked up this year and all of the 3 we picked up in the draft look more promising than just about any of the picks in Richardson's tenure.
 

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Premium said:
We hope he does, but lets just remember Pettracca didn't come good until he was 24 the same as Parish - not every kid is like a Walsh.
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Going back a bit but I remember players like Joey, Goddard taking a long time to come good as well.

The problem is we Saints fans have had a gutful of waiting for success and players to come good.

We probably lose a bit of perspective because of that
 
g_TRAIN said:
Going back a bit but I remember players like Joey, Goddard taking a long time to come good as well.

The problem is we Saints fans have had a gutful of waiting.
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We all have , but what hurts is when we give them the time and they crater like McCartin or even Coffield and Clark getting major injuries when they are at the age to produce and you can even add Gresham to that list and maybe even Marshall because the last 2 yrs have been injury riddled.
Dunstan was the classic , we waited for him to become the player we wanted and after 8yrs de-list him.
Acres the same.
 
Munga said:
Yeah this is the year Clark should dominate, he's not so young anymore. 23 in a few days time. Make or break time as a midfielder.
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Premium said:
We hope he does, but lets just remember Pettracca didn't come good until he was 24 the same as Parish - not every kid is like a Walsh.
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g_TRAIN said:
Going back a bit but I remember players like Joey, Goddard taking a long time to come good as well.
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Whereas Dunstan came good in Game 1 and then proceeded to develop into a constipated crab over the course of the next few years.
 
The issue with fans judging coaches is that we are too tied up in the emotion. Winners are grinners and that's basically what we base everything off.

I mean after this latest loss we have people saying "we need to scrap the deadwood and play the kids" and also "why did Ratts get rid of Dunstan we need him?" They are literally opposing views but both sets of people are saying the coach is crap.

I see people saying Ratts is Richo 2.0, I don't see the similarity but from a winning perspective Ratts is already better than Richo because he made finals and even when we didn't make finals we were able to beat top sides which we basically could never do under Richo.

It sucks to lose no doubt, but that round one loss was nothing compared to some of the debacles of last year. Yes it was very disappointing but to write off the coach or say he needs to be sacked after that is crazy.

We need to give him time. His contract is up at the end of the year and some people hold out hope of Clarkson, I just don't see any way that that happens and besides I've seen us sign glamour coaches before and it made things worse. A lot of the time people want a shiny new coach because they think it will magically make us better. People saying that McRae is a better coach after one game, honestly there is no way we can know that yet.

Coaches are basically crap until they're good. See Hardwick, see Goodwin. Both would have had similar threads to this on their club boards.

I've seen many coaches get sacked and it has rarely helped our cause. Ratten took a team that hadn't won a final in a decade to a finals win in his first year. With the injuries we have now he has a huge challenge on his hands but surely we are all hoping he and the team can rise to it, but besides that if we do lose a few games are we really going to all come in here and kick Ratts each week? Seems like a monumental waste of time.
 
The big risk for a coach is to become predictable in what kind of plan you play to and how you use players- it's something that the opposition can then use to their advantage. Richo became too predictable in all respects, and the style Ratts brought in in 2020 was good for us then, got us into a final but Geelong did pick it apart and sat on our runners and slowed the game down, and that was picked up by other coaches.
I don't think Ratts has tweaked it much and it's obvious how to strangle us. Our game will still work OK, but we need everyone on board to be working as a team and we just didn't get that against Collingwood.
 
bird_man said:
It makes a lot more sense just to bring in Highmore for the role as the 7th defender rather than take away Membrey from the forward line
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Especially with our desperately poor midfield. Persist with Battle down back but we need to give him and the others in the defence more support.
 

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Premium said:
We hope he does, but lets just remember Pettracca didn't come good until he was 24 the same as Parish - not every kid is like a Walsh.
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I think Parish was 23 but Hunter looked good before injury playing mid. Which is what made Parish step up too.
 
I wonder what the tipping point might be for the Saints admin to pull the trigger and abort the mission, refresh coaching group and in that scenario do they hope that a new coach can get the playing group to fulfil its percieved potential or dump/trade all non-essential players and set for a hard rebuild.

I suppose they will definitely let Ratten see out his contract to avoid scandal, so like it or lump it we've got the Ra-Ra version of Saints Footy, (by which I mean Rath-Ratten)

But I wonder how bad things would actually have to go for us to sack him early? It would have to even be more than certs for the spoon in June I think. I'm talking player in-fighting, wanting out, that kind of drama.

Let's hope we don't veer anywhere near that neighbourhood. At this stage I don't put anything past us. We could get correct and storm into the 4, as per my off-season prediction, but the entire AFL community thinks we'll be shit this year, most of the fans on here think we're shit, so as hard as it is for me to conceive, it might be time for me to work on the assumption that maybe we're not going to do great things in 2022.

Sick of it frankly.

Every decision we have made for donkeys years, seems to be weird and needing to be justified (rather than boring and obvious and failsafe) and not without merit but so much downside:
  • Lovett
  • Seaford
  • Not giving Lyon financial security, letting him get his head turned
  • Hiring Scott Watters then realising what he was
  • Hiring Alan Richardson instead of Mark Williams
  • Letting Pelchen have his way with us
  • Letting Trout dictate what the make up of our club should be
  • Drafting Billings and McCartin
  • Trading pick 5 for Carlisle and Gresham
  • Drafting Clark and Coffield when we wanted mids
  • Alternating between Hickey and Longer
  • Trading a 2RDP for Nathan Freeman, keeping him injured on the list for years then delisting him after a few games
  • Trading in a bunch of picks to secure Clavarino and Austin
  • Extending Richo's contract
  • Letting Adam Kingsley go and keeping Richo
  • Bringing in Hannebury on a massive contract, despite injury concerns
  • Bringing in all of Alistair Clarkson's support staff
  • Trading pick 6 for Hill, Howard and probably Paddy came as a result of that
  • Drafting Allison as a long-term prospect forward, then turning him into a backman
  • Bringing in Paddy Ryder and Zac Jones, despite injury concerns
  • Trading in Brad Crouch instead of Jye Caldwell
  • That's without all the things we didn't do, like trying to move up in the draft order by trading good players, trading out Armitage, Steven or Ross when they had some market value, developing certain players properly, retaining players like McCartin, Hind, and Parker, giving Luke Beverage a job sooner before the Bulldogs would be ready to find a new head coach, approaching upcoming assistants like Leppa and Caracella etc
Yes, most of those decisions were an entirely different admin, and as I said most had serious upside, and I did support them at the time, in some cases still do, but DAMN why can't it just go right for us for a change? Boo Hoo sorry eveyone, just chucking my toys out of my pram here. Thank god for Liverpool, that's all I can say.
 
austinnn said:
I wonder what the tipping point might be for the Saints admin to pull the trigger and abort the mission, refresh coaching group and in that scenario do they hope that a new coach can get the playing group to fulfil its percieved potential or dump/trade all non-essential players and set for a hard rebuild.

I suppose they will definitely let Ratten see out his contract to avoid scandal, so like it or lump it we've got the Ra-Ra version of Saints Footy, (by which I mean Rath-Ratten)

But I wonder how bad things would actually have to go for us to sack him early? It would have to even be more than certs for the spoon in June I think. I'm talking player in-fighting, wanting out, that kind of drama.

Let's hope we don't veer anywhere near that neighbourhood. At this stage I don't put anything past us. We could get correct and storm into the 4, as per my off-season prediction, but the entire AFL community thinks we'll be sh*t this year, most of the fans on here think we're sh*t, so as hard as it is for me to conceive, it might be time for me to work on the assumption that maybe we're not going to do great things in 2022.

Sick of it frankly.

Every decision we have made for donkeys years, seems to be weird and needing to be justified (rather than boring and obvious and failsafe) and not without merit but so much downside:
  • Lovett
  • Seaford
  • Not giving Lyon financial security, letting him get his head turned
  • Hiring Scott Watters then realising what he was
  • Hiring Alan Richardson instead of Mark Williams
  • Letting Pelchen have his way with us
  • Letting Trout dictate what the make up of our club should be
  • Drafting Billings and McCartin
  • Trading pick 5 for Carlisle and Gresham
  • Drafting Clark and Coffield when we wanted mids
  • Alternating between Hickey and Longer
  • Trading a 2RDP for Nathan Freeman, keeping him injured on the list for years then delisting him after a few games
  • Trading in a bunch of picks to secure Clavarino and Austin
  • Extending Richo's contract
  • Letting Adam Kingsley go and keeping Richo
  • Bringing in Hannebury on a massive contract, despite injury concerns
  • Bringing in all of Alistair Clarkson's support staff
  • Trading pick 6 for Hill, Howard and probably Paddy came as a result of that
  • Drafting Allison as a long-term prospect forward, then turning him into a backman
  • Bringing in Paddy Ryder and Zac Jones, despite injury concerns
  • That's without all the things we didn't do, like trying to move up in the draft order by trading good players, trading out Armitage, Steven or Ross when they had some market value, developing certain players properly, retaining players like McCartin, Hind, and Parker, giving Luke Beverage a job sooner before the Bulldogs would be ready to find a new head coach, approaching upcoming assistants like Leppa and Caracella etc
Yes, most of those decisions were an entirely different admin, and as I said most had serious upside, and I did support them at the time, in some cases still do, but DAMN why can't it just go right for us for a change? Boo Hoo sorry eveyone, just chucking my toys out of my pram here. Thank god for Liverpool, that's all I can say.
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If it goes pear shape this year i wouldn't be surprised to see GT put something together for a take over, I would bank on it.
He will get Rooey on board to keep members happy

Oh yeah Alison played wing on the weekend LOL
 
Holy Hunter Clark said:
Saints just on 7 News.
Not sure if anyone else saw it.

Reports that the game review wasn’t pretty and coaching stuff singled out individual efforts and what wasn’t good enough. Hope this helps set some standards and means we come out firing Sunday night.

Was also mentioned Billings put in a big session and isn’t to far away which is fantastic news to end on.
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They said the same shit last year
 
Beard of Zeus said:
If we play like we did on Friday, we are sh*t.
Sh*t inbetween list, neither good nor bad

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Kane sums it up Perfectly, not winning a flag and not giving the fans hope by drafting top end talent. Had one rising star nom in 4 years. We might be fcuked
 

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botts said:
Kane sums it up Perfectly, not winning a flag and not giving the fans hope by drafting top end talent. Had one rising star nom in 4 years. We might be fcuked
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I've said it before, I don't believe that they are chasing a premiership, they want to stay competitive while rebuilding on the fly. If we make a few finals series to keep membership rolling in I think that they'd be pretty happy. Selling another ground up rebuild would be pretty tricky to navigate while we are in heavy debt and post pandemic.
 
gringo2011 said:
I've said it before, I don't believe that they are chasing a premiership, they want to stay competitive while rebuilding on the fly. If we make a few finals series to keep membership rolling in I think that they'd be pretty happy. Selling another ground up rebuild would be pretty tricky to navigate while we are in heavy debt and post pandemic.
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We may not have a choice if we can’t win games.
 
jwikked said:
Yeah I'm a bit tired of the "learned lessons" and "harsh feedback" rhetoric from the club.
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The footy club isn’t dumb. I think they know how there supporters feel. But they still pump it out anyway
 
jwikked said:
Yeah I'm a bit tired of the "learned lessons" and "harsh feedback" rhetoric from the club.
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Since 2016

Mental fadeouts a consistent theme of the last 7 years
 

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