List Mgmt. 2022 Trade and Free Agency Thread

[Jivlain]

 

[briztoon]

I might be wrong but I don't think the number of draft picks you can take into the draft is limited to the number of list spots.

I think it's the number of draft picks you can use is limited to the number of list spots.

There is a difference.

We can take the 7 picks to the draft but at the time we have to match the Ashcroft bid, we can only use the number of picks to match that we have list spots available (likely to be 5).

After we match the Ashcroft bid, we would have 3 draft picks and 4 list spots available, so would be fine.

I'm sure clubs regularly have more draft picks assigned going into the draft than what they use on draft night.

That is incorrect. It most definitely is tied to the number of available list spots you have available. Nor can you take "hidden" picks to the draft.

 

[Thomasno]

I had a read of the last 3-4 pages of the Dogs thread and man is that effed up. References to Putin and basically blowing there whole trade and draft period plus next years by not having our first all to punish Dunkley, Pickering and of course the BEars. They are so unhinged there sole focus is not on improving there list but punishing everyone oh and bidding or threatening to bid on Fletcher.

Further to that, they are claiming victory in having one of the better trade periods of all teams - as far as I can tell, they are up there with Sydney with not having done anything - given they have only brought in Jones as a free agent.

It is honestly one of the most messed up supporter groups ive had the displease of reading - just lacking in all common sense.

Don’t forget the one thing they’ve done this period so far is bring in Jones, who is an antivaxxer conspiracy nut who’s 31 and has been out of the system for 2 years now.

BRAVO SAM

 

[AB09]

That is incorrect. It most definitely is tied to the number of available list spots you have available. Nor can you take "hidden" picks to the draft.

No worries.

I thought I saw that the Dogs had 6 picks prior to matching the bid on Darcy at pick 2 in last year's draft.

I didn't think they had 6 list spots available.

 

[briztoon]

What we can do is, if GWS can take 6 picks to the draft, with 31 and 57 being the last two, we can trade a future second pick for both picks, realising that 31 will slide back to 32 and 57 slides forward 3 or 4 spots, depending on whether Davey is bid on before Fetcher or not. That's if GWS wants to pass on it's last two selections.

 

[theteamtobeat]

100% agreed on Bevo. I maintain the 2016 premiership will end up hurting the dogs quite badly in the long run because it’s essentially given Bevo a free pass for as long as he wants - and we’re already starting to see the effects of what happens when you give free reign to a Joe Rogan-like man child.

What are you on about. Bevo is a good coach. They made the grand final in 2021.

 

[rye]

bevo is a different kettle of fish than most but that doesnt seem particularly uncommon amongst premiership coaches.

 

[Gadzorks]

The GH5 was devastating but Lions fans rightly called out the club. It showed that something was not right, and was the catalyst for change.

Dunkley is professional, talented player who managed to win the BnF after telling the entire competition he didn't want to be part of the dogs organization. They had 12 months to change his mind but he still clearly does not respect their club enough to be a part of it. Reportedly because of the lack of professionalism, which is being reinforced by the carry on in this trade period. The club could have found other ways to strengthen their hand, but prefer to posture and sook and threaten.

The dogs fans are filthy about this trade and are focusing on the 'who gets what'. Like grade three babies. Their club would be better served if they used some of that intense energy to pressure their club to create an environment where the bnf winner is proud to be a member of their club and actually want to stay. Or at least cry with the enormity of leaving ala Rischitelli.

 

[T Rick]

Assuming Ashcroft goes at 1 and Davey goes at 14:
Matching pick one takes picks 34, 35, 36, 38 & 39, getting Ashcroft and pick 50 in change.
Picks before 33 move down one, pick 37 moves up 2, picks from 40-49 move up 4, and from 50 onwards move up 3.
Essendon uses picks 23 (nee 22) and 38 (nee 42), getting Davey and pick 46 in change. No overall impact on our picks.
We now have picks 50 (change from 39), 52 (nee 55) and 53 (nee 56), allowing us to match up to pick 19 without deficit.

Assuming Ashcroft goes at 3 and Davey at 14:
Matching pick three takes picks 34, 35, 36 & 38, getting Ashcroft and pick 53 in change.
Picks before 33 move down one, pick 37 moves up 2, picks from 39-55 move up 3, and from 56 onwards move up 2.
Essendon uses picks 23 (nee 22) and 39 (nee 42), matching Davey and getting pick 46 in change.
Our pick 36 (nee 39) becomes 35.
We now have picks 35 (nee 39), 52 (nee 55), 53 (change from 38), 54 (nee 56), allowing us to match up to pick 9 without deficit.
(obviously in this scenario I've assumed that Davey goes before Fletcher but that change doesn't actually matter - we can match pick 9 without the post-Davey shuffle as well).


Those will be needed for Fletcher (unless we take a deficit).

Well done Jivlain!

 

[Tom14]

No worries.

I thought I saw that the Dogs had 6 picks prior to matching the bid on Darcy at pick 2 in last year's draft.

I didn't think they had 6 list spots available.

Not sure about last year, but in 2020 they definitely relaxed the list spots = number of picks rule because list spots were at a premium due to list size reductions. Decent timing for the dogs re matching the JUH bid.

 

[lionraven]

If a player nominates for the draft, I understand they are also able to nominate their terms - hence Jack Martin

19

Jack Martin

Age

30

Ht

186cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

16.2

4star

K

10.0

4star

HB

6.3

4star

M

4.9

5star

T

3.7

5star

G

0.9

4star

D

14.9

4star

K

7.9

3star

HB

7.0

4star

M

4.3

4star

T

3.6

4star

G

1.1

5star

D

8.2

2star

K

4.6

2star

HB

3.6

3star

M

1.8

2star

T

2.0

4star

G

0.6

3star

getting to Carlton on a large front-ended contract to deter others from nominating. Would such contracts enable players to nominate other special terms ala - location clause whereby a player opts to reserve the right to not attend any team-related activities if they are not within a certain proximity to their preferred home location. That would immediately stop any other team trying to poach Dunkley, knowing they would be paying him a premium salary to not attend anything that is not near Noosa/Brisbane. It would be absolutely hilarious if there were such provisions but it would also mean pretty much mean every player becomes similar to a free agent at the end of their contract given they could always take this route to get to their preferred club.

 

[Hollow Knight]

If a player nominates for the draft, I understand they are also able to nominate their terms - hence Jack Martin getting to Carlton on a large front-ended contract to deter others from nominating. Would such contracts enable players to nominate other special terms ala - location clause whereby a player opts to reserve the right to not attend any team-related activities if they are not within a certain proximity to their preferred home location. That would immediately stop any other team trying to poach Dunkley, knowing they would be paying him a premium salary to not attend anything that is not near Noosa/Brisbane. It would be absolutely hilarious if there were such provisions but it would also mean pretty much mean every player becomes similar to a free agent at the end of their contract given they could always take this route to get to their preferred club.

I believe by “nominating terms” it is purely contract length and salary. Nothing else.

 

[Tom14]

If a player nominates for the draft, I understand they are also able to nominate their terms - hence Jack Martin getting to Carlton on a large front-ended contract to deter others from nominating. Would such contracts enable players to nominate other special terms ala - location clause whereby a player opts to reserve the right to not attend any team-related activities if they are not within a certain proximity to their preferred home location. That would immediately stop any other team trying to poach Dunkley, knowing they would be paying him a premium salary to not attend anything that is not near Noosa/Brisbane. It would be absolutely hilarious if there were such provisions but it would also mean pretty much mean every player becomes similar to a free agent at the end of their contract given they could always take this route to get to their preferred club.

No. Can nominate number of years/$ figure, not anything else.

 

[Hollow Knight]

In any case, I think people should cool their jets on the PSD strategies until the very, very, very unlikely situation occurs where Dunkley doesn’t get traded to us tomorrow.

 

[Lazza16]

We should run a sweep - pick the minute the Dunkley deal is announced tomorrow

5.50pm AESDT

 

[JasRulz63]

I believe by “nominating terms” it is purely contract length and salary. Nothing else.

I thought it was reported during the Martin saga that unlike free agents, teams have to pay the player's nominated figures in specific years for previously listed players taken in the ND/PSD.

EDIT:

Martin names terms for long-term deal to get him to Blues

Jack Martin has nominated terms for a long-term contract of more than $3 million in the hope it will knock other suitors out of the race and land him at Carlton next year.

amp.theage.com.au

Unlike matching a restricted free agent's contract terms, where a club only has to pay the averaged out amount of the total contract each year, a club taking a player with nominated terms in the pre-season draft must pay the nominated figures in each of the years of the contract. This means that clubs must pay the $1 million-plus amount next year then the specific lower amounts in years two to five.

 

[trikster]

the whole group think mentality of bulldogs fans being "happy to send him to the PSD instead of accepting an offer below what they think he is worth" is quite fascinating. It's very much a cult type of behaviour where the followers parrot the leaders words. I know teams supporters can be referred to as being tribal but this is taking it to a whole new level. I've even seen one say we clearly don't rate Dunkley because we have prioritised getting picks for Ashcroft/Fletcher over getting them better picks

 

[Warwick]

If a player nominates for the draft, I understand they are also able to nominate their terms - hence Jack Martin getting to Carlton on a large front-ended contract to deter others from nominating. Would such contracts enable players to nominate other special terms ala - location clause whereby a player opts to reserve the right to not attend any team-related activities if they are not within a certain proximity to their preferred home location. That would immediately stop any other team trying to poach Dunkley, knowing they would be paying him a premium salary to not attend anything that is not near Noosa/Brisbane. It would be absolutely hilarious if there were such provisions but it would also mean pretty much mean every player becomes similar to a free agent at the end of their contract given they could always take this route to get to their preferred club.

Haha could you imagine?

My terms are 6 years at $650k.

A steak at the Norman every Thursday night.

A Bulimba postcode.

And a locker between Cam Ah Chee and Hugh McCluggage.

If you can accomodate that, I’ll go anywhere.

 

[beatnik]

bevo is a different kettle of fish than most but that doesnt seem particularly uncommon amongst premiership coaches.

What do you mean bruz? I’m fully grouse

 

[Dalions]

We have been adamant about getting at the very least, pick 39 back from the dogs. That to me, suggests we really would prefer to take 5 picks to the draft, and be able to match the bid at pick one on Ashcroft.

If we're not trading any of our remaining future picks, we currently have enough future points to match a bid on Fletcher at pick 9.

The only second round picks that I see as possibly attainable are GWS's 31 (606), and maybe Sydney's pick 37. But it's only really worth trading for Sydney's pick if we see both Geelong and us in the GF next year, and it's only really worth trading for pick 31, if we see both us and Geelong finishing top 4.

34 - 542
35 - 522
36 - 502
38 - 465
55 - 207
56 - 194

F2 (36) - 502
F2 (37) - 483
F3 (56) - 194
F4 (74) - 0

Assuming we can get 39 from the doggies.
When a bid for Ashcroft comes in (pick 1) don’t all of those five picks go to the back of the draft?

So if there is 70 picks taken to the draft by all clubs and a bid comes at pick 1 for Ashcroft then all of those 5 picks in the 30’s for us, drop back to picks 65-69.
So by the time the pick for Fletcher comes in at let’s say (pick 20) all of those picks of ours will be down to roughly picks 45-50 which will average out at around 300 points per pick. Which gives us plenty of points to match a bid for Fletcher without trading back in.
So the pick 39 is pretty valuable to us to ensure that we have enough points to match Ashcroft and then Fletcher will take care of itself.

 

[mpal6]

Haha could you imagine?

My terms are 6 years at $650k.

A steak at the Norman every Thursday night.

A Bulimba postcode.

And a locker between Cam Ah Chee and Hugh McCluggage.

If you can accomodate that, I’ll go anywhere.

I remember Josh Carr doing it when coming back from Fremantle to Port.

He said "For any club thinking to pick me up in PSD - I'll be living in Adelaide next year. just make sure you can cover my weekly travel plans"

 

[davemc_lions]

We want something back for points. All we do under that scenario is give them away.

that is the problem at one stage we either going into next year less points/picks to take a chance on someone
Or going into next year not having Dunkley

I prefer Dunkley

 

[Morbidly_Obese]

100% agreed on Bevo. I maintain the 2016 premiership will end up hurting the dogs quite badly in the long run because it’s essentially given Bevo a free pass for as long as he wants - and we’re already starting to see the effects of what happens when you give free reign to a Joe Rogan-like man child.

Hey bro, don't shit on Joe Rogan he's cool.

 

[mpal6]

Its kind of weird, in spite of arguing in Dunkley thread all trade period - so far I've not felt the affinity or anxiety which I went through during Neale trade to us. May be I feel Dunkley is just surplus and nice to have. We still have some ability to cover that area if we miss out.

I was more worried about points for Ashcroft and Fletcher and looks like club had the same view.

 

[haystark]

Surprised Essendon haven’t gotten Matho. Wouldn’t cost much but the points from that pick might be nice?

 

[davemc_lions]

Surprised Essendon haven’t gotten Matho. Wouldn’t cost much but the points from that pick might be nice?

i thought he be good for them
They have a bunch of outside players who do not want to get in and dirty