List Mgmt. 2025 List Management II 📃

[Aphrodite]

 

[ctwenty1]

I agree...been saying this for a couple years but all the experts on here disagree...we need backline players who can hit a target.

I like what i see with carrol and wilson, will be interesting to see how Nic Newman comes back.

that age gap though is far too big - need someone in their mid 20's

 

[agro]

Where is this coming from? 2 weeks ago Andrew Dillon said there's no change (this year)... can't imagine they're going to change it for next year, clubs won't be willing to cop a rule change the same year as the draft.

Besides, I've said it a million times, we should focus on finishing last next year... the difference between 18th and 13th is negligible.

Last night Cam Raynor stepped up when needed and was a big reason the Lions got over the line. He would have been ours had we not won a couple of close games in 2017 that were ultimately meaningless for our "winning cultcha". The result was, we drafted Dow because the Lions took Raynor...

You take Raynor out of that Lions side and add him to ours... who knows, we might've gone all the way in 2023...

Cam Raynor is a good player but was a very slow burn, and with our poor player development I dare say we would have traded or delisted him by this time.

 

[Coops93]

This place has changed quick. A month or so ago it was "We must trade one, if not more, of our big 5/6" to now "they're untradable unless we get massive overs".

Our list is still top heavy with poor depth and a thin B grader level which has been brutally exposed for a yr and a half now. We need to round out a fair bit and we don't have a lot of assets to move on of worth. With 1 first round pick (TDK) in a rather poor draft, I'm not really sure what our options are, noting that we absolutely do not want to trade out next yrs assets given the uncertainty around F/S and we have a kid right at the pointy end. If anything, we want to bolster that hand...

We're going to have to get creative if we're going to bring anyone of worth in this year.

 

[AndyLucimitis]

Sydney's 1st pick is not attractive in a draft that lacks quality depth.
We are much better to keep a core group and make smart decisions & build around them.

Only way a deal gets done is if it is too good a offer to refuse whether that is players or high draft picks.

Agree - I made this point earlier about Brisbane. I'm over Sydney and Brisbane just pilfering players for relatively next to nothing. This media narrative that, because, hypothetically, a McKay or a Curnow wants out , that we should just acquiesce and cut our losses for an Ollie Florent and change is rubbish.

Yes - there is an argument to sell 'high' with Curnow but it needs to be a godfather offer.

 

[KohPhi]

Why would we trade a player who would “make the world of difference” for another club if we aren’t getting one of that clubs best players? It’s like Sydney trading Errol Gulden to us for TDK’s compo pick, HOK and Frankie Evans.

It's all part of our plan to finish last, by the sounds of it

 

[Coops93]

Count me as one that wants Walsh as captain next season. I've wanted it all yr and mentioned it a handful of times, with the only reservation being the rumours he wanted out.

Now he's put that to bed, 100% make him captain. Might be hard/unfair on Weiters who has probably been seen as the de facto next in line for years, but I feel like for where we're at now, Weiters seems too much like a CEO for me. Perfectly clean cut, says the right things, probably trains completely the right way and, in fairness to him, would be an ideal captain in many, many other scenarios. But I think this team is in a mild/moderate transition period right now and getting the next phase of the list to take ownership from the senior heads I think is the ideal outcome.

They've done well to get us where we are, and I thank Cripps, Doch and Weiters primarily for that, but now I think is the right time to get the younger energy at the top.

 

[Juice030103]

Think Cripps should give the captaincy to Walsh for sure. Have a little change in dynamics within the club couldn’t hurt

 

[Blue_Fusion]

Why would we trade a contracted key forward like Hary or Charlie if we don't get something "delusional" in return!

We don't want draft picks - we want players that can move the needle immediately

Immediately is wishful thinking. We need to have the side to win a flag to want immediate return. We just simply don't have that side atm.

Don't get me wrong, I'd LOVE to get Gulden.. I just don't see it happening and yes, you're correct we are well within our right to demand something delusional otherwise we keep him... perhaps we force the Swans to get creative to give us better pick for next year or put Gulden on the table.

 

[4flagsin5yrs]

Charlie's 29yo.

Two firsts (part to be used in trades for other players), two of McDonald (post extensive due diligence), Roberts, Papley or Haywood.

After asking for Gulden or the Lizard (+ one or the four above).

Separately, a deal with WCE that gets us Ryan somehow...Guv going their way?

As others have said, Guv stays if JSOS goes? Or do we back in Weiters, Young, Haynes, Cowan, Newman... need a project KPD too? HOF ain't KPD size really?

 

[The Blue Weirdo]

Especially when one is a generational talent that we can build the entire forward line around, and is still just 24yo.

If fate had allowed us to play 3 finals this year, I'd be prepared to bet that Frankie would do better than Charlies total of 3 goals in 2024's campaign.

 

[Red Bull]

Trading doesn’t have to be a “next Saturday’s game” scenario.
I would hope Austin/Wright have a broader vision of things than that.
We need to make considered decisions with a view to “winning the war” rather than just “winning the battle”
Fremantle’s work recently appears to have set them up nicely for the now and the future.
Curnow is 29yo in February with dodgy knees and has indicated he’d be open to other clubs.
Are we winning the premiership next year with Curnow ?
We wouldn’t be bottoming out without him but the trade bounty we’d receive in return alongside the salary cap relief would certainly help list management define the future and the bigger picture going forward.
Sometimes you have to look at what’s to gain rather than what’s lost …

 

[CaptainCharisma]

This place has changed quick. A month or so ago it was "We must trade one, if not more, of our big 5/6" to now they're untradable unless we get massive overs.

Our list is still top heavy with poor depth and a thin B grader level which has been brutally exposed for a yr and a half now. We need to round out a fair bit and we don't have a lot of assets to move on of worth. With 1 first round pick (TDK) in a rather poor draft, I'm not really sure what our options are, noting that we absolutely do not want to trade out next yrs assets given the uncertainty around F/S and we have a kid right at the pointy end. If anything, we want to bolster that hand...

We're going to have to get creative if we're going to bring anyone of worth in this year.

I think this just means the messaging from the club has worked - well at least the message that has been pushed since GW has been more in the media spotlight (a couple of weeks before he "officially" took over)

It is the right one too. If we are making a song and dance about drastically changing the list and everyone is on the trading block then other clubs would see us as vulnerable to poach a discount rate star player from and player managers would be pushing "trade requests" that tie the clubs' hands.

Operating a bit more quietly keeps everything a little less chaotic and if we do end up arranging a Charlie trade in the background we won't be bent over.
The Swans are clearly a professional (and non-leaky) outfit as evidenced by the Buddy deal years ago and there wasn't many whispers of Pavlich as CEO more recently either.

If trading out a big name player doesn't eventuate I am not concerned either.
Revamping the football/coaching department, further developing the youngsters we saw in the last month and getting some players back on the park can get us on the right track.

Freeing up money previously allocated to TDK, JSOS and McGovern contract trigger should help us target some players next year once we survey the landscape and assess if we can turn it around under Voss or we need to go in another direction.

 

[BlueLocke]

Wouldn't be surprised if TDK is waiting for his exit interview to tell Voss that he's leaving in person, which is a nice touch of professionalism and respect.

 

[Red Bull]

He's an unrestricted free agent, we have no bargaining on the price other than to convince him to stay whether that be up our offer and/or length of contract.

I’m aware he’s an UFA.
It works for us no matter where he goes … if the price is right.
If he somehow decided to accept unders from another club, we’d be screwed and he could GAGF for good …

 

[AndyLucimitis]

Wouldn't be surprised if TDK is waiting for his exit interview to tell Voss that he's leaving in person, which is a nice touch of professionalism and respect.

Nice but I honestly can't believe he hasn't told the club a couple of months ago and Voss was just holding the company line in the pressers

 

[jj1978]

I’m aware he’s an UFA.
It works for us no matter where he goes … if the price is right.
If he somehow decided to accept unders from another club, we’d be screwed and he could GAGF for good …

If he's spiteful like his dad has become, would not be shocked if he accepts a deal much lower than ours.

 

[Red Bull]

If he's spiteful like his dad has become, would not be shocked if he accepts a deal much lower than ours.

If that were to transpire, at least the cards would be on the table and a few here could finally extinguish the flame …

 

[Wickzki]

This place has changed quick. A month or so ago it was "We must trade one, if not more, of our big 5/6" to now they're untradable unless we get massive overs.

You make valid points, but I think the last few weeks have shown a clear shift in the salary landscape, TDK being a good example.

While I still believe TDK is being heavily overpaid relative to his output, we’re seeing a trend where players of a similar level are also getting contracts in that range. And the number of players signing these contracts is only going to keep rising.

That shift actually makes the long-term deals we’ve already locked in look a lot more valuable by comparison. Players on those contracts suddenly look like bargains relative to what the market is now demanding. The flip side is it also makes recruiting players of similar talent from outside the club much harder, because they’re costing more than ever

So the real question becomes: do we lock in and retain what we’ve already got, or do we trade players out for draft picks and other team's players and try to rebuild? And if we do go down the draft route, who’s realistically going to give us the kind of picks needed to replace that talent? Even then, once those replacements are targeted, they’ll probably cost us just as much—if not more—than the players we already have with just as many questions marks and draftees will need to fight with other kids we have developing for their opportunity

That’s why I think the smartest strategy right now is to ride out the storm: add depth in our weaker areas, keep developing what’s already on the list, and look for quality when and where it presents itself. The contracts we signed before this salary inflation hit are going to be worth their weight in gold going forward.

It’s time to manage the list with intelligence and patience, not emotion.

 

[jj1978]

You make valid points, but I think the last few weeks have shown a clear shift in the salary landscape, TDK being a good example.

While I still believe TDK is being heavily overpaid relative to his output, we’re seeing a trend where players of a similar level are also getting contracts in that range. And the number of players signing these contracts is only going to keep rising.

That shift actually makes the long-term deals we’ve already locked in look a lot more valuable by comparison. Players on those contracts suddenly look like bargains relative to what the market is now demanding. The flip side is it also makes recruiting players of similar talent from outside the club much harder, because they’re costing more than ever

So the real question becomes: do we lock in and retain what we’ve already got, or do we trade players out for draft picks and other team's players and try to rebuild? And if we do go down the draft route, who’s realistically going to give us the kind of picks needed to replace that talent? Even then, once those replacements are targeted, they’ll probably cost us just as much—if not more—than the players we already have with just as many questions marks and draftees will need to fight with other kids we have developing for their opportunity

That’s why I think the smartest strategy right now is to ride out the storm: add depth in our weaker areas, keep developing what’s already on the list, and look for quality when and where it presents itself. The contracts we signed before this salary inflation hit are going to be worth their weight in gold going forward.

It’s time to manage the list with intelligence and patience, not emotion.

I think Wright is pretty cluey with the new landscape and Tassie incoming and how that'll affect free agency offers, picks, and trades. Let's not fall into the trap of Stains and some other lowly teams where they bank huge million+ offers on many years for a few players leaving nothing much left for the remainder. Perhaps Cook and he have been working in the background to ensure we distribute our cap more evenly on players and has been hunting down our own version of Cotton-On and the like.

 

[RPCB]

Pick 40 would help pay for Cody - doesn't mean we should be devaluing our own assets. And "looks to be in decline" because of one poor year?

AFL HQ might help fix that.

 

[Bamboo Harvester]

Austin was appointed 2020….

Kozzie was drafted 2019…..

Thanks for the history lesson....but I was potting our previous 'list manager', not Austin.

 

[Bfevola]

The real issue for the AFL is free agency and not father son.

Lets face it the good players only want to go to contenders. Or heavily cashed up clubs.

Look at Brisbane, now getting another good player for nothing. And Geelong always seems to do the same..

 

[HereComesJuddy]

Frankie went beast mode

 

[Blue_Fusion]

Wouldn't be surprised if TDK is waiting for his exit interview to tell Voss that he's leaving in person, which is a nice touch of professionalism and respect.

lmfao... he already told us all with his half hearted performances...

 

[JimmyRabbit49]

Immediately is wishful thinking. We need to have the side to win a flag to want immediate return. We just simply don't have that side atm.

Don't get me wrong, I'd LOVE to get Gulden.. I just don't see it happening and yes, you're correct we are well within our right to demand something delusional otherwise we keep him... perhaps we force the Swans to get creative to give us better pick for next year or put Gulden on the table.

First off lets just say we got a Gulden (23) or Butters (24) - they could impact immediately and still be impacting in 8-10 years - that still fits our list profile just doesn't push us off into the never never of always waiting for our list to mature.

Secondly I don't believe we are as far of as people think - we desperately need outside runners who use the ball well - but if we plug in Newman, Walsh, Smith, Cottrell and a Butters/Gulden type recruit suddenly our outside run is improved dramatically (before you get to improvement from Carroll, Cowan & co). It is also massively under rated on here just how much we missed Harry because TDK and Harry were simply not able to give us the contested mark option that gave our defenders an out as we came out of defence - someone who at worst meant the ball was knocked out of bounds rather than an opposition mark