List Mgmt. 2025 List Management

[serial_thrilla]

 

[go_the_dockers]

Have a look at the comments.

Snuffaluphagus - I think this will almost put a smile on your face

 

[rgauci]

Melts over a 4 pick downgrade are fantastic. Yes I'm accounting for the Lions and Suns to keep their picks (14, 16 & 17) and being used for academy bids.

Yes, I am also chasing a trash react from Snuff.

They will slide them slightly for pick upgrades. Like any list manager would do.

 

[Freoforever86]

Also, wouldn’t surprise me to see us trade 19 for another pick in next years first round

 

[Nodgey]

If this deal means we lose out on Toby Whan I'll be apoplectic

Toby must be crap anyway if people reckon picks after 33 are worthless I just don’t get it. Unfathomable.

 

[Taylor]

Assume we will trade a later future pick to make sure we can cover a Whan bid in the 40s

Any bid from pick 41 onwards is matched with your next pick, whether it's the very next pick or round 100 pick #1800. We don't need a pick to match. If we have a list spot we have a pick there waiting way down the line.

 

[go_the_dockers]

Assume we will trade a later future pick to make sure we can cover a Whan bid in the 40s

Any pick after 40 is automatically matched with your next pick.

No need for points.

 

[Freoforever86]

Any bid from pick 41 onwards is matched with your next pick, whether it's the very next pick or round 100 pick #1800. We don't need a pick to match. If we have a list spot we have a pick there waiting way down the line.

Cool, thanks for clarifying. Must be confident.
I’ve seen Whan at 40 in one phantom. Rest he’s nowhere near it

 

[Docker82]

Melts over a 4 pick downgrade are fantastic. Yes I'm accounting for the Lions and Suns to keep their picks (14, 16 & 17) and being used for academy bids.

Yes, I am also chasing a trash react from Snuff.

Think there's actually a pretty good chance the Suns keep those picks and they're eaten up in an early bid. Brisbane possibly as well.

It might be that the Suns look to downgrade Pick 7/8 and Carlton Pick 9 so a lot of pucks in the 20s and 30s likely get traded to Gold Coast. Carlton might trade the pick into next year though.

It really depends from here what Gold Coast get for pick 7/8 and/or players like Fiorini and Buderick. And yes, they'll be other picks swapped on draft night but if the picks in the right range are swapped pre-draft Gold Coast may not be able to make that work on draft night tbh.

 

[bellie4pm]

Pick 19 worth considerably more than pick 18 - more like a F1 in 10-15 range if rhere’s a club out there wanting to choose first on Night 2. (Esp with tassie coming to gut the draft for a couple of years.)

Trade doesnt look so bad if the above happens

 

[Alfonz]

It just seems like such a nothing thing to be angry about. Got our guy early in the week which is a positive. And we threw in some late picks that will be worthless on draft night to get it done.

But the points!!! Yeah cool.

Come away still holding an early enough pick. Probably means we’re comfortable with our targets - which fits with what I’ve been saying about how teams will draft in the first round. And also probably means we only plan on one live pick plus an NGA late.

I am bewildered more than angry. I'm fine with McVee, Rodriguez?, NGA and walk away. But how we didn't get a F2 from Brisbane or F3 from WC (which could have been useful next year) is beyond me.

The pick swaps looks strange enough that a crazy conspiracy theory (bidding, draft collusion, blackmail, etc) has become a semi-plausible idea.

 

[Docker82]

Pick 19 worth considerably more than pick 18 - more like a F1 in 10-15 range if rhere’s a club out there wanting to choose first on Night 2. (Esp with tassie coming to gut the draft for a couple of years.)

Trade doesnt look so bad if the above happens

Pick 23 is the first pick in the second round. We just traded that for McVee.

Wouldn't be surprised if that pick is traded again in a Petracca deal tbh. If it is Gold Coast probably hold it and it disappears or is traded on night one of the draft.

 

[Jezzitizle]

I am bewildered more than angry. I'm fine with McVee, Rodriguez?, NGA and walk away. But how we didn't get a F2 from Brisbane or F3 from WC (which could have been useful next year) is beyond me.

The pick swaps looks strange enough that a crazy conspiracy theory (bidding, draft collusion, blackmail, etc) has become a semi-plausible idea.

Brisbane probably have 30 top 10 academy products next year, and west coast will probably get the afl to upgrade all their picks to the front of the draft for reasons.

 

[The Lobbster]

From the ABC trade period blog and Dean Bilton

“In my opinion, Freo look to be making very deliberate and specific moves in this trade and draft period.

The goal for the Dockers was to get Judd McVee, have another decent pick to use and ensure they can match a bid for NGA Toby Whan if needed. Tick, tick, tick.

It's also worth keeping in mind that pick 33 will likely blow out into the 40s on draft night, and in this particular draft I don't think that's worth holding up the club's other ambitions.

I can see why some Freo fans aren't happy with this deal (helping the Eagles out a little is probably running some up the wrong way), but the Dockers know what they're doing and they're getting it done.”

TLDR; they think that without 33 there would’ve been a holdup for the deal. We didn’t rate 33 enough to hold the deal up so we put it in.

 

[Jezzitizle]

From the ABC trade period blog and Dean Bilton

“In my opinion, Freo look to be making very deliberate and specific moves in this trade and draft period.

The goal for the Dockers was to get Judd McVee, have another decent pick to use and ensure they can match a bid for NGA Toby Whan if needed. Tick, tick, tick.

It's also worth keeping in mind that pick 33 will likely blow out into the 40s on draft night, and in this particular draft I don't think that's worth holding up the club's other ambitions.

I can see why some Freo fans aren't happy with this deal (helping the Eagles out a little is probably running some up the wrong way), but the Dockers know what they're doing and they're getting it done.”

TLDR; they think that without 33 there would’ve been a holdup for the deal. We didn’t rate 33 enough to hold the deal up so we put it in.

That can’t be it, a more plausible solution is the club are full of utter morons without any rhyme or reason to their actions!

 

[apuchar]

From the ABC trade period blog and Dean Bilton

“In my opinion, Freo look to be making very deliberate and specific moves in this trade and draft period.

The goal for the Dockers was to get Judd McVee, have another decent pick to use and ensure they can match a bid for NGA Toby Whan if needed. Tick, tick, tick.

It's also worth keeping in mind that pick 33 will likely blow out into the 40s on draft night, and in this particular draft I don't think that's worth holding up the club's other ambitions.

I can see why some Freo fans aren't happy with this deal (helping the Eagles out a little is probably running some up the wrong way), but the Dockers know what they're doing and they're getting it done.”

TLDR; they think that without 33 there would’ve been a holdup for the deal. We didn’t rate 33 enough to hold the deal up so we put it in.

They asked us to help and then we allowed them to dictate.

 

[Docker82]

From the ABC trade period blog and Dean Bilton

“In my opinion, Freo look to be making very deliberate and specific moves in this trade and draft period.

The goal for the Dockers was to get Judd McVee, have another decent pick to use and ensure they can match a bid for NGA Toby Whan if needed. Tick, tick, tick.

It's also worth keeping in mind that pick 33 will likely blow out into the 40s on draft night, and in this particular draft I don't think that's worth holding up the club's other ambitions.

I can see why some Freo fans aren't happy with this deal (helping the Eagles out a little is probably running some up the wrong way), but the Dockers know what they're doing and they're getting it done.”

TLDR; they think that without 33 there would’ve been a holdup for the deal. We didn’t rate 33 enough to hold the deal up so we put it in.

Pick 33 won't get into the 40s on draft night.

For every early bid they'll be a pick before pick 33 used to match. Each time that happens Pick 33 stays where it is. If two picks before Pick 33 are used it goes down to Pick 32.

Reasonably convinced our Pick 46 will come close to going inside Pick 40 tbh.

 

[2big2strom]

my conspiracy theory is the AFL didn't want Brisbane and WC to do a straight swap due to the obvious collusion & draft tampering, so told them get a third club involved. we were the only club stupid enough to agree to get involved and the AFL will help us secure something juicy towards the end of the trade period (I'm thinking someone else's FA compo or perhaps permission to smooth out a big fishes large contract)

(yes, I am choosing to go full delusional instead of full melt)

 

[mattis117]

Haven't had this much fun playing the opposing side in a thread for a while.

The other side just wilfully ignoring all the data so they can maintain the rage and cry that we screwed up. I get it, it's fun to be upset sometimes also.

The trade is only diabolical under the assumption that the existing pick value system is accurate. The collective intelligence of the AFL list managers, the draft watchers as well, all are saying that the draft is likely to be below average. Since the draft value index is built upon an average draft, the value of each pick in this upcoming draft has been determined to be less than normal.

We can do some simple mathematics.

Post Allen Compo, difference is as follows:


Now let's assume that the list managers secretely agreed that this draft had five top end talents less than usual, top ten picks for example. That would result in the following calculation:


Suddenly, the before and after are much closer in value.

The specifics of the assumptions made don't matter. All that matters is there is clearly an understanding between list managers that the value of picks in this draft is lower than the pick value index.

Value is determined by the parties making a trade - not by an outside system. As stated yesterday, it will be interesting to see how other trades are valued in the coming days to get more data on this.

What we can say though, is if pick 23 does have less value than a normal pick 23, we have gotten a fantastic deal for Judd McVee.

 

[Sewell21]

my conspiracy theory is the AFL didn't want Brisbane and WC to do a straight swap due to the obvious collusion & draft tampering, so told them get a third club involved. we were the only club stupid enough to agree to get involved and the AFL will help us secure something juicy towards the end of the trade period (I'm thinking someone else's FA compo or perhaps permission to smooth out a big fishes large contract)

(yes, I am choosing to go full delusional instead of full melt)

You lost me at “the AFL will help us”

 

[Joao]

Once Brodie is traded for pick 28, there'll be no reason to visit the AFL site again until November now. Wallsy was supposed to drag it out until next wednesday so we can enjoy another week of trade radio.

 

[Nodgey]

My tin foil hat has me wondering if the WAFC is involved in this. Help out the slime at our expense.

 

[Tonga Bob]

From the ABC trade period blog and Dean Bilton

“In my opinion, Freo look to be making very deliberate and specific moves in this trade and draft period.

The goal for the Dockers was to get Judd McVee, have another decent pick to use and ensure they can match a bid for NGA Toby Whan if needed. Tick, tick, tick.

It's also worth keeping in mind that pick 33 will likely blow out into the 40s on draft night, and in this particular draft I don't think that's worth holding up the club's other ambitions.

I can see why some Freo fans aren't happy with this deal (helping the Eagles out a little is probably running some up the wrong way), but the Dockers know what they're doing and they're getting it done.”

TLDR; they think that without 33 there would’ve been a holdup for the deal. We didn’t rate 33 enough to hold the deal up so we put it in.

Dean Bilton's a Weags fan isn't he?

 

[2big2strom]

You lost me at “the AFL will help us”

yeah that's when I realised I had to add full delusional to my post

 

[Superkoops]

Can’t understand two aspects of the trade:

• why we just essentially threw away pick 44/45
• why we didn’t at least get a F3 as part of deal.

(I’m hopeful that there will be something else tied to this deal down the track - either end of trade period or a pick swap at some point after trade period or live on the night of draft).

The end trade:
13,34 > 20,McVee (rates McVee at 23/24) so that in itself is ok.

45,51 > 47 makes zero sense
Not fussed about pick 50/51.

Happy to throw in 51 for goodwill but 45>47??

When reflecting on the deal for Reidy (upgrading to get pick 50/51, but all seems rather pointless when we just throw away pick 44/45.

Makes zero sense.

 

[A New Hope]

Can we blame Henry for this as well?