Past #25: Robbie Tarrant - traded to RFC for CCJ&picks - 2yr deal at RFC - 174 NM games/44 NM goals - retires 13/7/23 effective immediately

[DunderHead]

I don’t see 38 as being “ponying up”. We gave pick 32 for Hampson back in the day haha.

What’s a fair trade to you?

That’s the first time you mentioned a pick. Yeah 38 is fair I’d say if was a straight swap. Not sure how Taz will factor into it though.

 

[Frank Thring]

I think you’ll find a number of North posters offering a very late pick to get it done in good faith, that’s the mark and good on us for the generous offer.

The tigers should be concentrating on how to get Tarrant via trade, that’s where the value is in saving the Chol compo.

Just a note, the tigers poached a required player and part of the leadership team. Let’s not pretend the tigers have morals. Tarrant leaves with our blessing as we need to refresh up the backline anyway, but it doesn’t discount it’s a dog act.


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He's a free agent, why is it a dog act?

 

[Theo23]

That’s the first time you mentioned a pick. Yeah 38 is fair I’d say if was a straight swap. Not sure how Taz will factor into it though.

I reckon I mentioned earlier that Taz and 38 for CCJ and a pick in the 50’s to cover whatever compo you would have gotten for Tarrant.

 

[Theo23]

That said, whilst it’s slightly under I’d expect the trade to be Tarrant + 38 for CCJ + a pick in the 50-60’s.

The benefit of that trade would be we keep the Chol compo, hence being inclined to take less in the trade for CCJ.

Confirmed^

 

[Devington]

I reckon I mentioned earlier that Taz and 38 for CCJ and a pick in the 50’s to cover whatever compo you would have gotten for Tarrant.

44. You already have five picks before that, and 38 would sneak in ahead of 40 which is your fifth. A six pick upgrade isn't huge, but North has all the leverage. I think it's the "fairest" compromise all considered.

 

[The acurate one]

The blunder was not extending him until he became eligible for free agency. Maybe they tried but I think both club and player benefit from eligibility.

Think Brown's wife made that untenable

 

[The Filth Wizard]

I reckon I mentioned earlier that Taz and 38 for CCJ and a pick in the 50’s to cover whatever compo you would have gotten for Tarrant.

Funnily enough for all the blow up this is the most generous trade I've seen either side moot.

 

[Theo23]

44. You already have five picks before that, and 38 would sneak in ahead of 40 which is your fifth. A six pick upgrade isn't huge, but North has all the leverage. I think it's the "fairest" compromise all considered.

I’m sure we could split pick 44 and get into the 50’s with another club, or if someone like Caddy were to leave there would be a few picks moved around.

 

[Tas]

I’m certainly not saying we have to be best buds, no-one is expecting that. But out of how many trades in the past decade how many have gone straight to the PSD with no ability to make a (somewhat) fair trade beforehand?

Crows did it to GWS with Hately, a former 1st round pick from 2018, last year. They told GWS he was being taken in the PSD and didn't talk about a trade. The only club that really has any kind of power when it comes to guaranteed movement is the team on the bottom. Even though we were second last in 2020, we couldn't really force someone into the PSD, because if we pushed someone better than Hatley into the PSD, there are no guarantees that Crows wouldn't just turn around and take him instead. It would be a dick move, but it is a lot harder to convince a player to take a punt when there is no certainty.

It is why I find it funny the media talking about Collingwood taking Lipinski in the PSD, Really? If there isn't anyone better available we can just take him instead. It is not like Collingwood is outbidding us on anything atm.

If any club was to put 500k salary on a bloke they’d be able to get him in the PSD as most clubs don’t have that type of cap room by the time the PSD comes around. Adelaide could easily get Dawson in the PSD if they wanted to, and that’s definitely “the best outcome” for the club if they did.

$500k isn't a lot, average salary is $330k or thereabouts. I'd say the only one in the bottom 6 who couldn't find $1m would be Collingwood, but as they retire off the overpaid B graders and wean off of those back-ended contracts they will be TPP solvent again in a year or two.

For a club like ours, probably a few clubs, we have contracts brought forward from previous years so we are way under TPP cap for next year, after the trade/free agency period we will have to bring forward more contracts from beyond 2022 into 2022 to hit the 100% TPP cap. All clubs would leave a certain amount reserved to finalise after the trade/free agency period. I don't think anything is finalised until the last list lodgement.

I’m sure the next time the Roos have a player leaving who is out of contract the club involved in that deal would think the PSD is a great option too. That’s just not how the industry really works.

We have had more than our fair share of players who have departed over the years, it is not often you get unlucky and have someone that goes to the team on the bottom. It is a s**t deal when faced with trading with a team that is on the bottom but that is just the luck of the draw. For better or worse, we have let Higgins and Brown go last year, Tarrant can walk to wherever he wants. If Richmond was on the bottom of the ladder the year you chased Lynch, tell me your club wouldn't have screwed them over.

As much as I don't want to screw anyone over, if the club fails to take advantage of every tool or resource to improve the list as much as humanly possible, then they haven't done their job. Crows screwed GWS last year, clubs are still dealing with them this year. It is kind of expected for the team on the bottom to use that position to leverage better deals and try and get as talented a player as they can in the PSD. The planets have to align though, there isn't always a good quality player on the move, prepared to go into the PSD and wanting to go the worst team in the comp.

I don’t listen to much Trade Radio but I’d suggest listening to Silvagni’s breakdown of how the PSD and club relations work a few nights ago from a bloke who worked in thag industry.

He worked in the industry, but he also left Carlton in limbo with mediocre list management. They haven't even been able to make it into the top 8 despite a gazillion top 5 picks.

I think a trade will be done for CCJ, I am sure both clubs will do their best to get the best outcome for their own club, and it is desirable to have win-win outcomes, not be Dodoro-like when it comes to trades. But at the end of the day, being last for our club is an unfortunate reality of where we are at and we aren't getting the handouts of a NSW or QLD club. This is the first time in my lifetime the club has finished last, hopefully the last time in my lifetime too, however, it would still be a mistake to not take advantage of the situation to get better as quickly as possible.

If the shoe was on the other foot I doubt you would have the same position.

 

[Theo23]

Crows did it to GWS with Hately, a former 1st round pick from 2018, last year. They told GWS he was being taken in the PSD and didn't talk about a trade. The only club that really has any kind of power when it comes to guaranteed movement is the team on the bottom. Even though we were second last, we couldn't really force someone into the PSD, because if we pushed someone better than Hatley into the PSD, there are no guarantees that Crows wouldn't just turn around and take him instead. It would be a dick move, but it is a lot harder to convince a player to take a punt when there is no certainty.

It is why I find it funny the media talking about Collingwood taking Lipinski in the PSD, Really? If there isn't anyone better available we can just take him instead. It is not like Collingwood is outbidding us on anything atm.



$500k isn't a lot, average salary is $330k or thereabouts. I'd say the only one in the bottom 6 who couldn't find $1m would be Collingwood, but as they retire off the overpaid B graders and wean off of those back-ended contracts they will be TPP solvent again in a year or two.

For a club like ours, probably a few clubs, we have contracts brought forward from previous years so we are way under TPP cap for next year, after the trade/free agency period we will have to bring forward more contracts from beyond 2022 into 2022 to hit the 100% TPP cap. All clubs would leave a certain amount reserved to finalise after the trade/free agency period. I don't think anything is finalised until the last list lodgement.



We have had more than our fair share of players who have departed over the years, it is not often you get unlucky and have someone that goes to the team on the bottom. It is a sh*t deal when faced with trading with a team that is on the bottom but that is just the luck of the draw. For better or worse, we have let Higgins and Brown go last year, Tarrant can walk to wherever he wants. If Richmond was on the bottom of the ladder the year you chased Lynch, tell me your club wouldn't have screwed them over.

As much as I don't want to screw anyone over, if the club fails to take advantage of every tool or resource to improve the list as much as humanly possible, then they haven't done their job. Crows screwed GWS last year, clubs are still dealing with them this year. It is kind of expected for the team on the bottom to use that position to leverage better deals and try and get as talented a player as they can in the PSD. The planets have to align though, there isn't always a good quality player on the move, prepared to go into the PSD and wanting to go the worst team in the comp.



He worked in the industry, but he also left Carlton in limbo with mediocre list management. They haven't even been able to make it into the top 8 despite a gazillion top 5 picks.

I think a trade will be done for CCJ, I am sure both clubs will do their best to get the best outcome for their own club, and it is desirable to have win-win outcomes, not be Dodoro-like when it comes to trades. But at the end of the day, being last for our club is an unfortunate reality of where we are at and we aren't getting the handouts of a NSW or QLD club. This is the first time in my lifetime the club has finished last, hopefully the last time in my lifetime too, however, it would still be a mistake to not take advantage of the situation to get better as quickly as possible.

If the shoe was on the other foot I doubt you would have the same position.

I’ll get to the rest of the post first, but first comment is incorrect. I believe they offered pick 40 as a first and final offer, then went to the PSD. And as previously stated, teams aren’t ever looking to do the best deals with expansion clubs who have raided the draft with concessions over the last decade.


source: https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/www...s/news-story/e2e4c1769d0b146b7ad698325c50df91

And it seems as though they rejected 40 and the PSD route was taken as they weren’t going to use that pick anyway, so why take it.

 

[Theo23]

I’m not referring to Silvagni because I think he’s good at his job, we can bother agree Carlton suck. Only brought him up as he’s probably the most open about his time in that role given he’s got a media gig talking about it. He wasn’t talking about himself when he brought it up, rather the industry as a whole.

Also, on the Tom Lynch comment. He was a free agent, so whether we came 1st or 18th how would that have made a difference in how we went about acquiring him?

 

[Theo23]

Lastly, I’m not sold on other teams snaking players. Let’s say a team had 7th pick in the pre-season and they wanted to use it to acquire a player who couldn’t get a trade done. He nominates 500k over a 4-year deal. I can’t imagine club lining up to take him with one of the first 6 picks if he refuses to do a medical or meet with coaches. You risk sinking 2mill into a player where you aren’t 100% sure what you are getting.

plus, back in the 2000’s that stuff was more likely to happen. With player-driven contracts and movements, I just can’t fathom a team taking a player against his will. Might happen, and might be good for the comp if it does, but I just can’t see a good club doing it.

Lipinski probably slides to the Pies if they want him.

 

[DesertRoo]

Lastly, I’m not sold on other teams snaking players. Let’s say a team had 7th pick in the pre-season and they wanted to use it to acquire a player who couldn’t get a trade done. He nominates 500k over a 4-year deal. I can’t imagine club lining up to take him with one of the first 6 picks if he refuses to do a medical or meet with coaches. You risk sinking 2mill into a player where you aren’t 100% sure what you are getting.

plus, back in the 2000’s that stuff was more likely to happen. With player-driven contracts and movements, I just can’t fathom a team taking a player against his will. Might happen, and might be good for the comp if it does, but I just can’t see a good club doing it.

Lipinski probably slides to the Pies if they want him.

If a player nominated for the draft and refuses to meet the coaching/medical staff of another club, in the hope of landing at a specific club, he should sit out for the year because of draft tampering…

 

[Theo23]

If a player nominated for the draft and refuses to meet the coaching/medical staff of another club, in the hope of landing at a specific club, he should sit out for the year because of draft tampering…

It would be pretty easy to do. There’s nothing forcing you to take a meeting or do a medical. Draft tampering would be reaching out to them and telling them not to take you. Which rightly or wrongly, is still happening in the national draft from time to time.

 

[DesertRoo]

It would be pretty easy to do. There’s nothing forcing you to take a meeting or do a medical. Draft tampering would be reaching out to them and telling them not to take you. Which rightly or wrongly, is still happening in the national draft from time to time.

And there’s nothing forcing you to nominating for the draft..

integrity is something missing from the hierarchy at offal house, as something like you’re suggesting above wouldn’t fly in any other comp.

 

[Merlin007]

And there’s nothing forcing you to nominating for the draft..

integrity is something missing from the hierarchy at offal house, as something like you’re suggesting above wouldn’t fly in any other comp.

FMD, how much wouldn't fly in any other elite competition around the world? let's start with rigging the fixture to suit the financial interests of the governing body

 

[Theo23]

And there’s nothing forcing you to nominating for the draft..

integrity is something missing from the hierarchy at offal house, as something like you’re suggesting above wouldn’t fly in any other comp.

Oh, you won’t here any disagreements on that. I agree, it should be open slather.
But it’s a dirty industry with teams and players trying to get what they want, how they want it.

I’m just acknowledging that is does happen and there are ways to finesse the system. There’s a reason players have agents to find ways to get s**t like that pushed through. And the better an agent is at something like that, the more money they make.

 

[Andyy]

I think you’ll find a number of North posters offering a very late pick to get it done in good faith, that’s the mark and good on us for the generous offer.

The tigers should be concentrating on how to get Tarrant via trade, that’s where the value is in saving the Chol compo.

Just a note, the tigers poached a required player and part of the leadership team. Let’s not pretend the tigers have morals. Tarrant leaves with our blessing as we need to refresh up the backline anyway, but it doesn’t discount it’s a dog act.


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Why is it a dog act?

CCJ is a required player for us too.

If you value Tarrant so highly why not offer a 2nd year prior to Richmond's offer?

 

[ferball]

Don’t let the truth get in the way of your fairy tales.
The AFL suspended CCJ and Stack.
They never paid any of the fine personally.
As to the rest of your post, anything to confirm that or just a bit more typing for the sake of the audience?

Why are you even on our *en board mate?

 

[Merlin007]

Don’t let the truth get in the way of your fairy tales.
The AFL suspended CCJ and Stack.
They never paid any of the fine personally.
As to the rest of your post, anything to confirm that or just a bit more typing for the sake of the audience?

They never paid the fines because the union stepped in and told the club to pay up; Mrs Cotchin apparently didn’t need the same help because brendon gale was happy to help out the captain’s wife. No wonder CCJ wants out

 

[ferball]

Did we make him pay the fine? Didn't think it played out that way.

Dunno. Maybe this website is run by incorrigible liars. What do you reckon?

Club Statement: Stack and Coleman-Jones AFL protocol breach

Richmond players Sydney Stack and Callum Coleman-Jones have been suspended for 10 matches, and will be sent home from Queensland, following a breach of the AFL’s COVID-19 protocols.

www.richmondfc.com.au

Love how the Qld coppers arrested Stack (who reportedly wasn't involved in any altercation too) but not CCJ. Qld coppers hey. What a pack of campaigners.

 

[ferball]

They never paid the fines because the union stepped in and told the club to pay up; Mrs Cotchin apparently didn’t need the same help because brendon gale was happy to help out the captain’s wife. No wonder CCJ wants out

Really. The AFLPA did something useful?

Still its no wonder he wants out given that sort of thing. Culture.

 

[Rioli2Rioli]

This is an interesting thread

 

[dus]

Can we do some sort of shenanigans like:
1. Trade Tarrant for a bunch of later Richmond picks.

2. Package up a bunch of picks for the Dog’s first. (17ish)

3. Trade this first for CCJ+Richmonds 20ish pick.

Tarrant gets to his destination.
We get CCJ
Dogs get combo for Darcy.
Tigers get a pick upgrade into the first round
We still get a pick in the sweet 10-30 range where there will be more movement in draft selections amongst different teams.

This is good.

Once we finish stage 2, we walk him anyway.

Welcome to business.

They’ll probably have Taz on $80k with a $350k Puma sponsorship. * them.

 

[LuvtheKangas]

This is an interesting thread
View attachment 1248547

Not really. The whole conversation started when your mate Theo made a whiny post about how unfair it would be if we used our superior bargaining position to our best advantage. He even asserted (without basis) that using the PSD is our first choice, though his subsequent posts show he actually believes trading might work. Both options are available to us, so it's appropriate that they're considered, no?

Yeah, it's annoying to Theo that we have the upper hand on this by virtue of our bottom finish. He need to get over it. Do you agree with him that North should simply cede our advantage in the interests of giving Richmond a better deal?

The thread will become more interesting if your answer is yes, as I would love to hear an unbiased justification.