Player Watch #38 Noah Cumberland

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RockJobster0312

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I'd take Cumberland over Ralphsmith from what I've seen, sounds a tad arrogant, that I know more than the entire Richmond selectors!! but there is something about his speed, agility and aggression that is pretty unique. Ralphsmith has the speed and athleticism, but not sure about the footy nous yet.
Iโ€™ve said this before, but Cumberland has had two good game at VFL level only.

He looked well out of his depth before that, and the speed of the VFL game caught him out more often than not.

Ralphsmith has shown more flashes at AFL level than Cumberland has at VFL level. Letโ€™s not get carried away.
 

RockJobster0312

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I don't get how the club states that Cumberland was close to getting senior games at the end of the season then they delist him and risk losing him in the rookie draft. It's not like he's commanding big dollars. He's had bugger all pre-season training or continuity and came off a serious injury to be pushing for seniors - a bloody impressive feat. Bizarre list management imo, should be locking him down.
I actually think that itโ€™s the logical list management move. We have four players out of Contract (Naish, Biggie, Cumberland, Garthwaite) and three rookie listed players out of contract (DES, Miller, Stack).

We need Senior list spots for our draft hand PLUS spots to potentially move up Pickett and Stack to the Senior list. Even if you could keep both on the rookie list for another year, it means next year you may have to make five plus list changes next year (albeit teams can use their mandatory three picks to upgrade rookies to the Senior list - but our draft hand at this stage is looking strong next draft as well).

That puts us in a very tight position, and list spots are at a premium. As I say, it was the logical move to keep both of them but make the required list spots available.
 

Grrr

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Iโ€™ve said this before, but Cumberland has had two good game at VFL level only.

He looked well out of his depth before that, and the speed of the VFL game caught him out more often than not.

Ralphsmith has shown more flashes at AFL level than Cumberland has at VFL level. Letโ€™s not get carried away.
He played a handful of games in the VFL all year with a 3 week covid layoff in between. He was off a reco and hadn't played since playing in Qld as a junior.
A few games in and he took a game apart. Not sure how much you expect from him, but you're a hard marker if you'd expect more. Was even mentioned as making a possible debut.
 

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Bojangles17

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Cumberland is explosive and some sort of athlete.
I reckon cumbo was promising rather than emphatically putting his name down as being a next gen star . I agree though , only handful of games post acl and you couldnโ€™t ask for much more , needs to improve plenty again to bring that to afl level
 

Drunken Wookie

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I actually think that itโ€™s the logical list management move. We have four players out of Contract (Naish, Biggie, Cumberland, Garthwaite) and three rookie listed players out of contract (DES, Miller, Stack).

We need Senior list spots for our draft hand PLUS spots to potentially move up Pickett and Stack to the Senior list. Even if you could keep both on the rookie list for another year, it means next year you may have to make five plus list changes next year (albeit teams can use their mandatory three picks to upgrade rookies to the Senior list - but our draft hand at this stage is looking strong next draft as well).

That puts us in a very tight position, and list spots are at a premium. As I say, it was the logical move to keep both of them but make the required list spots available.
Get some, let's be honest, fairly speculative late second round/third round picks onto the primary list ahead of a kid who looks ready to debut? Also risking another club nabbing him. It just seems like a strange move from the outside.
 

RockJobster0312

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He played a handful of games in the VFL all year with a 3 week covid layoff in between. He was off a reco and hadn't played since playing in Qld as a junior.
A few games in and he took a game apart. Not sure how much you expect from him, but you're a hard marker if you'd expect more. Was even mentioned as making a possible debut.
The way he finished the season was very strong, and his two good games I refer to were his last two games. I donโ€™t disagree that you canโ€™t ask for much more than that in those two games specifically.

Certainly he deserves another year on the list and a full pre-season with full VFL opportunity. Iโ€™m happy that he seemingly has that.

Yet letโ€™s not go overboard and suggest that those two good games put him in a higher echelon of player such as Ralphsmith. Or that he has shown a consistency that gives confidence in his ability to perform at an AFL level. In the last two games he was very good. But in the previous games he was awful. He needs more runs on the board more than anything, which he will get next year.

Get some, let's be honest, fairly speculative late second round/third round picks onto the primary list ahead of a kid who looks ready to debut? Also risking another club nabbing him. It just seems like a strange move from the outside.
Well Iโ€™d point out that Cumberland himself is a pick in the 40s (second round). And those list spots are mandated by the AFL as well as the amount of picks that we look to be taking into the draft.

Iโ€™m terms of another club taking him (and Biggie for that matter) in the rookie draft ahead of us, thatโ€™s certainly a risk. I donโ€™t believe that it has happened before however, and I would hope that the COVID list restrictions and the fact that most teams will be doing something similar this year (Constable, Lachie Oโ€™Brien etc.) will see that risk be maintained at a relatively low level.

Again, let us not lose sight of the Forest from the trees. His last two games at VFL was very good, but is showing something in two games enough consistently at VFL level to definitely say Cumberland is still anything more than a speculative player himself?
 

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I don't get how the club states that Cumberland was close to getting senior games at the end of the season then they delist him and risk losing him in the rookie draft. It's not like he's commanding big dollars. He's had bugger all pre-season training or continuity and came off a serious injury to be pushing for seniors - a bloody impressive feat. Bizarre list management imo, should be locking him down.
Using the system to our advantage.
Nothing wrong with that.
 

Spluff

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I don't get how the club states that Cumberland was close to getting senior games at the end of the season then they delist him and risk losing him in the rookie draft. It's not like he's commanding big dollars. He's had bugger all pre-season training or continuity and came off a serious injury to be pushing for seniors - a bloody impressive feat. Bizarre list management imo, should be locking him down.
Not like it was hard to be close to senior games for us - we had MRJ on the ground who was about as useful as Helen d'Amico.
 

mauricerioli

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There may be a gentlemanโ€™s agreement of sorts between clubs, that if a club delists a player and promises to rookie them that another club doesnโ€™t jump in.
 

SunshineBoy

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You realise Aarts has a contact and Noah doesn't? What do you propose? sack Aarts? trade him?
2020 Aarts wasn't bad. I actually saw a lot of games that year. In a team that was playing well. Fair enough he was rewarded with a couple of years. Promoted from the VFL team I think. 2021: The whole team looked crap this year. And I'm all for ditching whatever doesn't work. i.e. small forwards who guard space. List management has been a bit strange. I would not have renewed Parker. I would've moved Caddy on too. But, if they've retained spots I imagine Dimma sees some role for them.
Cumberland looks like a great footballer. has had his career stuffed by huge injury mid season and then COVID. I thought he looked good when drafted and when played this year. But he is out of contract and with Nyoun, delisted and I doubt both will return. I think Noah is the better footballer and is more likely to play senior football soon.
He didnโ€™t have a contract till after the season finished , didnโ€™t deserve an extension, I hope you still feel the same way when stack goes to another club because if it
 

SunshineBoy

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When you look back at the trade period and the fact that the there were higher potential players on considerably less coin than Caddy (Brander, Constable, Dumont, Sier, even Naish) that received no interest both as trade targets nor as delisted free agents, Caddy was extremely unlikely to find another home.

In terms of Aarts, I think the reason we signed him on when we did was as you said to start, in 2020 he played his role. You need that in players - even if theyโ€™re not best 26. The reality is that the โ€˜best 26โ€™ shouldnโ€™t be your litmus test anyway, as when you think on injuries, form, suspensions etc. you need more like aโ€™best 30-32โ€™.

The other element is that Aarts and Parker are both on the rookie list, whereas Cumberland was on the Senior list. We needed space on the Senior list (I believe due to the rookie list rules and time spent on there), so itโ€™s equally about as much as keeping the likes of Stack and Pickett.
Arts is on the senior list with a two year contract extension,and what role did he play? Guarding space handballing to the opposition getting caught with the ball?
 

tora tora tora

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He didnโ€™t have a contract till after the season finished , didnโ€™t deserve an extension, I hope you still feel the same way when stack goes to another club because if it
Pretty sure aarts got a 2 year contract at end of 2020. As he isn't out of contract until 2022
Stack leaves the club you're going to blame it on aarts.. sounds like you don't like Aarts too. Bit harsh as he was ok in 2020. Played 14 games. Didn't go well in the final. Got himself another contract. Unfortunately stack got a 10 week ban, and f@ed up in Perth. Came from a long way back this year. But was a highlight when most of team was horrendous
Not resigning Parker would've freed up one spot. Trading caddy another..
No news on stack is probably good news. I very much hope he stays and is best 22. Every club seems to be doing their final cuts and stack has survived.
Maybe a new coach will solve our forward problems. But I'd be happy to not see George or.aarts first choice small forward this year.
 
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Charlie Pannam

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Blair mentioned the other day on radio he was unlucky not to debut this year. Coming off that knee reckon weโ€™ve only seen a small sample of what heโ€™s capable off.
Get himself super fit so he can play that high hf capable of exposing opponents with his speed.

The club has promised him a spot and stated that on our website, good enough for me that heโ€™ll be in Y&B next year.
 

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Arts is on the senior list with a two year contract extension,and what role did he play? Guarding space handballing to the opposition getting caught with the ball?
Pretty sure aarts got a 2 year contract at end of 2020. As he isn't out of contract until 2022
Stack leaves the club you're going to blame it on aarts.. sounds like you don't like Aarts too. Bit harsh as he was ok in 2020. Played 14 games. Didn't go well in the final. Got himself another contract. Unfortunately stack got a 10 week ban, and f@ed up in Perth. Came from a long way back this year. But was a highlight when most of team was horrendous
Not resigning Parker would've freed up one spot. Trading caddy another..
No news on stack is probably good news. I very much hope he stays and is best 22. Every club seems to be doing their final cuts and stack has survived.
Maybe a new coach will solve our forward problems. But I'd be happy to not see George or.aarts first choice small forward this year.
Jake Aarts
#16 Richmond Tigers
Age: 26yr 10mth Games: 34 Born: December 8, 1994 Origin: Richmond Football Club
Height: 177cm Weight: 75kg Position: Forward
Last Drafted: Round 1, Pick #16 2018 Rookie Draft by Richmond Tigers
Supercoach Price: $217,700 Supercoach Profile
AFL Fantasy Price: $319,000 AFL Fantasy Profile
Contract Status: Out of contract at the end of 2022 AFL Player Contracts
 

tora tora tora

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He didnโ€™t have a contract till after the season finished , didnโ€™t deserve an extension, I hope you still feel the same way when stack goes to another club because if it
I think Stack wants to stay but feels insulted about the contract we have offered him. Whispers suggest that it is full of conditions and triggers in an effort to motivate him to prepare and perfC

I can see why the club has created such stipulations and requirements and I can see why Sydney feels like the club is being too harsh and undervaluing him. I also think that he knows he can be is own worst enemy and may not have the discipline he needs to get the best out of himself so he doesn't disappoint the club, his teammates and, most importantly, himself. I genuinely think that he is frightened that he won't be able to hold it together long enough to be the player he believes he can become and that terrifies him more than playing the victim card and blaming the world around him if he does fail.

Stack has such an upside. He could easily be as consistent and as damaging as Bolton. If he signs and commits to the team and himself, next year I can see him truly announcing himself as a star of the competition.
I thought Stacky had resigned for a year just did some checking in that thread and to quote Tragic. Seems like he's not signed yet, too many conditions. Anyhow again its not Aarts contract holding him out. Its the conditions we are putting on him.
 

Grrr

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The way he finished the season was very strong, and his two good games I refer to were his last two games. I donโ€™t disagree that you canโ€™t ask for much more than that in those two games specifically.

Certainly he deserves another year on the list and a full pre-season with full VFL opportunity. Iโ€™m happy that he seemingly has that.

Yet letโ€™s not go overboard and suggest that those two good games put him in a higher echelon of player such as Ralphsmith. Or that he has shown a consistency that gives confidence in his ability to perform at an AFL level. In the last two games he was very good. But in the previous games he was awful. He needs more runs on the board more than anything, which he will get next year.



Well Iโ€™d point out that Cumberland himself is a pick in the 40s (second round). And those list spots are mandated by the AFL as well as the amount of picks that we look to be taking into the draft.

Iโ€™m terms of another club taking him (and Biggie for that matter) in the rookie draft ahead of us, thatโ€™s certainly a risk. I donโ€™t believe that it has happened before however, and I would hope that the COVID list restrictions and the fact that most teams will be doing something similar this year (Constable, Lachie Oโ€™Brien etc.) will see that risk be maintained at a relatively low level.

Again, let us not lose sight of the Forest from the trees. His last two games at VFL was very good, but is showing something in two games enough consistently at VFL level to definitely say Cumberland is still anything more than a speculative player himself?
I don't agree regarding Cumberland but each to his own. I guess all players are speculative early on.
 

Grrr

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I reckon cumbo was promising rather than emphatically putting his name down as being a next gen star . I agree though , only handful of games post acl and you couldnโ€™t ask for much more , needs to improve plenty again to bring that to afl level
He has so many AFL traits. He goes very hard at the ball in the air and on the ground, he is super athletic with real speed and great lateral movement and he is very aggressive. Of course he needs to improve, but his 5 goals in no time at all in a VFL game showed what he is capable of. With a full preseason I think he be right up there next season. Hopefully.
 

RockJobster0312

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Pretty sure he is on the main list, off the Richmond website..#16,2018 RookieElevation
Think thatโ€™s just an error on the website. I see that itโ€™s over a few players having a quick look.

Hereโ€™s a link to a story from mid this year that indicates he is still on the rookie list.

 

Sir_Loin

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Blair mentioned the other day on radio he was unlucky not to debut this year. Coming off that knee reckon weโ€™ve only seen a small sample of what heโ€™s capable off.
Get himself super fit so he can play that high hf capable of exposing opponents with his speed.

The club has promised him a spot and stated that on our website, good enough for me that heโ€™ll be in Y&B next year.
no idea where he plays. Is he a mid? Caddy type medium forward?

would want to have a few strings to his bow.
 

Charlie Pannam

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no idea where he plays. Is he a mid? Caddy type medium forward?

would want to have a few strings to his bow.
Medium forward from what Iโ€™ve seen in the 2s, no idea of his midfield craft or tank

heโ€™s only 183cm, but good vertical leap and can take a pack mark.

Explosive at ground level too, that game he kicked 6 he was hitting ground level ball ala Charlie Cameron ( maybe Iโ€™m adding a bit of Mayo) .

Itโ€™s hard to judge 2s form though I remember thinking Alex Gilmour was going to be a very good medium/small forward after some very impressive 2s performances and got delisted not long after ๐Ÿ˜‚
 

Sir_Loin

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Medium forward from what Iโ€™ve seen in the 2s, no idea of his midfield craft or tank

heโ€™s only 183cm, but good vertical leap and can take a pack mark.

Explosive at ground level too, that game he kicked 6 he was hitting ground level ball ala Charlie Cameron ( maybe Iโ€™m adding a bit of Mayo) .

Itโ€™s hard to judge 2s form though I remember thinking Alex Gilmour was going to be a very good medium/small forward after some very impressive 2s performances and got delisted not long after ๐Ÿ˜‚
remember David Gourdis? Haha Jesus
 

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