Current 4yo Boy Missing Yunta SA

[PenfoldsFan]

What would be a more 'perfect time, then?

Introducing a whole night, and limiting the opportunity to mount a full-scale search introduced a range of other alternative scenarios - further to wander without being seen, animal and human intervention, misadventure, ....

As I said, mid morning.

If this is just a cover story for something more sinister, then having it begin on or just before dusk would be counter productive as whilst as you say it would hamper an initial search, once day breaks and you have boots on the ground and eyes in the air, he shouldn't have been too far away, but he wasn't.

From mid morning, at 2.5km/hr average, hes 5-6km away before a call is made with nothing to stop him going further as time ticks by.
The search starts at the homestead and works outward, so they are continually playing catchup.
By the time they've covered a 5km radius thoroughly by air, he's closer to 10km away, and so on.
Thats a lot more believable than a 4yo traveling all night in the dark imo.

Every person ive spoken to about it has virtually said the same thing, as soon as it became dark and he realised he was lost, fear would have set in and he'd find somewhere close by to hide.
No one believes a 4yo continues to wander around in the dark alone, if he did, he would be the exception and whilst that is a possibility, what are the odds?

So how far from home would he realisticaly be by dark, as I said before, a few k's at best, and thats if he walked in a straight line which I highly doubt.
.
A lost child that sees and hears searchers after a night out there would be running towards the noise if he were only a few k's away.

 

[PenfoldsFan]

Could be part truth to the story.
The Grandmother could have said Gus was inside the house watching tv or playing in a room while she was busy in another room and Gus slipped out the door unnoticed instead of saying he was left outside for half hour.

Agreed, and its that honesty that has me believe thats where he actually was to begin with.
The reality and the story put forward split sometime after 5.30 imo.

 

[PenfoldsFan]

I think the playing in the dirt like (at some time) is most likely true. There needs to be a narrative which shows why Gus may have been left unattended, but also that the carer in charge knew where he was. It's plausible, but also convenient.

I also think the 'looked for him at 5.30' is plausible - that's the time it would be starting to get dark, work is finished for the day, time to get the little kids washed, fed and ready for bed (given the younger sibling's age).
What prompted the grandparent to 'look’ at 5.30? Was that when the other adults returned home? Probably didn't 'look' before then IMO.

What I have doubt about is the 'last seen at 5pm' claim. How do they know it was 5pm? Why go to the dirt pile at 5pm, and not bring Gus back then? What was the normal routine?
I think it's quite possible that Gus was forgotten about for several hours at least, and this negligence has been mitigated by the '5pm sighting' narrative. I just think the 5pm thing is very 'convenient'.

Yep, and if 5pm was really 4pm he'd have been further away by dark or 4pm really 3pm, further away again.
Now youre getting to that point where a daytime search the following morning starting from the homestead and working outward leaves a lot more catching up to do and less likely that he hears or sees anyone to help him.

 

[Underarrest_]

I think the playing in the dirt like (at some time) is most likely true. There needs to be a narrative which shows why Gus may have been left unattended, but also that the carer in charge knew where he was. It's plausible, but also convenient.

I also think the 'looked for him at 5.30' is plausible - that's the time it would be starting to get dark, work is finished for the day, time to get the little kids washed, fed and ready for bed (given the younger sibling's age).
What prompted the grandparent to 'look’ at 5.30? Was that when the other adults returned home? Probably didn't 'look' before then IMO.

What I have doubt about is the 'last seen at 5pm' claim. How do they know it was 5pm? Why go to the dirt pile at 5pm, and not bring Gus back then? What was the normal routine?
I think it's quite possible that Gus was forgotten about for several hours at least, and this negligence has been mitigated by the '5pm sighting' narrative. I just think the 5pm thing is very 'convenient'.

This is possible. Police would have to confirm that the family/Gus was not anywhere else that day such as at a club, visiting neighbours/other family, gone to a bigger town shopping and what time they might have returned if they did.

 

[Kurve]

Did you do a door knock, Kurve ?

No, didn't engage with any locals at all.

Just walked a way, looking at the foliage and our own footprint, kicked some dirt up, wondered what the hawk was interested in but it was chasing something moving fast, not still. Probably a small snake.

 

[Lady O]

How does this fit with no footprints, no tracks, no scent? Wouldn't entering a dam leave some sort of print or track? There's a finite number of deep enough dams nearby, searchable by drone first, and then by foot with or without dogs. Bodies float, unless weighed down. Not saying it's impossible but surely all possible dams have been examined by now?

It's not that simple. When the body sinks during drowning, it may become stuck in the silt in a dam and fail to refloat. Children have a different ratio of gut to overall mass. Dam water is very cold due to the silt blocking sunlight, and the bacteria that causes the gasses to collect in the gut may not be sufficiently activated to refloat the body.

 

[dc3]

What would be a more 'perfect time, then?

Introducing a whole night, and limiting the opportunity to mount a full-scale search introduced a range of other alternative scenarios - further to wander without being seen, animal and human intervention, misadventure, ....

5:00pm two weeks earlier …..

 

[Frank Bunn]

If Gus had wandered off, would he have gone into the bush? Or perhaps, if he was looking for Mummy, he would have walked down the driveway? It's only about 250 metres to Oak Park Road, where he could have been abducted without trace or been the victim of an accident.

Alternatively, someone could have parked on Oak Park Road. Walked in unseen and taken him. The farm runs thousands of sheep, which needs workers. Who else had regular access to the homestead?

 

[CodyRose]

As coincidence would have it, I've been away in South Australia and checked out the terrain near Yunta, of course I didn't go to the Oak Park property but it's pretty much the same all through that area.

Since I was there, took a little walk.

The flies are small, sticky and thick, you can see for miles and looking at the foliage from the ground is very different to drone or video footage. The smaller stuff closer to the ground and clumpy is not dense enough to conceal a child but as they get bigger or bushy enough to hide a four year old, they start to grow more like little trees with skinny bare limbs from the base, so they're no good either.

Looked to be real easy to spot a child, from a long way away actually.

As we walked out it seemed Gus probably wasn't there or they'd have found him.

No dogs or signs of, there were enough roadkilled roos to attract them but no wedgetails and the only bird of prey I spotted was a hawk.

Thankyou very much for doing that.

 

[CodyRose]

5:00pm two weeks earlier …..

Any day between the day he was last independently seen and official "disappearance day". IMO

 

[CodyRose]

Yep, and if 5pm was really 4pm he'd have been further away by dark or 4pm really 3pm, further away again.
Now youre getting to that point where a daytime search the following morning starting from the homestead and working outward leaves a lot more catching up to do and less likely that he hears or sees anyone to help him.

I think a lost 4 yr old child would be crying loudly once it got dark.

 

[FR0GGY]

Try as I might I can't even get my head around the concept of a grandparent leaving a 4yo alone, unsighted, for a full 30 minutes, whether they're playing outside or not.

I also keep coming back to the family's alleged description of Gus as 'a shy boy, not known to wander'.

A 'shy' boy doesn't strike me as one who summons the courage and will to wander away from his sense of security formed by the presence of the home and grandparent, and in doing so contradicts the family's assessment of him.

Imo.

IMO country folks/kids are different.
They would do things city folks wouldn’t dream of letting kids do.

 

[Cataholic]

IMO country folks/kids are different.
They would do things city folks wouldn’t dream of letting kids do.

Don't disagree, but I still reckon the fundamental instinct to be protective is the same.

 

[FR0GGY]

Don't disagree, but I still reckon the fundamental instinct to be protective is the same.

Yeah but that’s my point what’s protective city V country is completely different.

 

[Cataholic]

Yeah but that’s my point what’s protective city V country is completely different.

I think the premise of keeping a child, a 4yo, under close surveillance remains the same.

The same grandparent allegedly had need to use a shotgun to despatch a snake on their very porch, just a metre or two from the house, but they deemed it suitable to leave a 4yo unattended for 30 minutes around 20 metres from the house??

Yeah, nah. Imo.

 

[nut]

You might want to do a bit of research on wedge tailed eagles. The birds generally weigh up to 5kg and under ideal conditions can lift up to 50% of their body weight. They don’t take kangaroos, a Joey maybe and they certainly wouldn’t have taken a child that may have weighed 2-3 times the birds weight. Now if Yunta had Pterodactyls then I could believe it .

Wedge-tailed Eagle

The Wedge-tailed Eagle is Australia's largest living bird of prey and one of the largest eagles in the world.

australian.museum

I will add it’s not to say an eagle wouldn’t attempt to attack a small child but it’s not going to swoop and lift the child away. A lot of reports of eagles and large animals are because the animal is already dead, not due to the eagle attacking it.

 

[Kurve]

When I read that story, the child was found 180m up a tree lol

 

[FR0GGY]

I think the premise of keeping a child, a 4yo, under close surveillance remains the same.

The same grandparent allegedly had need to use a shotgun to despatch a snake on their very porch, just a metre or two from the house, but they deemed it suitable to leave a 4yo unattended for 30 minutes around 20 metres from the house??

Yeah, nah. Imo.

If you believe the snake story.
They were also looking after/ distracted by a younger child were they not?

 

[Cataholic]

If you believe the snake story.
They were also looking after/ distracted by a younger child were they not?

Yes they were allegedly.

 

[Kurve]

If Gus had wandered off, would he have gone into the bush? Or perhaps, if he was looking for Mummy, he would have walked down the driveway? It's only about 250 metres to Oak Park Road, where he could have been abducted without trace or been the victim of an accident.

Alternatively, someone could have parked on Oak Park Road. Walked in unseen and taken him. The farm runs thousands of sheep, which needs workers. Who else had regular access to the homestead?

View attachment 2473340

It doesn't seem possible anybody could sneak up on that property, unless they knew the occupants routines and where they would be later in the day, making an approach from behind the main residence using the outbuildings and sheds etc as cover.

Or they snuck in at night and stayed hidden through the day but then if abduction was the purpose, not only do they have to get in unseen but they also have to get out.

 

[Percel]

I think the premise of keeping a child, a 4yo, under close surveillance remains the same.

The same grandparent allegedly had need to use a shotgun to despatch a snake on their very porch, just a metre or two from the house, but they deemed it suitable to leave a 4yo unattended for 30 minutes around 20 metres from the house??

Yeah, nah. Imo.

Tiger, copperhead, brown or black vs a kid playing?

I’d be guilty of paying more attention to the Joe Blake out bush

 

[PenfoldsFan]

It doesn't seem possible anybody could sneak up on that property, unless they knew the occupants routines and where they would be later in the day, making an approach from behind the main residence using the outbuildings and sheds etc as cover.

Or they snuck in at night and stayed hidden through the day but then if abduction was the purpose, not only do they have to get in unseen but they also have to get out.

The first thing they'd need to know is that there was a child there to abduct.
Then, they'd need to know he'd be outside for 30 minutes unattended on that day.

 

[Kurve]

My money's still on a dam. If not on Oak Park, then somewhere close by. I wonder if Gus had a pet dog. Kids have been known to go exploring with their dog. I guess we would have heard if he had, unless the dog came home before Gus was found missing.

The dam I saw divers in looked slimed with long grass or reeds a small child could get caught up in and sunk under.

I thought at the time, draining it entirely and dredging might be necessary.

 

[shorsky]

Try as I might I can't even get my head around the concept of a grandparent leaving a 4yo alone, unsighted, for a full 30 minutes, whether they're playing outside or not.

I also keep coming back to the family's alleged description of Gus as 'a shy boy, not known to wander'.

A 'shy' boy doesn't strike me as one who summons the courage and will to wander away from his sense of security formed by the presence of the home and grandparent, and in doing so contradicts the family's assessment of him.

Imo.

I’d suggest that even those children classed as ‘wanderers’ have their own very sound reasons for going off somewhere.
It’s usually because they are intrigued by something - maybe they heard an interesting sound, saw a reflection, or they’re following a butterfly or a bird or a rainbow; maybe they decided to do something or find something, perhaps something they overheard adults talking about. They don’t usually just go off aimlessly, and they don’t consider the possibility of getting lost because their thoughts don’t go that far in the moment.
I did wonder if perhaps Jess had said she wouldn’t be gone long, but then ended up being away for hours. Would Gus head off to look for her ? I doubt it because I think it’d be common for her to be gone for some time.
If he got into trouble from Shannon and she said ‘just you wait til GM Josie gets home!’ - would he run away ? If that happened, would he hide when he heard them calling & looking for him ? Would he go on the road to walk to his Dad ? And perhaps got picked up and abducted …

 

[shorsky]

I think the premise of keeping a child, a 4yo, under close surveillance remains the same.

The same grandparent allegedly had need to use a shotgun to despatch a snake on their very porch, just a metre or two from the house, but they deemed it suitable to leave a 4yo unattended for 30 minutes around 20 metres from the house??

Yeah, nah. Imo.

Different grandparent. The gun toutin’ snake dispatcher was said to be out tending sheep when Gus went missing.