Opinion A different perspective

[FR0GGY]

Nah we won that first quarter too, the stance rattling them was the big talking point. We won every first quarter of that finals series.

The power stance has a winning record does it not

 

[John Who]

And, what is the big deal if you are an apologist?

Isn’t that your or anyone else's choice. You are allowed to support your way. It is your membership.

My choice is, I can engage in conversation with you or not. If I choose to, I should act civil and if someone opinion is different, don’t argue with them, maybe others should try and understand that point.

But they won’t and they certainly don’t.

The big deal is that Jenny doesn’t think she’s a a club apologist and that a lot in here are mislabelling her as such when they either don’t know the meaning of the word or they do it to ridicule for fun’s sake. Or she is actually an apologist and she’s in denial.

I personally don’t think she’s an apologist.

 

[Morning_Fog]

The big deal is that Jenny doesn’t think she’s a a club apologist and that a lot in here are mislabelling her as such when they either don’t know the meaning of the word or they do it to ridicule for fun’s sake. Or she is actually an apologist and she’s in denial.

I personally don’t think she’s an apologist.

I understand that.

Even if she was, and i do not believe she is. It would not matter.

 

[FR0GGY]

When you put all the events together.
Tippett debarcle/sanctions
Sanderson sacking
Dean Bailey suspension & death
Phil Walsh murder
Best player walking out
GF loss
Power stance ridicule
Sam Jacobs brothers Death
Camp Debacle
Tex’s baby passing
Sloane’s baby passing
(I’m sure I’ve missed something)

Combine it with the off field ineptness you see and hear about it’s a wonder we haven’t had Carlton like results.

Also to those that say that the Phil Walsh murder wouldn’t have affected them that much just go and watch the West Coast match following his passing.

 

[John Who]

I understand that.

Even if she was, and i do not believe she is. It would not matter.

It doesn’t matter to you but it matters to Jenny, which is the only person that matters with respect to Jenny.

It’s about respect of the individual in a forum. We all deserve that.

 

[Morning_Fog]

It doesn’t matter to you but it matters to Jenny, which is the only person that matters with respect to Jenny.

It’s about respect of the individual in a forum. We all deserve that.

John, my comment would apply to everyone. Not just jenny.

 

[Thegibbsgamble]

Let's not forget that forums like Big Footy also provide unlimited opportunities for anonymous criticism, much of which is purely opinion based on prejudices and limited knowledge.
While this thread was started as a genuine conversation about mental health and well being being part of our recent structural and performance issues, many of you have chosen, once again, to use it as a vehicle to abuse and denigrate from the comfort of your keyboards. Big Footy is symptomatic of the problem and will never be part of the solution.

You sound like ricciuto when he said go support some other club or shut up.

The club puts out anonymous bullshit all the time with controlled leaks to the media.

 

[Thegibbsgamble]

The big deal is that Jenny doesn’t think she’s a a club apologist and that a lot in here are mislabelling her as such when they either don’t know the meaning of the word or they do it to ridicule for fun’s sake. Or she is actually an apologist and she’s in denial.

I personally don’t think she’s an apologist.

Your memory not good hey?

She's gone off with some serious personal abuse due to cognitive dissonance a few times.

 

[Thegibbsgamble]

As with 99.9% of non-Geelong supporters, I can't stand Dangerfield (though I will concede he's an elite player). But is it really reasonable to have expected him to change his mind and stay just because of Walsh's passing?

Would anyone, in any line of employment, say to their partner, "I know we made all these plans, but my boss just sadly passed away, and I've decided to stay put." Or if you were the on the other side of the coin, would you be happy if your partner said that to you?

Having said that, those crocodile tears of his in the WC game does seem a bit rich in retrospect.

After such an event, he had an obligation to tell everyone he was leaving and not leave us hanging for months and months.

He is and always be a campaigner.

 

[Morning_Fog]

As with 99.9% of non-Geelong supporters, I can't stand Dangerfield (though I will concede he's an elite player). But is it really reasonable to have expected him to change his mind and stay just because of Walsh's passing?

Would anyone, in any line of employment, say to their partner, "I know we made all these plans, but my boss just sadly passed away, and I've decided to stay put." Or if you were the on the other side of the coin, would you be happy if your partner said that to you?

Having said that, those crocodile tears of his in the WC game does seem a bit rich in retrospect.

I actually think that would be a very fair and reasonable time to change your mind. Especially if you were a leader in that organisation.

A perfect example would be, a colleague of mine sadly passed away in a motor vehicle accident late last year and his deputy has chosen to move on at the end of that year. Due to his passing and the sudden loss of leaders in that workplace, she decided to place her move on hold for 12 months to help find a suitable replacement and allow a transition to occur.

 

[marty36]

These comments mainly by salty opposition supporters that the club is broken are laughable. The 2017 GF meltdown and camp bulls**t has gone on long enough. Its boring and lazy journalism. At what point will we stop hearing about 2017? Another 20years? Tbh the club has brought a lot of this trolling media coverage on itself due to total mismanagement. The club needs to weed out those that oversaw the mismanagement. The club also needs to be handed back to its members. At that point will we have the club we all deserve.

Are you going to lend the club the $$$ to payout the debt owed by the club to allow this

So members get control

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[subaru]

The point is, I can get all upset and angry like you are, or I can wait until the review is complete and then react according to the outcome. You are going to maintain the rage and then double down if the outcome isn’t what you want which is what you expect, right? And achieve what exactly? Meanwhile I continue to live my life, don’t take my anger out on my family or random people on an Internet forum, and should things go as you suspect, I’ll contemplate cancelling our gold memberships at the end. Or, if there ARE massive changes, I can have saved all that angst and aggravation!

Jen,
Bedwetters gonna wet the bed

Imagine living the whole season angry at the one thing you’re meant to enjoy ?

The personal abuse has reached peak levels for just having a different opinion from a particular group on here.

I’m with you.
I’ll never hand in my membership but there’s heaps on here that should for the sake of their own mental health.

Meanwhile I’ll wait for the review - if it’s shit I’ll say so - if it seems to have identified problems and sheds light on how to fix them , I’ll be more than happy

Either way I’ll be at the footy next year supporting my players !

 

[subaru]

“Physically and mentally abuse, torture and humiliate them..” - where are you getting your “facts”?

I know

It’s ludicrous !
2 internal reviews and a review by the AFL integrity unit but somehow our boys were exposed to this ? Oh, he left outs tied naked to trees !

 

[subaru]

Firstly, If you're going to respond to a post at least have the intelligence to respond to the content of the post rather than regurgitate what you have posted before.
Secondly, feel free to act or respond as you like with hporregard to what the club is/isn't doing as you have told us time and time again, but at least have the decency to allow others to respond as they like without you telling people what to do. Whether you like what people post is irrelevant.

This is the stuff that posters take exception too. In fact its another example of your hypocrisy.

Oh the irony !
“Allow others the decency “????
“ posters take exception to “ - yeah and respond precisely how you have, questioning someone’s intelligence.

There’s “hypocrisy” right there , sport. Right in front of you !

 

[marty36]

Why should we wait for the outcome??
What is it that the current leadership have done for you to even consider cutting them some slack??

The thing is the outcome is somewhat irrelevant. If these muppets were doing what they should have been doing we wouldn't be in this mess. We have pi**ed an opportunity up the wall mostly because of bad decisions after bad decisions.....but you want to see the outcome of the review before you pass judgment....NO!!

The outcome is right here in front of you, right now for all the footy world to see.

I think you are judged as an apologist because you want the supporters to give those at the club the benefit of the outcome of reviews, decisions etc.

Those things you would like to see the outcome of before passing judgment have been catastrophic.

There is nothing to wait for, judgement day has arrived, here and now and they deserve no further benefit.

Time is up, they should just f##k off.

Wtf why should we wait for the review outcome



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[subaru]

If I ran a poll on this board asking “Does Jen have a history of being an AFC apologist” what do you reckon the results would be?

Exhibit A

 

[subaru]

Wtf why should we wait for the review outcome

View attachment 746323

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[Cap]

To me it all comes back to that camp.
Death , losing grand finals is part of normal life however painful.
But to call the players weak and physically and mentally abuse , torture and humiliate them after what they'd been through beggars belief.
This is where it all started to fall apart.
What's worse the person responsible was never held to account and the players were lost forever after that.

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I see the handling of the camp as being the issue, not the camp.

The camp has been investigated by the AFL and no complaints to the ALFPA (remembering the Dees camp got shut down before it started from complaints).

Strong leadership was needed after the GF and the camp and the AFC was found lacking, that allowed the camp to become the distraction it was.

In hindsight, lack of leadership in making big changes post GF also cost the club big time.

Like others have pointed out (not me, I backed the players in, incorrectly) the cuts should have happened after that GF.

Not sure if that's a failing of Pyke, Fagan, Roo or Chapman. Or a combination of them.

 

[kirky]

When you put all the events together.
Tippett debarcle/sanctions
Sanderson sacking
Dean Bailey suspension & death
Phil Walsh murder
Best player walking out
GF loss
Power stance ridicule
Sam Jacobs brothers Death
Camp Debacle
Tex’s baby passing
Sloane’s baby passing
(I’m sure I’ve missed something)

Combine it with the off field ineptness you see and hear about it’s a wonder we haven’t had Carlton like results.

Also to those that say that the Phil Walsh murder wouldn’t have affected them that much just go and watch the West Coast match following his passing.

The football club suffered in the space of 18 months the loss of a senior assistant coach and then the gruesome murder of their coach. No AFL club has ever had to deal with those two issues jointly. Yes, AFL clubs have had deal with the former but it has been rarely one where the senior assistant has had a daily impact and they certainly have never ever had to deal with the latter.

We will never underestimate the impact of all these events. I'm hoping that in the near future that we do win the flag and then I hope someone makes a documentary on these times from Tippetgate thru the deaths, the GF, the camp, the player loss, the last two years, the review and then finally lifting the holy grail. You couldn't write a script for what has happened the past 7 years and strangely in a perverse sort of way it has all occurred since my father passed away from pancreatic cancer in Oct 2012. It is likely I'm in a living hell.

 

[1991firstgamer]

I see the handling of the camp as being the issue, not the camp.

The camp has been investigated by the AFL and no complaints to the ALFPA (remembering the Dees camp got shut down before it started from complaints).

Strong leadership was needed after the GF and the camp and the AFC was found lacking, that allowed the camp to become the distraction it was.

In hindsight, lack of leadership in making big changes post GF also cost the club big time.

Like others have pointed out (not me, I backed the players in, incorrectly) the cuts should have happened after that GF.

Not sure if that's a failing of Pyke, Fagan, Roo or Chapman. Or a combination of them.

Probably a little bit of everything in the end
Maybe I over stated the camp but things happened on that camp that shouldn't have happened regardless of wether they were not deemed crossing the line by the league

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[jenny61_99]

Probably a little bit of everything in the end
Maybe I over stated the camp but things happened on that camp that shouldn't have happened regardless of wether they were not deemed crossing the line by the league

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“Maybe” you overstated? What things happened? Torture? Mental abuse? Humiliation? Were you there? The drastic over exaggeration and embellishment from so many of you, the quick progression from rumour to becoming absolute fact (despite none of you actually knowing).... and you all gobble it up. Then the media vultures lap it all up and regurgitate it and the feeding frenzy gets bigger and bigger.... You are your own worst enemies.

 

[slice]

“Maybe” you overstated? What things happened? Torture? Mental abuse? Humiliation? Were you there? The drastic over exaggeration and embellishment from so many of you, the quick progression from rumour to becoming absolute fact (despite none of you actually knowing).... and you all gobble it up. Then the media vultures lap it all up and regurgitate it and the feeding frenzy gets bigger and bigger.... You are your own worst enemies.

Were you there?

You speak with a lot of authority but have the same knowledge of the circumstances as the rest of us.

Your perspective and what you choose to believe is no more valid than anyone else’s given none of us actually know what happened.

 

[1991firstgamer]

“Maybe” you overstated? What things happened? Torture? Mental abuse? Humiliation? Were you there? The drastic over exaggeration and embellishment from so many of you, the quick progression from rumour to becoming absolute fact (despite none of you actually knowing).... and you all gobble it up. Then the media vultures lap it all up and regurgitate it and the feeding frenzy gets bigger and bigger.... You are your own worst enemies.

flipping settle down
Don't blame us for the club stuffing up
Things happened.

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[kirky]

“Maybe” you overstated? What things happened? Torture? Mental abuse? Humiliation? Were you there? The drastic over exaggeration and embellishment from so many of you, the quick progression from rumour to becoming absolute fact (despite none of you actually knowing).... and you all gobble it up. Then the media vultures lap it all up and regurgitate it and the feeding frenzy gets bigger and bigger.... You are your own worst enemies.

Perhaps they all have attention spans of goldfish then again

You Now Have a Shorter Attention Span Than a Goldfish

The study reveals a major ...

time.com

 

[jenny61_99]

I see the handling of the camp as being the issue, not the camp.

The camp has been investigated by the AFL and no complaints to the ALFPA (remembering the Dees camp got shut down before it started from complaints).

Strong leadership was needed after the GF and the camp and the AFC was found lacking, that allowed the camp to become the distraction it was.

In hindsight, lack of leadership in making big changes post GF also cost the club big time.

Like others have pointed out (not me, I backed the players in, incorrectly) the cuts should have happened after that GF.

Not sure if that's a failing of Pyke, Fagan, Roo or Chapman. Or a combination of them.

Everybody backed the players in. They’d just made it to a GF FFS. Pyke was right to look for a way to improve mental toughness. We didn’t quite have that animal instinct. Like you said, the camp wasn’t the main problem - in fact, in the overall scheme of what was 2018, it was the least of our concerns (though played out the biggest in the media). Our injuries were the single biggest factor of why we fell in a hole in 2018. The handling of BOTH of these things were very poor. Perhaps the fallout from one (camp) masked the fallout from the other? 2019 became a “but we just need to back the boys in” mantra in selection policies and was singlehandedly the worst thing we did. Who drove that? Pyke? Campo? Both? Maybe you could forgive them for the first quarter of the season (assuming that with the camp and injury situation behind us all would be returned to 2017 standard) but once ROB proved himself, surely it planted the seed that the kids could be worth giving a chance? They always spoke about “learnings” where I think it was clear they weren’t actually learning from any of their mistakes.