Adelaide's decline

[PonsfordMagpie]

The Crows have broken the drought.

Well done.

 

[Gordon Farkas]

Unless the Crows can beat the Hawks tonight

Cue new thread: "Hawthorn's decline"

 

[HairyO]

Cue new thread: "Hawthorn's decline"

The 20 already on MB and The Bay not enough?

 

[mightymouse75]

Hi five Adelaide ..
Sucked I'm whorks.

 

[RePete]

Time for thread to be renamed to "Adelaide's rise"

But seriously though, imagine being smacked by 2020 Crows lol

 

[Chuckie357]

Unfortunately for crows supporters tonight’s win means director Mark ricciuotto will continue on at the club for another 5 years

Also I wonder if Laird will leave at the end of the year? 3/4 time solane pulled the players in and he was the only one who do didn’t go in, didn’t even look remotely interested in entering

 

[Freomaniac]

Time for thread to be renamed to "Adelaide's rise"

But seriously though, imagine being smacked by 2020 Crows lol

As I have said, I dont think the crows are as bad as the 0-13 record, not the 3-13 record suggests.

Had the crows played as well as they did vs those 3 wins vs the hawks, giants and blues in the 1st 10 games of the season, they would of got another 2-4 wins. Swans in round 1 was a loss by under a goal. Lost to freo in round 5 8.6.54 to 4.10.34 whe at 3 quarter time it was freo 5.3.33 to crows 4.8.32. They could of beaten the saints in Adelaide oval despite being 17 points down at 3 quarter time. Lost to essendon by under a goal and kicked 1.6.12 in that final quarter. should of beaten essendon by 3-4 goals.

So i theory, insetad of 3 wins, crows could of got 5-7 wins.

 

[Freomaniac]

Unless the Crows can beat the Hawks tonight (they might have a shot against the Giants) but after that it would seem likely they'll be the first VFL/AFL to go winless since Fitzroy in 1964 (good omen)?

Whilst they've gotten progressively worse I don't think they're the worst wooden spoon team I've seen. Obviously, Melbourne in 2013 is the worst (and even then we finished 17th), which shows you how bad the Giants were in their second season.

Then everyone always invokes Fitzroy's final season to compare how bad a team is going, which terrible as they were is not fair considering their predicament at the time.

Adelaide this season remind of Freo in 2001 a bit. That season Freo lost the season opener to Carlton by 1pt at Subiaco. From there they lost some tight games between 3-4 goals, then Drum got sacked midseason and they started getting walloped, but ended up winning a couple of games including against the Hawks who nearly made the GF that year.

I've seen many worse Freo sides than that one. The Crows this year are obviously transitioning and lost their first game which was very winnable, another against Essendon where they bottled about 4 chances in the last three mins. Basically, they've lost confidence and forgotten how to win. But I dont believe they are such a bad team. Not as bad as their winless record indicates.

Lost to carlton in 2001 by a point and also lost to the saints and cats by 2-3 goals each i think and all 3 of those losses were at home....

So you have seen many Worse freo sides than that 2001 side? Really? name which years then.

 

[Major Colvin]

Lost to carlton in 2001 by a point and also lost to the saints and cats by 2-3 goals each i think and all 3 of those losses were at home....

So you have seen many Worse freo sides than that 2001 side? Really? name which years then.

Statistically, there are plenty - to name a few -

1995 Fitzroy 2 wins 58%
1996 Fitzroy 1 win 49%
2011 Gold Coast 3 wins 56%
2012 GWS 2 wins 46%
2013 GWS 1 win at 50%
2013 Melbourne 2 wins 54%
2016 Essendon* 3 wins 61%
2017 Brisbane 3 wins 61%

Compare those to Freo 2001 - 2 wins @72%

 

[1970crow]

While you certainly cleaned up at the trade table for Wingard, I have no doubt that in an ideal world you'd have kept Polec and Wingard. Every club loses the occasional player they'd like to keep, whatever, but I don't think Port can pretend that either was truly on Port's terms. That's especially true with Polec IMO.

No way that they'd have wanted to keep Polec who was demanding a contract value based only on his final year performance. Huge mistake for a player his age to get a contract not averaged over multiple year's of performance. Wingard wasn't putting in, they wanted more and he thought best to head elsewhere. Should have been a win:win, like when Crows traded out Vince for the pick we thought would get us Matt Crouch. Still to play out, but Port looking well ahead there.

Port seem to make excellent decisions with existing player contracts. The proof is their ability to purchase high value missing pieces. Whether they get there or whether they got the right guys, the fact that they keep who they want to keep and have space for big dollar acquisitions says they're getting something extremely right.

 

[1970crow]

Says a few things.

Played few draftees when going well in 2017 for instance.
Quality of draftees since has been poor.
Draftees now being thrown to the wolves in a poor team.

Played few draftees when going s**t in 2018 and 2019. Even this year, few seniors have actually missed out. Our large number of kids getting games has largely been injury related and only Gibbs, Knight, Rat and Seedsman are being left in the shed. What selection philosophy has Mackay getting a game 4 weeks ahead of Sholl's debut? And it's not like there were SANFL games for Sholl to demand selection from, it's been kick and giggle, if a scratch at all. And that's how we select when we're rebuilding, it's much worse when we're contending or still a mathematical chance to fall into 8th.

 

[Freomaniac]

Statistically, there are plenty - to name a few -

1995 Fitzroy 2 wins 58%
1996 Fitzroy 1 win 49%
2011 Gold Coast 3 wins 56%
2012 GWS 2 wins 46%
2013 GWS 1 win at 50%
2013 Melbourne 2 wins 54%
2016 Essendon* 3 wins 61%
2017 Brisbane 3 wins 61%

Compare those to Freo 2001 - 2 wins @72%

Ah all the wooden spoon sides.

Port in 2011 had also 3 wins and 64.5%

The Swans of 1992-4 were very bad too.

Saying that... Pity that 2001 dockers side didnt win 3 more close games as they would of got 16th instead and a priority pick.

 

[JPetro83]

IF the season had 22 games the Crows would have missed the wooden spoon and pick 1. glad it ends this weekend. Pick 1 in ours.

 

[BronCrow]

IF the season had 22 games the Crows would have missed the wooden spoon and pick 1. glad it ends this weekend. Pick 1 in ours.

If we beat Richmond (unlikely) and West Coast beat North, we will not have the wooden spoon. Pick 1 is not completely guaranteed yet.

 

[Dirty Bird]

I am happy to be proved wrong, but my suspicion is that is the exception not the norm.

2013 South Australia champions
SA def. NSW/ACT by 47pts
SA def. QLD by 100pts
SA def. VicC by 34pts
SA def. VicM by 3pts
SA def. WA by 10pts

2014 South Australia champions
SA def. WA by 31pts
SA def. VicC by 22pts
SA def. WA by 5pts
VicM def. SA by 14pts
SA def. VicC by 63pts
SA def. VicM by 9pts

2015 Victoria Country champions
WA def. SA by 1pt
SA def. VicM by 25pts
SA def. WA by 73pts
VicC def. SA by 28pts
VicC def. SA by 11pts
VicM def. SA by 5pts

2016 Victoria Metro champions
SA def. Allies by 44pts
SA def. WA by 37pts
VicM def. SA by 3pts
SA def. VicC by 11pts

2017 Victoria Metro champions
WA def. SA by 1pt
SA def. Allies by 51pts
VicM def. SA by 67pts
SA def. VicC by 46pts

2018 South Australia champions
SA def. VicC by 27pts
SA def. WA by 89pts
SA def. Allies by 24pts
SA def. VicM by 55pts

2019 Western Australia champions
SA def. WA by 11pts
VicM def. SA by 17pts
VicC def. SA by 1pt
SA def. Allies by 17pts

Record over past 7 years

VicC 6-3 +163
VicM 4-5 -14
WA 7-2 +254
Allies 4-0 +136

NSW/ACT 1-0 +47
Qld 1-0 +100

 

[BronCrow]

2013 South Australia champions
SA def. NSW/ACT by 47pts
SA def. QLD by 100pts
SA def. VicC by 34pts
SA def. VicM by 3pts
SA def. WA by 10pts

2014 South Australia champions
SA def. WA by 31pts
SA def. VicC by 22pts
SA def. WA by 5pts
VicM def. SA by 14pts
SA def. VicC by 63pts
SA def. VicM by 9pts

2015 Victoria Country champions
WA def. SA by 1pt
SA def. VicM by 25pts
SA def. WA by 73pts
VicC def. SA by 28pts
VicC def. SA by 11pts
VicM def. SA by 5pts

2016 Victoria Metro champions
SA def. Allies by 44pts
SA def. WA by 37pts
VicM def. SA by 3pts
SA def. VicC by 11pts

2017 Victoria Metro champions
WA def. SA by 1pt
SA def. Allies by 51pts
VicM def. SA by 67pts
SA def. VicC by 46pts

2018 South Australia champions
SA def. VicC by 27pts
SA def. WA by 89pts
SA def. Allies by 24pts
SA def. VicM by 55pts

2019 Western Australia champions
SA def. WA by 11pts
VicM def. SA by 17pts
VicC def. SA by 1pt
SA def. Allies by 17pts

Record over past 7 years

VicC 6-3 +163
VicM 4-5 -14
WA 7-2 +254
Allies 4-0 +136

NSW/ACT 1-0 +47
Qld 1-0 +100

As I said, that was only my suspicion, was happy to be proved wrong. We don't appear to have as many draftees as other states though despite that success at under 18 carnivals each year. Why do you think this might be?

 

[Dirty Bird]

As I said, that was only my suspicion, was happy to be proved wrong. We don't appear to have as many draftees as other states though despite that success at under 18 carnivals each year. Why do you think this might be?

I cherry picked this period, because before this Im pretty sure SA sucked (I didnt go looking though, I might be wrong there)

I think there was an inferoirity complex where we would pick the best team to win there and then, we'd go for the average players with mature bodies who at that age stood out, but were close to their ceilling while the other sides always selected on potential.

If the SANFL changed their philosophy, we'd be a worse team, but we could find some diamonds in the rough here and there.

 

[Freomaniac]

If we beat Richmond (unlikely) and West Coast beat North, we will not have the wooden spoon. Pick 1 is not completely guaranteed yet.

IF the season had 22 games the Crows would have missed the wooden spoon and pick 1. glad it ends this weekend. Pick 1 in ours.

either of you actually want the spoon?

Do you really want to be reminded from Port fans in which SA team got the Spoon 1st?

 

[BronCrow]

either of you actually want the spoon?

Do you really want to be reminded from Port fans in which SA team got the Spoon 1st?

If winning the spoon means we get a generational talent in the draft, and win another flag before them, who do you think will have the last laugh. No guarantee that Port will win the flag yet this year. They have only beaten 1 of the other 3 sides in the top 4.

Only problem is this year is the best talent in the draft is academy zoned to the Western Bulldogs.

 

[Freomaniac]

If winning the spoon means we get a generational talent in the draft, and win another flag before them, who do you think will have the last laugh. No guarantee that Port will win the flag yet this year. They have only beaten 1 of the other 3 sides in the top 4.

Only problem is this year is the best talent in the draft is academy zoned to the Western Bulldogs.

Well I do live in SA, and yes I did read the sunday mail a couple of weeks back and saw A lot of SA talent that might get picked up.

You really want that academy zone talent from the dogs?

Because heres what will happen, You guys will select him. Dogs will match the bid and get him. You might as get The tall ruck/forward From west Adelaide anyway.

Saying that. I am sure theres other SANFL talent the crows are looking at too.

 

[BronCrow]

I cherry picked this period, because before this Im pretty sure SA sucked (I didnt go looking though, I might be wrong there)

I think there was an inferoirity complex where we would pick the best team to win there and then, we'd go for the average players with mature bodies who at that age stood out, but were close to their ceilling while the other sides always selected on potential.

If the SANFL changed their philosophy, we'd be a worse team, but we could find some diamonds in the rough here and there.

I have a feeling that you are right about that. We need to have a greater focus on players that can develop in to the future.

Others have suggested that we develop our own independant under 18's comp, similar to what they have in Victoria. Keep the self interest of SANFL clubs away from developing juniors.

 

[BronCrow]

Well I do live in SA, and yes I did read the sunday mail a couple of weeks back and saw A lot of SA talent that might get picked up.

You really want that academy zone talent from the dogs?

Because heres what will happen, You guys will select him. Dogs will match the bid and get him. You might as get The tall ruck/forward From west Adelaide anyway.

Saying that. I am sure theres other SANFL talent the crows are looking at too.

Do you not pick the best talent available at pick 1?

If we don't, I can assure you North will.

Not only that, on recent history, the Crows don't tend to pick local. This has cost them by the way, and is something I have been critical of.

 

[Freomaniac]

Do you not pick the best talent available at pick 1?

If we don't, I can assure you North will.

Not only that, on recent history, the Crows don't tend to pick local. This has cost them by the way, and is something I have been critical of.

To me pick 1 is overrated. Its not going to single handedly turn the club around. Your picks of 1, 11 (If GWS finish 9th) 20 and 29 will help your club immensely 4-5 years down the track when all 4 picks are 22-24 years old.

Yeah we can go back to 2007 when your mob took Dangerfield over Brad Ebert. Dangerfield has been very good for both Crows and Geelong. Brad Ebert isnt as good as Dangerfield but still is a solid player.

2008 you chose Phil Davis from North Adelaide but technically isnt South Australian but born in Canberra. You could of Got ryan Schoemakers who was an injury prone but solid Swingman as CHF/CHB. But you at least got compo for Davis when he fled to GWS.

then in 2009 your team chose Talia at pick 13 and Gunston at pick 29. No SA player was as good as those 2 between picks 14 and 28.

I am actually a South Adelaide fan in the AFL and I hope both of these blokes do get picked up by the crows. Both are mids as well and I have seen them both play.

Theres at least 3 guys at Woodville West torrens, 2 guys at North and 2 at Glenelg I expect to get drafted. Hell there are a couple of crows players that can be picked at Father-son and tyson edwards son is one of them

 

[BronCrow]

To me pick 1 is overrated. Its not going to single handedly turn the club around. Your picks of 1, 11 (If GWS finish 9th) 20 and 29 will help your club immensely 4-5 years down the track when all 4 picks are 22-24 years old.

Yeah we can go back to 2007 when your mob took Dangerfield over Brad Ebert. Dangerfield has been very good for both Crows and Geelong. Brad Ebert isnt as good as Dangerfield but still is a solid player.

2008 you chose Phil Davis from North Adelaide but technically isnt South Australian but born in Canberra. You could of Got ryan Schoemakers who was an injury prone but solid Swingman as CHF/CHB. But you at least got compo for Davis when he fled to GWS.

then in 2009 your team chose Talia at pick 13 and Gunston at pick 29. No SA player was as good as those 2 between picks 14 and 28.

I am actually a South Adelaide fan in the AFL and I hope both of these blokes do get picked up by the crows. Both are mids as well and I have seen them both play.

Theres at least 3 guys at Woodville West torrens, 2 guys at North and 2 at Glenelg I expect to get drafted. Hell there are a couple of crows players that can be picked at Father-son and tyson edwards son is one of them

Pick 1 when used wisely can go some way towards turning around your club Riewoldt, Hodge, though I will acknowledge it is not the be all and end all. We will have a strong hand after this draft has finished. I notice you have not included a compo pick for Brad Crouch, who I believe is gone. Also, if the rumours about Rory Atkins going to GCS on a 5 year deal are true, that would possibly give us another band 2 compo pick.

Agree with points 2 and 3, you don't exclusively pick local talent, but in the last 3-4 drafts we have picked kids from interstate when there have been better local options, ie 2016 with pick 15 we picked Jordan Galluci ahead of Will Hayward, who is a local. We could have also picked other Non-South Australian talent in Jarrod Berry, Sam Powell-Pepper and Tim English. Later in that draft we picked Myles Poholke and Elliot Himmelberg ahead of Willie Rioli and Jack Graham. Though Himmelberg is starting to develop nicely.

On you 4th point, which 2 South Adelaide players are you talking about?

On your final point, 1 of those 3 WWT guys is Lachie Jones, who is a Port Academy selection, and the other 2 are Jase Burgoyne, son of Peter, and Taj Schofield, son of Jarrad. 1 of the 2 at NA is Tariek Newchurch who is a Crows Academy selection. Also there is James Borlase at Sturt, who is also a Crows Academy selection. I imagine Kaine Baldwin would be one of the ones at Glenelg, along with Riley Thilthorpe at WA as previously mentioned.

 

[Dirty Bird]

either of you actually want the spoon?

Do you really want to be reminded from Port fans in which SA team got the Spoon 1st?

They’ve already won 3