AFL overtaking NRL in QLD

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Ice-Wolf

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Australians don't really care about international rugby league.
Nobody cares about international Rugby League. Rugby Union is the international version of the Rugby Codes.

The only interest that International Rugby League holds is the potential of beating New Zealand at a form of Rugby and we'd still prefer to see it in the other form of the game.
 

madmug

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Actually, most Australians don't give a damn about sport full stop.
The Kangaroos get a fraction of the ratings of an SOO game, even a dead rubber.
Well you're right there, they don't.

Most people have other issues in their lives, sport is either incidental or irrelevant.

I was thinking more that 'sports orientated people' would support Australian teams, or at least wished them well & success.

Like the Roy Morgan tables of footy support.

Swans have over 1,000,000 who 'support' them, but only about 55,000 members.
 

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Goroyals22

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I think most people support any team playing for Australia.
Id argue plenty support whoever we play..

I certainly dont cheer for the bully boy cricket team no matter who they play… maybe against England.

I hate soccer so don’t care if they loose and have no interest in league so dont care..


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
 

BringBackTorps

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Brisbane 2 is a no-brainer in a RL heartland city of 2.4m; & almost a certain inclusion at some stage in the near future.
It will give the NRL a good boost in Qld. ratings & Rights'$, crowds at Suncorp, & increased MSM coverage in Qld. (I'm not sure if, however, it will help reverse the collapse in GR male contact RL nos. in Brisbane).

Due to covid, lockdowns, & financial problems etc., a decision by the NRL on whether it (& the NRL clubs!) will agree to introduce Brisbane 2 has been postponed. "Plans for a 2023 entry...have been put on hold for at least 12 months" ie if Brisbane 2 eventuates, it will occur from season 2024, or later.


Daily Telegraph P. Rothfield 25.7.21
A sneak preview of the jerseys for the three Brisbane clubs — the Jets, Firehawks and Dolphins — all bidding to become the NRL’s 17th team. Plans for a 2023 entry into the competition have been put on hold for at least 12 months due to Covid.

(This link also shows the designs of the 3 teams that ar applying to become Brisbane2).
 
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Aussie in exile

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kaypee

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Strange that the ARL are very hopeful of becoming an Olympic sport, but don't want to play at the RLWC
That will be the death knell for the sport. Turning fringe sports into Olympic events kills them. See surfing and skateboarding. Lame.
 

Aussie in exile

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That will be the death knell for the sport. Turning fringe sports into Olympic events kills them. See surfing and skateboarding. Lame.
Strange logic on the ARL's part. Either they do they don't want to become more international. There is no halfway house.
I'm struggling that they don't want to go the the RLWC, but want to become an Olympic sport.
 

Gigantor

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It's certainly true that in the Australian context, all Olympic sports survive on the taxpayer teat.
None of them fend for themselves.
All have barely two cents to rub together.
 

BringBackTorps

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E. McGuire has predicted 28.7.21 that a 20th team based in Far North Qld. may be joining the AFL, soon after 2028- based probably in Cairns, but with some home games played in Darwin.

 

BringBackTorps

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The Gemba independent expert Report (released 17.6.21, & paid for by 12 NRL clubs) investigated the benefits & disadvantages of adding Brisbane 2.

The Gemba Report stated

"• A consortium of NRL Clubs is seeking independent analysis on the potential impacts of expansion, and the opportunity cost of investing in NRLW or participation instead (my emphases)".

"What could be the benefits of increasing investment into the NRLW over the next five years?
What could be the benefits of increasing investment into the grassroots and participation initiatives?".

"Participants are more likely to be interested in professional sporting leagues than members of the general population.

[Pro/semi Pro] LEAGUE INTEREST AMONGST PARTICIPANTS
KEY:
First No.= % Of General Population Who Have An Interest In A Pro/semi-Pro League
Second No.= % Of Aust. Participants Of Relevant Sport Who Also Have An Interest In That Sport's Pro/semi-Pro League

35% 79% AFL, 28% 74% NRL, 16% 69% Super Rugby, 28% 69% BBL, 16% 58% Super Netball, 18% 52% AFLW, 15% 49% NRLW, 17% 49% A League, 16% 48% NBL, 19% 47% WBBL, 14% 43% W League".

(The first no. % taken from Morgan Polls. I assume definition of an "interest" is very loose)
The second no. % taken from Ausplay surveys - which is a survey of 1 person in every thousand; & counts a personas a "participant" in a sport, even if they answer they played the sport only once in the last 12 months!)


"• While there are many drivers of passion, Gemba’s proprietary data supports the notion that those that participate in a particular sport are more likely to be passionate about the corresponding national leagues

• Three quarters of Rugby League Participants are passionate about the NRL and half about the NRLW

• In terms of converting participants into fans, NRLW is third amongst professional women’s leagues, behind Super Netball and AFLW and is comparable with the A-League and NBL"

The Australian 24.6.21
Gemba Report- see pgs 4, 5, & 177.
https://origin.go.theaustralian.com...RL-Expansion-Analysis_Final-Report_170621.pdf



A major reason for adding Brisbane 2, according to 8+ comments from RL officials recently, is to strengthen the NRL & GR contact RL nos. - & concerns from them about the increasing growth of the AFL & GR AF in SEQ.

Some RL officials, however, may believe this (main?) objective of thwarting AF growth in SEQ could be best, & most efficiently, achieved by spending much more on GR contact RL in general; & perhaps the NRLW in particular ie Brisbane 2 is not the most cost-effective & efficient GR RL conduit.

There has been a collapse in male GR contact RL nos. in Sydney; & the Gold Coast-Brisbane (excluding the Ipswich District RL comp.)-Sunshine Coast corridor.
In late July 2020, the QRL announced, for all Greater Brisbane (but excluding the Ipswich JRL comp.) there were about 5000 jnrs, from U6-U12 inclusive, in the RLBJ comp. This is a shockingly low no. for a RL heartland of c. 2.2m - & c. 10%+ of this 5000 were playing only RL club non-contact Tag.

Having 8.5/9 NRL clubs in Sydney has not prevented this collapse. Can it be convincingly concluded that Brisbane 2 would greatly increase male contact RL nos. in the Gold Coast- Brisbane - Sunshine Coast corridor?

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Horts

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The South-East corner I could possibly see, however you'd need years with a team based in the Mid-to-Far North to capture the state.
 

Aussie in exile

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That will be the death knell for the sport. Turning fringe sports into Olympic events kills them. See surfing and skateboarding. Lame.
To be honest it's not going to happen as the ARL only want it played at the Brisbane Olympics in the off season so the Olympic committee won't agree to that. They wont sent a team anyway to an Olympics if it's in the NRL season
 

BringBackTorps

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Major decisions- & major worries- for the NRL about Brisbane 2 & male contact RL nos. in SEQ

Courier Mail P. Crawley & P. Bardel 23.8.21

Crawley & Bardel said

"The issue on whether now is the right time for expansion given the financial implications related to Covid as well as the constant debate about whether there is enough rugby league talent to support another team has divided the game for some time now.

[V'landys said] “The thing with this is that it has been on the agenda for many years. A decision has to be made one way or another.

“As I have said from day one the business cases have got to stack up,” he continued.

“The thing we are looking at is, one, it has to financially stack up. Two, what are they going to do with participation and pathways? That is important for us.

“AFL has certainly made a lot of inroads up there and we have to make sure we keep Queensland as a heartland.

“And the third thing is how are they going to improve the fans base? Have they got a fan, are they going to get a fan base, or are they just migrating people away from existing customers? We want new customers".



Courier Mail 23.8

"GAME ON! JETS’ $250 MILLION EXPANSION COUP

By Peter Bardel


"Redcliffe has an asset base of $100 million, while the Firehawks have $25 million in cash reserves, although there are major concerns the Jets are cash-strapped and do not have the funds to satisfy the NRL’s demands.

News Corp understands the Ipswich City Council is prepared to consider more than $10 million in funding for the Jets should they clinch a licence as the NRL’s 17th team for 2023 or 2024.




V’landys says potential playing numbers are a key factor in the expansion battle and Harding [Ipswich mayor] confirmed she had personally written to the ARLC boss to back the Jets amid fears the rival AFL code will destroy (!) the NRL in the Ipswich region.
(Very unlikely- GR AF not now strong in semi-regional, & generally working class, Ipswich district)

“If the NRL didn’t embrace this region, the AFL could certainly be a threat to the code in the western corridor,” Harding said.

“The AFL have made the decision to expand substantially here, they have set up a $70 million facility (at Springfield) and they aren’t silly, they can see the growth potential out here.

“I’ve written to Peter V’landys. The Brisbane Jets are the perfect option for the NRL. It’s the region with [RL] heart. It’s the grassroots of rugby league...
Ipswich is the fastest growing city in Queensland"

Brisbane’s 2032 Olympics victory shapes as a game changer for the Jets in terms of infrastructure.

Harding is confident of state and federal government support for the construction of a 12,000-to-20,000 multi-purpose stadium in Ipswich that would match Townsville‘s Queensland Country Bank Stadium for quality.
“When you see the new stadium in Townsville, it’s a massive economic multiplier for the North Queensland region and it would be the same for Ipswich (All emphases, & words in brackets, mine)".
 
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Gigantor

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A bit of hyperbole from the Ipswich major to put a bit of meat on the bones of the Jets bid.
I thought the Ipswich council had made a financial contribution to the Springfield training facility, so it's a bit rich to all of a sudden start claiming that the AFL will "destroy" the NRL.
 

GC2015

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The NRL are very close to approving a second team in Brisbane with the Ipswich and Firehawks bidding teams are supposedly about to merge in an attempt to see off the Redcliffe bid. So it's down to two bids - the combined Jets and Firehawks vs the Dolphins. It also looks like the expansion team is likely to net Cameron Munster and Wayne Bennett which would be two massive coups.

After the Titans loss on Thursday night, it's very likely no Queensland team will feature in the NRL finals this year. This would spell the second consecutive year without Queensland representation in the NRL finals. It's obviously a major concern for the NRL, especially when you consider how well the Brisbane Lions are going right now. The Lions and Suns both hit record membership numbers this year meanwhile the Broncos have never looked weaker. The NRL desperately needs another team in Brisbane to counteract what's happening right now.

This should also mean the AFL will put more effort into making the Suns work because two firing AFL teams in Queensland will be very hard for the NRL to compete with.
 

Bjo187

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The NRL are very close to approving a second team in Brisbane with the Ipswich and Firehawks bidding teams are supposedly about to merge in an attempt to see off the Redcliffe bid. So it's down to two bids - the combined Jets and Firehawks vs the Dolphins. It also looks like the expansion team is likely to net Cameron Munster and Wayne Bennett which would be two massive coups.

After the Titans loss on Thursday night, it's very likely no Queensland team will feature in the NRL finals this year. This would spell the second consecutive year without Queensland representation in the NRL finals. It's obviously a major concern for the NRL, especially when you consider how well the Brisbane Lions are going right now. The Lions and Suns both hit record membership numbers this year meanwhile the Broncos have never looked weaker. The NRL desperately needs another team in Brisbane to counteract what's happening right now.

This should also mean the AFL will put more effort into making the Suns work because two firing AFL teams in Queensland will be very hard for the NRL to compete with.
Which of those two bids getting up would damage the afl more in qld do you think?
 

GC2015

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Which of those two bids getting up would damage the afl more in qld do you think?
Redcliffe. Not only are they a financial strong leagues club with their own stadium and a successful history, but it would undo a lot of the hard work the Lions/AFL have put into the Moreton Bay/Sunshine Coast region in recent years. The Sunshine Coast is currently the 9th most populated city in Australia and is growing quickly with many people moving there from the southern states (similar to the Gold Coast but on a smaller scale). I know the Lions are currently building new training facilities out west in Springfield but Ipswich is a far more rusted on rugby league heartland than the Moreton Bay/Sunshine Coast area. A lot of southerns have relocated to the Sunshine Coast over the last 20 years so Aussie rules has a decent following up there but it could be completely compromised if a NRL team is started up there.

Having said that, either bid joining the NRL hurts the AFL. It would likely mean there would be an NRL match is played in Brisbane every weekend and the increase in content obviously means more media exposure for rugby league and less for Aussie rules.
 

BringBackTorps

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The Australian B. Read 22.8.21

Headline "THE INCURSION OF THE AFL IS HELPING DRIVE NRL EXPANSION"

BRENT READ said

"The AFL’s big-money incursion into southeast Queensland will be at the forefront of the ARL Commission’s expansion committee on Monday morning as they hear final pitches from the three bid teams vying to become the NRL’s 17th side.

Three years after former chair Peter Beattie notably warned the code needed to expand or die, he will be among the officials from head office sitting in on meetings with the Redcliffe Dolphins, Brisbane Jets and Brisbane Firehawks as they make one final and potentially decisive claim for the prospective 17th licence.

Their [Redcliffe Dolphins] home ground is already up to NRL standard, having hosted games in recent weeks when the competition has been played in southeast Queensland. Crucially, analysis also suggested the northern corridor was just as important to the code as the west, which is at the heart of the Brisbane Jets’ plans.

Both (?) regions (not regional Ipswich & Toowoomba, AF not strong there- but AF has strong growth in nthn. Brisbane & Sunshine Coast) are under threat from the AFL and ARL Commission chair Peter V’landys made it very clear that protecting rugby league’s patch would play a key role in their thinking.

V’landys conceded it was the sort of decision that could define his legacy at the helm of the code... expansion has ramifications for rugby league’s long-term future given the AFL’s lavish spending in southeast Queensland and the need for a new team to stand on their own financial feet.

“AFL, to their credit, did a good job last year when they were up there – they went into the Department of Education, they have done everything,” V’landys said.

“They have a great strategy. I take my hat off to them. We’re not going to sit back and let Queensland wither on the vine.

“We have a responsibility to ensure that Queensland remains one of the main heartlands of rugby league in the world.”

While much has been made about the threat to rugby league in the western corridor, the north is under siege as well not only from AFL but from soccer.

According to documents seen by the NRL and The Australian, nearly $60 million has been invested on AFL and soccer facilities in the Moreton Bay region over the past five years. The Dolphins’ have a huge area to service and strength in junior numbers.

While the ARL Commission is cognisant of the threat from the AFL, they are also wary of eating into their three existing clubs in southeast Queensland as well as the Melbourne Storm, who rely on Queensland for much of their talent.

...[V'landys] “Secondly, pathways – how are they going to improve participation, and thirdly, how are they going to increase the rugby league fan base without migrating away from existing (sides).

“We want new customers, not old customers...(All my words & emphases in brackets)".

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/subscribe/news/1/?sourceCode=TAWEB_WRE170_a_TWT&dest=https://www.theaustralian.com.au/sport/nrl/the-incursion-of-the-afl-is-helping-drive-nrl-expansion/news-story/3c62569e3f2a459732ce1650e9387e49&mem
 
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Football Tragic

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This reeks of desperation for mine. They are expanding into their own heartlands. It'll be like AFL adding another club in Geelong - its not going to increase our supporter base. It might be good if you can add an additional game for tv to increase revenue with broadcast rights but it would cannibalise supporters, sponsor and exposure to the existing team.

I just don't see how this would help the overall reach, appeal, participation levels, investment or exposure the NRL will get from this costly venture. It just seems like they are trying to white ant the afl's expansion efforts and plug holes in a sinking ship instead of actually growing their competition.

This will only hurt the league financially and with talent drain. Already many of their foundation clubs are struggling to stay financially viable, this will sound the death noll for many of them.
 

Gigantor

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This reeks of desperation for mine. They are expanding into their own heartlands. It'll be like AFL adding another club in Geelong -
It's not really like putting a team in Geelong.
It's actually more like putting a 3rd team in Perth.
Why would you do that?
1. because you can
2. because it soaks up any unmet demand in the game, soaks up a bit more media interest, starves other sports (even more) of media interest and sponsorships, etc.
 

Football Tragic

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It's not really like putting a team in Geelong.
It's actually more like putting a 3rd team in Perth.
Why would you do that?
1. because you can
2. because it soaks up any unmet demand in the game, soaks up a bit more media interest, starves other sports (even more) of media interest and sponsorships, etc.
But really, what would be the purpose? If you can bring in two expansion clubs it would mean another game to watch on tv and more broadcast revenue but would that reward absorb the cost of running another club? I doubt it. This is the reason why the AFL have been dragging their heels with the new Tassie team. They already have a captive audience. It won't get them any more supporters and probably only a marginal increase in sponsorship, membership and media attention. And that's in a state that doesn't have their own team yet.

In the past, people were feed information from a limited media sources. Northern newspapers gave the AFL limited exposure if at all. That has changed. Today, people search the internet for what they want and more people are watching and reading about our code. Adding another team and having papers write or news services speak about them, doesn't hold the same weight as it did.

It really does seem like a panicked reaction to the bleeding that's occurring in Queensland. It doesn't grow additional support. It doesn't increase participation or potential players. It doesn't bring more media/exposure. It's preaching to the converted.

I'd be trilled when the NRL expand with new clubs in NSW and Queensland. It will continue to stretch their resources and give them e=very little in return.
 
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