AFL overtaking NRL in QLD

[RedV3x]

Part of the problem with relying on Auskick numbers

Is that you have to define what you are talking about Auskick means different things in different states.

there are a lot of kids enrolled but how does this translate to later adult participation or engagement with AFL

It's easy. If the numbers are going up then the prospects are good.

I know

that anecdotal evidence isn't evidence at all.

It's a bit like Soccer

No it's not. Most people have played soccer as a kick around entertainment but not as an organised sport.
Auskick (the junior kind) is a kick and catch game. it's a distinction participation.
Kids know there is a connection to AFL. It even has goal and points
and the whole idea is to forget about parent allegiances.

 

[dave10]

From someone living in the Goldy.
Putting aside the quantitative stats and participation numbers. What I can say is since Hardwick came to the Club, there’s been a steadily increasing presence of the Suns in this region. Walking around town you used to see a Suns cap or shirt here and there. Now you will see them almost everyday out and about. Kids are wearing that red jumper too.

It’s great to see the Suns gaining traction.

 

[hampton]

No it's not. Most people have played soccer as a kick around entertainment but not as an organised sport.
Auskick (the junior kind) is a kick and catch game. it's a distinction participation.
Kids know there is a connection to AFL. It even has goal and points
and the whole idea is to forget about parent allegiances.

How is playing for your local soccer team in organised competition 'kick around entertainment' but playing auskick different? If anything I'd say its the other way around, auskick are coming directly to the schools whereas to play for your soccer team you or your parents have to seek it out.

Kids know they're playing soccer too there's a net and goals etc doesn't mean they're growing up to support A-league clubs.

It's a nice ambition but let's not get ahead of ourselves in what the numbers actually mean.

 

[hampton]

From someone living in the Goldy.
Putting aside the quantitative stats and participation numbers. What I can say is since Hardwick came to the Club, there’s been a steadily increasing presence of the Suns in this region. Walking around town you used to see a Suns cap or shirt here and there. Now you will see them almost everyday out and about. Kids are wearing that red jumper too.

It’s great to see the Suns gaining traction.

Agree with this - this is more of a measure than auskick participation numbers. Definitely Suns are gaining some traction on the gold coast.

 

[Bjo187]

How is playing for your local soccer team in organised competition 'kick around entertainment' but playing auskick different? If anything I'd say its the other way around, auskick are coming directly to the schools whereas to play for your soccer team you or your parents have to seek it out.

Kids know they're playing soccer too there's a net and goals etc doesn't mean they're growing up to support A-league clubs.

It's a nice ambition but let's not get ahead of ourselves in what the numbers actually mean.

A person that participates in a sport for 3 years is 7x more likely to be a fan of that sport as an adult. That's why auskick is so important, particularly in these northern markets. Soccer fans are created through participation as well, it's just that most kids follow the cooler international options of the EPL, Serie A etc.

 

[hampton]

Most kids that play soccer end up following the dominant code in their city/state - AFL or rugby league. A smaller portion end up casually supporting EPL and even less become more fervent A-league supporters.

 

[RedV3x]

playing auskick different?

Auskick is organised sport as against kick-to-kick, good kick around entertainment.

Auskick are coming directly

From AFCs. they are huge money-earners.

 

[RedV3x]

what the numbers actually mean.

Increasing numbers of Auskick players means that there is an increasing likelihood of more Australan Rules Football players.

 

[RedV3x]

Agree with this - this is more of a measure than auskick participation numbers. Definitely Suns are gaining some traction on the gold coast.

Anecdotal"evidence" can be encouraging but statistics are usually more meaningful.

 

[RedV3x]

Most kids that play soccer end up following the dominant code in their city/state

That's a sweeping statement not backed up by any statistics what-so-ever.
IMO the earlier a person stops playing organised soccer then the earlier that person probably pick up another sport.
The corollary is also true.
These days there are lots of alternatives.
My anecdotal story is that many kids dropped out of organised soccer at a very early and they have moved onto another winter sport/activity. In Perth, teenage baseball participation and netball participation are huge but few will continue/follow baseball and if anything move over to cricket. Netball is a lot more likely to grab girls early and keep them there throughout their life especially now with the national league. Basketball is a sport that starts with low numbers but picks up teenage participation and later modest following.

 

[hampton]

That's a sweeping statement not backed up by any statistics what-so-ever.
IMO the earlier a person stops playing organised soccer then the earlier that person probably pick up another sport.
The corollary is also true.
These days there are lots of alternatives.
My anecdotal story is that many kids dropped out of organised soccer at a very early and they have moved onto another winter sport/activity. In Perth, teenage baseball participation and netball participation are huge but few will continue/follow baseball and if anything move over to cricket. Netball is a lot more likely to grab girls early and keep them there throughout their life especially now with the national league. Basketball is a sport that starts with low numbers but picks up teenage participation and later modest following.

It's a sweeping statement but hardly controversial to say that most kids that follow sport in Australia follow AFL or NRL primarily, as opposed to A-league, regardless of what sports they've played. Are you needing statistical evidence of this.

But yes you're saying what I'm saying, just because a kid plays a sport doesn't automatically qualify them as a fan of that game. Otherwise we'd have a shitload of soccer, baseball and swimming fans.

 

[RedV3x]

It's a sweeping statement

And wrong.

Otherwise we'd have a shitload of soccer, baseball and swimming fans.

Wrong again.
There's sport and there's recreation.There are a large number of recreations with huge participants that are truly minor sports. To be a sport, that activity needs an organisation with rules.
People run walk, run, swim sail,surf, bicycle, skate, ski. etc. Individuals tend to recreate but teams tend to play sports, but lots of people recreate with multiple people or play informally. Tennis and cricket for example.
Some sports like netball and football have good early pickup and good follow through.
Some sports like baseball and soccer have good early pickup and poor follow through.
Some sports like cricket, basketball and rugby have good teenage pickup.
Some sports like golf, tennis, bowls, badminton and squash have good adult pickup.
A lot of sports don't figure because people recreate and don't officially compete.

 

[hampton]

And wrong.



Wrong again.
There's sport and there's recreation.There are a large number of recreations with huge participants that are truly minor sports. To be a sport, that activity needs an organisation with rules.
People run walk, run, swim sail,surf, bicycle, skate, ski. etc. Individuals tend to recreate but teams tend to play sports, but lots of people recreate with multiple people or play informally. Tennis and cricket for example.
Some sports like netball and football have good early pickup and good follow through.
Some sports like baseball and soccer have good early pickup and poor follow through.
Some sports like cricket, basketball and rugby have good teenage pickup.
Some sports like golf, tennis, bowls, badminton and squash have good adult pickup.
A lot of sports don't figure because people recreate and don't officially compete.

Soccer has rules and organisations and teams and all that jazz. It’s not yet taken over Australia, but if you look at participation numbers you’d think it’s way bigger than afl or nrl.

But I’m wrong, right. Heard that story.

 

[RedV3x]

Soccer has rules and organisations

So it is a sport, but just kicking a round ball around doesn't qualify.

if you look at participation numbers

You'll notice good early numbers, but poor teenage years for soccer.

But I’m wrong,

You are very sloppy with your comprehension, implications and statements.

 

[hampton]

So it is a sport, but kicking a round ball around doesn't qualify.



You'll notice good early numbers, but poor teenage years for soccer.



You are very sloppy with your comprehension, implications and statements.

So when kids plays soccer in local sporting comps it’s just kicking around a ball as recreation but when kids play auskick it’s serious business and they’re on the direct afl pathway to becoming an afl player? Not sure I follow your rambling logic.

 

[RedV3x]

So when kids plays soccer in local sporting comps it’s

I think I explained very clearly in "To be a sport, that activity needs an organisation with rules."
That's why I call you out.

just kicking around a ball as recreation

That's what I said.

but when kids play auskick it’s serious business and they’re on the direct afl pathway to becoming an afl player?

Auskick is organised play. it's not just kick-to-kick Auskick was developed to catch the attention of yougnsters and direct them to playing Australian Football.
You never mention you definition of Auskick and I have a feeling that under the AFL banner Auskick includes what we call "modified football". Modified football brings a player into "premiership" football, the teenage years and onwards.
So in terms of the AFL, "Auskick. it’s serious business and they’re on the direct AFL pathway to becoming an AFL player"

Notice I added the correct punctuation and capitalisation to your statement which you are still too lazy or incompetent to use..

 

[hampton]

I think I explained very clearly in "To be a sport, that activity needs an organisation with rules."
That's why I call you out.



That's what I said.


Auskick is organised play. it's not just kick-to-kick Auskick was developed to catch the attention of yougnsters and direct them to playing Australian Football.
You never mention you definition of Auskick and I have a feeling that under the AFL banner Auskick includes what we call "modified football". Modified football brings a player into "premiership" football, the teenage years and onwards.
So in terms of the AFL, "Auskick. it’s serious business and they’re on the direct AFL pathway to becoming an AFL player"

Notice I added the correct punctuation and capitalisation to your statement which you are still too lazy or incompetent to use..

But I'm not talking about kids kicking around soccer balls in the park I'm talking about official participation numbers of kids playing soccer in competitions, which is in the vicinnity of 600-700k in this country. Which is far ahead of other football codes including Auskick + AFL and RL+ Variations. Yet soccer is nowhere near bigger in terms of fandom as a national sport than those two. That's the only point I'm saying, that participation numbers alone do not equal growth of the national league of that sport.

 

[RedV3x]

I'm talking about official participation numbers of kids playing soccer in competitions

i know.

soccer is nowhere near bigger in terms of fandom as a national sport

Yes, as i stated earlier.

Some sports like netball and football have good early pickup and good follow through.
Some sports like baseball and soccer have good early pickup and poor follow through.
Some sports like cricket, basketball and rugby have good teenage pickup.

 

[Bjo187]

But I'm not talking about kids kicking around soccer balls in the park I'm talking about official participation numbers of kids playing soccer in competitions, which is in the vicinnity of 600-700k in this country. Which is far ahead of other football codes including Auskick + AFL and RL+ Variations. Yet soccer is nowhere near bigger in terms of fandom as a national sport than those two. That's the only point I'm saying, that participation numbers alone do not equal growth of the national league of that sport.

Well a few things here, soccer is non contact, contact sports always have less participation. Id also contest the soccer isn't as popular as AFL and NRL nationally. I think if you did a survey there would be more people in Australia that have an interest in soccer at some level than AFL and NRL.

If the local soccer league was the best in the world, it would be more popular than both sports local leagues, but fans are split across many leagues throughout the world and because it's not a top level local competition and in people's face all the time, the interest is more casual locally.

 

[RedV3x]

'm saying, that participation numbers alone do not equal growth of the national league of that sport.

And as i said, not dispitung what you said, something like "The the growth in participation numbers is always encouraging".
Also it's what participation in particular.. Auskick numbers mean different things to different people.
When the ABS did a proper census of sports participation they looked at teenage years.
Sadly, the ABS doesn't do census anymore but surveys and the surveys IMO are flawed.

 

[RedV3x]

I think if you did a survey

There already are surveys. It's attendances and ratings that say Australians aren't interested in professional soccer.

If the local soccer league was the best in the world,

If Australia had the best rl competition in the world....hold on....it does....I think.
If AFL was played widely around the world.....imagine.......it's not.... but there are simple reasons for that.

fans are split across many leagues throughout the world

The highest attendances and highest ratings of a domestic competition is not in a soccer country.
Soccer is widely played across the globe but not to the same intensity as some other sports.

 

[hampton]

Well a few things here, soccer is non contact, contact sports always have less participation. Id also contest the soccer isn't as popular as AFL and NRL nationally. I think if you did a survey there would be more people in Australia that have an interest in soccer at some level than AFL and NRL.

If the local soccer league was the best in the world, it would be more popular than both sports local leagues, but fans are split across many leagues throughout the world and because it's not a top level local competition and in people's face all the time, the interest is more casual locally.

Which is my point too. But if you’re lumping in auskick/afl as a contact sport that’s not how most parents see it. I’d rate auskick alongside soccer, ie a sport parents are happy their kids playing for a bit of sports competition. So naturally there should be far higher participation of non contact or low contact sports.

I also think there might be a passing at best interest of soccer by lots of people, which is why Matildas and Socceroos are so popular because it comes up every so often only.

 

[RedV3x]

I’d rate auskick alongside soccer, ie a sport parents are happy their kids playing for a bit of sports competition.

Yes, that's what it was introduced for.

So naturally there should be far higher participation of non contact or low contact sports.

Yes, at that age but not at the teenage years which is seen as all-important.

I also think there might be a passing at best interest of soccer by lots of people,

Yes, but only at international level like so many other international sports.

 

[Cmarsh]

Another Lions GF apperance. Have really turned things around after being a bit of a laughing stock less than 10 years ago.

 

[Tackle Bag]

But I'm not talking about kids kicking around soccer balls in the park I'm talking about official participation numbers of kids playing soccer in competitions, which is in the vicinnity of 600-700k in this country. Which is far ahead of other football codes including Auskick + AFL and RL+ Variations. Yet soccer is nowhere near bigger in terms of fandom as a national sport than those two. That's the only point I'm saying, that participation numbers alone do not equal growth of the national league of that sport.

Soccer records participation very differently to AFL (and NRL I think).
Soccer basically includes anyone who attended a promotional event or anything soccer related as a participant.

AFL and NRL only count those who are registered with a club or training program as participants.

In terms of actual registered players with a club or junior program the soccer numbers are far less than you think.

Here is a breakdown of Soccer “participation numbers” for 2024, released by Football Australia: