Carlton 1979-82; Why don't we rate them?

[Bluelegs]

They were better.

Nowhere near as dominant as 50s Melbourne or 80s Hawthorn

 

[Bomberboyokay]

Because it was pre-salary cap era and they bought all the best available players. Or so the story goes.

 

[footyfan1978]

When we talk about the great teams over time we hear about Collingwood in the 20s and 30s, Melbourne in the 50s and 60s, Hawthorn in the 80s and in recent times the Lions, Cats and Hawks.

For those of us who remember the Carlton team from 1979-1982 was one of the greatest teams of all time. The team had so many champions, so many big game players who did it when it counted and were a brilliant team.
They are every bit as good if not better than the recent dominant teams of Lions, Cats and Hawks. I actually rate them higher.
Not sure why some leave them out of the equation. Absolute champion team.

David Parkin always says this too.
It is certainly my favourite teams to ever watch as a Carlton supporter.
I did enjoy the 1987 and 1995 flags too but knew the 79 and early 80's teams were as good as it gets. I believe if the Jeasulenko-George Harris amazing club politics storm that happened after 1979 had not taken place that team would most likely to have won 4 premierships in a row but in 1980 we were a shell of our best with no real coach.

Coz it's Carlton.

This. he he. We are hated so is another reason.

Jesaulenko, Doull, Southby, Hunter, Johnston. Could keep rolling off the champions.

Harmes, Sheldon, Ashman, Jimmy Buckley, Bosustow, Val Perovic, Maclure, Fitzpatrick, Maylin, Greg Wells, McConville and Glascott were pretty handy types too in some of those premiership teams.
Quick runners like Alex Marcou and Vin Catoggio probably struggle to even get a spot in some of those grand finals although I think Catoggio was at Melbourne for the Wells trade in 1981 premiership year. David McKay, Barry Amstrong and Trevor Keough probably played in the 79 flag but were retired for later ones maybe.
David Clarke that was originally a Geelong star was part of 82 finals campaign and very good in the preliminary win over the Hawks but poor bugger could not find a spot in the grand final team. Very strong team. I think champion full back Southby missed a couple of those grand finals due to injury and back up key defenders had to play.

This Carlton team was one of the greatest ever and given the same training, facilities etc would destroy the modern day teams like Geelong and Hawthorn.

I agree but I also count the 1984 and 85 Bomber teams as doing the same. They were a taller group of players than the earlier Carlton power teams.

Because they probably cheated, or did something shady.

Nah unfortunately they were just damn good.

Who doesn't rate them?

As with anything nice about Carlton, I simply choose to ignore it.

he he

Nowhere near as dominant as 50s Melbourne or 80s Hawthorn

I would love to know how good the 50's Dees sides were but will never know.
I rate the Hawks 80's outfits as the most consistent contenders but the Carlton early 80s teams and Bombers mid 80's teams best were even better.
It is why the Carlton 1982 team beat the Hawks twice in the finals and probably the 82 qualifying final the most dazzling display I ever recall seeing in a finals series of quality sides. It is the game I wish I could most find on video again.

The Bombers 11 goals in last quarter of 1985 Grand Final over Hawks was also very powerful stuff.

Everyone rates things differently so not surprising. Some clearly rate things on stats only.
Winning three premiership in a row in record books will impress people that glance over records more. In that sense Lions 3 in a row is going to get talked about more. No real surprise.
On stats our 95 side won 16 games in a row to take flag, was 4 games clear on top of ladder and destroyed the runner up after that team won their preliminary final by 15 goals.
However I'd rather bottle the team I saw in the 79 and 82 era as I rated the contenders harder to beat of those times. They lost more games than 95 model that did better on stats but for sheer talent and power to excite they had contenders to the crown that was no shame to drop a few games to in those years. I know I will never see it that good again but still enjoy what can be achieved in recent eras of football where the landscape does not allow a number of super sides to exists at same time. The talent is spread more thin over more clubs. Someone still has to win a flag each year though but you will never see the number of genuine stars in the one team as watching a 1984 Essendon run over the top of a quality Hawks in that grand final or the Carlton 1982 team overcome a raging favourite in Richmond that year. Those grand finals the most epic I seen in terms of heavyweights playing off for a title that was the hardest to win. You had to play out of your skin to beat another champion team. Kudos to Hawks for rising off the mat and making 7 grand finals in a row in those 80's. It is always funny to me they are talked about as the dominant side of 80's however give me the Essendon and Carlton teams over them at their best.
I think in 8 finals in the 80's we beat Hawks 5 times to their 3.
Essendon also won 2 grand finals in a row over the Hawks.
It was the heavyweight division in those times for mine to win a flag.
North and Tigers also had some serious talent on their list to be contenders around 1982 times. I don't remember a more brilliant bunch of 4 or 5 sides existing in such a small window of time. To win a flag then seemed harder in terms of how good you had to be to win against the top few teams. I have a feeling at one stage North had 4 Brownlow Medallists on their list in early 80's but never won a flag in that time. There was no salary cap and Hawks, Carlton, North and Essendon seem to attract most of the quality players from interstate. Buckenara, Ken Judge, the Krakouer brothers, Kenny Hunter, Peter Bosustow and Leon Baker that were star players in early 80s that joined some of these teams that already were high quality with 5 or 6 champs already in a strong team. God help the poor Melbourne teams with only Robbie Flower as one champ or St.Kilda with Trevor Barker. That all changed in late 80's when salary caps and drafts started up. Slowly things evened out and you won't ever get to see that many champs be assembled in one team.

 

[kane249]

Because it was pre-salary cap era and they bought all the best available players. Or so the story goes.

This

Hawks and Cats of modern day are more impressive as the whole competition is on a relatively level playing field with a salary cap and drafting.

 

[South of the Yarra]

it was the ******* fifties.

So John Coleman, Dick Reynolds and Bill Hutchison are irrelevant because it was the 50s ?????

 

[iluvparis]

I do get a chuckle about the hard on for the 'equalization' era when since 2000 we've had 3 dominant dynasties in just 15 years.

That salary cap though!

 

[iluvparis]

Carlton of the 1900s - where's the love?

 

[_Mike_]

People aren't rating Carlton for obvious reasons. They finished last this year for a reason, and it wasn't having a side riddled with injuries.

 

[HBF]

This Carlton team was one of the greatest ever and given the same training, facilities etc would destroy the modern day teams like Geelong and Hawthorn.

It might have been 4 straight GF's had Percy Jones not been coaching us in 1980.

 

[le dominateur]

If the Blues had the umpires in their pockets like Hawthorn they probably would have won 6 or 7 flags in a row in that era.

 

[asanque]

If the Blues had the umpires in their pockets like Hawthorn they probably would have won 6 or 7 flags in a row in that era.

Carlton would have won 1 less game without blatant umpire favoritism throughout the entire game against port vs a few contentious 1st quarter decisions ruled correct by the afl.

 

[MarkT2]

They only beat Collingwood & Richmond!

 

[JackFlash]

When we talk about the great teams over time we hear about Collingwood in the 20s and 30s, Melbourne in the 50s and 60s, Hawthorn in the 80s and in recent times the Lions, Cats and Hawks.

For those of us who remember the Carlton team from 1979-1982 was one of the greatest teams of all time. The team had so many champions, so many big game players who did it when it counted and were a brilliant team.
They are every bit as good if not better than the recent dominant teams of Lions, Cats and Hawks. I actually rate them higher.
Not sure why some leave them out of the equation. Absolute champion team.

Because they have won once in the AFL era, they are a relic of the past whose record these past 15 years is abominable. They WERE a great club in the 70's and 80's, they stomped on everybody, opened the cheque book and bought their flags, Carlton were the biggest and best of all the Victorian clubs, but they lost their mojo the moment the draft came into play and a few rules had to be adhered too. Some dodgy dealings and a lack of acceptance of the National competition has cost them dearly, Carlton have floundered ever since and struck the iceberg head on in 2005. Losing their home base was a disastrous move, it will be a long time before they are a power again. They have a huge fan base, but where are they all? They could mount a Richmond like comeback, but i'm not sure they will see any joy for the next five years at least.

 

[South of the Yarra]

Because they have won once in the AFL era, they are a relic of the past whose record these past 15 years is abominable. They WERE a great club in the 70's and 80's, they stomped on everybody, opened the cheque book and bought their flags, Carlton were the biggest and best of all the Victorian clubs, but they lost their mojo the moment the draft came into play and a few rules had to be adhered too. Some dodgy dealings and a lack of acceptance of the National competition has cost them dearly, Carlton have floundered ever since and struck the iceberg head on in 2005. Losing their home base was a disastrous move, it will be a long time before they are a power again. They have a huge fan base, but where are they all? They could mount a Richmond like comeback, but i'm not sure they will see any joy for the next five years at least.

That is nothing to do with how great they were between 79-82. They tried to buy Premiershios, so did we, so did Richmond, so did North, so did everyone. They just bought better.

 

[Noel Gallagher]

Carlton has lost alot of respect as we all now know that most of their premierships where bought. Geelong 2007-11 were a great side but got VERY lucky with the father son rule nabbing the ablett boys, scarlett and hawkins -all under the old system and paid bugger all for them. Brisbane were gifted numerous draft concessions/ All thing being equal regardless of this saturdays result Hawthorn is clearly greatest side of the modern era.

 

[South of the Yarra]

Carlton has lost alot of respect as we all now know that most of their premierships where bought. Geelong 2007-11 were a great side but got VERY lucky with the father son rule nabbing the ablett boys, scarlett and hawkins -all under the old system and paid bugger all for them. Brisbane were gifted numerous draft concessions/ All thing being equal regardless of this saturdays result Hawthorn is clearly greatest side of the modern era.

Most teams in that era tried to buy Premierships. Carlton just bought better.

 

[South of the Yarra]

Carlton has lost alot of respect as we all now know that most of their premierships where bought. Geelong 2007-11 were a great side but got VERY lucky with the father son rule nabbing the ablett boys, scarlett and hawkins -all under the old system and paid bugger all for them. Brisbane were gifted numerous draft concessions/ All thing being equal regardless of this saturdays result Hawthorn is clearly greatest side of the modern era.

And it was more mid eighties when the cheque book really came out.

 

[Jesse Custer]

Everything was bought with paper bags in those days. Nothing compares to the modern era. These days it's drafting and trading that gets you success. Not to mention there's 18 teams. If Hawthorn wins on Saturday they will be undisputed kings of VFL/AFL.

 

[Gavin Excell]

Carlton has lost alot of respect as we all now know that most of their premierships where bought. Geelong 2007-11 were a great side but got VERY lucky with the father son rule nabbing the ablett boys, scarlett and hawkins -all under the old system and paid bugger all for them. Brisbane were gifted numerous draft concessions/ All thing being equal regardless of this saturdays result Hawthorn is clearly greatest side of the modern era.

These sort of posts will become more apparent next week if hawks win. Big footy needs a west coast flag

 

[Gavin Excell]

Cos it's not cool to. Carlton have been on the nose for a while.

Also relatively underrepresented in the media.

Where does Dan26 rank those flags?

Dan 26! What a joker that guy is. Let me take a guess his analysis will come up with flash in the pan Essendon 2000 defeat of powerhouse melbourne as the greatest of all flags.
The Carlton 1995 side stacks up equally to essendon 2000. Very similar actually.

 

[Genuine Attempt]

Ha! I thought the title of this thread was asking why we don't rate Carlton now. In 2015...

Not that I really should be laughing at Carlton

 

[JackFlash]

That is nothing to do with how great they were between 79-82. They tried to buy Premiershios, so did we, so did Richmond, so did North, so did everyone. They just bought better.

They were more ruthless than anyone else that's for sure, they stepped on toes, they didn't care about form fours etc it was all about Premierships and they were right! The problem for Carlton was the National competition brought them back to earth with a thud and Elliott & co didn't want to play that sort of game, shrewd recruiting, talent spotting, trades and deals were all foreign to them unless it involved a huge pay cheque. They got the 1995 flag with an old list of stars with some question marks on salary caps etc and it's been downhill ever since. Their teams of the 70's and 80's certainly deserve recognition, but you know sometimes the mud sticks and people tend to forget easily. Carlton were once feared opposition, nowadays everyone wants to play them twice!

 

[andrew coombs]

It might have been 4 straight GF's had Percy Jones not been coaching us in 1980.

Hard to say. Had the Jezza/ Harris blowup not occurred the Blues may not have hired David Parkin as coach. Could they have kept winning with Jezza at the helm? Maybe not.

 

[Altum Volantes]

Because it was pre-salary cap era and they bought all the best available players. Or so the story goes.

To be fair, that didn't really stop them in the salary cap era either.

 

[Jesse Custer]

Dan 26! What a joker that guy is. Let me take a guess his analysis will come up with flash in the pan Essendon 2000 defeat of powerhouse melbourne as the greatest of all flags.
The Carlton 1995 side stacks up equally to essendon 2000. Very similar actually.

20 straight wins. 1 loss all year. Destroyed teams in the finals. Carlton lost two games. Just got over the line against the Bears in the QF. Essendon's season slightly more impressive.