News & Events CFMEU Protests

[vealesy]

So therefore what you are saying is anyone with a Safety Degree or no site experience is a moron?

When it comes to construction sites, yes, they are a moron if they truly believe they know better than someone who has been doing their job with no incidents for years.

 

[garygee]

So i guess you are just ignorant by choice then.

Actually I'd consider myself far from ignorant.

1. They are a laughing stock because they are hypocrits (again your opinion) when confronted with a real dilemma that their very presence as created (How does that happen? You either follow the rules or you don't.) Safety should be taught by a tradie to an apprentice. Not by someone who sat in a classroom and read a book.
It is not "my view". It is the same view held by most people forced to sit in a classroom and be spoken to like we are children.

More opinion.

We know more about how to do our job safely than the "teacher" does.

Yet more opinion

2. Theres nothing wrong with doing a job safely and i never inferred anything like that.

I'm glad to hear that. I bet you don't practice what you preach and I bet you take shortcuts with safety.

The problem is, who is defining what is deemed safe? I gave an example just before where a safety bureaucrat has actually made my job MORE dangerous. I could give more, but you are too heavily brainwashed to believe this is whats happening.

Ah, we get to the root of the problem, you don't like being told by someone who has not done an apprenticeship what ladder to use. Tell me, have you studied bio-mechanics? BTW apparently I'm brainwashed. I can see you and your mates sitting there with your arms crossed like a row of little Buddhas contributing and learning nothing.

3. I am going to get hurt because apparently a little card or a piece of paper is going to protect me from all things dangerous.

You obviously read the safety notices at work as carefully as you read your own posts. Why are you going to get hurt?

No longer am i allowed to rely on common sense and logical experience. I have the dweeb with the shiny new hard hat to protect me now.

Show me the rule or legislation that says you are no longer allowed to rely on common sense and logical experience.
BTW a degree takes a jittle longer than a couple of days.
Here are the questions again in case you had forgotten
Is it your view that anyone with a "safety degree" is usually a laughing stock.
Who is going to get hurt?

 

[vealesy]

Its the majority of people's view that "safety" is now about "arse covering". Anyone that thinks otherwise is not blue collar or hasn't worked in the last 10 years. Of course thats my opinion, but is a standard opinion these days. I know you can't get your head around that. Fools dont realise they are fools.

I know who WONT get hurt. Insurance companies and the now untouchable corporations.

LOL at thinking you need to study bio mechanics to have a good sense of balance and spatial awareness.

Get your head out of a book and pick up a hammer and do something. Or are you going to ban hammers next?

 

[Zim^zuM]

Its the majority of people's view that "safety" is now about "arse covering". Anyone that thinks otherwise is not blue collar or hasn't worked in the last 10 years. Of course thats my opinion, but is a standard opinion these days. I know you can't get your head around that. Fools dont realise they are fools.

I know who WONT get hurt. Insurance companies and the now untouchable corporations.

LOL at thinking you need to study bio mechanics to have a good sense of balance and spatial awareness.

Get your head out of a book and pick up a hammer and do something. Or are you going to ban hammers next?

There's so many lines I want to quote but cbf. This post pretty much sums it up. As I mentioned earlier I am going to be starting one of these courses. Why? Because it's a bullshit growing industry with a ridiculous amount of high paying jobs advertised every day. $120k a year to do nothing. I pretty much just want to be able to write these bullshit reports to how knobs want them.

One thing to realise is these officers are not always at fault, it's the rules and regulations over dramatised because of fools who have ignored logic and put themselves at risk and got hurt. They dont make the rules, they just enforce them. Trouble is as you pointed out some will enforce them in a ridiculous manner. That is why this new industry created should come from within. So you cant just leave school and get a degree. A tradie with experience should be moulded into these roles. Theres no point sooking about things being enforced by the government. So sometimes it's beneficial to see the bigger picture. That $20k expense sometimes can save you 100k in fines + extras. It only takes one idiot to get that fine. Or to have to pay medical costs, and see your insurance premium sky rocket as ours has because of one idiot. And even though I sometimes benefit by this (by having to design and construct a recommendation) that one accident means our insurance expense is minced and with the overall industry going down and costs going up I'm looking at other alternatives to ensure I make good money for my family.

I've worked for 10 years in construction/engineering mainly with steel. From larger buildings/factories to maintenance/engineering for large production/manufacturing plants. We own our own business, so I see and feel the effects of our rising insurance because one bloke ****ed his hand on a drill. No advisor/degree in the world can protect someone who is supposed to be a skilled tradesman taking a stupid shortcut while drilling. When drilling thick steel all you need to do is clamp it down and keep your hands away. And it's ridiculous that I then get punished financially. So if you cant beat them join them lol. But because of those bad apples a whole industry as you say is created.

I've seen so many examples and been so frustrated not just with safety, but engineers straight from school with no practical experience or knowledge. To the point that an engineer did not know what a combination square was or how you would use it.

One example of a safety officer appointed at a place we do maintenance is there was a pit with a tank. There was a normal ladder tied and went down the the pit. **** all room. It was deemed unsafe and I was called to sort it. This guy had no concept of anything. Being paid big bucks to simply call me and sort it. Talking to him about the options was pointless. He wanted a ladder with channel as the frame. Of course without measuring you can see that doesn't fit. I had to draw and explain it couldn't fit. In the end all I did was make rung a ladder that would be bolted in permanently. Safety wasn't improved. It done the exact same job as the other ladder, just I got money for it. Problem is if someone fell of the other ladder the company would be screwed with fines. So better off paying me 1k for the permanent ladder made to regulation. At least now when someone falls it's just medical and insurance penalties.

SO I figure if these morons are getting the cash, so can I. Having run my own business and directly dealt with many different and relevant scenarios I understand the balance required to meet regulation, but be practical and keep costs at a bare minimum. Sometimes a shortcut is just as safe as the long cut. There was a job not long ago where my God at the costs if a safety officer was involved. We had to move a steel channel already erect over by about 100mm. The end of that was connected to another channel. So it was like a T. A safety officers immediate response would have been hire a crane and move it that way. So you have the crane minimum charge, plus the time needs to suit him. When all you need is to weld a plate, make sure the holding channel is secure. Then slide it across the welded plate and re weld. You dont even need a prop. The channel is then moved before the crane even rocks up.

Have you seen the new work cover add? That also sums up what you have been saying. Where the guy is on the roof for 5 minutes then the add ends with the workcover dude rocking up in his hard had like he is going to let all his anger from school let rip.

 

[Zim^zuM]

Incorrect.

Tradies think you are a joke and we only nod our heads and sign your forms so you feel important and leave us alone to do our job.

Deal with it. You are as well liked as a parking inspector.

IS that a 100% feeling to every officer? Do you ever come across a guy where you think "well there's at least one campaigner who actually isn't a dweeb" Are there ones you can see at least worked in the industry? Or are all of them people who went straight to school.

PS my hard hat isn't shiny. It's disgusting lol. And my vest has more holes than orange with welding burns.

PPS: I forgot to mention in my other post if you ever want to see dweeb central head over to Amcor lol. They 'pride' themselves on their safety. It it by far the most over the top shit I have ever encounter. We had to make a few rails on a machine/conveyor for their maintenance staff to be protected. The ****ing drama to just get to it to measure it. Took an hour to just get in. Luckily we done the installation during shut down in between Christmas and new year. But even then dropping off the rails saw nearly 2 hours of waiting. Because an officer had to watch us doing it. Strictly had to walk through the awkward yellow path. Wasted alot of time over bullshit.

 

[garygee]

Its the majority of people's view that "safety" is now about "arse covering".

Still Opinion. Plenty of bad laws and legislation is based around opinion. We need facts. If you are unhappy with the leadership of your union then run against them or start a new union. Corrupt and incompetent unions are not the fault of the "idea". My Uncle used to run the local representation of the union because no one else would. Is tjis any way to run things?

Anyone that thinks otherwise is not blue collar or hasn't worked in the last 10 years. Of course thats my opinion, but is a standard opinion these days. I know you can't get your head around that. Fools dont realise they are fools.

Is being "blue collar" some sort of qualification?

I know who WONT get hurt. Insurance companies and the now untouchable corporations.

Insurance companies and corporations amost never get hurt.

LOL at thinking you need to study bio mechanics to have a good sense of balance and spatial awareness.

No-one ha said this. However does a good sense of balance and spatial awareness give you any idea how to lift things? How many leads can be plugged in to a single power point? How to change a lightbulb? etc? NO

Get your head out of a book and pick up a hammer and do something. Or are you going to ban hammers next?

Hmmm books. Dangerous things books. You might learn something or have an original thought if you read one. Better burn them all. My BIL is a tradie (chippie). I've seen him mre than once use a large circular saw while pissed and wearing thongs. Does that mean all chippies should be pissed and wear safety slippers? I refuse to lift anything I deemed over 20kgs. Am I bad or does the company beneffit from me having no sick days with a bad back? You make pretty big assuptions based on little evidence. To get back to the question raised by the OP and almost never addressed by the media.

WHY DOES GROCON WANT TO APPOINT IT'S OWN SAFETY OFFICERS?
Another question that should be asked
WHY DOES THE MEDIA FOCUS ON THE VIOLENCE THAT OCCURS WHEN YOU TRY TO CROSS A DISPUTED PICKET LINE AND NOT ON THE DISPUTED ISSUE?

 

[vealesy]

Dude, im not unionised. My issue is not with unions. Im actually pro-union.

Ex tradies that jumped on the safety gravy train are the worst. You know what they say, those that cant do... Teach.

My electrical license says i know wtf im doing with light bulbs too.

You dont lift over 20kg?

Hahahahahahahaha. Dweeb much?

Anyway i havent the time to rant here, ive got actual real things that have a purpose besides paying your mortgages, to do.

Dont kid yourself, what you do is not for the benefit of the workers primarily, it is money, pure and simple.

 

[garygee]

Dude, im not unionised. My issue is not with unions. Im actually pro-union.

We agree then. Contrary to your posts

Ex tradies that jumped on the safety gravy train are the worst. You know what they say, those that cant do... Teach.

People say lots of things. Most aren't true.

My electrical license says i know wtf im doing with light bulbs too.

Funny, we had a fully qualified sparky wire up our new building. The dimmer in one meeting room dimmed the whole floor. There was many other defects that were obviously the result of laziness The defect list was miles long.

You dont lift over 20kg?
Hahahahahahahaha. Dweeb much?

More he-man attitude that results in people getting injured. No wonder you hate safety officers. Is this typical of your attitude? BTW 'wont' and 'can't' are two different words.

Dont kid yourself, what you do is not for the benefit of the workers primarily, it is money, pure and simple.

I've never thought any different. It's always about the money.

 

[Hard_to_Beat]

.

More he-man attitude that results in people getting injured. No wonder you hate safety officers. Is this typical of your attitude? BTW 'wont' and 'can't' are two different words.

Are you made of cellophane?

 

[vealesy]

Are you made of cellophane?

More like jelly.

 

[vealesy]

I've never thought any different. It's always about the money.

Blahblah you know one shit sparky so therefore all sparkies should be treated like children.

You lost all hope of winning any kind of debate when you let slip you WONT lift heavy things.

If you were my employee i would find another reason and sack you.

 

[garygee]

Blahblah you know one shit sparky so therefore all sparkies should be treated like children.

You lost all hope of winning any kind of debate when you let slip you WONT lift heavy things.

If you were my employee i would find another reason and sack you.

I'd never be your employee, might be the other way around though. Maybe you can explain why I should risk hurting my back for my job? (BTW I don't get employed to lift things)

 

[vealesy]

Why would you risk your back lifting more than 20kg?

Is it risky because thats what "guidelines" are?

Or because you have no spine?

 

[garygee]

Are you made of cellophane?

Queensland's Wokplace health and safety on litfing.
http://www.deir.qld.gov.au/workplace/subjects/manualhandling/issues/limits/index.htm

10 percent of male workers had the capacity to lift 27kg safely once every 5 minutes, but they could only lift 14.5 kg if asked to do so 16 times per minute.
90 percent of male workers were able to lift 14 kg every 5 minutes but could only lift 4.5 kg safely if asked to do so 16 times per minute.

Hey Vealsey, is Hard_to_Beat one of the morons you spoke of?

Read the post again boys. 'Won't' and 'can't' are two different words.

 

[Hard_to_Beat]

I used to load 20 foot containers to the roof with 50kg bags and I have never had a back related issue in my life.

You're a ****en girl mate.

 

[vealesy]

Queensland's Wokplace health and safety on litfing.
http://www.deir.qld.gov.au/workplace/subjects/manualhandling/issues/limits/index.htm

10 percent of male workers had the capacity to lift 27kg safely once every 5 minutes, but they could only lift 14.5 kg if asked to do so 16 times per minute.
90 percent of male workers were able to lift 14 kg every 5 minutes but could only lift 4.5 kg safely if asked to do so 16 times per minute.

Hey Vealsey, is Hard_to_Beat one of the morons you spoke of?

Read the post again boys. 'Won't' and 'can't' are two different words.

ROFL!

Do you hand flyers out at your local gym with this info?

 

[Chism]

I used to load 20 foot containers to the roof with 50kg bags and I have never had a back related issue in my life.

You're a ****en girl mate.

No need to be a hero and the laws are there for a reason. Manual handling is one the biggest causes of workers injuries ever. I used to do this , I used to do that.

People use to be doing this on construction sites also....

Just because you have not done your back it does not mean others have not and get back to me if the inevitable happens and you do injure it seriously and are unable to even tie your shoes in the morning let alone lifting one of your own kids and your boss drops you like hot bag of spuds to avoid paying any sort of compensation.

Times and laws change for a reason and it is done to protect people from themselves with the hero can do anything attitude that you are displaying right now.

 

[Chism]

ROFL!

Do you hand flyers out at your local gym with this info?

Last time i looked at the gym you were not doing this for 8+hrs a day in the scorching sun to make a living for yourself and also in the comfort of an air conditioned gym you have the choice to stop and rest whenever you want and go at your own pace without a boss screaming at you to hurry up.

 

[Zim^zuM]

Bend your knees and ur back will be fine.

 

[vealesy]

Last time i looked at the gym you were not doing this for 8+hrs a day in the scorching sun to make a living for yourself and also in the comfort of an air conditioned gym you have the choice to stop and rest whenever you want and go at your own pace without a boss screaming at you to hurry up.

So find a job you can handle then.

Perhaps a receptionist role would suit. How many times are they allowed to lift a phone to their ear per hour?

 

[Chism]

I will leave it there.

Have fun with the thread.

 

[Hard_to_Beat]

No need to be a hero and the laws are there for a reason. Manual handling is one the biggest causes of workers injuries ever. I used to do this , I used to do that.

Just because you have not done your back it does not mean others have not and get back to me if the inevitable happens and you do injure it seriously and are unable to even tie your shoes in the morning let alone lifting one of your own kids and your boss drops you like hot bag of spuds to avoid paying any sort of compensation.

Times and laws change for a reason and it is done to protect people from themselves with the hero can do anything attitude that you are displaying right now.

"Hero" has got nothing to do with it. I don't possess any unusual traits when it comes to manual dexterity.

You would have to go a long way to find a stronger union man than myself, but I can't grant any serious consideration to the supplied statistics.

Men of the correct physical proportion can handle that sort of workload with ease. The kind of men that built this country.

 

[vealesy]

Good post.

A shame now we have girly office men "protecting us from ourselves".

How do we get protection from these effeminate authoritarian types?

 

[garygee]

I used to load 20 foot containers to the roof with 50kg bags and I have never had a back related issue in my life.

You're a ****en girl mate.

Wow. You must be some sort of hero then. Did you get piad a lot? Some people are born to be life's oxen. Are you surprised you learned to read and write?

ROFL!

Do you hand flyers out at your local gym with this info?

Ha ha ha very funny. You know it's much easier to add a funny quip than actually contribute.

Why would you risk your back lifting more than 20kg?

Is it risky because thats what "guidelines" are?

Or because you have no spine?

Ah no and no. Again ,why should I risk hurting my back for my job? FYI 20kg is an arbitrary amount. I think the legislation in most states says 27kgs for males.

I can't grant any serious consideration to the supplied statistics.

The supplied statistics come directly from the legislation. If you can't accept them you are in for some serious problems.

Men of the correct physical proportion

Did you seriously mean to type that comment or are you trying to make some sort of joke?

To remind you all again as you seem to forget and have trouble understanding my posts.
WHY DOES GROCON WANT TO APPOINT IT'S OWN SAFETY OFFICERS?
Another question that should be asked
WHY DOES THE MEDIA FOCUS ON THE VIOLENCE THAT OCCURS WHEN YOU TRY TO CROSS A DISPUTED PICKET LINE AND NOT ON THE DISPUTED ISSUE?

 

[Hard_to_Beat]

Wow. You must be some sort of hero then. Did you get piad a lot? Some people are born to be life's oxen. Are you surprised you learned to read and write?

Nailed it in one.

I engaged in manual labor in order to avoid basic education and to impress an anonymous person on the internet at some undetermined time in the future.

Can I have my medal now?