Chad Cornes Drop off

[Groove]

I was watching a tape of Port vs Brisbane early this year at footy park and Cornes was absolutely everywhere, taking marks, throwing his weight around and it seems to me that he always starts the year strongly only to drop off towards the end... to the extent of being benched in some games.
does anyone have any thoughts as to why this might be?

 

[Portia]

I dunno, but it affected most of the side. When we had blokes dropping left, right and centre we had desperation. But the more we had players coming back as the year went on, the more we lost it.

 

[Paralowiepower]

Just watched the Hawthorn game, which was a week later (on fox footy), and Chad was awesome.
Do you reckon it might of been because Tredders got injured in the Brisbane game, and was out of the Hawthorn game and chad had virtually the forward line to himself?

 

[PAfolwr]

Originally posted by Paralowiepower
Just watched the Hawthorn game, which was a week later (on fox footy), and Chad was awesome.
Do you reckon it might of been because Tredders got injured in the Brisbane game, and was out of the Hawthorn game and chad had virtually the forward line to himself?

It could also be that when Tredders is there we tend to become more predictable in how we deliver it into the forward fifty.
Chad is not a big part of the equation, and he tends to float to the wing and kick it to Tredders (or in that direction) himself.

 

[PJ Power]

Groove makes a pertinent point here. Chad enjoyed a very good start to the year (first 7 rounds) before his suspension against the Kangas for that pretty harsh decision. From that incident on, I can't recall a really top-3 game although he did take alot of marks.

When fighting desperately for the ball, whether it be loose on the ground or in the air, Chad is a real favourite of everyone's. The problem as I see it, is that at the moment he is in the team as a key forward. This implies that he should be playing to a set position, whether it be either CHF or FF, alternating with Tredders. Call me old fashioned, but I think any top side must have players playing to these positions, especially in finals when the best-intentioned game plans become more uncertain because of pressure. Chad simply fluctuates too much along the flanks, wings and in defence and therefore isn't fulfilling his role as a key forward. If the coaches want him to play the roaming role, then that is fine so long as we find a substitute to help Tredders either at CHF or FF.

 

[Portia]

I'm pretty sure thats why we're so desperate for Damon White to be the leading full-forward we've been looking for - both the club -and- supporters.

Chad Cornes for us could be like John Barker was for Hawthorn in 2001 - that one very difficult forward to match up on. The trick is that this needs two other capable key forwards playing. Hopefully Damon will come on.

We have some very smart players, and being able to free those players up a bit through a good structure would make us the real premiership threat. We have a fair number of good thinking or instinctual players that are stuck playing systematic football.

 

[Groove]

a point that hasnt really been discussed which i mean to refer to, was the fact that it wasnt just last year this happened but it is a recurring factor. Chad seems to get a lot of confidence out of a good preseason and having a good fitness base but then maybe just falls into the "same old same old" mind set during the season.
I agree with an earlier comment tho, when he is fighting on the ground or taking those strong marks he is just fabulous to watch, i think his main problem might be that he is one of those confidence players ie. if he gets it early he'l have a good one if not..

 

[PJ Power]

I actually thought his 2002 was almost the converse. From memory he finished that year off with two of his bigger games (Brisbane rd 22, Essendon SF), before a real downer in the prelim against Brisbane.
He's just not quite as consistent week-in-week-out over the full season as Tredders.
I think that's the other issue. It is very easy to start expecting Chad to be the next Warren, maybe one year behind in development at every step of the way. Watching them this year, I think that they are both quite different players, and if anything compliment each other well because of their differences.

Porthos is right. Chad's value would sky-rocket, if someone else could play the second key forward role in his place. He would virtually be free to play like a Pavlich - roam forward, on-ball and back wherever the need arises.

 

[PAfolwr]

Originally posted by PJ Power
...Porthos is right. Chad's value would sky-rocket, if someone else could play the second key forward role in his place. He would virtually be free to play like a Pavlich - roam forward, on-ball and back wherever the need arises.

I agree. Chad is the third forward.
Not that I think he isn't good enough to play as the second or even the main forward. He is, and he has shown so whenever Tredders has been injured.
He plays as the third forward, that's his job in our team. Things like getting the ball on the wing, going even further back whenever we are defending, playing further forward when we are attacking etc.
We do expect a bit much from him at times. As a third forward he probably is the best going around.
Once we get a proper second forward he will shine just by playing the same role as now, except that the other teams will have no one to match up with him.

 

[Groove]

ouch pafolwer
i think your being a bit harsh on studley there.
he in his time has taken some games apart, my only criticism of him is his inability to kick goals. and his tail ending, but to say that he isnt good enough to be a 2nd forward.... i think your wrong. but hey this is what this forums all about...contrasting opinons.

 

[PAfolwr]

Originally posted by Groove
ouch pafolwer
i think your being a bit harsh on studley there.
he in his time has taken some games apart, my only criticism of him is his inability to kick goals. and his tail ending, but to say that he isnt good enough to be a 2nd forward.... i think your wrong. but hey this is what this forums all about...contrasting opinons.

I think I may have expressed myself wrong if that's how it came across.

IMO not only he is good enough to be second forward, but also good enough to be first forward. He has produced the goods on a number of occasions when Tredders has been missing to prove that.

However, his role within our team is that of a "traditional" third tall forward.
We usually play Lade or Primus as a permanent forward and Tredders as the CHF. That leaves Chad Cornes as the "third" forward. A job that IMO he does extremely well.
Where he gets judged harshly (IMO) is that people expect him to not only do this job, but also produce "permanent" forward statistics, like more marks inside fifty and more goals.

Hope that makes more sense.

 

[PJ Power]

Originally posted by PAfolwr
We usually play Lade or Primus as a permanent forward and Tredders as the CHF. That leaves Chad Cornes as the "third" forward. A job that IMO he does extremely well.
Where he gets judged harshly (IMO) is that people expect him to not only do this job, but also produce "permanent" forward statistics, like more marks inside fifty and more goals.

Hope that makes more sense.

The key to next year, is who Choco will choose as his stay at home FF. It is not by coincidence that Lloyd and Lynch have spearheaded the last 4 premiership teams and have kicked healthy bags of goals in crucial finals.
Tredders is a gem at CHF and kicks more than enough goals playing from this position.
Chad plays his current role very well, but has never really been played out of the goal-square long enough for him to kick bags of goals.
I cringe everytime Mark rotates our small forwards as our FF. They are good at their specialty: being opportunists. Occasionally it pays off against a vulnerable defence to play Shaun Burgoyne as the leading forward, but not against quality sides in finals.

I would really like to see us play a more traditional forward line with someone to regularly "stay at home". The tough question is who?
Patful, maybe down the track. Champion, if he overcomes horrible recurring hammy problems, is more likely to play up the field. Damon White strikes me as a clever forward, but his lack of experience and perhaps strength make him more of a candidate for a HF flank. I think we are down to Lade and/or Primus.

I still feel (hindsight and all) that Jade Rawlings would have been more handy than most people acknowledge. He would have topped us off perfectly.
Damn you Nick Stevens forever, for depriving us of his services.

 

[Portia]

I dunno who said that Rawlings wouldn't have been a good get for us.

I reckon White has a real show. He's big enough, strong enough and smart enough - all he needs is the experience, and I reckon he'll get it.

Also don't write off Ackland as a smokey - he's got that killer lead.

 

[Port01]

Originally posted by Porthos
I dunno who said that Rawlings wouldn't have been a good get for us.

I reckon White has a real show. He's big enough, strong enough and smart enough - all he needs is the experience, and I reckon he'll get it.

Also don't write off Ackland as a smokey - he's got that killer lead.

White's biggest problem is still his ground level game. He is certainly big enough, and strong enough to play as the stay at home forward though. Has the great ability of getting position and taking 1 grab marks well out of punching range. Long arms.

Still to be tested at AFL level though.

I always cringe seeing Dew or someone playing under the long ball at FF.

 

[Portia]

Originally posted by Port01
White's biggest problem is still his ground level game. He is certainly big enough, and strong enough to play as the stay at home forward though. Has the great ability of getting position and taking 1 grab marks well out of punching range. Long arms.

Still to be tested at AFL level though.

I always cringe seeing Dew or someone playing under the long ball at FF.

I wouldn't mind seeing Dew ready under the long ball with White at FF though.

The thing about these untested forwards is that we have the smalls than can make them look good if Choco chooses to give them that job.

 

[Arsene Wenger]

Damon WHite is the man for the job, surely he will be given his opportunity this year...

I really rate this fella as a traditional forward, who takes marks and kicks long goals...

all he needs is the experience, and we must give it to him!!!

 

[Macca19]

I think we pretty much all agree that White is our great FF hope for the future. It really is a shame he did his leg/ankle last year.

If he can come in and play 12-15 games and kick 20-25 goals then it will be a real bonus for us and will certainly help his development.

I'd like to see Champion get close to playing consistent SANFL league footy next season.

If Whitey is struggling early in the pre season/season then Troy Chaplin may just get his chance at FF. He said his goal is to play Round 1...he'd have a much better chance of fulfilling that at FF rather than anywhere in defence at the moment.

 

[mic59]

Originally posted by Macca19
I think we pretty much all agree that White is our great FF hope for the future.

Sorry, but I can't agree. But before you all strike me off your Christmas lists let me explain. It's an explanation I've used before so it must sound like a cracked record.

Damon White is good and has impressive enough credentials to be considered for a place in the forwards. But if Mark Williams had been interested in a conventional FF he'd have played Chad Cornes there more often. OK, some of Chads' best games have been away from the goals, even as far away as CHB. But he was playing some good games at FF in 2000 and wasn't given much of a run there.

So no, I don't think Damon White will be the answer at FF. But only because he won't play FF, more likely some wing cum HFF cum forward pocket.

 

[Port01]

Maybe the fact we always get toweled up by leading forwards like Neitz and Hall may make him rethink his position on them.

 

[PAfolwr]

Originally posted by mic59
Sorry, but I can't agree. But before you all strike me off your Christmas lists let me explain. It's an explanation I've used before so it must sound like a cracked record.

Damon White is good and has impressive enough credentials to be considered for a place in the forwards. But if Mark Williams had been interested in a conventional FF he'd have played Chad Cornes there more often. OK, some of Chads' best games have been away from the goals, even as far away as CHB. But he was playing some good games at FF in 2000 and wasn't given much of a run there.

So no, I don't think Damon White will be the answer at FF. But only because he won't play FF, more likely some wing cum HFF cum forward pocket.

Chad Cornes and Tredrea are best where they are.
If it aint broke, don't fix it.
FF is "broke" so that needs fixing, but not by either Tredrea or Cornes.

How good is White? Frankly I have no idea, but sounds the goods. However I tend to agree with your logic.
I think all of our talls, and that includes White, will be tried out in defense at some stage.

Once we have our defense just right and only concede an average of two to six goals per game, then Choco will try and fix our so-called "deficiency" in the forward line. In the meantime it will be left to our resting ruckmen and a select few shorter players.
I hope I am wrong with that, but unfortunately I truly believe it.