Cleanout Time

[Bianconerri]

Delist: MAXWELL, SHAW, jolly, Hudson, Russell, lynch, Blair, mooney, Witts.

Don`t know about delisting Heater Dicky, its amazing how long the rose coloured glasses have lasted with the Captain, its taken a while, but alas they have finally arrived at the station of reality.

 

[THATSGOLD]

Get rid of Shaw and Harry, we will not have a defense that can win a flag. You might be able to get rid of one, but both of them will do too much damage.

Newsflash, we don't have one now, we are out.

 

[forwardflanker]

Hudson
Jolly
Krak
Dids
Clarke
Richmond
Gault
Didak
Johnson
Russell

That is not an unreasonable list though I think that they might keep Clarke or Russell or both as depth; and maybe Jolly on base wage. I was more directing my post to those who in addition to those players wanted Maxwell, Macaffer, Mooney, Witts which is just crazy. I not sure you can make more than about 10 changes to the list without seriously affecting the chemistry of the side and also the additional problem of finding 10+ players to replace them with. Although our problem is a bit unique I guess because as you said none of those players listed are going to make us better, the only benefit they might have is related to depth.

 

[THATSGOLD]

It will be an interesting trade period. I suspect though that both players will be retained. Whatever happens I just hope it strengthens the side because right now I think we could easily slip out of the 8 next year. I don't have a problem with this providing the team is moving towards being a realistic premiership chance.

I reckon Buckley will be very active. He won't want the same thing occuring next season or it will be his own arse out the door. Could you imagine we are still talking about the undisciplined acts of Shaw and off field issues of Harry next year? He's head would be wanted.

 

[Bring_Back_Brad]

It was Reid's worst game for the season last night. But what really threw the forward line out of whack was the presence of Keeffe. He was continually running into the holes that Reid and Cloke needed to be leading into. I think it was a big mistake of Buckley's to play Keeffe in this role. I don't blame Keeffe for this, it was his first game up forward all year. It reminded me of the Cloke to CHF move by MM in the 03' GF all those years ago. We also had Elliott and Maxwell through the forward line. Far too many tall and lead up types. The balance was completely off.

Couldn't agree more finals aren't the time for experiments this was a major **** up by Bucks. Unforgivable.

 

[Quicky]

Couldn't agree more finals aren't the time for experiments this was a major **** up by Bucks. Unforgivable.

It was an ordinary coaching decision but hardly unforgivable.

 

[jmac70]

I reckon Buckley will be very active. He won't want the same thing occuring next season or it will be his own arse out the door. Could you imagine we are still talking about the undisciplined acts of Shaw and off field issues of Harry next year? He's head would be wanted.

I agree with you. Bucks looked like a man that was well and truly sick of the same issues happening again.

 

[Paddywhackers]

Newsflash, we don't have one now, we are out.

I reckon if you read this guys posts circa 09/10 he would have been reactionary and basically wrong.

 

[KJpie]

We should seriously consider trading Heath Shaw. He's lost the plot. I'd be all for getting rid of him if we could somehow entice a young key back or forward to the club.

How do we trade him "A" as he can walk if placed on the trade table due to the fact he is a FA as you have stated?

 

[forwardflanker]

It was Reid's worst game for the season last night. But what really threw the forward line out of whack was the presence of Keeffe. He was continually running into the holes that Reid and Cloke needed to be leading into. I think it was a big mistake of Buckley's to play Keeffe in this role. I don't blame Keeffe for this, it was his first game up forward all year. It reminded me of the Cloke to CHF move by MM in the 03' GF all those years ago. We also had Elliott and Maxwell through the forward line. Far too many tall and lead up types. The balance was completely off.

It was a huge mistake imo. You do not wait until the first final to change the teams forward structure that they've been playing to all year. And you especially don't do it to accommodate a player who has probably player fewer than 100 minutes of football as a forward in his short career. 2-3 times the ball was kicked to Keefe 1v1 in the goal square when if he wasn't there it wouldn't have been Cloke and a therefore a certain goal for us.

I rate Keefe as a defender but if a situation occurs where there is no match up for him in the forward line the he should have been rested. I guess they were concerned about having a chop out for Grundy, or if Grundy got injured, however Maxwell would have been just as effective chop out (meaning Keefe was useless there) and the injury risk was just something we had to take - Port was risking the exact same thing by only playing one ruck.

 

[Matz]

I think Marty Clarke is a MUST for delisting as hes just not up to AFL standard. Russell is a MUST also but I think has a year to go so I doubt they will pay him out.
Ben Richmond not really fussed as I dont think he hogs a list spot due to him coming from another code(correct me if im wrong). I think we will see alot of changes in the off season but cant see the club delisting stacks in one hit like last year but then again I could be wrong.

 

[Quicky]

It was a huge mistake imo. You do not wait until the first final to change the teams forward structure that they've been playing to all year. And you especially don't do it to accommodate a player who has probably player fewer than 100 minutes of football as a forward in his short career. 2-3 times the ball was kicked to Keefe 1v1 in the goal square when if he wasn't there it wouldn't have been Cloke and a therefore a certain goal for us.

I rate Keefe as a defender but if a situation occurs where there is no match up for him in the forward line the he should have been rested. I guess they were concerned about having a chop out for Grundy, or if Grundy got injured, however Maxwell would have been just as effective chop out (meaning Keefe was useless there) and the injury risk was just something we had to take - Port was risking the exact same thing by only playing one ruck.

Do we know if Lynch was injured or dropped? It felt to me like we were trying to fill a role, that forward come ruck role, despite the fact we didn't have a player that could play it. Almost like we did it to spite ourselves. We would have been far better off playing a second dedicated ruck.

The other terrible tactical mistake we made was playing our spare man at the contest. We did this earlier in the season and it didn't work at all. Our best footy coincided with playing our loose player in defense. I thought we had learned from this mistake. But in a clutch final we revert to a tactic that we have already determined does not work for us. It really was a strange decision.

 

[KJpie]

Over rated player who makes at least 2 big **** ups a match.

Shaw's a gun on his day the problem is you never know which Shaw is going to turn up on any given week.

I don't like him playing Deep in defence so often, he needs to be moved between the flanks from time to time. We could use the pace around the ground.

 

[KJpie]

Almost like we did it to spite ourselves. We would have been far better off playing a second dedicated ruck.

The other terrible tactical mistake we made was playing our spare man at the contest. We did this earlier in the season and it didn't work at all. Our best footy coincided with playing our loose player in defense. I thought we had learned from this mistake. But in a clutch final we revert to a tactic that we have already determined does not work for us. It really was a strange decision.

Absolutely baffling???

 

[loki04]

How do we trade him "A" as he can walk if placed on the trade table due to the fact he is a FA as you have rightly stated?

IIRC he is a signed player until 2015 so he isn't a FA and is able to be traded should he agree/club wanting to go down that path.

 

[forwardflanker]

Do we know if Lynch was injured or dropped? It felt to me like we were trying to fill a role, that forward come ruck role, despite the fact we didn't have a player that could play it. Almost like we did it to spite ourselves. We would have been far better off playing a second dedicated ruck.

The other terrible tactical mistake we made was playing our spare man at the contest. We did this earlier in the season and it didn't work at all. Our best footy coincided with playing our loose player in defense. I thought we had learned from this mistake. But in a clutch final we revert to a tactic that we have already determined does not work for us. It really was a strange decision.

+10000 on the spare man at the contest. It's just common sense that a loose player in defence is going to have a much greater impact on the contests their involved in than the extra man at the stoppages. I mean it's pretty simple logic, I have nfi why they continue to do it

Buckley needed to either create our own loose man in their defence or man up their loose man. I prefer having our own loose man because I think manning up the +1 played into their hands with their hard running rebound players and small forward line. There is an argument though that we kick so badly to our forward that their +1 is going to be more influential although Port aren't a great kicking side themselves.

I guess the ironic thing was that we lost the game in the list quarter after Port decided to get rid of the loose man and just play 1v1 accross the ground.

It wasn't a great night for our coaches

 

[loki04]

I think Marty Clarke is a MUST for delisting as hes just not up to AFL standard. Russell is a MUST also but I think has a year to go so I doubt they will pay him out.
Ben Richmond not really fussed as I dont think he hogs a list spot due to him coming from another code(correct me if im wrong). I think we will see alot of changes in the off season but cant see the club delisting stacks in one hit like last year but then again I could be wrong.

Would rather we fill those spots with yanks who have genuine elite athletic ability if we are going for a long shot smokeys.

 

[loki04]

+10000 on the spare man at the contest. It's just common sense that a loose player in defence is going to have a much greater impact on the contests their involved in than the extra man at the stoppages. I mean it's pretty simple logic, I have nfi why they continue to do it

Buckley needed to either create our own loose man in their defence or man up their loose man. I prefer having our own loose man because I think manning up the +1 played into their hands with their hard running rebound players and small forward line. There is an argument though that we kick so badly to our forward that their +1 is going to be more influential although Port aren't a great kicking side themselves.

I guess the ironic thing was that we lost the game in the list quarter after Port decided to get rid of the loose man and just play 1v1 accross the ground.

It wasn't a great night for our coaches

You know what's worse in the last quarter the 2 teams switched loose man tactics.

Port took away their loose man in def and moved it to extra man at the contest and we did the opposite and they were MORE effective at both tactics!

 

[KJpie]

It was Reid's worst game for the season last night. But what really threw the forward line out of whack was the presence of Keeffe. He was continually running into the holes that Reid and Cloke needed to be leading into. I think it was a big mistake of Buckley's to play Keeffe in this role. I don't blame Keeffe for this, it was his first game up forward all year. It reminded me of the Cloke to CHF move by MM in the 03' GF all those years ago. We also had Elliott and Maxwell through the forward line. Far too many tall and lead up types. The balance was completely off.

Agreed, it also made for a double edged sword as Reid and Keeffe are 2 of our best users of the ball out of defence.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

Harry would be no loss to the team. We need players with elite disposal skills pumping the ball forward. However, there are so many players begging to be delisted or traded that we will not be able to cut as many as we would like. The vast majority of players listed on here for a cleanout did not even play yesterday. Our disposal skills are awful. We cannot carry so many poor kickers in the side and pretend that they are semi elite players. Several of the players we tout as having trade value probably would not a game in another top 8 side.

 

[KJpie]

IIRC he is a signed player until 2015 so he isn't a FA and is able to be traded should he agree/club wanting to go down that path.

Have you seen where to access a list of our FA's etc Loki?

 

[Magpie4Life]

Clinton Young shapes a a good replacement for Harry. A much better kick.

 

[loki04]

Have you seen where to access a list of our FA's etc Loki?

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/a...every-club-rated/story-e6frf9lx-1226594977631
Is the best I could find.

COLLINGWOOD
Alan Didak, 30, unrestricted
Ben Johnson, 31, unrestricted
Nick Maxwell, 29, unrestricted
Dale Thomas, 25, restricted
EXPOSURE: Dids says he will retire after this year, while Dale Thomas is content to wait until mid-year. Like Travis Cloke before him, you figure he will play hard ball but has the intention of staying. Harry O'Brien is out next year.

Then 2014.
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2013-06-21/clubs-eye-2014-free-agents

 

[Matz]

Would rather we fill those spots with yanks who have genuine elite athletic ability if we are going for a long shot smokeys.

Agree, like North are doing with that basketball recruit cant remember his name but geez hes huge and athletic!

 

[forwardflanker]

You know what's worse in the last quarter the 2 teams switched loose man tactics.

Port took away their loose man in def and moved it to extra man at the contest and we did the opposite and they were MORE effective at both tactics!

Finding someone who can effectively play as the loose man is a pretty big need for us now since Maxwell's decline this season has been so dramatic. The fact we had O'brien doing it in the last, who would have to be one of the worst in the side in the air, says a bit about where it's at - his positioning wasn't great either. I guess Toovey will have to be tried for that spot, I can't see anyone else capable of doing it. I'd prefer someone who is a better kick but at least he is athletic and good defensively.