Opinion Cometh the time, cometh the man.

[forwardflanker]

I am not going to be abusive to anybody but I definitely think that Beams has left D Thomas in his wake.
To say that Thomas is better is certainly not supported by the evidence,we have to go back 3 seasons for Thomas,s best and that is a long while.
It matters not that Beams won the Copeland which was entirely deserved and his form has been better than Reid also,FF you are guilty yourself of giving Thomas a higher ranking than Beams when clearly the the gap between the 2 grows bigger all the time.
I will agree with you that Beams has not equaled Thomas,s 2011 form but neither has Thomas and I think he has less chance of equaling it than Beams.

I also think That most supporters of other teams would prefer Beams over Thomas so it is not just a Collingwood choice because he won the Copeland it is because he HAS become better than Thomas of which there is almost universal agreement.

Beams showed in his few games last season just how badly we missed him and how good he had become and I expect him to widen the gap even further on Thomas this season.

Well given both have missed significant portions of recent seasons I think you can only compare them on what their best is and I think Thomas has a bit on him in that respect (same with Reid for that matter). I don't disagree that many would prefer Beams over Thomas at the moment but that isn't a measure of who the better player is. Beams appears to me to be a more durable player than Thomas with less risk that he goes on to have a lengthy career playing at a high standard. Given the extent of his injuries and reliance on his pace there is still a huge question mark on whether Thomas can get back to what he was.

On Reid, he was a top 10 player in the AFL in 2011 imo and whist not maintaining that form has been a quality CHB since despite injury problems. He's only 24 and already AA and premiership player so it's not as if his best years have passed (hopefully anyway though he does strike me as injury prone). Additionally, he has proved last season that he can do a very solid job as second fiddle to Cloke which only increases his value (this versatility in itself should make him one the most valuable players in the side imo_). Like Thomas, if his fitness was guaranteed then he's a better player than Beams imo.

There's nothing that really distinguishes Beams from a load of other quality midfielders in the AFL yet I think many on this board would regard him as a top 10 midfielder in the AFL. Even if you look at our players - he doesn't have Pendlebury's class, Swan's and Daisy's line breaking ability or Ben Reid's value as a intercepting and rebounding defender. He's a really solid player and a great professional but not in the same class as the above players imo. Happy to be proven wrong but that's how I see it at the moment.

 

[Robroy22]

Personally I think you'll be proven wrong. Beamer is the second most natural footballer at the club, he's just no where near as funny as Swanny! In terms of footy nous (finding it, using it and being in the right spots) Beamer has everyone but Swanny covered on our list. Don't get me wrong, Pendles is an outstanding distributor and a wonderful mover in traffic, but Beamer has the old style footy smarts and just enough of a mean streak to make him dangerous to would be taggers. Given a fair run with injuries I think you'll see Beamer feature in the top ten midfielders for quite a few years yet.

 

[medhurstISGOD]

Beams has great ball winning ability both inside and out, very good disposal on both sides of the body by both hand and foot, can kick 55+, kicks >1 goal a game, one of the best snap shots at goal in the league, can handle a tag, tackles and has no major weaknesses at all, but yeah apart from that nothing really stands out.

 

[Robroy22]

Beams has great ball winning ability both inside and out, very good disposal on both sides of the body by both hand and foot, can kick 55+, kicks >1 goal a game, one of the best snap shots at goal in the league, can handle a tag, tackles and has no major weaknesses at all, but yeah apart from that nothing really stands out.

Yeah he's pretty ordinary isn't he?

 

[Pie eyed]

Well given both have missed significant portions of recent seasons I think you can only compare them on what their best is and I think Thomas has a bit on him in that respect (same with Reid for that matter). I don't disagree that many would prefer Beams over Thomas at the moment but that isn't a measure of who the better player is. Beams appears to me to be a more durable player than Thomas with less risk that he goes on to have a lengthy career playing at a high standard. Given the extent of his injuries and reliance on his pace there is still a huge question mark on whether Thomas can get back to what he was.

On Reid, he was a top 10 player in the AFL in 2011 imo and whist not maintaining that form has been a quality CHB since despite injury problems. He's only 24 and already AA and premiership player so it's not as if his best years have passed (hopefully anyway though he does strike me as injury prone). Additionally, he has proved last season that he can do a very solid job as second fiddle to Cloke which only increases his value (this versatility in itself should make him one the most valuable players in the side imo_). Like Thomas, if his fitness was guaranteed then he's a better player than Beams imo.

There's nothing that really distinguishes Beams from a load of other quality midfielders in the AFL yet I think many on this board would regard him as a top 10 midfielder in the AFL. Even if you look at our players - he doesn't have Pendlebury's class, Swan's and Daisy's line breaking ability or Ben Reid's value as a intercepting and rebounding defender. He's a really solid player and a great professional but not in the same class as the above players imo. Happy to be proven wrong but that's how I see it at the moment.

Gven Beams has had but parts of a single season to show his wears in the mid-field I think it's extremely presumptuous to even compare him to Swan, but as we are.....Swan took years to show the form he is now famous for and years more to be recognised.
There was no instant stardom for either Swan or Pendlebury...

 

[Robroy22]

Yep it took a summer of having Johnno getting stuck into him to make Swanny realise just what he was capable of...I think Beamer has already seen what he's capable of (Premiership player in his first year, Copeland 2012) and now he just needs the fitness to get back there. Hopefully Johnno can be utilised somewhere down the track to get the new crop of midfielders to work just as hard.

 

[ThisIsJake]

im sorry but if anyone says that beams is better than pendles they are out of their mind.
pendles is the best player in the comp (yes better than ablett), swan and cloke are both in the 10-15 range and beams is in the 15-20 range!

 

[Bard]

im sorry but if anyone says that beams is better than pendles they are out of their mind.
pendles is the best player in the comp (yes better than ablett), swan and cloke are both in the 10-15 range and beams is in the 15-20 range!

Swan is easily top 10.

 

[Robroy22]

Or we could all just sit back and go: "How lucky are we that we have so many GUN midfielders all in the same team? And a bunch that compliment each other's skill sets so well....how could we have got so many?"
Thanks Mr. Hine.

 

[Collingwoodity]

im sorry but if anyone says that beams is better than pendles they are out of their mind.
pendles is the best player in the comp (yes better than ablett), swan and cloke are both in the 10-15 range and beams is in the 15-20 range!

Swan is easily top 10.

I completely understand Carlton schmucks underrating Swan but for Pies' supporters to underrate him is criminal.

About 10 players in the AFL can single-handedly influence a game in the balance. Swan is one of them. That's what makes him a better player than say a Roughhead or Hannebery.

 

[ThisIsJake]

I completely understand Carlton schmucks underrating Swan but for Pies' supporters to underrate him is criminal.

About 10 players in the AFL can single-handedly influence a game in the balance. Swan is one of them. That's what makes him a better player than say a Roughhead or Hannebery.

yeah i would actually have him at 6-10 i just didn't want to be labelled as a bias one eyed pie supporter, which i now realise is stupid becuase im on the collingwood board.. my bad!
but i still think the order goes pendles>swan>cloke>beams and that beams has a fair way to go to get to pendles /swan standard

 

[surfer1]

One of the reasons he gets overrated is because he's a Copeland winner. He had an excellent 2012 and was excellent when he came back in 2013 but even with that form he was not in the top 4 players at the club (Thomas, Pendlebury, Cloke and Swan all better, arguably Reid as well) yet people on this board talk about him as the second coming of Christ. As I said above he's a good player but a superstar of the game he is not, however if it it makes you feel better hurling abuse at what I think is a pretty reasonable opinion then continue.

I must assume you say this in jest. He was out most of 2013 and the way he came back was nothing short of amazing

 

[Jasper84]

I completely understand Carlton schmucks underrating Swan but for Pies' supporters to underrate him is criminal.

About 10 players in the AFL can single-handedly influence a game in the balance. Swan is one of them. That's what makes him a better player than say a Roughhead or Hannebery.

That is probably the next step for beams and to a lesser extend swan. To be able to identify what is required to win the game off your own boot and to take the initiative to make it happen. It is all well and good to get 30+ touches in the middle but they need to be able to say " right now my team needs me to stand up and I will play wherever I'm going to have the most influence in the game". As much as it pains me to say it, Judd and Hird were the masters of this in their heyday. Swanny has done it a bit but this is where beams could elevate himself to top 10

 

[forwardflanker]

Or we could all just sit back and go: "How lucky are we that we have so many GUN midfielders all in the same team? And a bunch that compliment each other's skill sets so well....how could we have got so many?"
Thanks Mr. Hine.

Or we could wonder why it is that we have so many gun midfielders yet were clearly not a top 4 side in 2013 and very likely won't be in 2014.

 

[Pleasedontfail11]

Or we could wonder why it is that we have so many gun midfielders yet were clearly not a top 4 side in 2013 and very likely won't be in 2014.

I blame injuries for 2013. Ball, Beams, Thomas and Jolly all had major injuries and all were major parts of our midfield. Imagine if those guys were injured in 2010.

 

[Collingwoodity]

That is probably the next step for beams and to a lesser extend swan. To be able to identify what is required to win the game off your own boot and to take the initiative to make it happen. It is all well and good to get 30+ touches in the middle but they need to be able to say " right now my team needs me to stand up and I will play wherever I'm going to have the most influence in the game". As much as it pains me to say it, Judd and Hird were the masters of this in their heyday. Swanny has done it a bit but this is where beams could elevate himself to top 10

Swan - Anzac Day 2013. Won the game for the pies.

 

[Cory]

Swan - Anzac Day 2013. Won the game for the pies.

2012*

 

[RuFiO]

Or we could wonder why it is that we have so many gun midfielders yet were clearly not a top 4 side in 2013 and very likely won't be in 2014.

Because Mick.

 

[surfer1]

Beams has great ball winning ability both inside and out, very good disposal on both sides of the body by both hand and foot, can kick 55+, kicks >1 goal a game, one of the best snap shots at goal in the league, can handle a tag, tackles and has no major weaknesses at all, but yeah apart from that nothing really stands out.

You forgot to mention his tats

 

[UpTheMags]

comparisons between beams, ball, swan and pendles are kindve unfair. hes a different player to all of them. he has amazing goal sense (swan does too but beams skills dont let him down). he gets a million possessions, a lot of one percenters and a lot of hard ball. his defensive game would be a great aspect of his game to improve. he will be a dominant player for a long time to come for the pies.

hes also a good user of the ball, not the best but handy nonetheless. imo his main asset is his goal sense, smart handpassing out of traffic and ability to just win a lot of ball game in game out. those assets alone have catapulted him into near-elite status in my mind

 

[rustyg70]

There is only one guy that can steer us towards another Grand Final, and he doesn't play in the midfield.
His name is Travis Cloke.
He IS the key player in our side.
If this man fires, no one can stop him.
Cloke for the Copeland and the Coleman.

 

[Vicky Park]

There is only one guy that can steer us towards another Grand Final, and he doesn't play in the midfield.
His name is Travis Cloke.
He IS the key player in our side.
If this man fires, no one can stop him.
Cloke for the Copeland and the Coleman.

Rusty, Cloke firing is one thing, but his accuracy is obviously the issue. He must be a nightmare for opposition teams, and close to the top of their list of problem Pies players, so difficult to match up. I really want a year when our forward line functions and enables Cloke more one-on-ones, instead of three-on-ones. If the former happens with frequency, and Cloke improves his accuracy - by which I mean he is closer to that of other top forwards - then he will smash it.

 

[Mental Magpie]

Beams is a ****ing star.
Cannot; and must not be compared to anyone else in the side. They all complement each other.
He is a walk up start.
Tough as nails. Hard at it. Very good off either side, by hand or foot. Kicks goals.
GUN.

 

[Markfs]

Personally I think you'll be proven wrong. Beamer is the second most natural footballer at the club, he's just no where near as funny as Swanny! In terms of footy nous (finding it, using it and being in the right spots) Beamer has everyone but Swanny covered on our list. Don't get me wrong, Pendles is an outstanding distributor and a wonderful mover in traffic, but Beamer has the old style footy smarts and just enough of a mean streak to make him dangerous to would be taggers. Given a fair run with injuries I think you'll see Beamer feature in the top ten midfielders for quite a few years yet.

better than pendlebury? friend of the family?

 

[rustyg70]

Rusty, Cloke firing is one thing, but his accuracy is obviously the issue. He must be a nightmare for opposition teams, and close to the top of their list of problem Pies players, so difficult to match up. I really want a year when our forward line functions and enables Cloke more one-on-ones, instead of three-on-ones. If the former happens with frequency, and Cloke improves his accuracy - by which I mean he is closer to that of other top forwards - then he will smash it.

Vicky P. not meaning to sound rude or anything but
He was the second best goal kicker last year depite having the most shots on goal.
He is our barometer.
Cloke fires= Pies win.
Its as simple as that.