News Coronavirus (COVID-19) Discussion Thread II

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The Butcher said:
Can anyone point me to a detailed and agreed upon description of what exactly happened with the vic quarantine "patient zero". My dream situation is to learn what specifically happened here in fact and what the best guesses (best) are on how the same/similar situation would have gone down elsewhere (nsw). There are some very strong opinions being shared here that I reckon should (must?) have been built on knowing this information, so i'm hopeful there will be a link to share. Thanks in advance.

The power of chance and luck can be equal/greater than the power of human planning and intervention. Especially when the planning and intervening is done by "popular" leaders. But how do you hold chance and luck to account? We don't, we hold onto the idea of human planning and interventions omnipotence. It can be powerful, but our system of planning and intervening hardly maximises that power. So i'm proposing we accept the limits of our social governance system, we aint ditching it anytime soon, and start to lay the blame where the blame lies.. chance and luck. Lets bring back.. Ritual Sacrifices!!

You know its right

iu
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The old 'back luck'/game of chance excuse eh?

Yeah you can try that line as a way of excusing the government - and pardon the pun but good luck with that.

Tell you what - wait for the Board Report to be released in about 4 weeks time and see how the bad luck line has worked for you - I bet the front cover of the report says ...The entire second wave was due to ........bad luck/could have happened to anyone - time to move on....

FFS - bad luck - who are these people?
 
7577969923 said:
Just listen to the evidence at the inquiry. The ten most senior politicians and bureaucrats gave evidence that none of them knows who made a critical decision to engage private security contractors who were subsequently given no training, adequate PPE etc. The evidence that Victoria's hotel quarantine was a shambles is overwhelming. There were serious concerns raised within DHHS on day 1 and by the CMO that were never acted upon.

At the end of the day, the numbers are irrefutable. Victoria has had 5 times the infections of NSW and 15 times the deaths before you even start to measure the cost in lost jobs and businesses destroyed.

It is not about political point-scoring, it is about accountability. If you have been watching the events and evidence with any degree of attention to detail and you are still running the lines you are I suspect you to be a rusted on partisan who is trying to paint their position as being the reasonable one.
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I wouldn't worry about actually trying to explain facts with these posters - its all about fate, the zodiac signs, the hand of God and bad luck for them.

A convenient way of dealing with any problem situation for the ignorant.

Probably thinks this years season was all bad luck for North - nothing to be done - all good for next year as our luck will change.
 
I am out of the loop. That's why I'm asking nicely to; see the description, in detail, of specifically what happened in vic hotel quarantine and, to see the arguments and explanations of exactly how it would have been prevented/reacted to if the situation were different (nsw). I recalled ages back some discussion in this thread about a patient zero in hotel quarantine and that the guy did self report when symptomatic and was somehow isolated after that, but that obviously the efforts were ineffective and virus spread from him. I'm just asking if anyone can link to an update/correction and massive fleshing out of that tidbit. too much? maybe.

Frankly, I haven't been keeping up. I felt a long time ago that there just wasn't enough high quality publicly available info to form a strong opinion and I don't trust myself to withhold judgement when being bombarded with half truths and misinformation, so I tend to remove myself from the situation. Every now and then i want to dip my toes in again and hope that those who seem to me highly invested and opinionated will help me out. If they don't want to that's fine, I'm not hurt, but I might learn that they didn't because they couldn't.
 

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The Butcher said:
I am out of the loop. That's why I'm asking nicely to; see the description, in detail, of specifically what happened in vic hotel quarantine and, to see the arguments and explanations of exactly how it would have been prevented/reacted to if the situation were different (nsw). I recalled ages back some discussion in this thread about a patient zero in hotel quarantine and that the guy did self report when symptomatic and was somehow isolated after that, but that obviously the efforts were ineffective and virus spread from him. I'm just asking if anyone can link to an update/correction and massive fleshing out of that tidbit. too much? maybe.

Frankly, I haven't been keeping up. I felt a long time ago that there just wasn't enough high quality publicly available info to form a strong opinion and I don't trust myself to withhold judgement when being bombarded with half truths and misinformation, so I tend to remove myself from the situation. Every now and then i want to dip my toes in again and hope that those who seem to me highly invested and opinionated will help me out. If they don't want to that's fine, I'm not hurt, but I might learn that they didn't because they couldn't.
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Read the reports mate - watch developments, gather facts and stop trolling with your bullshit - you sound like a likely candidate for the Victorian Public Service.
 
The Butcher said:
I am out of the loop. That's why I'm asking nicely to; see the description, in detail, of specifically what happened in vic hotel quarantine and, to see the arguments and explanations of exactly how it would have been prevented/reacted to if the situation were different (nsw). I recalled ages back some discussion in this thread about a patient zero in hotel quarantine and that the guy did self report when symptomatic and was somehow isolated after that, but that obviously the efforts were ineffective and virus spread from him. I'm just asking if anyone can link to an update/correction and massive fleshing out of that tidbit. too much? maybe.

Frankly, I haven't been keeping up. I felt a long time ago that there just wasn't enough high quality publicly available info to form a strong opinion and I don't trust myself to withhold judgement when being bombarded with half truths and misinformation, so I tend to remove myself from the situation. Every now and then i want to dip my toes in again and hope that those who seem to me highly invested and opinionated will help me out. If they don't want to that's fine, I'm not hurt, but I might learn that they didn't because they couldn't.
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This is not the forum for getting your first information. You didn't start off by claiming you had no background information you were willing to write it off as simple dumb luck.
 
Shima, it's trolling to ask about the commonly agreed upon beliefs concerning a very narrow but extremely important part of the total situation (hotel quarantine) and in the meantime imply that the impact of chance may be being underestimated? For all I know somewhere out there on the webs there is a great breakdown of events as they happened and the hypothetical alternatives. In reading this thread I get the feeling that there must be, and I get that feeling from what I perceive to be the strength of some opinions being shared. Today I've been trying to find such a breakdown but I've completely failed. My posts here have been one part of my attempt. It wasn't a total waste of time, I infer from Gaso's post that there is a 4corners ep I should watch, I'll search that out next.. tho my opinion of that program isn't what it was 30yrs ago and I'm reluctant to believe they've played out the "what if" hypothetical to any great depth. Thanks to all, particularly Numbers, for your time/effort.
 
7577969923 said:
This is not the forum for getting your first information. You didn't start off by claiming you had no background information you were willing to write it off as simple dumb luck.
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🤪This is not the forum, full stop.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app
 
And you Mr sleeping right next to me...
 
The Butcher said:
I am out of the loop. That's why I'm asking nicely to; see the description, in detail, of specifically what happened in vic hotel quarantine and, to see the arguments and explanations of exactly how it would have been prevented/reacted to if the situation were different (nsw). I recalled ages back some discussion in this thread about a patient zero in hotel quarantine and that the guy did self report when symptomatic and was somehow isolated after that, but that obviously the efforts were ineffective and virus spread from him. I'm just asking if anyone can link to an update/correction and massive fleshing out of that tidbit. too much? maybe.

Frankly, I haven't been keeping up. I felt a long time ago that there just wasn't enough high quality publicly available info to form a strong opinion and I don't trust myself to withhold judgement when being bombarded with half truths and misinformation, so I tend to remove myself from the situation. Every now and then i want to dip my toes in again and hope that those who seem to me highly invested and opinionated will help me out. If they don't want to that's fine, I'm not hurt, but I might learn that they didn't because they couldn't.
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Good luck with that attitude.

No self respecting mob is gonna want a part of you.

Well... Actually that may want you in several parts but that is what happens if you are a heretic, and not what I meant.
 
Off topic but yeah, I guess one thing I enjoy about the online world is how much more low cost it is to avoid joining a mob than it is in the physical world. Or even to join and abandon particular mobs as the situation changes. What a shame that the gift of online anonymity and it's potential for individual thinking and the avoidance of the downsides of mob belonging got out competed by the lure of the mob. Not saying mob membership doesn't have very real and substantial benefits in the physical, non anonymous, world. Anyway...
 

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this is tough times for all, but especially for us in metro melb.

I've moved away from tele , the news and the fear that has been jammed down our throats. So I thought I'd take a left turn in life and post a vid of a song performed by a group of brilliant singers/song writers.

the key is the joy on their faces a they ' get s**t done'.

My point is don't let this s**t rule your life, it's nothing more than a * on your personal journey.

Peace out good people, enjoy :)


 
 
ferball said:
NSW hasn't had local transmission from an unknown source for two weeks now.

So theoretically we have no community transmission of the virus. We have about 20 cases a week from international arrivals tho.
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Since I made this post we've had one case of conmunity transmission from an unknown source.

That is after at least two weeks without one. The dreaded two weeks...


So it's gonna take a month at least without unknown transmissions before we could say it's probably out of the community.
 
What’s everyones prediction on today’s press conference? I’ll go with the following : He’ll start by telling us what a great job we’re all doing . He’ll bombard us with numbers . Put the fear of god into us, tell us Curfew to remain until past grand final , no movement outside 5kms, protesting to remain illegal . Some trivial sh*t like 6 people can meet in a park for 52 minutes as long as you social distance and all live within 5kms of rendezvous point. Then finish with some false hope ‘we will re visit the progress in 2 weeks ect ect’
 
bengrina said:
What’s everyones prediction on today’s press conference? I’ll go with the following : He’ll start by telling us what a great job we’re all doing . He’ll bombard us with numbers . Put the fear of god into us, tell us Curfew to remain until past grand final , no movement outside 5kms, protesting to remain illegal . Some trivial sh*t like 6 people can meet in a park for 52 minutes as long as you social distance and all live within 5kms of rendezvous point. Then finish with some false hope ‘we will re visit the progress in 2 weeks ect ect’
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They have had a terrible week so reckon he needs a few positives.
 
 
 
 
r0 of 0.69 to 0.75
 
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