Health Depression

[MP_]

There really is no cure for this shit, just existing and pretending. Happiness is just a myth.

 

[Caesar]

There really is no cure for this s**t, just existing and pretending. Happiness is just a myth.

Happiness isn't a myth per se - it's just not the perpetual state of being that it's made out to be, or a particularly good life goal.

I think it is important to recognise 'being happy' as a human construct - i.e. a name we give to a collection of emotions we feel - because anything based on an emotional state is by definition simply a transient experience. Nobody out there is happy all of the time, or even most of the time. One of the most powerful and successful Muslim caliphs of the middle ages famously counted his happy days towards the end of his life, and came up with the number 14.

The social history of the quest for happiness is a pretty interesting one, and worth reading up on. Today it is very secular and commercial, something co-opted by brands and marketers to sell us stuff we don't need. But the roots go all the way back to Christian morality - which basically weaponised any normal negative feelings humans had by telling us they were the result of a moral shortcoming. We have lost the moral superstition but we still treat negative feelings as something to be eliminated.

At the end of the day, we aren't designed to be happy - we're wired for reproduction and survival. Those are difficult tasks requiring struggle and work, which we are not inclined to take on if we are kicking back feeling content. So our brain limits the dopamine and instead gives us big frontal lobes chock full of executive and analytical function, to make us dissatisfied and push us forward.

To me this is incredibly liberating. My inability to be happy is something I share with every single other member of the human race - and yet there are still billions and billions of us who have worked out how to live rewarding and meaningful lives in spite of it.

I don't think letting go of the happiness ideal solves depression, but for me at least it was an important step to finding the meaning and drive to pull myself out of the hole. Taking 'being happy' off the table - or rather, ceasing to think or worry about happiness at all - let me focus on achievable and realistic goals which have (at least for now) given me a very satisfying life that is full of good things.

 

[MP_]

Happiness isn't a myth per se, it's just not the perpetual state of being that it's made out to be.

I think it is important to recognise 'being happy' as a human construct - i.e. a name we give to a collection of emotions we feel - because anything based on an emotional state is by definition simply a transient experience. Nobody out there is happy all of the time, or even most of the time. One of the most powerful and successful Muslim caliphs of the middle ages famously counted his happy days towards the end of his life, and came up with the number 14.

The social history of the quest for happiness is a pretty interesting one, and worth reading up on. Today it is very secular and commercial, something co-opted by brands and marketers to sell us stuff we don't need. But the roots go all the way back to Christian morality - which basically weaponised any normal negative feelings humans had by telling them they were the result of a moral shortcoming. We have lost the moral superstition but we still treat negative feelings as something to be eliminated.

At the end of the day, we aren't designed to be happy - we're wired for reproduction and survival. Those are difficult tasks requiring struggle and work, which we are not inclined to take on if we are kicking back feeling content. So our brain limits the dopamine and instead gives us big frontal lobs chock full of executive and analytical function to make us dissatisfied and push us forward.

To me this is incredibly liberating. My inability to be happy is something I share with every single other member of the human race - and yet there are still billions and billions of us who have worked out how to live rewarding and meaningful lives in spite of it.

I don't think letting go of the happiness ideal solves depression, but at least for me it was an important step to finding the meaning and drive to pull myself out of the hole. Taking it off the table let me focus on achievable and realistic goals, which (at least for now) has given me a very satisfying life that is full of good things.

 

[Caesar]

 

[phantom13]

I dont often agree with Caesar but his broad point there is pretty apt.

Were conditioned to chase hapiness and if your always chasing the next thing to make you happy you never will be.

I would say the bit i disagree with (and it might be me not interpreting it correctly) is that we are capable of hapiness, but it involves slowing down and being greatful for what you have. That sounds easy, its absolutely not.

 

[MP_]

Happiness isn't a myth per se - it's just not the perpetual state of being that it's made out to be, or a particularly good life goal.

I think it is important to recognise 'being happy' as a human construct - i.e. a name we give to a collection of emotions we feel - because anything based on an emotional state is by definition simply a transient experience. Nobody out there is happy all of the time, or even most of the time. One of the most powerful and successful Muslim caliphs of the middle ages famously counted his happy days towards the end of his life, and came up with the number 14.

The social history of the quest for happiness is a pretty interesting one, and worth reading up on. Today it is very secular and commercial, something co-opted by brands and marketers to sell us stuff we don't need. But the roots go all the way back to Christian morality - which basically weaponised any normal negative feelings humans had by telling us they were the result of a moral shortcoming. We have lost the moral superstition but we still treat negative feelings as something to be eliminated.

At the end of the day, we aren't designed to be happy - we're wired for reproduction and survival. Those are difficult tasks requiring struggle and work, which we are not inclined to take on if we are kicking back feeling content. So our brain limits the dopamine and instead gives us big frontal lobes chock full of executive and analytical function, to make us dissatisfied and push us forward.

To me this is incredibly liberating. My inability to be happy is something I share with every single other member of the human race - and yet there are still billions and billions of us who have worked out how to live rewarding and meaningful lives in spite of it.

I don't think letting go of the happiness ideal solves depression, but for me at least it was an important step to finding the meaning and drive to pull myself out of the hole. Taking 'being happy' off the table - or rather, ceasing to think or worry about happiness at all - let me focus on achievable and realistic goals which have (at least for now) given me a very satisfying life that is full of good things.

I’ve had time to digest what you wrote and you’re right. I actually don’t want or need happiness, I just want to be free of the self hate and negative thoughts and the guilt associated with my life so far. Being free from my mind is what I seek.

 

[The Dice Man]

Happiness isn't a myth per se - it's just not the perpetual state of being that it's made out to be, or a particularly good life goal.

I think it is important to recognise 'being happy' as a human construct - i.e. a name we give to a collection of emotions we feel - because anything based on an emotional state is by definition simply a transient experience. Nobody out there is happy all of the time, or even most of the time. One of the most powerful and successful Muslim caliphs of the middle ages famously counted his happy days towards the end of his life, and came up with the number 14.

The social history of the quest for happiness is a pretty interesting one, and worth reading up on. Today it is very secular and commercial, something co-opted by brands and marketers to sell us stuff we don't need. But the roots go all the way back to Christian morality - which basically weaponised any normal negative feelings humans had by telling us they were the result of a moral shortcoming. We have lost the moral superstition but we still treat negative feelings as something to be eliminated.

At the end of the day, we aren't designed to be happy - we're wired for reproduction and survival. Those are difficult tasks requiring struggle and work, which we are not inclined to take on if we are kicking back feeling content. So our brain limits the dopamine and instead gives us big frontal lobes chock full of executive and analytical function, to make us dissatisfied and push us forward.

To me this is incredibly liberating. My inability to be happy is something I share with every single other member of the human race - and yet there are still billions and billions of us who have worked out how to live rewarding and meaningful lives in spite of it.

I don't think letting go of the happiness ideal solves depression, but for me at least it was an important step to finding the meaning and drive to pull myself out of the hole. Taking 'being happy' off the table - or rather, ceasing to think or worry about happiness at all - let me focus on achievable and realistic goals which have (at least for now) given me a very satisfying life that is full of good things.

This is an incredibly good post, and worthy of multiple readings.

 

[Caesar]

I actually don’t want or need happiness, I just want to be free of the self hate and negative thoughts and the guilt associated with my life so far. Being free from my mind is what I seek.

Yeah this was kind of what I was trying to get at, albeit poorly

When I was depressed I spend a lot of time living internally and thinking about what was wrong with my life and how unhappy I was.

When I started to get out of my depression, it wasn’t about that thinking magically reversing. It was more of a slow shift to an external focus - less time doing nothing and thinking about myself and more time doing things and thinking about other people. At that time, if you stopped and asked me if I still was unhappy and guilty and regretful I still would have said yes - it’s just my attention was being demanded by other things so those thoughts were less intrusive.

That phase of my life lasted a long period of time - like, years. I was doing the right things but it was hard. I needed a lot of antidepressants and a lot of counselling to just get me out of bed and keep me moving - because those depressed thoughts were always threatening to suck me back down.

But as time went on I started to see more and more benefits from doing the right things. I lost a ton of weight. My career took off. My relationships improved. The more focus and energy I put externally, the more that came back to me in terms of return on investment.

One day I just realised that I now spent very little time thinking about the stuff that used to make me depressed. And when those thoughts came into my mind, it was easy to dismiss them as unimportant - because I was more interested in putting my attention into other things that are far more rewarding.

I think the critical thing is that it didn’t involve me suddenly flipping how I felt about the past. To some extent, depressed me was right about that not ever really changing - I still carry the same regrets and guilt and frustration with myself about the mistakes I have made. The difference is just that it not very important to me any more, so I rarely think or worry about it.

If you asked me if that means I’m happy, I wouldn’t know what to say. I would say I am engaged in my life. I do interesting things, I am focused on the people I care about, I have goals and aspirations I am working towards. Sometimes I feel the feels - good and bad. Most of the time I am pretty emotionally neutral because my brain is engaged in non-emotional activities.

I think that’s the secret really. It’s not really about being happy, it’s just about being interested in getting out of bed.

Anyway, thanks for coming to my TED talk

 

[T2B_]

Some knowledgeable folk in here, I just have a bit of an odd question. Anyone know if deep enough depression can cause hallucinations and/or delusions? Even without psychosis. I've read some sources say it can, but nothing that goes into much detail or explains much.

 

[Feraligatr]

Some knowledgeable folk in here, I just have a bit of an odd question. Anyone know if deep enough depression can cause hallucinations and/or delusions? Even without psychosis. I've read some sources say it can, but nothing that goes into much detail or explains much.

Yes I believe so.

Depression has a lot to do with brain chemistry not being correct so if they are out of whack enough that would definitely be able to cause both of the above conditions. The brain is crazy.

 

[CM86]

So many amazing conversations in this thread! It's genuinely impressive.


What are people's idea of 'suicidal ideation'?

Because I don't think there's a clear understanding of the different levels and aspects of it.

 

[MP_]

So many amazing conversations in this thread! It's genuinely impressive.


What are people's idea of 'suicidal ideation'?

Because I don't think there's a clear understanding of the different levels and aspects of it.

I didn’t know there were different levels. I do it a lot however, for me and this will seem weird it gives me comfort, knowing there is a way out of things get too bad. It has now become my sleeping habit, the only way I can fall asleep is to visualise myself not being here. Being in a permanent coma is my most common ideation and generally is what I fall asleep too. Pretty sad when I look at what I’m writing down here.

 

[undefined]

Some knowledgeable folk in here, I just have a bit of an odd question. Anyone know if deep enough depression can cause hallucinations and/or delusions? Even without psychosis. I've read some sources say it can, but nothing that goes into much detail or explains much.

Has happened when changing meds, especially in the night. Quite horrible.

 

[Run n Spread]

Once again I post here. I hate myself I have nowhere to go. I'm 40 ****ing years old and ready to die but don't want to. What do I do next 40 years I really don't want another counselling session or mediation

 

[ash_1050]

Once again I post here. I hate myself I have nowhere to go. I'm 40 ******* years old and ready to die but don't want to. What do I do next 40 years I really don't want another counselling session or mediation

Life can be a slog sometimes mate.

There's the obvious questions (are you seeing a psychologist, are you on meds, are you eating healthy, drinking less alcohol etc) that all contribute towards treating symptoms and causes. It's an important part of depression.

In terms of dealing with the nihilist outlook I've found it's always good to have something or several things to look forward to. It can be a holiday, a gig, dinner with a friend, or indeed anything that helps to give life purpose and intent. I'm working so I can do X or buy Y is the mentality that's got me through, and when things look pointless it's usually because the upcoming plans are pretty light on.

You're 40, and you're at the half way point in life. Pick a country you've always wanted to visit and go in 12 months time. Treat yourself to a mid life crisis purchase such as a new car or a kick arse home theatre setup. Tick off a bucket list item that's there because why not? The next 40 years of your life are for getting the most out of things before you kick the bucket and disappear of the face of the earth forever.

 

[Feraligatr]

Once again I post here. I hate myself I have nowhere to go. I'm 40 ******* years old and ready to die but don't want to. What do I do next 40 years I really don't want another counselling session or mediation

I know exactly how you feel.

Looking forwards and feeling like there is no hope sucks.

 

[Run n Spread]

I know exactly how you feel.

Looking forwards and feeling like there is no hope sucks.

There must be some failing that try do what you want to do in life.
Otherwise I got nothing. I had a very nice conversation tonight I didn't think possible.
And I hope to make an effort to reconnect with others.
Otherwise I next time need to make more of an we effort to speak out against certain things

 

[Ace Rimmer]

How are we all doing today?
Not so bad for me so far, but I've just had breakfast and am about to go to work, so we'll see...
A few work-related problems appear to have been cleared up, and my arthritis is easing off, and I've got ten days' holiday starting on Sunday, so feeling fairly sunny today. I hope you are all doing better too.

 

[Shell]

I've shaken off the seasonal crap a lot earlier this year. Last year was a longer struggle tho.

 

[Ace Rimmer]

I've shaken off the seasonal crap a lot earlier this year. Last year was a longer struggle tho.

That's good news. Take every good thing that comes your way and enjoy it guiltlessly, because plenty of bad things will come our way and we have no choice but to deal with them.
I'm in Scotland, so we are just heading into the darker days and colder weather. I hope you have a really, really good summer!

 

[MP_]

That's good news. Take every good thing that comes your way and enjoy it guiltlessly, because plenty of bad things will come our way and we have no choice but to deal with them.
I'm in Scotland, so we are just heading into the darker days and colder weather. I hope you have a really, really good summer!

You searching for the Loch Ness monster over there

 

[Shell]

That's good news. Take every good thing that comes your way and enjoy it guiltlessly, because plenty of bad things will come our way and we have no choice but to deal with them.
I'm in Scotland, so we are just heading into the darker days and colder weather. I hope you have a really, really good summer!

Wow, certainly puts my winter blues into perspective then, lol.

I've never been to Scotland- furthest north I've been is Manchester. Where abouts are you??

 

[Shell]

You searching for the Loch Ness monster over there

That was on the news the other night! Didnt really pay that close attention to the story tho.

 

[MP_]

That was on the news the other night! Didnt really pay that close attention to the story tho.

They have found some unique sounds which has theme excited

 

[Fabab]

I was born and bred in Scotland certainly dont miss the winter times.
Having a bad few days at the moment turned my phone off yesterday as couldnt face talking to anyone ,had last two nights with barely no sleep.
Currently on no depression meds ,chronic back pain due to a work injury and havent worked for a few years i got paid off and no big payout either.

Any sleeping advice folks? Ive tried meditation ,headspace and smiling minds i was recommended to try but they dont help.

Hope you all have a pleasant day.