Do it for Bucks

[dave_27]

• Presti will play on Lloyd, and may get another Brownlow Vote against the Dons.

Is this the same spud that got his a-s handed to him by Lloyd the last time he played against Collingwood?

Or was that Wakelin?

 

[The Fireman]

"A fading star in a dying constellation" might be better

very good.

 

[wce4premiership]

they wont make the 4 no matter who they do it for.

 

[doppleganger]

Untrue. Now the great Voss has retired Adam Goodes is. Two Brownlows, one premiership medal, All Australian, Indigenous team member, modest, intelligent . Hird, argueably may be with - one brownlow, two premierships, but FIG definitely not - one brownlow - NO PREMIERSHIP. Or are we just talking white men here?

not if u include bucks SANFL awards

1 - premiership
1 - magarey medal, equiv to brownlow
1 - fos williams medal, equiv to norm smith
1- port b&f

all this in the one year!!

so bucks has two BOG's in grand finals
two best player in the league, ie Brownlow & Magarey

throw in the rising star which he beat voss & hird to easily

bucks is the most decorated player

just happened to play for a dud teams in the AFL, originally brisbane bears, then collingwood.

 

[plugger47]

not if u include bucks SANFL awards

1 - premiership
1 - magarey medal, equiv to brownlow
1 - fos williams medal, equiv to norm smith
1- port b&f

all this in the one year!!

so bucks has two BOG's in grand finals
two best player in the league, ie Brownlow & Magarey

throw in the rising star which he beat voss & hird to easily

bucks is the most decorated player

just happened to play for a dud teams in the AFL, originally brisbane bears, then collingwood.

Mate a SNAFL award is about as valuable as a John Howard fridge magnet.

 

[Pevers-Legend]

• Presti will play on Lloyd, and may get another Brownlow Vote against the Dons.
• Clement will oppose James Hird.
• Wakelin will play on Lucas, if not Clement while Heath Shaw runs with Jimmy in the middle as he can't get the ball.
• Nick Maxwell will take Courtney Johns and do a good job on him, physchologically will get into Johns mind.
• The great man Heritier will take Laycock if Essendon are stupid enough to crowd a forward line consisting of Lloyd and Lucas with other tall duds. Harry can play tall and he will never lose his feet in a contest, as he never has!

Matthew Lloyd v Shane Wakelin
Player MT K H D Avg M Avg HO Avg T Avg FF FA G Avg B SC Rat Avg
Matthew Lloyd 10 95 28 123 12.3 55 5.5 3 0.3 7 0.7 9 13 37 3.7 11 233 740 74
Shane Wakelin 10 78 17 95 9.5 30 3 5 0.5 11 1.1 10 3 0 0 0 0 408 40.8
Totals 20 173 45 218 10.9 85 4.2 8 0.4 18 0.9 19 16 37 1.8 11 233 1148 57.4


Matthew Lloyd v Simon Prestigiacomo
Player MT K H D Avg M Avg HO Avg T Avg FF FA G Avg B SC Rat Avg
Matthew Lloyd 11 112 28 140 12.7 70 6.4 4 0.4 9 0.8 9 11 41 3.7 20 266 884 80.4
Simon Prestigiacomo 11 38 22 60 5.5 18 1.6 1 0.1 10 0.9 5 11 0 0 0 0 225 20.5
Totals 22 150 50 200 9.1 88 4 5 0.2 19 0.9 14 22 41 1.9 20 266 1109 50.4


Scott Lucas v Shane Wakelin
Player MT K H D Avg M Avg HO Avg T Avg FF FA G Avg B SC Rat Avg
Scott Lucas 11 120 28 148 13.5 43 3.9 4 0.4 10 0.9 8 6 16 1.5 9 105 684 62.2
Shane Wakelin 11 79 24 103 9.4 32 2.9 6 0.5 13 1.2 9 2 0 0 0 0 442 40.2
Totals 22 199 52 251 11.4 75 3.4 10 0.5 23 1 17 8 16 0.7 9 105 1126 51.2


Scott Lucas v Simon Prestigiacomo
Player MT K H D Avg M Avg HO Avg T Avg FF FA G Avg B SC Rat Avg
Scott Lucas 12 156 37 193 16.1 78 6.5 3 0.3 14 1.2 7 8 24 2 17 161 979 81.6
Simon Prestigiacomo 12 47 31 78 6.5 22 1.8 1 0.1 13 1.1 6 9 0 0 1 1 302 25.2
Totals 24 203 68 271 11.3 100 4.2 4 0.2 27 1.1 13 17 24 1 18 162 1281 53.4


So Lloyd avg 3.7 goals a game on presti and wakelin. 12.7 (12.3) disposals and 6.4 (5.5) marks on Presti (Wakelin). Wow - thats a record I'd be proud of.

Scotty averages 2 (1.5) goals, 16.1 (13.5) disposals, 6.5 (3.9) marks per game on Presti (Wakelin)

Yup our two key forwards are screwed everytime we play the pies.

 

[Lonie_from_50]

Matthew Lloyd v Shane Wakelin
Player MT K H D Avg M Avg HO Avg T Avg FF FA G Avg B SC Rat Avg
Matthew Lloyd 10 95 28 123 12.3 55 5.5 3 0.3 7 0.7 9 13 37 3.7 11 233 740 74
Shane Wakelin 10 78 17 95 9.5 30 3 5 0.5 11 1.1 10 3 0 0 0 0 408 40.8
Totals 20 173 45 218 10.9 85 4.2 8 0.4 18 0.9 19 16 37 1.8 11 233 1148 57.4


Matthew Lloyd v Simon Prestigiacomo
Player MT K H D Avg M Avg HO Avg T Avg FF FA G Avg B SC Rat Avg
Matthew Lloyd 11 112 28 140 12.7 70 6.4 4 0.4 9 0.8 9 11 41 3.7 20 266 884 80.4
Simon Prestigiacomo 11 38 22 60 5.5 18 1.6 1 0.1 10 0.9 5 11 0 0 0 0 225 20.5
Totals 22 150 50 200 9.1 88 4 5 0.2 19 0.9 14 22 41 1.9 20 266 1109 50.4


Scott Lucas v Shane Wakelin
Player MT K H D Avg M Avg HO Avg T Avg FF FA G Avg B SC Rat Avg
Scott Lucas 11 120 28 148 13.5 43 3.9 4 0.4 10 0.9 8 6 16 1.5 9 105 684 62.2
Shane Wakelin 11 79 24 103 9.4 32 2.9 6 0.5 13 1.2 9 2 0 0 0 0 442 40.2
Totals 22 199 52 251 11.4 75 3.4 10 0.5 23 1 17 8 16 0.7 9 105 1126 51.2


Scott Lucas v Simon Prestigiacomo
Player MT K H D Avg M Avg HO Avg T Avg FF FA G Avg B SC Rat Avg
Scott Lucas 12 156 37 193 16.1 78 6.5 3 0.3 14 1.2 7 8 24 2 17 161 979 81.6
Simon Prestigiacomo 12 47 31 78 6.5 22 1.8 1 0.1 13 1.1 6 9 0 0 1 1 302 25.2
Totals 24 203 68 271 11.3 100 4.2 4 0.2 27 1.1 13 17 24 1 18 162 1281 53.4


So Lloyd avg 3.7 goals a game on presti and wakelin. 12.7 (12.3) disposals and 6.4 (5.5) marks on Presti (Wakelin). Wow - thats a record I'd be proud of.

Scotty averages 2 (1.5) goals, 16.1 (13.5) disposals, 6.5 (3.9) marks per game on Presti (Wakelin)

Yup our two key forwards are screwed everytime we play the pies.

I never referred anything as being Presti>Lloyd. It is obvious the champion that Lloyd is, has a good record on Presti. I was referring ONLY to this,

Rnd 22, Collingwood vs Essendon, 2000
3 - J Misiti (Ess)
2 - B Caracella (Ess)
1 - S Prestigiacomo (Coll)

 

[Pevers-Legend]

Player MT K H D Avg M Avg HO Avg T Avg FF FA G Avg B SC Rat Avg
Anthony Rocca 207 1572 697 2269 11 1011 4.9 759 3.7 294 1.4 124 185 341 1.6 237 2283 12930 62.5
Josh Fraser 136 1199 676 1875 13.8 633 4.7 1383 10.2 291 2.1 213 127 120 0.9 101 821 10048 73.9
Matthew Lloyd 212 2166 582 2748 13 1332 6.3 17 0.1 210 1 175 198 767 3.6 350 4952 17048 80.4
Scott Lucas 225 2723 690 3413 15.2 1265 5.6 41 0.2 394 1.8 145 169 370 1.6 258 2478 17077 75.9


Oh and overall Lloyd and Lucas pants Rocca and Fraser - your two key forwards. Nice try.

You may have a better team than us at the moment, but KP forwards - don't even try.

 

[GRANGE_GSM]

not if u include bucks SANFL awards

1 - premiership
1 - magarey medal, equiv to brownlow
1 - fos williams medal, equiv to norm smith
1- port b&f

all this in the one year!!

so bucks has two BOG's in grand finals
two best player in the league, ie Brownlow & Magarey

throw in the rising star which he beat voss & hird to easily

bucks is the most decorated player

just happened to play for a dud teams in the AFL, originally brisbane bears, then collingwood.

hahahhaa magary equivlent to the bronwlow?? your kidding right? hahaha

so do we put jeremy clayton,brett ebert ion the same catagory as bucks?....lol u tool! haha margary equiv as the brownlow!

haha and equiv to the norm smith! pull the other 1 mate!

norm smith and charles brownlow will be turning in their grave!

 

[Lonie_from_50]

Untrue. Now the great Voss has retired Adam Goodes is. Two Brownlows, one premiership medal, All Australian, Indigenous team member, modest, intelligent . Hird, argueably may be with - one brownlow, two premierships, but FIG definitely not - one brownlow - NO PREMIERSHIP. Or are we just talking white men here?

Adam Goodes has and will never be used in the one of billions of Hird vs Voss vs Buckley arguments, simply because he hasn't been around in the era of these guys, and players like Robert Harvey and Mark Ricciuto have also never been included because they aren't part of this argument.

And once again, when we rate an individual, why does a premiership get rated higher? It is a team sport, and it relies on 40 players to get you there and 22 players to win it. Not 1 and 1.

Buckley has won the following awards which rate an individual:
SANFL

• Magarey Medal 1992
• Jack Oatey Medal 1992
• Port Adelaide B&F 1992

AFL

• Brownlow Medal 2003
• 2nd Brownlow Medal 1998
• 3rd Brownlow Medal 1999
• Best and Fairest 1994, 1996, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2003
• 2nd Best and Fairest 1993, 1997
• 3rd Best and Fairest 2001
• All-Australian 1996, 1997, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2003
• International Rules Series 1998, 1999
• AFL Rising Star 1993
• Alex Jeasulenko Medal 1997
• Norm Smith Medal 2002
• Allies Captain 1997
• Collingwood Captain 1999-2006
• Collingwood Team of the Century (HBF)
• Collingwood Captain Record Games Holder
• Brownlow Medal Votes 178 (equal 5th all-time)
• AFL Life Member

That shows he is highly decorated as an individual, as, if not more, than his opposed players.

Then again, I am not to say he is better than Hird or Voss, as I believe they are as good as each other and should only be along side each other, and will always be. I do however add in-depth discussion to help Buckley's case, considering in this case, he gets written off because of the colours he wears, and because of his clubs success.

 

[plugger47]

Adam Goodes has and will never be used in the one of billions of Hird vs Voss vs Buckley arguments, simply because he hasn't been around in the era of these guys, and players like Robert Harvey and Mark Ricciuto have also never been included because they aren't part of this argument.

And once again, when we rate an individual, why does a premiership get rated higher? It is a team sport, and it relies on 40 players to get you there and 22 players to win it. Not 1 and 1.

Buckley has won the following awards which rate an individual:
SANFL

• Magarey Medal 1992
• Jack Oatey Medal 1992
• Port Adelaide B&F 1992

AFL

• Brownlow Medal 2003
• 2nd Brownlow Medal 1998
• 3rd Brownlow Medal 1999
• Best and Fairest 1994, 1996, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2003
• 2nd Best and Fairest 1993, 1997
• 3rd Best and Fairest 2001
• All-Australian 1996, 1997, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2003
• International Rules Series 1998, 1999
• AFL Rising Star 1993
• Alex Jeasulenko Medal 1997
• Norm Smith Medal 2002
• Allies Captain 1997
• Collingwood Captain 1999-2006
• Collingwood Team of the Century (HBF)
• Collingwood Captain Record Games Holder
• Brownlow Medal Votes 178 (equal 5th all-time)
• AFL Life Member

That shows he is highly decorated as an individual, as, if not more, than his opposed players.

Then again, I am not to say he is better than Hird or Voss, as I believe they are as good as each other and should only be along side each other, and will always be. I do however add in-depth discussion to help Buckley's case, considering in this case, he gets written off because of the colours he wears, and because of his clubs success.

You used the term "decorated". Got nothing to do with era's played, the prison uniform soneones wearing etc or how many minor awards they pick up in hicksville. Its about the value of the award. So the Baden Powell Knot Tying Proficiency Badge is equivalent to the Victoria Cross is it?

 

[doppleganger]

Player MT K H D Avg M Avg HO Avg T Avg FF FA G Avg B SC Rat Avg
Anthony Rocca 207 1572 697 2269 11 1011 4.9 759 3.7 294 1.4 124 185 341 1.6 237 2283 12930 62.5
Josh Fraser 136 1199 676 1875 13.8 633 4.7 1383 10.2 291 2.1 213 127 120 0.9 101 821 10048 73.9
Matthew Lloyd 212 2166 582 2748 13 1332 6.3 17 0.1 210 1 175 198 767 3.6 350 4952 17048 80.4
Scott Lucas 225 2723 690 3413 15.2 1265 5.6 41 0.2 394 1.8 145 169 370 1.6 258 2478 17077 75.9


Oh and overall Lloyd and Lucas pants Rocca and Fraser - your two key forwards. Nice try.

You may have a better team than us at the moment, but KP forwards - don't even try.

fraser is our only ruck

if we had another ruck he would be able to play up forward, but as it is

Rocca, T.Cloke, Buckley, Medhurst, Didak, Egan, L.Davis will be our forwards

 

[doppleganger]

hahahhaa magary equivlent to the bronwlow?? your kidding right? hahaha

so do we put jeremy clayton,brett ebert ion the same catagory as bucks?....lol u tool! haha margary equiv as the brownlow!

haha and equiv to the norm smith! pull the other 1 mate!

norm smith and charles brownlow will be turning in their grave!

was more in reference to the silly SA people trying to claim port adelaides 34 SANFL premierships as equivalent to VFL-AFL

but bucks showed that in a succesful team he still dominates

also showed he excels in the big games, played in 3 GF's and was BOG in 2 of them!

 

[Lonie_from_50]

You used the term "decorated". Got nothing to do with era's played, the prison uniform soneones wearing etc or how many minor awards they pick up in hicksville. Its about the value of the award. So the Baden Powell Knot Tying Proficiency Badge is equivalent to the Victoria Cross is it?

I'm assuming that your argument is that a premiership medal judges an individual better than the Brownlow Medal, best and fairest, captaincy, etc. In that case, is Aaron Keating a better individual than Nathan Buckley, or is Leo Barry?

 

[doppleganger]

Mate a SNAFL award is about as valuable as a John Howard fridge magnet.

not according to our SA friends, they try to claim SANFL awards as equivalent to VFL-AFL

more just highlighting that Buckley has dominated in succesful teams as well as poor teams

Buckley played with Voss, and Buckley had the better season, easily.

Buckley left to play football in its heartland, Voss stayed and was rewarded for his club being a rabble by being gifted the remnants of fitzroy.

 

[kelvin_sheedy]

And once again, when we rate an individual, why does a premiership get rated higher?

Because there are those rare individuals that have an inate ability to get their team over the line at the *highest* level.

Look at other sports for an example. Maradona got Argentina over the line in 86, Zidane with France in 98.

Carey did it at North, Hird at Essendon, Voss at Brisbane.

The last 10 minutes of the 2002 GF. Voss stood up and was the difference. Swap Voss with Buckley that day and the result would have been different.

Thats where we can differentiate the greats.

 

[plugger47]

I'm assuming that your argument is that a premiership medal judges an individual better than the Brownlow Medal, best and fairest, captaincy, etc. In that case, is Aaron Keating a better individual than Nathan Buckley, or is Leo Barry?

No what you should have assumed from what I posted is that th rankings for "deocrations" are"
1. Brownlow - Goodsie has 2 - FIG 1 - Hird 1 - Juddy - 1
2. Grand final winner - Goodsie - 1 - FIG no cigar and never will have one as long as his arse points downwards- Hird 2 - Juddy 1
3. Norm Smith - Goodsie 0 - Bucks 1- Hird - 1- Juddy 1

Everything else totally irrelevant, particularly SAFL trinkets. In fact we should deduct points off FIG for having some of the wretched things. Because the Brownlow outweighs a GF medal the most decorated are:
1. Adam Goodes
2. Hird
3. Judd (equal on Brownlows and Norms but less GF medals)
4. FIG a fast fading fourth.

Rating a Norm Smith third in the honurs is justified by its sad devaluation in the 2006 fiasco

 

[Cyclops]

Mmmmmm the combination of football-blind ignorance and deliberate trolling is soooooo delicious, I just have to bite.

...The last 10 minutes of the 2002 GF. Voss stood up and was the difference. Swap Voss with Buckley that day and the result would have been different...

I am sick of this crock. Swap Buckley for Voss in 2002 and the Pies would've lost by a mile. Buckley was clear BOG from Rocca: both played arguably the best games of their careers to keep an underrmanned side close to a much more powerful experienced outfit. Voss was nowhere near his own best and nowhere near Buckley on the day. In 2003 when Buckley played with less than his usual consistency (ie more like Voss in 2002) we were utterly belted.

 

[Cyclops]

...1. Adam Goodes.... fiasco

Just edited down your post for clarity.

I mean he's a beaut footy player but seriously, don't mention him in the same breath as the great trio of Bucks/Voss/Hird

 

[UpTheGuts]

That could be pies theme next year!

Surely that's the only reason #5 from Collingwood is going around again... just a few more $$$$$$$

 

[kelvin_sheedy]

Mmmmmm the combination of football-blind ignorance and deliberate trolling is soooooo delicious, I just have to bite.



I am sick of this crock. Swap Buckley for Voss in 2002 and the Pies would've lost by a mile. Buckley was clear BOG from Rocca: both played arguably the best games of their careers to keep an underrmanned side close to a much more powerful experienced outfit. Voss was nowhere near his own best and nowhere near Buckley on the day. In 2003 when Buckley played with less than his usual consistency (ie more like Voss in 2002) we were utterly belted.

We can debate this point till the cows come home but history will show you that certain players have won GF's and got their teams over the line.

Can't argue with history and fact.

 

[Lonie_from_50]

Because there are those rare individuals that have an inate ability to get their team over the line at the *highest* level.

Look at other sports for an example. Maradona got Argentina over the line in 86, Zidane with France in 98.

Carey did it at North, Hird at Essendon, Voss at Brisbane.

The last 10 minutes of the 2002 GF. Voss stood up and was the difference. Swap Voss with Buckley that day and the result would have been different.

Thats where we can differentiate the greats.

Buckley's last ten minutes were as good as his first 110. I have posted this somewhere, that Bucks had as much touches, more inside 50's, and more hardball gets than Voss did in the last ten minutes. Voss' influence was bigger and better, but Buckley did as much, just not the reward.

It is amazing how people continue to rate Buckley as if he is a piece of ********. His skills are his assets, and his consistency. Voss has lead a great team in history and been respected for his fair-play and toughness on the field. Hird is amazing at what he does, and how good he is in big games.

When it comes to Buckley, people always find the negatives. Most Collingwood supporters who come on here to stick up for Bucks, never show anything against both Voss and Hird, because as one eyed as we are, we know the truth. However, if you don't see black and white, the negatives are always addressed and nobody shows there respect of the great man. When facts and figures are shown up to support our opinions, they are no use because you all have no respect for a club, and any individual involved with that club gets the same treatment.

There are some who are the opposite of the people I am talking about, and I am sure they feel embarrassed for what is said, just like most of us Pies fans feel when a moron who supports the black and white comes on here and acts like them (ie. DTM).

Buckley will always be rated as a superstar by respected football followers, and be under-rated by most of the public who have a hatred for a football club because of their rich history and passionate support.

 

[Lonie_from_50]

No what you should have assumed from what I posted is that th rankings for "deocrations" are"
1. Brownlow - Goodsie has 2 - FIG 1 - Hird 1 - Juddy - 1
2. Grand final winner - Goodsie - 1 - FIG no cigar and never will have one as long as his arse points downwards- Hird 2 - Juddy 1
3. Norm Smith - Goodsie 0 - Bucks 1- Hird - 1- Juddy 1

Everything else totally irrelevant, particularly SAFL trinkets. In fact we should deduct points off FIG for having some of the wretched things. Because the Brownlow outweighs a GF medal the most decorated are:
1. Adam Goodes
2. Hird
3. Judd (equal on Brownlows and Norms but less GF medals)
4. FIG a fast fading fourth.

Rating a Norm Smith third in the honurs is justified by its sad devaluation in the 2006 fiasco

Why do you continue to mention Adam Goodes. He is a great footballer, but this discussion that will never end is a Buckley/Hird/Voss discussion take 18946. Goodes shouldn't be mentioned anywhere.

 

[Lonie_from_50]

We can debate this point till the cows come home but history will show you that certain players have won GF's and got their teams over the line.

Can't argue with history and fact.

When will you realise it is a team sport and a premiership is won by 22 players on the day. Each and every player who wore a guernsey in the winning side on the last Saturday in September is equally represented. A ten minute performance doesn't result in winning a game of football, a 120 minute performance does, whether it is the one 1 percenter on the day, or the 1 clearance, or the 20 clearances.

 

[DapperDon]

No what you should have assumed from what I posted is that th rankings for "deocrations" are"
1. Brownlow - Goodsie has 2 - FIG 1 - Hird 1 - Juddy - 1
2. Grand final winner - Goodsie - 1 - FIG no cigar and never will have one as long as his arse points downwards- Hird 2 - Juddy 1
3. Norm Smith - Goodsie 0 - Bucks 1- Hird - 1- Juddy 1

Everything else totally irrelevant, particularly SAFL trinkets. In fact we should deduct points off FIG for having some of the wretched things. Because the Brownlow outweighs a GF medal the most decorated are:
1. Adam Goodes
2. Hird
3. Judd (equal on Brownlows and Norms but less GF medals)
4. FIG a fast fading fourth.

Rating a Norm Smith third in the honurs is justified by its sad devaluation in the 2006 fiasco

why don't you add AA to the list, or will that make Goodes look bad??

AA Team
Hird- 95, 96, 00, 01 (captain), 03
Goodes- 03, 06

so seeing as Hird has captained his country I rank him higher on personal awards

1.Hird
2.Goodes
3.Judd
4.FIG