Review Draft Review

[jmac70]

How high?

As high as Joe Cocker.

 

[Quicky]

Personally I would hope we would never waste pick 6 on a specialist permanent half back flanker. Your theory has merit.

It's consistent with the clubs statements on Scharenberg too. But it seems commonly accepted around the forums that Shaz will be a half back flank. I think people need to start getting excited by what he will offer us in the midfield.

 

[popin]

How high?

 

[mike123]

It's consistent with the clubs statements on Scharenberg too. But it seems commonly accepted around the forums that Shaz will be a half back flank. I think people need to start getting excited by what he will offer us in the midfield.

I don't think he'll be just a half back flank, he'll be Jimmy Clement and Nick Maxwell combined...




















That can occasionally pinch hit in the middle

 

[Quicky]

I don't think he'll be just a half back flank, he'll be Jimmy Clement and Nick Maxwell combined...




















That can occasionally pinch hit in the middle

He'd want to be Luke Hodge if he is playing in the backline. Actually if you combined Clement and Maxy that wouldn't be far off.

 

[Gone Critical]

It's consistent with the clubs statements on Scharenberg too. But it seems commonly accepted around the forums that Shaz will be a half back flank. I think people need to start getting excited by what he will offer us in the midfield.

Personally I will just be excited to see Scharenberg get onto the field. Feel a bit like a doomsday prophet here but I think we need to reappraise Scharenberg with a consideration about what his injury history will have done tohis development and potential. He isn't the no 6 draft pick we selected in 2013. He came with an injury history which had already probably pushed him down the draft list a few places and we were the team that took a punt on him. His sesamoiditis didn't respond as we had hoped and required surgery and a delay in his development.

He got back late in the season and by any objective assessment looked well off the pace in the VFL. No surprise there as he had missed a lot of footy. Then an ACL. Give him roughly 12 months to return and he probably gets to make a few appearances in the VFL late 2015. Realistically 2016 becomes his1st real season and it is then we will find out how much the injuries have set him back physically, mentally and developmentally. There is no doubt our gamble seems not to have paid off. Forget what Hine says if we had a chance now to swap Shaz for Aish we would do it in a heartbeat.

I say this to emphasise that we need to rethink the player Shaz may become. The injuries will have an influence on his career. I believe he would not be a top 10 draft pick anymore if you had put him back into the draft this year. Cool your jets and hope Shaz can become a good player in the seasons ahead but we as supporters need to give him time and reduce our expectations of the player he may be.

 

[Ricky90]

I'd hope that all four guys in Scharenberg, Langdon, Maynard and Manteit have what it takes to run through the middle. Very much like Hodge who is good in both positions.

Obviously Scharenberg has the quality, so he's our preferred option when talking full time midfielder, but I see each of the others with qualities to their game that excite me looking at it from a midfielder perspective.

I don't think we specifically draft for a position anymore other than perhaps key forwards and ruckmen, more so look for guys with scope to find a home they can thrive in on the field. A lot of recent draftees show traits that with the right development can have an impact in many positions. And from there it will be about finding the one they're best at primarily and the ones they're capable of secondary.

Smart, in my opinion.

 

[Quicky]

Personally I will just be excited to see Scharenberg get onto the field. Feel a bit like a doomsday prophet here but I think we need to reappraise Scharenberg with a consideration about what his injury history will have done tohis development and potential. He isn't the no 6 draft pick we selected in 2013. He came with an injury history which had already probably pushed him down the draft list a few places and we were the team that took a punt on him. His sesamoiditis didn't respond as we had hoped and required surgery and a delay in his development.

He got back late in the season and by any objective assessment looked well off the pace in the VFL. No surprise there as he had missed a lot of footy. Then an ACL. Give him roughly 12 months to return and he probably gets to make a few appearances in the VFL late 2015. Realistically 2016 becomes his1st real season and it is then we will find out how much the injuries have set him back physically, mentally and developmentally. There is no doubt our gamble seems not to have paid off. Forget what Hine says if we had a chance now to swap Shaz for Aish we would do it in a heartbeat.

I say this to emphasise that we need to rethink the player Shaz may become. The injuries will have an influence on his career. I believe he would not be a top 10 draft pick anymore if you had put him back into the draft this year. Cool your jets and hope Shaz can become a good player in the seasons ahead but we as supporters need to give him time and reduce our expectations of the player he may be.

I think as fans we can focus obsessively on the short term. A football career for a top end player can last 15 years or more. Scharenberg will have lost 1 and a half years. I don't see it as doom and gloom as much as unfortunate. He has had bad luck with his feet but presumably that is fine now. He had an unfortunate collision knee injury. To judge his progress on one rusty VFL performance when he has returned I don't think is fair. To suggest our "gamble" has not "paid off" I think is well to premature to make. I don't expect him to step into midfield immediately but I don't see why becoming a class player in the midfield for us is unrealistic.

 

[Gone Critical]

I think as fans we can focus obsessively on the short term. A football career for a top end player can last 15 years or more. Scharenberg will have lost 1 and a half years. I don't see it as doom and gloom as much as unfortunate. He has had bad luck with his feet but presumably that is fine now. He had an unfortunate collision knee injury. To judge his progress on one rusty VFL performance when he has returned I don't think is fair. To suggest our "gamble" has not "paid off" I think is well to premature to make. I don't expect him to step into midfield immediately but I don't see why becoming a class player in the midfield for us is unrealistic.

I am agreeing with what you say to a point. It's not that I believe Scharenberg can't become a class player but that because of more than anything the mental damage long term injury can do and the loss of the development he has had to endure the chances of that happening have taken a hit. I just see a lot of posting here suggesting he will just walk back into being the gun he was destined to be pre injury . Unfortunately it doesn't work like that. Injury curtails careers but it is impossible to measure to what degree.

The VFL reference was not made to judge him rather to say when he does get back to play again don't be surprised if he doesn't show much in 2015. He will hopefully get a few games in in 2nd half of the season and get his toes wet for 2016. The gamble reference is hypothetical but hypothetically speaking if you could swap Aish and Scharenberg right now which way would you go?

 

[Prestige Presti]

Personally I will just be excited to see Scharenberg get onto the field. Feel a bit like a doomsday prophet here but I think we need to reappraise Scharenberg with a consideration about what his injury history will have done tohis development and potential. He isn't the no 6 draft pick we selected in 2013. He came with an injury history which had already probably pushed him down the draft list a few places and we were the team that took a punt on him. His sesamoiditis didn't respond as we had hoped and required surgery and a delay in his development.

He got back late in the season and by any objective assessment looked well off the pace in the VFL. No surprise there as he had missed a lot of footy. Then an ACL. Give him roughly 12 months to return and he probably gets to make a few appearances in the VFL late 2015. Realistically 2016 becomes his1st real season and it is then we will find out how much the injuries have set him back physically, mentally and developmentally. There is no doubt our gamble seems not to have paid off. Forget what Hine says if we had a chance now to swap Shaz for Aish we would do it in a heartbeat.

I say this to emphasise that we need to rethink the player Shaz may become. The injuries will have an influence on his career. I believe he would not be a top 10 draft pick anymore if you had put him back into the draft this year. Cool your jets and hope Shaz can become a good player in the seasons ahead but we as supporters need to give him time and reduce our expectations of the player he may be.

Can I offer a different perspective?

This is just a theory, but I believe these injuries may potentially be a blessing in disguise long term.
Hine spoke about Langdon and how him missing out being drafted in 2012 made him more mentally resilient and how crucial that is for the modern AFL player, obviously injury and not being drafted are different issues entirely but developing a certain mental resilience out of times of tragedy as a young AFL player could transform Shazza into a different, potentially better player long term, obviously it's a little much to expect him to perform short term, but in his hopefully 10 year+ career he will have more than recovered, there are examples of players having returned from early injury.

Perhaps the ACL will give his foot more time to heal, playing VFL and AFL next year could very well have re-aggravated it? we've seen with Fasolo how a mismanaged foot that isn't given enough time to repair can hinder performance, a tad optimistic but it's possible.

Regardless, i do expect Shazza can still be the better player than Aish and will offer us more down the track then Aish would have (we have many developing mids of his size) so i genuinely believe Hine wouldn't change a thing, we have Langdon and Freeman to fill our needs short term and long term Shazza will develop into a good/great player yet, assessing Aish on one good season is tough, a lot of time and events can change things, he is for example looking pretty homesick at the moment (that's more than likely a Brisbane thing however)

I also fully expect the next few years a few more early picks will develop short/long term injuries from that draft, there's always a few and unfortunately Shazzas has come that little bit earlier than most, perhaps he'll be a better player, perhaps he'll be worse but you are certainly right, he does need time.

 

[mike123]

Can I offer a different perspective?

This is just a theory, but I believe these injuries may potentially be a blessing in disguise long term.
Hine spoke about Langdon and how him missing out being drafted in 2012 made him more mentally resilient and how crucial that is for the modern AFL player, obviously injury and not being drafted are different issues entirely but developing a certain mental resilience out of times of tragedy as a young AFL player could transform Shazza into a different, potentially better player long term, obviously it's a little much to expect him to perform short term, but in his hopefully 10 year+ career he will have more than recovered, there are examples of players having returned from early injury.

Perhaps the ACL will give his foot more time to heal, playing VFL and AFL next year could very well have re-aggravated it? we've seen with Fasolo how a mismanaged foot that isn't given enough time to repair can hinder performance, a tad optimistic but it's possible.

Regardless, i do expect Shazza can still be the better player than Aish and will offer us more down the track then Aish would have (we have many developing mids of his size) so i genuinely believe Hine wouldn't change a thing, we have Langdon and Freeman to fill our needs short term and long term Shazza will develop into a good/great player yet, assessing Aish on one good season is tough, a lot of time and events can change things, he is for example looking pretty homesick at the moment (that's more than likely a Brisbane thing however)

I also fully expect the next few years a few more early picks will develop short/long term injuries from that draft, there's always a few and unfortunately Shazzas has come that little bit earlier than most, perhaps he'll be a better player, perhaps he'll be worse but you are certainly right, he does need time.

Yes but how many developing mids do we have with his speed skill and decision making?

 

[Prestige Presti]

Yes but how many developing mids do we have with his speed skill and decision making?

Good point, after this draft we certainly have a bit more speed and skill to work with which is a plus, but I just believe what Shazza will provide when he eventually gets fit is slightly more vital then what Aish provides, with Broomy, Freeman and Kennedy filling similar roles to that of Aish, despite being inferior players (for now) obviously it's a tad too early to call and is certainly more of a prediction.

 

[Quicky]

I am agreeing with what you say to a point. It's not that I believe Scharenberg can't become a class player but that because of more than anything the mental damage long term injury can do and the loss of the development he has had to endure the chances of that happening have taken a hit. I just see a lot of posting here suggesting he will just walk back into being the gun he was destined to be pre injury . Unfortunately it doesn't work like that. Injury curtails careers but it is impossible to measure to what degree.

The VFL reference was not made to judge him rather to say when he does get back to play again don't be surprised if he doesn't show much in 2015. He will hopefully get a few games in in 2nd half of the season and get his toes wet for 2016. The gamble reference is hypothetical but hypothetically speaking if you could swap Aish and Scharenberg right now which way would you go?

In honesty, I'd take Scharenberg. I think he is more talented. I think he has more scope at AFL level. And I think he fits our list needs better. The injuries are a worry, but I think we pay too much attention to them. You are right that they could take a toll mentally. But I have faith (perhaps misplaced?) that our vetting process will ensure we won't select a shrinking violet at pick 6.

 

[swoop42]

I have a dream.

A dream that this draft is eventually seen as a super draft and much like Geelong of a what a decade or more ago now garner 5 or 6 future premiership stars in the one draft year.

I'm excited by this years crop of tall, versatile, aggressive, unflinching and talented players who mostly possess above average foot skills.

It's certainly a year to nail our selections with those types added to our mix.

 

[loki04]

Personally I will just be excited to see Scharenberg get onto the field. Feel a bit like a doomsday prophet here but I think we need to reappraise Scharenberg with a consideration about what his injury history will have done tohis development and potential. He isn't the no 6 draft pick we selected in 2013. He came with an injury history which had already probably pushed him down the draft list a few places and we were the team that took a punt on him. His sesamoiditis didn't respond as we had hoped and required surgery and a delay in his development.

He got back late in the season and by any objective assessment looked well off the pace in the VFL. No surprise there as he had missed a lot of footy. Then an ACL. Give him roughly 12 months to return and he probably gets to make a few appearances in the VFL late 2015. Realistically 2016 becomes his1st real season and it is then we will find out how much the injuries have set him back physically, mentally and developmentally. There is no doubt our gamble seems not to have paid off. Forget what Hine says if we had a chance now to swap Shaz for Aish we would do it in a heartbeat.

I say this to emphasise that we need to rethink the player Shaz may become. The injuries will have an influence on his career. I believe he would not be a top 10 draft pick anymore if you had put him back into the draft this year. Cool your jets and hope Shaz can become a good player in the seasons ahead but we as supporters need to give him time and reduce our expectations of the player he may be.

One of our scouts on ebw has repeatedly reiterated he would still select Shaz at the same pick even knowing his injurys.

They rate him massively.

 

[Gone Critical]

Can I offer a different perspective?

This is just a theory, but I believe these injuries may potentially be a blessing in disguise long term.
Hine spoke about Langdon and how him missing out being drafted in 2012 made him more mentally resilient and how crucial that is for the modern AFL player, obviously injury and not being drafted are different issues entirely but developing a certain mental resilience out of times of tragedy as a young AFL player could transform Shazza into a different, potentially better player long term, obviously it's a little much to expect him to perform short term, but in his hopefully 10 year+ career he will have more than recovered, there are examples of players having returned from early injury.

Perhaps the ACL will give his foot more time to heal, playing VFL and AFL next year could very well have re-aggravated it? we've seen with Fasolo how a mismanaged foot that isn't given enough time to repair can hinder performance, a tad optimistic but it's possible.

Regardless, i do expect Shazza can still be the better player than Aish and will offer us more down the track then Aish would have (we have many developing mids of his size) so i genuinely believe Hine wouldn't change a thing, we have Langdon and Freeman to fill our needs short term and long term Shazza will develop into a good/great player yet, assessing Aish on one good season is tough, a lot of time and events can change things, he is for example looking pretty homesick at the moment (that's more than likely a Brisbane thing however)

I also fully expect the next few years a few more early picks will develop short/long term injuries from that draft, there's always a few and unfortunately Shazzas has come that little bit earlier than most, perhaps he'll be a better player, perhaps he'll be worse but you are certainly right, he does need time.

It's an interesting theory and one. I have seen put out there frequently in the past. Of course there is no way to prove either your view or mine either way. That's my problem with that theory. It is used to provide hope why a player can overcome set backs and we can always say look at player X they became a really good player after a long term lay off but we will never know if player X may have become player X plus 10% without the injury.

I don't buy the theory myself because it flys in the face of everything else we believe. Young players benefit from the tough first few pre seasons they put into their bodies, footy is a mental game at this level and the other top 10 picks likeAish now have a body of experience and positive thought processes about their game that enhance them. Early seasons are important in a players career to develop their base position and it makes a difference to players careers to land at a club with good development program's like Geel or Hawthorn compared to say Carlton or Melbourne. I can expand this even further.

Allthose ideas to me make much more sense than the idea that long term injury will give players a mental resilience that will make the better in the long term. Any benefits bought from that aspect of their recovery must surely overall be overcomes in almost all cases by the negative effects. I just can't buy the argument that long term injury could somehow be a blessing in a young players career. There is no way in my mind Shaz wouldn't be better off being out there fit and ready to go now.

The other thingI disagree with is the idea that Fasolo was mismanaged from an injury point of view. Truth is neither of us have any idea about his management without access to the actual details of his care and if we had that we would then need the appropriate medical training to be able to interpret it. What Ido know is Fas has had a navicular injury and these do have a significant risk of re injury and chronic problems no matter the care. Faso loss problem is much more likely to be the nature of the injury not the management. Re injury does not equal mismanagement.

 

[Gone Critical]

In honesty, I'd take Scharenberg. I think he is more talented. I think he has more scope at AFL level. And I think he fits our list needs better. The injuries are a worry, but I think we pay too much attention to them. You are right that they could take a toll mentally. But I have faith (perhaps misplaced?) that our vetting process will ensure we won't select a shrinking violet at pick 6.

Understanding that this can only be hypothetical I would go Aish and I believe any objective view of the evidence would lead to that conclusion. Doesn't mean the answer couldn't change down the track or that Shaz can't end up with the better career but at this point the odds favour Aish as having the better career.

They were rated very closely at the time of the draft and since then Aish has franked his credits and appears well on track to be a serious player and one his initial draft ranking suggested he should become. Shaz has had some serious set backs and when he is ready for his 1st proper tilt at an AFL season, 2016 , he will probably need further time to make up for lost ground like most players coming back form ACLs and the like need.

Take away our club bias and I can't see how anyone could not have Aish as now being ahead of Shaz. Injuries damage careers

 

[Gone Critical]

One of our scouts on ebw has repeatedly reiterated he would still select Shaz at the same pick even knowing his injurys.

They rate him massively.

Without wanting to be difficult The Collingwood recruiting team and the club as a whole is the last place you could go to have that question answered objectively. Collingwood can't answer hypotheticals about Shaz because he is a reality at the club. We, the club , have to back him to the hilt and believe in him. Hine et al can't be seen to be anything other than supporting Shaz so any answer they give, for all sorts of bias's, can't be taken as being an objective assessment

 

[Prestige Presti]

It's an interesting theory and one. I have seen put out there frequently in the past. Of course there is no way to prove either your view or mine either way. That's my problem with that theory. It is used to provide hope why a player can overcome set backs and we can always say look at player X they became a really good player after a long term lay off but we will never know if player X may have become player X plus 10% without the injury.

I don't buy the theory myself because it flys in the face of everything else we believe. Young players benefit from the tough first few pre seasons they put into their bodies, footy is a mental game at this level and the other top 10 picks likeAish now have a body of experience and positive thought processes about their game that enhance them. Early seasons are important in a players career to develop their base position and it makes a difference to players careers to land at a club with good development program's like Geel or Hawthorn compared to say Carlton or Melbourne. I can expand this even further.

Allthose ideas to me make much more sense than the idea that long term injury will give players a mental resilience that will make the better in the long term. Any benefits bought from that aspect of their recovery must surely overall be overcomes in almost all cases by the negative effects. I just can't buy the argument that long term injury could somehow be a blessing in a young players career. There is no way in my mind Shaz wouldn't be better off being out there fit and ready to go now.

The other thingI disagree with is the idea that Fasolo was mismanaged from an injury point of view. Truth is neither of us have any idea about his management without access to the actual details of his care and if we had that we would then need the appropriate medical training to be able to interpret it. What Ido know is Fas has had a navicular injury and these do have a significant risk of re injury and chronic problems no matter the care. Faso loss problem is much more likely to be the nature of the injury not the management. Re injury does not equal mismanagement.

Oh don't get me wrong, I use the word 'potentially' very strictly, although in saying that with Shazza i believe it's more likely he'll bounce back and that's more to do with his game style.
When players that are more athletic get injured long term, like Daisy, they lose a bit of speed and flair, Shazzas traits are less athletic and more technical, he'll certainly lose that bit of early fitness development but he won't lose his ability to kick a football and read the play, where as Aish for example is more heavily reliant on his speed and fitness, that's a point of difference that whilst once again is just a theory, I feel will benefit Shazzas athletic profile then those more athletic burst types.
Perhaps 'blessing' is a tad much, but hopefully he's using the time on the sidelines wisely, Nathan Brown for instance is using his time injured to learn to become a better leader, a bloke that's mentoring and rehabilitating alongside Shazz is Macaffer, one of the hardest workers at the club, so i believe and hope that on top of mental resilience, Shazza is further developing himself and learning off the best workers and leaders at the club, he certainly has leadership qualities, perhaps being injured will fast track those?
So yes i think to an extent you are right, whilst he's missing development as a player, as a professional athlete and potential club leader he could be learning things, traits, and habits that are almost an alternative means of development.

I guess it matters when he comes back, and that's quite important, he did get some good development time in before getting injured, so he has a blueprint, his injury was on the lower end of ACL injuries apparently and could be back in May, he starts full contact training after Christmas?
If that's true i believe he can get a fair bit of developing in this year.

In regards to the Fasman, mismanaged was the wrong word, i'm not sure after which game Bucks said this, it might have been the Melbourne game, but he said something along the lines of 'Fas has a lot of potential and perhaps we are guilty of rushing him back in because of that' or something similar, i would say they were more caution-less but you can't blame him, you just don't know with those foot injuries, the point i was trying to make was he has time to get his feet right, it's debatable whether this time off will actually benefit it but surely it can't be a bad thing to give it some rest, once again, got no idea how those injuries work and i'll take your word for it.

 

[Buckley is my hero]

Recruitment decisions last year are done and dusted and we move onto this year. Reality is that Aish has a two year start over over Shazza. That's two years that Shazza's never going to get back. After that who knows. Most players suffer setbacks at some stage in their careers. James Hird lost almost two years in the middle section of his career with foot issues. Let's hope all of Shazza's setbacks occurred at the start of his career.

 

[Gone Critical]

Oh don't get me wrong, I use the word 'potentially' very strictly, although in saying that with Shazza i believe it's more likely he'll bounce back and that's more to do with his game style.
When players that are more athletic get injured long term, like Daisy, they lose a bit of speed and flair, Shazzas traits are less athletic and more technical, he'll certainly lose that bit of early fitness development but he won't lose his ability to kick a football and read the play, where as Aish for example is more heavily reliant on his speed and fitness, that's a point of difference that whilst once again is just a theory, I feel will benefit Shazzas athletic profile then those more athletic burst types.
Perhaps 'blessing' is a tad much, but hopefully he's using the time on the sidelines wisely, Nathan Brown for instance is using his time injured to learn to become a better leader, a bloke that's mentoring and rehabilitating alongside Shazz is Macaffer, one of the hardest workers at the club, so i believe and hope that on top of mental resilience, Shazza is further developing himself and learning off the best workers and leaders at the club, he certainly has leadership qualities, perhaps being injured will fast track those?
So yes i think to an extent you are right, whilst he's missing development as a player, as a professional athlete and potential club leader he could be learning things, traits, and habits that are almost an alternative means of development.

I guess it matters when he comes back, and that's quite important, he did get some good development time in before getting injured, so he has a blueprint, his injury was on the lower end of ACL injuries apparently and could be back in May, he starts full contact training after Christmas?
If that's true i believe he can get a fair bit of developing in this year.

In regards to the Fasman, mismanaged was the wrong word, i'm not sure after which game Bucks said this, it might have been the Melbourne game, but he said something along the lines of 'Fas has a lot of potential and perhaps we are guilty of rushing him back in because of that' or something similar, i would say they were more caution-less but you can't blame him, you just don't know with those foot injuries, the point i was trying to make was he has time to get his feet right, it's debatable whether this time off will actually benefit it but surely it can't be a bad thing to give it some rest, once again, got no idea how those injuries work and i'll take your word for it.

No worries and I am not trying to be a doomsday prophet re Shaz. Their is still plenty of chance for him to become a topline AFL player. Sometimes I just think we need to temper our enthusiasm re some of our players who have yet to debut.

I see our flag players that many posters have almost written off as still having a vital role in our rise back up. Specifically I refer to the Blairs, Sacks, Tooveys and Caffs. We need our top 10 choices to really kick on but the rest of the picks have a speculative element to them. Maynard is a good case in point where I see some posters almost having him as a likely best 22 player in 2015. Saw a really good post from Knightmare the other day re Maynard saying a realistic expectation for Maynard would for his to reach a level of say a Macaffer in a few seasons. Of course we would all hope he could be even better. My point is not to overburden the likes of Shaz with unrealistic expectation and see what our steady experienced palyers still have to offer.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

No worries and I am not trying to be a doomsday prophet re Shaz. Their is still plenty of chance for him to become a topline AFL player. Sometimes I just think we need to temper our enthusiasm re some of our players who have yet to debut.

I see our flag players that many posters have almost written off as still having a vital role in our rise back up. Specifically I refer to the Blairs, Sacks, Tooveys and Caffs. We need our top 10 choices to really kick on but the rest of the picks have a speculative element to them. Maynard is a good case in point where I see some posters almost having him as a likely best 22 player in 2015. Saw a really good post from Knightmare the other day re Maynard saying a realistic expectation for Maynard would for his to reach a level of say a Macaffer in a few seasons. Of course we would all hope he could be even better. My point is not to overburden the likes of Shaz with unrealistic expectation and see what our steady experienced palyers still have to offer.

Interesting you talk up Caff despite two knees in his career so far but arent prepared to back Shaz. I suspect youre just trying to be circumspect, just keeping a lid on it. Which is understandable. But the bottom line is that our future depends on the progress of the next generation and teh likes of top 20 picks Grundy Broomnhead Kennedy Scharenburg Freeman and now De Goey are vital elements in that, just as Reid Brown Beams Sidebottom Thomas and Pendlebury were. Its just how it works. You cant expect anything special out of the four you named, they have reached their plateau.

 

[Laurie Holden]

I think as fans we can focus obsessively on the short term. A football career for a top end player can last 15 years or more. Scharenberg will have lost 1 and a half years. I don't see it as doom and gloom as much as unfortunate. He has had bad luck with his feet but presumably that is fine now. He had an unfortunate collision knee injury. To judge his progress on one rusty VFL performance when he has returned I don't think is fair. To suggest our "gamble" has not "paid off" I think is well to premature to make. I don't expect him to step into midfield immediately but I don't see why becoming a class player in the midfield for us is unrealistic.

Exactly right! and who is to say if we'd picked Aish that he wouldn't have done a knee? If he had then 2015 would be a development year for him too. These things can't be helped in footy. Advantage we do have with him is he will be mentally stronger and will spend a lot of time on strategies and understanding our game plan. All things that will improve his game when he gets back. Don't rush him back and lets get him going for 2016 with the aim of playing 200-250 games.

 

[jmac70]

This page has too many words.

 

[ace andy]

Langdon is actually earmarked for an eventual move to the midfield too.

Imagine Pendles, Shazza and Langdon all running through the midfield. Nobody will be complaining about how small our mids are anymore, that's for sure!

Why does everyone have to move to the midfield to be a great player. Corey Enright is a fantastic footballer who spent his career on the back flank. I would rather a 10/10 half back then a 8/10 midfielder. Not everyone who is good in defence will be as good in the midfield. If they will be better players in the midfield then defence then fine but I don't get the obsession with moving to the midfield.