For the older brigade

[Fred]

Does anyone else remember being at the Junction Oval in, I think 1961, when Richmond failed to kick a goal against the Saints. It's the only time I can remember when the saints were on the right end of an unusual event or record.
Mind you, the grounds were mostly a sea of mud in those days. Any players that complain about Colonial should have a look at some old films of games in the depths of winter.

 

[Fred]

Very disappointing that the first question I put up attracted no replies.
Even some abuse from Stengas, g4e etc. about old farts would have been acceptable.
I'm now going to slink away and enrol in a creative writing course.
It's possible, of course, that I'm the only one left alive who was at that game.

 

[Mr Ripper]

Never mind Fred. That's the kind of topic that lights my eyes up...bit before my time, that's all.

 

[Grendel]

Sorry Fred but im like Mr.Ripper. Anything sort of pre 75/6 and its before my time.

 

[Mags]

Same Here
Pre 85 though is my time!

 

[sandie]

Fred
Yeah I am sorry too mate, I was born in 61, so it must have been a great year. Heh Heh.
Cheers

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mantis

 

[Fred]

Bluey
Could you please start a geriatric site for us older codgers, so we can swap wonky knee stories etc.

 

[Grendel]

Hey Fred, i might not be geriatric, but i can swap wonky knee storys with you! My right knee is stuffed from cricket!

Whats wrong with yours??

 

[Heartbroken Richmondite]

Well Fred, you found one. I was at that game and as a Richmond fan it was the worst day of my life. The score was 12.19.91 to 0.8.8. The ground was not particularly muddy and it was not windy, quite okay for football. I do not remember any of the names of the StKIlda players but some of the Richmond players included NevilleCrowe, PaddyGuinane, BillyBarrot, KevinBartlett, TonyJewell and JohnNorthey, most of whom went on to play in the 1967 premiership. Richmond were the last team not to score a goal in a game, although it has happened 27 times in VFL history. But StKilda certainly hold a lot of poor records including lowest scores, most wooden spoons, the Hawthorn comeback debacle the year before last, and when FredFanning kicked 18 goals in a game, it was against StKilda. And just a little bit of trivia on that one - the StKilda full back that day was a bloke called Stretton, who became the General Stretton who officiated at the Darwin Cyclone Tracey clean-up.

Heartbroken Richmondite

 

[Mr Ripper]

Heartbroken Richmondite recalled:
I do not remember any of the names of the StKIlda players but some of the Richmond players included NevilleCrowe, PaddyGuinane, BillyBarrot, KevinBartlett, TonyJewell and JohnNorthey, most of whom went on to play in the 1967 premiership.

Hmmmm. Swooper debuted in 1963, TJ in '64 and Hungry in 1965. Maybe you watched them playing in the thirds on that fateful 1961 afternoon.

 

[Heartbroken Richmondite]

As an after thought Fred I thought I would send in this one also. It is not football-related but for some younger contributors to this website it may open their eyes a bit.

I have just turned 60 and I am absolutely staggered at what the younger generation do not know. While having lunch recently with a group of about ten 18-30-year-olds they started taking the mickey out of me and began testing my general knowledge. One bloke disputed my story that Pearl Harbor started the war with Japan, he claimed most offensively that Hiroshima was the start of it all and that Pearl finished it. I had to take a history book to work next day to show him and prove to him that he is a complete arseh*le. He never knew that Japan bombed Darwin, Broome and Townsville. They never knew that Germany even started World War 2, they thought it had simply been going since the Depression started. They had never heard of Cazaly, Harry Hopman, Opperman the cyclist, nor Harold Larwood and Bodyline. And as for early history they all knew f-all about the Greeks, Romans or Egyptians. But they all know how to play computer games, drive their fast cars stupidly (almost all of them have either been booked, lost licences or now paying huge insurance bills for being so arrogant). Today's youth, Fred, has a massive lot to learn. Unfortunately it may be too late for many of them who are so over-confident as to be obnoxious and so secure in the knowledge that any time they get into trouble, Mummy and Daddy will simply write out the cheque to cover the problem. Fred, I know which era I preferred to live in.

Heartbroken Richmondite

 

[mud n blood]

Must have been the drugs their parents were taking, that affected their common sense and general knowledge abilities .....

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Anyway, that's what I reckon ........

mud n blood

 

[Bernie]

You're old when you take your kids to the Museum and you can remember everything in the exhibition on Melbourne in the 50's. At least I didn't see Phar Lap run.
On the topic '.. they don't seem to know their history ..', I really like the Stev Waugh approach to cricket , where he gets team members to prepare talks on cricket history topics, so that they really get to appreciate their achievements.

 

[sainter]

Fred,

I'm not really from the older brigade but for some reason I loved that statistic.

Any other statistics that does not involve wooden spoons, lowest scores and greatest winning (losing) margins are most welcome.

And well said mud and blood!



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Fortius Quo Fidelius

 

[Heartbroken Richmondite]

To Mr Ripper

Your reply to my first letter came surprisingy fast, only 23 minutes after I sent mine. You must be either a fellow Richmond supporter who was there that terrible day or you must be a computer with very quick access to those stats. Yes, I was wrong and those three you mentioned may have been in the thirds but I think that was most unlikely. But several other names came to mind the more I thought about it and those players were MikePatterson, DickGrimmond, FredSwift and RogerDean. It would be interesting if the club had the team list of those who played that day but if they did I am sure they would not willingly release it for trivia purposes.

I also seem to remember a game between Footscray and Carlton in the late 1980s when Carlton kicked their only goal during the final two minutes of play. Although Richmond's no-goal tally happened almost 40 years ago, I am not a great believer that any particular record can never be broken. At some time in the future we may see a very weak team play an extremely strong team and go goal-less on the day. We have seen some very low scores in the last 10 years or so and there is every chance that one day the impossible could happen - no score at all.

I congratulate you on your quick response but I can swear on the Bible that I was there on that day in 1961. If I lie, may God strike me dead at this very moment . . . aaaaaagh.

 

[Fred]

Thanks all. Some good reading there.
Heartbroken Rich. - Agree with you about "youngsters" and general knowledge. Aust history should be compulsory in schools.
Sainter - Guess we can look forward to the day when the AFL really turn everything on its head. We'll hold every good record then.

 

[Bloodstained Angel]

Good thoughts there Fred

I think the teaching of history should be compulsory in all Schools, I have heard alot of that gross-ignorance before. I work for a firm of solicitors here in Sydney and you wouldn't beleive the rubbish some of the younger lawyers come oyt with these days.

One guy rang me up last week and wanted to know what the capital of Russia was (WTFk?)

Another wanted to know how long the Six Day War lasted and 'did Japan win' ?

I mean seriously people these are laywers with very expensive degrees and on big salaries and they don't know jack-shit

What do these people get taught these days ? - It makes you wonder.

cheers

 

[dave_4813]

Dug this up from a while ago...A good read.

 

[dogsbody]

To Mr Ripper

I also seem to remember a game between Footscray and Carlton in the late 1980s when Carlton kicked their only goal during the final two minutes of play. Although Richmond's no-goal tally happened almost 40 years ago, I am not a great believer that any particular record can never be broken. At some time in the future we may see a very weak team play an extremely strong team and go goal-less on the day. We have seen some very low scores in the last 10 years or so and there is every chance that one day the impossible could happen - no score at all.

That game I do remember, Richmondite. It was a traditional mid winter game at the Western Oval, cold, windy and wet. Carlton’s goal came off a doubtful (in my eyes anyway) free kick for holding by Stephen McPherson on Mark Arceri near the end of the last quarter. You could hear the sighs of disappointment around the ground. It was the same season or perhaps one soon after that West Coast were goal less until time on in the last quarter. Having broken the ice, they slotted through 2 more to give their score respectability. Two almosts I’ve seen.

Don’t be too hard on your younger work mates. I can recall friends of my parents snorting at my ignorance of WW1, Spanish Civil War, Depression, between the wars social movements and hagiography. In time, your young collegues will complain about their youngsters lack of knowledge of the Gulf Wars, Terrorism, Bali, Timor etc. There’s a famous quote about irresponsible youth by Aristotle. Yep, the young are ignorent and arrogant. Thus it has always been, thus it is and thus it always will be.

 

[mianfei]

That game I do remember, Richmondite. It was a traditional mid winter game at the Western Oval, cold, windy and wet. Carlton’s goal came off a doubtful (in my eyes anyway) free kick for holding by Stephen McPherson on Mark Arceri near the end of the last quarter. You could hear the sighs of disappointment around the ground. It was the same season or perhaps one soon after that West Coast were goal less until time on in the last quarter. Having broken the ice, they slotted through 2 more to give their score respectability. Two almosts I’ve seen.

Don’t be too hard on your younger work mates. I can recall friends of my parents snorting at my ignorance of WW1, Spanish Civil War, Depression, between the wars social movements and hagiography. In time, your young collegues will complain about their youngsters lack of knowledge of the Gulf Wars, Terrorism, Bali, Timor etc. There’s a famous quote about irresponsible youth by Aristotle. Yep, the young are ignorent and arrogant. Thus it has always been, thus it is and thus it always will be.

You are so right about how annoying most people’s poor knowledge of sporting history is. Whenever I try to discuss it I am ignored and I have no liking for it at all. I assume - perhaps with arrogance I confess - that if people had the knowledge of sporting history I have people who follow sport would question modern trends.

I bought the West Coast game on Name A Game and it really does show how the solid man-on-man game and speedy running of West Coast failed completely when exposed to a really muddy ground. They were attacking for most of the last quarter with the wind but could not goal; Footscray went forward three times for the quarter, goaled once and should have goaled on the other two occasions but for a bad kick by Simon Atkins and a very good attempted smother by Waterman (on Steve MacPherson). If Footscray had goaled in the first case it is easy to imagine that they would have had the confidence to keep the Eagles on 0.4 (4), which would have been:

1. the lowest score in the V/AFL since 1899
2. the first (and almost certainly only for all time) score of 0 goals by an eventual premier side
   • though it is entirely possible that failing to score a goal would have disheartened the Eagles enough to affect their form in the critical macth with Carlton (ironic?) the following week and the rematch that would have resulted at Waverley had they lost in the last round

Carlton were similar - if anything even worse. If you look at the following week’s game against Sydney one sees so clearly how much those two games reflect serious weaknesses in Carlton and West Coast, who would have formed an AFL diarchy if roofed stadiums had been invented by 1990. As I see it, a team that fails in the worst conditions cannot be considered a “great” team at all no matter how good it looks in the dry. (In cricket, I apply the same logic to the supposedly great West Indian teams of the 1980s, who would have been very ordinary if the standard of spin bowling had been what it was thirty years beforehand).