Fremantle's list is over rated

[jarman]

Everyone starts off the season with zero premiership points.

CC has got us two bonafide wins over top 4 sides on their own dungheap for the first time in our history. Is that doing nothing?

Are Geelong and Melbourne two bonafide top 4 sides. In my view - no. They are good, average sides at the moment. If they were good bonafide sides, Freo would have not beaten them at home.

And Freo is definetly not a bonafide top 4 side.

 

[Dark Destiny]

Re: Sumich will replace CC if he fails

Actually I see that as the most critical reason why Worsfold defecates from a great height on Connolly.

I can name half a dozen players who were with us and were average or downright appalling or during the Judge era, who have improved dramatically since Worsfold took over.

The only players I can think of who were good both pre and post Worsfold are Matera, Kerr, Wirrpunda and Cousins, and the latter two have unquestionably taken huge steps since Woosh took over.

Contrast that with Freo, and I can name plenty of guys who started well either at Freo or other clubs but have gone backwards dramatically after even relatively short periods under Connolly. Headland? Polak? Medhurst? It took about 3 weeks for Josh Carr to turn into a shrinking violet.

Connolly has, is and will continue to ******** away an astonishing amount of talent due to his complete and utter inadequacy as a coach. He's smart, he'd make a great assistant but he's just far to weak an individual for the top job.

Mead raised a point about Connolly in his last post that I'd like to extend on. I think Connolly is a top bloke and is what every club needs...but as I have said in a previous post, he is currently on a tightrope. If he gets Fremantle into the eight, he has the opportunity to redeem the teams efforts in late 2004. If he fails to achieve this though, he will be gone.

Unfortunately the news for West Coast fans will get worse here because your beloved full forward of the decade in Peter Sumich will be a primary candidate in becoming CC's replacement. He will lead the Dockers to greater success.

Let's face it, Woosha's doing too good a job at WCE to lose his spot and Suma has aspirations to be a coach...he wouldn't get recognition in any other part of Australia, but if CC gets the boot, BOOM! Suma will be coming home to Fremantle where it all began....

I can already see the WCE fans branding him as a traitor but the truth is both clubs would have two fantastic players from the WCE who were South Fremantle products coaching both WA teams. It wouldn't get any more competitive in WA than that! I think both the Eagles and the Bulldogs should feel a great sense of satisfaction should this occur.

 

[Ripper]

Actually I see that as the most critical reason why Worsfold defecates from a great height on Connolly.

I can name half a dozen players who were with us and were average or downright appalling or during the Judge era, who have improved dramatically since Worsfold took over.

Hunter- timid, utterly lost youngster -> Tough, incredibly hard at it, 10 mark a game CHB.

Fletcher- Extremely inconsistent, shoddy skilled midfielder -> Perpetual motion, sublimely skilled totally consistent elite midfielder

Embley- A footballing joke. Unfit, no skills, no discipline -> Tough, committed, ultra fit and dedicated player, wears a vice-captains hat now.

Cox - Raw, unfit beanpole -> Top 2 ruckman in the competition. Extremely fit and tough (a trend emerges?)

Glass - Lost, mediocre defender in McIntosh's shadow -> The backbone of our defence.

..and the list goes on for pretty much as long as I want it go on for. The only players I can think of who were good both pre and post Worsfold are Matera, Kerr, Wirrpunda and Cousins, and the latter two have unquestionably taken huge steps since Woosh took over.

Contrast that with Freo, and I can name plenty of guys who started well either at Freo or other clubs but have gone backwards dramatically after even relatively short periods under Connolly. Headland? Polak? Medhurst? It took about 3 weeks for Josh Carr to turn into a shrinking violet.

The quality of a list is always a function of a coaches ability to motivate and maintain discipline- if he's doing his job and people are in good form and working hard to develop, naturally the list looks better in time- if he's not, player fail to live up to their potential.

Connolly has, is and will continue to ******** away an astonishing amount of talent due to his complete and utter inadequacy as a coach. He's smart, he'd make a great assistant but he's just far to weak an individual for the top job.

Thank you mead you have backed up my point , ALL of the Eagles players you mentioned were there when Woosha took over and are now coming good with age and experience, juat like the Brisbane team had years together before they matured into the outfit they were with plenty of ups & downs along the way just like we are now. They still managerd to have a huge downer in the final against Sydney however.

I didn't see a "win at all costs attitude" displayed in their most important game of their season.

It is also no co-incidence that our most consistant players players are the Pav's , Haselbys , Longmuirs , Bells, etc. that are a lot older age & experienced wise than the rest.

 

[Ripper]

Are Geelong and Melbourne two bonafide top 4 sides. In my view - no. They are good, average sides at the moment. If they were good bonafide sides, Freo would have not beaten them at home.

And Freo is definetly not a bonafide top 4 side.

That is your view, the punters obviously thought different.

Check the Ladder.

I hear a lot of "I have a feeling" and "He is no good" type things but I have yet to hear anything concrete that convinces me that I am wildly wrong.

You blokes would sack Micheal Schumacher half way through a GP if he was in the middle of the pack.

 

[YAKUZA]

Re: Sumich will replace CC if he fails

Mead raised a point about Connolly in his last post that I'd like to extend on. I think Connolly is a top bloke and is what every club needs...but as I have said in a previous post, he is currently on a tightrope. If he gets Fremantle into the eight, he has the opportunity to redeem the teams efforts in late 2004. If he fails to achieve this though, he will be gone.

Unfortunately the news for West Coast fans will get worse here because your beloved full forward of the decade in Peter Sumich will be a primary candidate in becoming CC's replacement. He will lead the Dockers to greater success.

Let's face it, Woosha's doing too good a job at WCE to lose his spot and Suma has aspirations to be a coach...he wouldn't get recognition in any other part of Australia, but if CC gets the boot, BOOM! Suma will be coming home to Fremantle where it all began....

I can already see the WCE fans branding him as a traitor but the truth is both clubs would have two fantastic players from the WCE who were South Fremantle products coaching both WA teams. It wouldn't get any more competitive in WA than that! I think both the Eagles and the Bulldogs should feel a great sense of satisfaction should this occur.

Agreed Connolly is probably a good bloke and that is the main reason that he is not a good Coach. He seems to me to be unable to exercise the basic fundamental of management, respect for his position eg., I am the boss and you the player are the employee. There must always be this invisible line between the two and Worsfold and other good coaches like Pagan, Sheedy,Malthouse etc., leave their players in no doubt that they are in charge and what they will and wont tolerate. Chris seems to think that by being their friend he will get the best out of them, unfortunately there will always be players who will take advantage of that situation and Freo have several players in that mould Headland, Medhurst, Polak, Woods to mention a few.
Re Sumich, your theory may well be right but I'm not 100% convinced and I don't see any evidence to convince me that he would be as good as or better than Broadbridge.

 

[BB gun]

Actually I see that as the most critical reason why Worsfold defecates from a great height on Connolly.

I can name half a dozen players who were with us and were average or downright appalling or during the Judge era, who have improved dramatically since Worsfold took over.

Hunter- timid, utterly lost youngster -> Tough, incredibly hard at it, 10 mark a game CHB.

Fletcher- Extremely inconsistent, shoddy skilled midfielder -> Perpetual motion, sublimely skilled totally consistent elite midfielder

Embley- A footballing joke. Unfit, no skills, no discipline -> Tough, committed, ultra fit and dedicated player, wears a vice-captains hat now.

Cox - Raw, unfit beanpole -> Top 2 ruckman in the competition. Extremely fit and tough (a trend emerges?)

Glass - Lost, mediocre defender in McIntosh's shadow -> The backbone of our defence.

Glass picked up in same draft as pavand haselby. When the eagles midfield isn't domininating games he struggles. Hadrill started at freo roughly the same time with less talent.
Cox- isn't tough. Sandi is just as tough, he came to freo rawer than cox.
Embley-not any tough than any freo player.did take his football to a new level, kinda like when Mcpharlin came to freo.
Flecture- this guy did step up for you.
Hunter is crap- has alway been hard at it sort, now is bigger and more mature, get you had off it.

J walker - stepped up improved player under CC
Hadrill - see above.
Jlo- stepped up improved.
the list goes on
CC is a good coach. From what i have heard worsford is a lot softer than judge.

 

[masai]

Re: Sumich will replace CC if he fails

Re Sumich, your theory may well be right but I'm not 100% convinced and I don't see any evidence to convince me that he would be as good as or better than Broadbridge.

Suma will need to get out and travel around to other clubs to see how the other side does things. He has really only seen how Freo, Souths and the Eagles do things, maybe a stint with Carlton or Hawthorn for example will give him more of lifes experiences.

Broadbridge has had a varied coaching career at under 18 level, Collingwood and Freo. Still worried that he might be a "nice" guy, can he be ruthless with "pretty boys"?. Does he make hard decisions?.

 

[Ripper]

Re: Sumich will replace CC if he fails

Unfortunately the news for West Coast fans will get worse here because your beloved full forward of the decade in Peter Sumich will be a primary candidate in becoming CC's replacement. He will lead the Dockers to greater success.

Unfortunately, reading between the lines I actually think that this is where the white anting started and lets remember it started last year when we were well entrenched in the top 6.

Do we have a MOB/Souths push to shoehorn Sumich into the top job at Freo?

The MOB president yelling abuse at the President and CEO at Half time is certainly a distraction that the team does not need to keep their minds on the Job.

What exactly has Suma achieved so far? CC was assitant at the Hawks and was credited with the tactics that got them within a kick of the 2001 Grand Final.

I am still waiting for a reason that the board was wrong to Re-sign the incumbant coach who had led the team form the worst spoon in recent history to winning more games than they lost.

 

[TheReason]

Re: Sumich will replace CC if he fails

Unfortunately the news for West Coast fans will get worse here because your beloved full forward of the decade in Peter Sumich will be a primary candidate in becoming CC's replacement. He will lead the Dockers to greater success.

You guys have still not learned have you?

You're now going to make your 4th coaching mistake? Get an experienced coach and make the offer so good, that he can't refuse.


Ripper_46 where do I start?

Are you sure you are not related to CC, a distant cousin perhaps, are you sure you don't owe him a favour? Are you in any way, shape or form, on the FFC board, a re you a trainer at the club, are you assistant coach, are you a relative of anyone at the club? Mate, you would the only person that steadfastly supports him to the hilt, no questions asked? Are you saying CC can't do no wrong, are you saying that CC should be coach of the decade?

It is also no co-incidence that our most consistant players players are the Pav's , Haselbys , Longmuirs , Bells, etc. that are a lot older age & experienced wise than the rest.

Bell - age is catching up and he's on the down-hill slide
Longmuir - Has still not lived up to expectations
Haselby - Well lets play the guy while he's injured hey? That'll destroy his confidence. CC you F******

The fact of the matter is Ripper_46:

3 years ago, Freo had the better list, no question about it. Yes WCE had some champion players, but overall a very average list.

CC coaching of the youngsters is non-existant. He has still not realised that to develop youngsters, you need to leave them on for the entirety of a game, to teach them how to play, regardless of whether they are getting beaten.

The fact that CC doesn't look to the long term with his youngsters is symptomatic of him being scared for his job. Is that the coach you want at your club?

Polak - I have said it many times before. He is a shadow of the player he was in his debut year. Who's fault is that? The irony is that CC might trade him at years end, and I hope to God its WCE that grab him, cause he, like many other Freo players, will become a Top Line, Champion player at CHB given proper instructions / nurturing etc.. And then in 35 years time Freo fans will be crowing on about how "we let him go".

Ripper_46, I fully expect you to come back and spin-doctor some carp about CC is a Top Bloke, the best coach, Freo are going good... etc...

How about surprising me and actually admitting if something is wrong at the club. Wake up and smell the coffee.

 

[Kapow!!!]

Right, just to clarify my statement on the first page, I should get a sig saying WARNING: Do not listen to this post if it's after a Freo loss...especially to Brisbane at Subi.

This is what I said the following day in the Do my eyes deceive me thread:

My insanity from last night has subsided by my anger hasn't by any means. Last night, amidst my "insanity" I posted "Freo are dead to me", a claim which, even though I was in no fit state to be posting (admittedly) is nearly smack on. As supporters we have sat through the worst, some good times followed by another lot of bad times...which is followed by another 6 months of bad times. I thought we'd turned a corner against Geelong but to come out and play like they did last night shows that we can't go anywhere with Connolly in charge.

Admittedly the players are those that played like cr*p but it's the coaches fault for their mindset. For not being tougher, stricter on the players thus they think they can get away with anything. Connolly has to go. The wins against Melbourne and Geelong have shown how good we can play if we have a good mindset, the losses to Hawthorn and Brisbane at home have shown though that we can't continue with good form.

My faith in the players dangles by a thread, my faith and patience with Connolly and the coaching staff has gone out the window. We aren't going to make finals or go anywhere with CC in charge and if Schwab doesn't do something about it soon, then he has to go aswell because we can't have a club based around mates.

I'm not gonna give in on Freo but by god I'm am absolutely LIVID at them at the moment

And I'm still livid. The way they played Saturday night was absolutely woeful. I don't know what I'm more sick of: Chris Connolly or people defending Chris Connolly. He needs to go and there's nothing more to it. He's inconsistent and he's unreliable as a coach. I don't think we'll see another finals series under him.

I'm not going to be able to see the game against the swans on Sunday as I'll be playing footy at the same time but there has never in my life been a time in which I'm glad I won't be able to see Freo play as much as this week. If the Swans are even somewhat in form they'll beat us by 5+ goals in ugly style of play.

For Saturday night the Umpires and our injuries are no excuse. Brisbane weren't playing their best side but Matthews said they were and we fell for it. There is no excuse for Saturday night, no force running against us, we just played like $#!^.

I think only 2 players could hold their heads up after that game: Cook and Murphy. Cook battled hard all game and really gave it his all, HE wanted it. Murphy kicked 3 goals and started to look like coming around and being a decent Full Forward, HE gave it his all.

Connolly needs to go and if he doesn't go then Schwab needs to go. End of story!

 

[masai]

Connolly needs to go and if he doesn't go then Schwab needs to go. End of story!

Fair enough, who do you have in mind?.

Broadbridge?.

Any "experienced" coaches available?.

What is the alternative?.

 

[Ripper]

Re: Sumich will replace CC if he fails

Are you sure you are not related to CC, a distant cousin perhaps, are you sure you don't owe him a favour? Are you in any way, shape or form, on the FFC board, a re you a trainer at the club, are you assistant coach, are you a relative of anyone at the club? Mate, you would the only person that steadfastly supports him to the hilt, no questions asked? Are you saying CC can't do no wrong, are you saying that CC should be coach of the decade?

None of the above and of course CC has and will continue to make mistakes.

Show me someone who has not made a mistake and I will show you someone who has not made a decision.

3 years ago, Freo had the better list, no question about it. Yes WCE had some champion players, but overall a very average list.

Rubbish, There are only 16 players left from the team that CC took over.
Of those
Thornton (0 games) Pick 66
Seigert (0 games) Rookie listed
Hayden (0 games) Rookie listed
Haines (0 games) Rookie listed
Woods (8 Games ) Pick 61
Haddrill (8 games) Promoted Rookie
Grover (17 games ) Promoted Rookie
Real high draft pick talent there
Cook
Macca
Parker
M Carr

Good players but not superstars
Walker
Justin Longmuir

Very good players

Bell
Pavlich
Haselby

The Cream.

Lets have look who is still there for WCE


Lynch (0 games) Rookie listed
Macdougal (0 games) Pick 5 2000
Humm (4 games) Pick 36 2000
Hunter (10 games) Pick 29 1999
Gaspar (7 games) Pick 14 1999
Green (12 games) Promoted Rookie 2000
Cox (17 games) Promoted Rookie 2000
Kerr (19 games) Pick 18 2000
Glass (26 games) pick 11 1999
Embley (37 games) Pick 57 1998
Fletcher (38 games) Promoted Rookie 1998
Wooden (56 games)
Wirrapunda (65 Games)
Braun (72 Games)
Gardiner (77 Games)
Matera (97 games)
Cousins (122 Games)
Banfield (171 Games)

Want to think again about that stupid statement?

CC coaching of the youngsters is non-existant. He has still not realised that to develop youngsters, you need to leave them on for the entirety of a game, to teach them how to play, regardless of whether they are getting beaten.

Medhurst
Hayden
Haddrill
Dodd
Webster
Schammer
Sandilands
To name a few. That argument doesn't hold water either. You are jus regurgitating urban myths.

The fact that CC doesn't look to the long term with his youngsters is symptomatic of him being scared for his job. Is that the coach you want at your club?

2003 draft squashs that argument, Dunn, Murphy, Mundy, Campbell , Peake & Johnson were a huge investment in youth when short term it would have been better to keep Koops & Croad.

Polak - I have said it many times before. He is a shadow of the player he was in his debut year. Who's fault is that? The irony is that CC might trade him at years end, and I hope to God its WCE that grab him, cause he, like many other Freo players, will become a Top Line, Champion player at CHB given proper instructions / nurturing etc.. And then in 35 years time Freo fans will be crowing on about how "we let him go".

Until last year you would have thought that Hunter & Glass were duds as well despite them having an extra 2 seasons on young Polly. Polly hasn't been a dud but he has a long
way to go yet.

Looking at all of the above it has bought home to me that CC has actually overachieved and Woosh has under achieved with what they inherited.

 

[CursoryMercenary]

Yeah that Eagles list is special, pity about the Docker one.

 

[Ripper]

Yeah that Eagles list is special, pity about the Docker one.

Yep, After looking at that you would wonder how the hell it could possibly be

Worfold 4 Connolly 3 head to head.

 

[Kapow!!!]

Fair enough, who do you have in mind?.

Broadbridge?.

Any "experienced" coaches available?.

What is the alternative?.

I know Malcom Blight doesn't want to coach but if we could get him that's the sort of coach we need.

Broadbridge realistically could only be the caretaker coach if CC was to be taken out Mid-season but I don't think that will happen.

Really if CC is to go it will be at the end of the season in which more potential coaches will be known. One thing is for sure as I said CC must go, he's not taking us anywhere.

Wild guess if we're going to go down the same path as we have in the past and select untried coaches who probably won't take us anywhere Roger Merret...even if he doesn't take us anywhere he'll toughen some of the softer players up

So with any luck Blight if not we may have to use Broadbridge.

 

[Streaker]

Eade would have been a good fit for the Dockers.

 

[TheReason]

Re: Sumich will replace CC if he fails

None of the above and of course CC has and will continue to make mistakes.

Show me someone who has not made a mistake and I will show you someone who has not made a decision..

You don't get it? You are still defending CC by making rhetorical questions.

Rubbish, There are only 16 players left from the team that CC took over.
Of those
Thornton (0 games) Pick 66
Seigert (0 games) Rookie listed
Hayden (0 games) Rookie listed
Haines (0 games) Rookie listed
Woods (8 Games ) Pick 61
Haddrill (8 games) Promoted Rookie
Grover (17 games ) Promoted Rookie
Real high draft pick talent there
Cook
Macca
Parker
M Carr

Good players but not superstars
Walker
Justin Longmuir

Very good players

Bell
Pavlich
Haselby

The Cream...

Well that's Freo's Recruiting Staff's fault = CC as he controls it. Lets go for the short term fix of importing another "big player at the end of this year" and give away 2 - 3 of our highest draft picks.

Lets have look who is still there for WCE


Lynch (0 games) Rookie listed
Macdougal (0 games) Pick 5 2000
Humm (4 games) Pick 36 2000
Hunter (10 games) Pick 29 1999
Gaspar (7 games) Pick 14 1999
Green (12 games) Promoted Rookie 2000
Cox (17 games) Promoted Rookie 2000
Kerr (19 games) Pick 18 2000
Glass (26 games) pick 11 1999
Embley (37 games) Pick 57 1998
Fletcher (38 games) Promoted Rookie 1998
Wooden (56 games)
Wirrapunda (65 Games)
Braun (72 Games)
Gardiner (77 Games)
Matera (97 games)
Cousins (122 Games)
Banfield (171 Games)

Want to think again about that stupid statement?.

Yes actually I do. Somehow you've tried to spin-doctor again about how Woosha inherited all these ready-made players. Mate he's built most of them into the players they are now.

The other point is looking at the above two comparisons brings home another home truth, Freo give away their early draft picks, whereas WCE rarely do. Additionally, WCE don't trade away their good players, wheras FFC does. Thats Freo's fault and has nothing to do with WCE.

Medhurst
Hayden
Haddrill
Dodd
Webster
Schammer
Sandilands
To name a few. That argument doesn't hold water either. You are jus regurgitating urban myths.

Schammer - Yeah he's really in form isn't he. Great move CC, play him while he's way underdone. That'll destroy his confidence, and IF Freo decided to trade him at year end, his value is less this year than last.

2003 draft squashs that argument, Dunn, Murphy, Mundy, Campbell , Peake & Johnson were a huge investment in youth when short term it would have been better to keep Koops & Croad.

Where do I start?

Murphy - kicked 3 goals last week... why the F*** wasn't he left on the ground for the whole game for his development?
Peake - Great coaching move by CC, "son you don't have to turn up @ 6am for E.Freo on Sun". EF": Get stuffed Peake, you are not playing Seniors. CC: EF, you can get stuffed Peake isb't playing reserves. Hey Ripper, I have a brainstorm, lets play Peake this week, even though he didn't get a game last weekend.

Croad - Yup, lets play him in the forward line at FFC whereas he's a natural athlete and needs to be led to the ball in the backline. EVERY man & his dog was blaying blood for CC to move him into defence. So where do Hawthoen play him now, Defence. Close to AA I belive this year.

Until last year you would have thought that Hunter & Glass were duds as well despite them having an extra 2 seasons on young Polly. Polly hasn't been a dud but he has a long
way to go yet..

I didd't say Polak was a Dud. I actually rate him very, very highly.

CC's use of Polak is slowly eroding any self-confidence he had and he will become a dud )over time) unless another coach takes over.

Looking at all of the above it has bought home to me that CC has actually overachieved and Woosh has under achieved with what they inherited.

Absolute Crap.

I am paying your team a compliment, when I say that Freo's list is Top 4 material. If it isn't, explain to me how they can win away? Is it because they can only play as the hunter rather than the hunted?

What you are saying Ripper_46 is so wrong. And what is blatantly obvious now to all and sundry is that you have personal reasons for backing CC at every opportunity you get. Deny all you want, I know the truth.

Listen to your own supporters opinions regarding CC, rather than spin-doctoring more Crap.

 

[Mead]

Glass picked up in same draft as pavand haselby. When the eagles midfield isn't domininating games he struggles. Hadrill started at freo roughly the same time with less talent.
Cox- isn't tough. Sandi is just as tough, he came to freo rawer than cox.
Embley-not any tough than any freo player.did take his football to a new level, kinda like when Mcpharlin came to freo.
Flecture- this guy did step up for you.
Hunter is crap- has alway been hard at it sort, now is bigger and more mature, get you had off it.

J walker - stepped up improved player under CC
Hadrill - see above.
Jlo- stepped up improved.
the list goes on
CC is a good coach. From what i have heard worsford is a lot softer than judge.

So basically all those guys are pretty rubbish or were always okay, and our list is comparable or worse to Freo's, Connolly is a good coach and Worsfold is soft. Well that clears up everything and explains the relative ladder positions, thank you.

Coming from the outside one thing which I don't understand about Fremantle is the wierd sort of self-flagellatory pride Freo fans seem to take in being terrible. The number of times I've heard comments like 'we might have sucked during the good old days, but at least we played with pride and were good to watch..' in reference to the recent losses is boggling. The disturbing thing is that its really just a more extreme form of that attitude which makes some freo fans accept the current performances of Freo. As long as you can wheel out an improbable derby win, an inspirational victory on the road in the middle of a heap of appalling losses, a good individual performance amongst a bunch of marshmallow puffs, everything seems to be okay. If anything, those occasional inspirational performances should be making it definitely NOT okay. Fremantle clearly have the players and the ability to beat anyone on their day, so why aren't they getting consistent performances out of them?

The only acceptable measure of football success is the number in the W column. You can waffle and fabricate as many crazy ideas about how Connolly is really doing a good job or has been handed a bum rap or whatever, but in the end that's the number which counts for everything.

IMO, it really comes down to this: Connolly deserved to be on notice after throwing away an absolute monty of a finals berth last season. If Freo don't make the finals this year he deserves to be sacked. Does anyone on this board honestly think that Connolly should be coach in 06 if he doesn't make the finals?

If you think so, hey that's fine by me, but it will just mean a return to the bad old/good old days for Freo, the collapse of the membership bandwagon, another few decades of mediocrity and wasting of talented young players, and perpetuation of the culture of acceptable failure that seems to still permeate at Freo. And maybe a few years down the track you'll find a new Clive and he'll play his one great game of his career against us in a derby and you'll have an inspirational win, but 25 years down the track do you really want to have a few moments like that as the only thing to hang your hats on?

You need to decide whether Freo wants to be a proud, professional AFL club, who only expects and accepts success, or wants to continue to be the ******ed stepchild of AFL football. In short, you need to decide whether you want to fire Connolly.

 

[BB gun]

Mead go troll somewhere else.
Wce list is stronger than Freos list. thats reason they have won more games. Just like st kilda's list at full strength is better than WCE list. your team is ******** and shouldn't win a premiership.
CC is just as good of a coach as worsfold.
Wce is the last team that can give us ******** for not stepping up in big games.

 

[Ripper]

Re: Sumich will replace CC if he fails

Well that's Freo's Recruiting Staff's fault = CC as he controls it. Lets go for the short term fix of importing another "big player at the end of this year" and give away 2 - 3 of our highest draft picks.

I am paying your team a compliment, when I say that Freo's list is Top 4 material.

Make up your mind!

It is clear to me that CC has done an outstanding job building a list when you look at what he started with.

Yes actually I do. Somehow you've tried to spin-doctor again about how Woosha inherited all these ready-made players. Mate he's built most of them into the players they are now.

Not at all the fact are irrefutable that WCE squad is 1or 2 years ahead of ours in experience.

The other point is looking at the above two comparisons brings home another home truth, Freo give away their early draft picks, whereas WCE rarely do. Additionally, WCE don't trade away their good players, wheras FFC does. Thats Freo's fault and has nothing to do with WCE.

We had to trade to get some experienced leaders a fact that I have already proved that you did not have to. In fact you are still reping indirectly the benifits of WCE's concessions of the early nineties with Banfield on your list and being able to get a 3rd round pick for Morrison.

You cannot have a whole team of young draft picks.

The only player that CC has traded away of note would be Mcphee.

Schammer - Yeah he's really in form isn't he. Great move CC, play him while he's way underdone. That'll destroy his confidence, and IF Freo decided to trade him at year end, his value is less this year than last.

Make up your mind , one minute CC shows no faith in young players and next minute he does.

Murphy - kicked 3 goals last week... why the F*** wasn't he left on the ground for the whole game for his development?

Why wasn't Chris Judd left on the ground the whole time in his early years for "development"?

Peake - Great coaching move by CC, "son you don't have to turn up @ 6am for E.Freo on Sun". EF": Get stuffed Peake, you are not playing Seniors. CC: EF, you can get stuffed Peake isb't playing reserves. Hey Ripper, I have a brainstorm, lets play Peake this week, even though he didn't get a game last weekend.

Clutching at straws there, Peake was at a Freo training session on the Sunday.

Croad - Yup, lets play him in the forward line at FFC whereas he's a natural athlete and needs to be led to the ball in the backline. EVERY man & his dog was blaying blood for CC to move him into defence. So where do Hawthoen play him now, Defence. Close to AA I belive this year.

42 goals is a good effort and it good to see him come really good. The extra couple of seasons and extra games have seen him improve just like Hunter & Glass

I didd't say Polak was a Dud. I actually rate him very, very highly.

CC's use of Polak is slowly eroding any self-confidence he had and he will become a dud )over time) unless another coach takes over.

Unsubtansiated crap. He was very good after copping a spray from the Coach (fancy that who would have thought that CC would give someone a spray?) at 1/2 time against Geelong

 

[dugrene]

Mead go troll somewhere else.
Wce list is stronger than Freos list. thats reason they have won more games. Just like st kilda's list at full strength is better than WCE list. your team is ******** and shouldn't win a premiership.
CC is just as good of a coach as worsfold.
Wce is the last team that can give us ******** for not stepping up in big games.

Nice one BB.

Couldnt have said it better myself.

Found this saying. Something the Toast Bone Pickers should read.

It is easy when we are in prosperity to give advice to the afflicted.

I get sick to the eyeballs when we have $100 worth of advice comming from 50cent mouths.

It like " oh..... my teams winning. That makes me smarter than you"
I'd rather real trolls comming in for fun than cliver dicks dripping syrupy words of knowledge then expecting all and sundry to be happy that we were fortunate enough to be addressed by the chosen.

 

[TheReason]

Re: Sumich will replace CC if he fails

Clutching at straws there, Peake was at a Freo training session on the Sunday.

So you are disputing that:

1. Peake asked FFC if he needed to front up for E.Freo @ 6am for a session.

2. Peake didn't rock up to E.Freo @ 6am and was subsequently told, "Team Rules, yoiu aint playing in the seniors".

3. FFC spat the dummy and told E.Freo, "Shove it, he is not playing in the Reserves".


More of the same spin-doctoring hey Ripper_46?


So tell me, if you are saying that Freo's list is over-rated, or CC didn't have much to work with when he came on board.... what does that say about the recruiting philosophy of FFC over the last 10 years, when you have been the worst performed club... and yet you still haven't used the low draft picks, wisely, to rebuild the team?

Tell me, IF CC gets the sack, at the end of this year, what will you do:

a). Proclaim that Freo are going backwards as they have lost the Saviour = CC?

b). Shout from roof tops that he was a dud of the highest order?


FFC, accepting mediocrity from birth... and still accepting it today.

The acceptance of Mediocrity from the fans, breeds Mediocrity in the players.

 

[jarman]

That is your view, the punters obviously thought different.

Check the Ladder.

I hear a lot of "I have a feeling" and "He is no good" type things but I have yet to hear anything concrete that convinces me that I am wildly wrong.

You blokes would sack Micheal Schumacher half way through a GP if he was in the middle of the pack.

I would not put my money on either at the moment for a GF spot. Even less chance of Freo making a GF and especially with CC there.

Problem is that CC is not Schumacher. Schumacher has proved himself and with that one has hope. CC has been there 3.5 years and what has really changed and above all what is going to change - nothing.

He has been given a go and he has not delivered. Time to get rid of him.

 

[Ripper]

Re: Sumich will replace CC if he fails

So you are disputing that:

1. Peake asked FFC if he needed to front up for E.Freo @ 6am for a session.

2. Peake didn't rock up to E.Freo @ 6am and was subsequently told, "Team Rules, yoiu aint playing in the seniors".

3. FFC spat the dummy and told E.Freo, "Shove it, he is not playing in the Reserves".

Peake was at the game Saturday night and at a Freo training session on the Sunday. If dunbar wants to be pedantic about one of his best players that is East Freo's problem.

More of the same spin-doctoring hey Ripper_46?

Lol , I have laad out a very credible aurgument without having to name call.

So tell me, if you are saying that Freo's list is over-rated, or CC didn't have much to work with when he came on board....

I think I have made a very strong case that CC didn't have a lot to work with when He started , certainly far less than Woosha did.
The Freo list was very overrated especially by the media, probably in an attempt to cover up for the Eagles underperforming.

Tell me how can a team go from 2nd in round 16 to 8th at the end of the year?

what does that say about the recruiting philosophy of FFC over the last 10 years, when you have been the worst performed club... and yet you still haven't used the low draft picks, wisely, to rebuild the team?

Up until the current Admin it was terrible , that is no secret.

Tell me, IF CC gets the sack, at the end of this year, what will you do:

If we don't make the finals and there is no huge injuries worries than I will support that he has to go.

But at the moment we would be shooting ourselves in the foot (yet again). There is still half a season to go and we are actually better placed (by one win & 20 odd %) than your lot were last year.

 

[TheReason]

Re: Sumich will replace CC if he fails

Lol , I have laad out a very credible aurgument without having to name call.

Saying you spin-doctor is not name calling.

Tell me how can a team go from 2nd in round 16 to 8th at the end of the year?

I presume you're talking about WCE in 2003.

In that case, we went to PA, got Poleaxed to the nth degree. We copped major injuries to the players that sustained us in the top 2, being:

Kerr was Spear Tackled, out for a few weeks
Embley out for 4-6 weeks - and when he returned was clearly still playing injured.
Gardiner - Knee = GAWN

On top of the injuries, our confidence got hammered and we never recovered for the rest of 03.

To be blunt, 03 serves me well in grounding my feet, and not getting hyped up in the slightest about WCE 10-1 run. 03 always sticks in my mind that anything can happen.

If we don't make the finals and there is no huge injuries worries than I will support that he has to go.

But at the moment we would be shooting ourselves in the foot (yet again). There is still half a season to go and we are actually better placed (by one win & 20 odd %) than your lot were last year.

Ripper_46

Fair enough....

Kudos to you for coming back a couple of times and replying. On a couple of ocassions I've come close to naming you everything under the sun, as I'm sure you have thought to do to me.