Would love to see/hear that now...
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Mega Thread General MFC Discussion Part III
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Bluelegs
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No video but found this article. What a call.
FOX FOOTY's David King says Melbourne Demons made 'a massive error' in appointing coach Mark Neeld
Neeld appointment was 'a massive error'
www.foxsports.com.au
Bluelegs
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Would love to see how this board reacted to this. Reckon I was laying into King for calling us out. Wonnaeamirri33 would have posted about 20 low res gifs in the thread.No video but found this article. What a call.
FOX FOOTY's David King says Melbourne Demons made 'a massive error' in appointing coach Mark Neeld
Neeld appointment was 'a massive error'
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Bluelegs
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One of my fav Gawn goals in that game. Held off a defender in each arm took the mark then turned around and kicked the ball straight into a Giants supporters head.
One of the brief flashes in his early career when you thought there might be something there
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Surely not as much as ELITE utility Luke Williams?
Tulip
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There's really no need to add to the margin
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No video but found this article. What a call.
FOX FOOTY's David King says Melbourne Demons made 'a massive error' in appointing coach Mark Neeld
Neeld appointment was 'a massive error'
FOX FOOTY's David King says Melbourne Demons made 'a massive error' in appointing coach Mark Neeld
Neeld appointment was 'a massive error'
www.foxsports.com.au
"" King, who played 241 games for North Melbourne, described Neeld as "a square peg in a round hole", explaining that the former Magpies assistant's game plan doesn't suit the Demons' playing list.
The Demons have lost their first eight games under rookie coach Neeld, who has vowed to turn what was a free-running side under Dean Bailey into "the hardest team to play against ""
..........................................................
Our culture, was as weak as anyone's ever was. We needed to smash the leaders who upheld the ways of that weak culture; who carried it like a parasite within, so to make the culture shift.
Why do you think Melbourne was so poor at developing our recruits, since late 1990's. Most of them failed during the period...
Neeld's team did us the biggest favour, in smashing most of that old culture. But he wasn't there, to rebuild a strong culture; so we will never know.
Again the club panicked, after the player revolt. And the player revolt happened, because past players and insiders were so afraid of what was taking place; they didn't understand it.
And they made it known they were backing the players point of view.
This is what happens in a mutiny, and any administration who backed the appointment, and then goes to water has little spine in allowing things to happen so poorly, by the players on-field.
Roos then came onboard, to finish the job. and to rebuild the club from a fresh, with no culture issues to speak of.
The thing is, Melbourne had not won a flag for 57 years, since the great Norm Smith lost the backing of the Mcc board.
.... And with that went the strong culture with him; and also with Barassi, to Carlton. Then to North after that.
The FACT that We have won a Premiership Flag so quickly after that time of Neeld, which brought two club builders in the form of P.Jackson, and P.Roos... to settle and rebuild our foundations, on and off the field. And Goody was appointed and anointed, under Roos's watch.
He, Goody, has been able to build a quality list, in his vision... and our kids have been able to develop thru this time... Because that old weak culture was SMASHed to pieces.
Lets look at the Saints history, they won one flag in 66 under Yabby Jeans... and then they lost Jeans to the Hawks, and guess what happened from there on. The Hawks went on a finals blitz, and the poor old Sainters went from promise to failure, over and over again, to this day.
Sound familiar.
.... There is an amateur culture right there, similar to what had been at Melbourne for best part of 50 years ( 1964 to, lets say 2014 ) Roosy's time.
The difference is in the ability to get the players to work harder at their craft, and at being the fittest they can be, at becoming positive about themselves and they're craft... and so our clubs work-rate has become the comps elite level.
This in turn effects the recruits; to become the best they can be as well, and our kids are spending much more time at the VFL level developing their games, and growing their bodies and fitness.
When they get promoted into the senior team they're roles are easier within an established professional team environment.
I say, thank-you Mark Neeld, for your part in helping us change our culture from the amateurish, to the elite professionals we are today.
And for taking the fall you've suffered, from your time with us.
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I was thinking about petracca's 40 disposals in the GF being revised to 39, and I was wondering if there had been discussion about what the correct disposal count should have been. Or if anyone has watched it back and counted his disposals that game.
Breaking the disposal record in a match like that seemed fitting and I was wondering whether petracca was robbed or if it was the right call.
Breaking the disposal record in a match like that seemed fitting and I was wondering whether petracca was robbed or if it was the right call.
Bluelegs
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FOX FOOTY's David King says Melbourne Demons made 'a massive error' in appointing coach Mark Neeld
Neeld appointment was 'a massive error'
"" King, who played 241 games for North Melbourne, described Neeld as "a square peg in a round hole", explaining that the former Magpies assistant's game plan doesn't suit the Demons' playing list.
The Demons have lost their first eight games under rookie coach Neeld, who has vowed to turn what was a free-running side under Dean Bailey into "the hardest team to play against ""
..........................................................
Our culture, was as weak as anyone's ever was. We needed to smash the leaders who upheld the ways of that weak culture; who carried it like a parasite within, so to make the culture shift.
Why do you think Melbourne was so poor at developing our recruits, since late 1990's. Most of them failed during the period...
Neeld's team did us the biggest favour, in dismantling most of that old culture. But wasn't there, to rebuild a strong culture; so we will never know.
Again the club panicked, after the player revolt. And the player revolt happened, because past players and insiders were so afraid of what was taking place, they didn't understand it.
And they made it known they were backing the players point of view.
This is what happens in a mutiny, and any administration who backed the appointment, and then goes to water has little spine in allowing things to happen so poorly, by the players on-field.
Roos then came onboard, to finish the job. and to rebuild the club from afresh....
The thing is Melbourne has not won a flag for 57 years, since the great Norm Smith lost the backing of the Mcc board.
.... And with that went the culture with him; and also with Barassi, to Carlton. Then to North after that.
The FACT that We have won a Premiership Flag, so quickly after that time of Neeld, which brought two club builders in the form of P.Jackson and P.Roos... to settle and rebuild our foundations, on and off the field. And Goody was appointed and anointed, under Roos watch.
He Goody, has been able to build a quality list in his vision... and our kids have been able to develop thru this time... Because that old weak culture was SMASHed to pieces.
Lets look at the Saints history, the won one flag in 66 under Yabby Jeans... and then they lost Jeans to the Hawks, and guess what happened from there on. The Hawks went on a finals blitz, and the poor old Sainters went from promise to failure, over and over again, to this day.
There is amateur culture right there, similar to what has been at Melbourne for best part of 50 years ( 1964 to, lets say 2014 ) Roosy's time.
The difference is in the ability to get the players to work harder at their craft, and at being the fittest they can be... and so the work-rate is the comps elite level.
This in turn effects the recruits; to become the best they can be as well, and our kids are spending much more time at the VFL level developing their games and growing their bodies and fitness.
I say thank-you Mark Neeld, for your part in helping us change our culture from the amateurish, to the elite professionals we are today.
And for taking the fall you've suffered, from your time with us.
This post is a bit all over the place but I think you're giving Neeld too much credit. He wasn't deliberately blowing up the club with some accelerationist agenda. He was simply incompetent at building relationships, implementing standards and getting the players to go his way. That the scope of his mis-management and that of our administration was so broad that it forced the AFL to intervene is not something I think he deserves to hang his hat on. All the credit for that transition belongs to Jackson, Roos, Bartlett and the rest of the board who came on during that period.
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Him being so bad at his job was the best thing he did, coz it meant we didnt **** around getting rid of him, who knows where wed be now if we had won a few more games under him, could have missed out on Roos all together
Any coach would have struggled coming in to that team at the time I reckon, we were a complete and utter shambles.
The fact that Neeld was equally as bad a coach, as the team was, made the transition even faster to get a proper rebuild underway.
I'm starting to think North may be headed down the same path, with their coach apologising for spraying the players.
The fact that Neeld was equally as bad a coach, as the team was, made the transition even faster to get a proper rebuild underway.
I'm starting to think North may be headed down the same path, with their coach apologising for spraying the players.
Bluelegs
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Neeld never would have apologised for anything lol. Told beamer to **** off and meant it.
The bloke was an absolute moron, more interested in making an example of the senior players than teaching them a better way. Embarrassing everyone by giving two kids the captaincy before they even knew how to train properly.
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Ill never forget that offseason when we brought in Dawes, Gillies, Byrnes, Rodan and Pedo.. there were actual Melbourne supporters happy with those moves. 
Bloke at my work who was a fellow Dees fan told me I was being far too negative, then after round 1 he came up to me before work and said I probably wasn't negative enough in hindsight.
Bloke at my work who was a fellow Dees fan told me I was being far too negative, then after round 1 he came up to me before work and said I probably wasn't negative enough in hindsight.
No, you have it wrong my friend.
Lets just say, I had word from within, as to what was happening before it all blew up. And the concern of past players was one of dismay, because they didn't fully understand cultures, and that they had indeed played without a perfect culture themselves.
We, the club, had a weakened culture since shortly after the Smith era. That cultures grows from being beaten all the time, week to week. And so a self protectionist culture starts to form, and from there, a social based culture takes over, with the players ego's taking the easy road of outside popularity. And a self protectionist fraternity arrives, to the detriment of the young developing players. Who in-turn have to tow the senior players line.
We got beaten by Jeans Hawks in Prelim 1987 which consolidated some fear of the Hawks mental hold over us. Then in 1988, we got absolutely smashed by the Hawks again, in the Grand final.
This really fortified the Hawks mental control over us in the big games, and had led to some more self protectionist culture creeping back into the club, amongst the new leaders from Ray Jordans mentoring time with us.
Barassi and Jordan had started the culture change, Via the new boys coming thru. But they didn't have time enough to thoroughly sort out the culture issues.
Again the Mcc has a profound effect to the detriment our our development under Barasi, by imo, vindictively fencing of the centre wicket area, in around Barass's 3rd season back with us. And worse to come, when Barass had been asking for better facilities, rooms for a better and bigger Gym, and players social rooms for after match etc...
With this, the Mcc sent our club packing to the famed Junction Oval... and huge step downward for the Mfc.
Barass's 5 Year plan, had bean blown out of the water, like a sitting duck. He couldn't then take us where he wanted us to be because of the backward step in facilities. It now seemed that Barass's influence, was now hurting the club, via a vindictive landlord.
Like Smith, they got rid of Barass as well.
Tulip
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Time really does heal all wounds, doesn't it. Neeld was awful at literally every facet of head coaching. Arguably the worst head coach of all time.
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Bluelegs
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What's your point here? Who do you think was more responsible for fixing our culture and rebuilding us as a club, Paul Roos Roos and Peter Jackson, or the people he sacked?
Ha. I wanted exactly what we ended up with. A self protectionist culture smashed, and in tatters... allowing a totally new culture to be developed by a top coach of our time.
Enter Mr Roos.
The former retired players actions in sinking Neeld, only brought the inevitable to our club. The time to rebuild with a strong vibrant and professional culture, where being you best and winning was the single focus and achievement.
A much less self-absorbed team list, and club. And a place where no glass-ceiling was being orchestrated by senior players, trying to maintain their station, without full commitment to being the best footballers.
This is where the clubs growth started from, this time of our history, and we got AFL assistance to get PJackson and PRoos, to overtake our clubs direction, such was the AFL's lack of confidence in any Melbourne boards, historically.
The rest they say is in the History books. Just as surely as big Maxies change of attitude, from the old drinking and smoking social clown Max, to the new leader we see beating all comers.
Max's old culture ways, compared to his newfound maturity and work ethic.
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With such an engrained social culture, as Melbourne's, decades growing all around the entire club, to all personnel. The club' doesn't see the weaknesses as anything different to a normal day at the office. "We're just fine".
And almost impossible to shift that culture out, without trading away all of our most senior players, to start afresh with kids. But then we would need to bring in senior players from successful clubs to lead and help train all and sundry, a new culture, adopted from they're former clubs.
See Barassi, going to captain coach Carlton.
Also see Luke Hodge and Sam Mitchell going off to Brisbane and West Coast. The Hawks losing some much needed leadership in the process.
I think it held them back but it kick-started the Brisbane Lions into strong AFL form.
West Coast, well they are getting what is so longly deserved. From they time of performance enhancements.
What I am saying is, its like trying to clean an Covid enclosed room that has harbored the virus for decades. You have to go all-in to rid the virus, completely. Because the occupants carry the virus, and all surfaces have it as well.
Neeld smashed the leadership, that had played with the amateur culture, and they had been passing that culture along, as a forced hand me down.
The players had had a happy culture of 'near-enough', good enough. They got payed even if they missed finals or premierships.
Socially they were prevalent.
You really have to completely un-knit the jumper, completely unravel it, to start again successfully... This is what happened, and Roosy had a much easier time of it, with what he was handed, rather than having to jettison most of the old guard himself. A very unpopular chore, for any outsider to manage, from within a self-protection racket. A cartel of the unwilling; the un-professional's.
Roosy may not have even taken the job,? if he had to do so much dirty-work, from the start.? It would have become a much harder task if he had to.
see Watts. and the uncommitted. early Gawn, etc. They were in the twilight brigade. played in both eras, and had learnt to old culture, before Roos got hold of them.
Roosy could not shift Watts from the old ways.
Dory_77
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I mean I agree the old culture needed changing and rebuilding, but Neeld (and others probably, like Schwab etc) unintentionally went full Attila the Hun.
Cultural change is hard and rarely linear and I guess in hindsight taking the club so close to the brink with the disasters of 2011-13 was useful. That said, it's ridiculous to give Neeld credit for what came afterwards. It took much wider heads to actually build a successful culture from that wreck.
Cultural change is hard and rarely linear and I guess in hindsight taking the club so close to the brink with the disasters of 2011-13 was useful. That said, it's ridiculous to give Neeld credit for what came afterwards. It took much wider heads to actually build a successful culture from that wreck.
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Im convinced, Mark Neeld is a hero
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