Good luck Jarryd Lyons

[Vhaluus]

I was one who felt a little disappointed to see Lyons departing in 2017. But honestly, I think the decision made sense because we had a surplus of similar midfield-types:
- Sloane
- MCrouch
- BCrouch
- Douglas
- Thompson
- Cam-Ellis Yolmen
- Kerridge
- Grigg
- Van Berlo

The fact that we made the GF with the midfield group we had back then seems justified of the decision to let Lyons go.
Sure, he’s gone on to bigger and better things, but the club can only go with the decisions back in 2016/2017.

Lyons is in the top 4 players on that list.

 

[Vhaluus]

Good luck Jarryd Lyons

I was one who felt a little disappointed to see Lyons departing in 2017. But honestly, I think the decision made sense because we had a surplus of similar midfield-types: - Sloane - MCrouch - BCrouch - Douglas - Thompson - Cam-Ellis Yolmen - Kerridge - Grigg - Van Berlo The fact that we made...

www.bigfooty.com

"When I started here I had a couple of quiet games in a row and I said to 'Fages' before the Gold Coast game, 'I'm happy if you don't want to pick me this week, I know I haven't been performing that well'," Lyons said.

"He said, 'Don't be stupid, you're in our team, your best is good enough'.

"It showed the character he was and what he saw in me. It was a small thing, but it meant a lot to me and I just wanted to repay him and the club.

What Lyons never got here from the Crows: belief.

He got it at the Lions and look what happened.

 

[Geoffa32]

Good luck Jarryd Lyons

I was one who felt a little disappointed to see Lyons departing in 2017. But honestly, I think the decision made sense because we had a surplus of similar midfield-types: - Sloane - MCrouch - BCrouch - Douglas - Thompson - Cam-Ellis Yolmen - Kerridge - Grigg - Van Berlo The fact that we made...

www.bigfooty.com

What Lyons never got here from the Crows: belief.

He got it at the Lions and look what happened.

I think what it comes down to is Pykes's favourite mids being Crouchs, Sloane, Douglas and even Thommo. Pyke saw Lyons as next rung below that.

Fagan wanted Lyons and could see him working well in the midfield he set up.

Pyke didn't.


Was Pyke wrong? We did make a GF in 2017? We didn't lose that GF in the midfield. Richmond's defence killed us and they stopped our run from HB.

Fast forward to today and Pyke was wrong. Lyons is dominating, Pykes boys floundering or retired and B Crouch pushed out.

Pyke was also effectively sacked.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

 

[John Who]

Lyons is in the top 4 players on that list.

Did you really think this out loud in 2017 when we were heading for the Finals?

 

[John Who]

I think what it comes down to is Pykes's favourite mids being Crouchs, Sloane, Douglas and even Thommo. Pyke saw Lyons as next rung below that.

Fagan wanted Lyons and could see him working well in the midfield he set up.

Pyke didn't.


Was Pyke wrong? We did make a GF in 2017? We didn't lose that GF in the midfield. Richmond's defence killed us and they stopped our run from HB.

Fast forward to today and Pyke was wrong. Lyons is dominating, Pykes boys floundering or retired and B Crouch pushed out.

Pyke was also effectively sacked.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

The other issue was that whilst Lyons had progressed over the years, our players seemingly regressed for a multitude of reasons eg. hamstring saga, team loss in confidence etc.

Had Lyons still stayed, would he improve as much as he is at Brisbane? Might he be physically mismanaged in 2018? All what ifs, really.

 

[Geoffa32]

The other issue was that whilst Lyons had progressed over the years, our players seemingly regressed for a multitude of reasons eg. hamstring saga, team loss in confidence etc.

Had Lyons still stayed, would he improve as much as he is at Brisbane? Might he be physically mismanaged in 2018? All what ifs, really.

It is a real Sliding Doors scenario.


I think at Brisbane he has a coach who wants him and has a midfield built well that he is an important member of.

He never had that at Adelaide or GC.

For us the lack of identifying Lyons talent ahead of Crouchs and Sloane, is one decision of many over the last decade or so that leads us to having the worst midfield in the comp right now.


I was wrong in identifying Lyons talent. But I pay to watch the Crows play, not get paid to make them play better.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

 

[Vhaluus]

Did you really think this out loud in 2017 when we were heading for the Finals?

Yep, posted it on this board too.

no-one is attempting to compare MCrouch and Lyons.

But Lyons would be CLEARLY our 3rd best midfielder this year.

Plenty of posts in this very thread of me defending Lyons in 2017. Here are a few more. If you want more please let me know because there are probably 100 posts on this thread alone of my defending Lyons in 2017.

The odds were ALWAYS that he'd get better this year, he's a young player.

We were dumb to get rid of him.

This isn't 'oh well, hindisght is 20/20' thing. Normal sight should have caught this one.

Thompson should have been delisted, Douglas should be playing his mature head in the SANFL role and Lyons would be in our best 22

Lyons would have contributed vastly more than Mackay this year. To put them in the same category after their performances last year makes me question if you even watch football.

Lyons stats scream incremental improvement. It's not like we had to give anything up to get him, we just had to delist Thompson and give some of his salary to Lyons to make the offer not insulting.

I agree on Wiggs getting a shot but that's another argument as we clearly wont.

As for Menzel you're dreaming, he's competing with Tambling for our worst trade. A mile off being AFL viable.

No-one is arguing he is elite, stop pretending we're making an argument we're not.

We're arguing he would be a lock for our best 22 and improve our team this year.

So because we're top of the ladder on percentage halfway through the season, we don't have any deficiencies and only an elite player could improve us?

Holy rose tinted glasses batman.

Does that mean McGovern won't improve us when he gets back from injury because he isn't elite?

 

[TubbsFarquhar]

Did you really think this out loud in 2017 when we were heading for the Finals?

Yes? Only Sloane and the Crouches were better than him then. VB had retired, Grigg was delisted in 2016, Kerridge was no longer on our list, Thompson was cooked, Dougie's best was behind him and lol at CEY.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Good luck Jarryd Lyons

I was one who felt a little disappointed to see Lyons departing in 2017. But honestly, I think the decision made sense because we had a surplus of similar midfield-types: - Sloane - MCrouch - BCrouch - Douglas - Thompson - Cam-Ellis Yolmen - Kerridge - Grigg - Van Berlo The fact that we made...

www.bigfooty.com

What Lyons never got here from the Crows: belief.

He got it at the Lions and look what happened.

Perfect article

Shows how selecting on form is the wrong approach. Form is temporary, class is permanent.

If you're good, you're good. If you're not, you're not. Then end.

Golden ticket system should be used imho

Just don't give them to s**t footballers like we do

 

[Vhaluus]

Perfect article

Shows how selecting on form is the wrong approach. Form is temporary, class is permanent.

If you're good, you're good. If you're not, you're not. Then end.

Golden ticket system should be used imho

Just don't give them to sh*t footballers like we do

Honestly even when he was 'in form' we didn't pick him at the Crows.

He nearly always performed extremely well as the sub, had a major impact in the brief game time he got nearly every single game.

In 2016 when he played full games he put in some very solid performances and was usually in the top half of our performers.

Lyons stepped up every single time he got the opportunity to at the Crows and met the challenge. But we still just didn't value him.

 

[1970crow]

Perfect article

Shows how selecting on form is the wrong approach. Form is temporary, class is permanent.

If you're good, you're good. If you're not, you're not. Then end.

Golden ticket system should be used imho

Just don't give them to sh*t footballers like we do

We have a lot more patience for bad performances from average players that have been around a while than we do up and com8ng talent. It's a flaw that exists to this very day.

 

[1970crow]

Honestly even when he was 'in form' we didn't pick him at the Crows.

He nearly always performed extremely well as the sub, had a major impact in the brief game time he got nearly every single game.

In 2016 when he played full games he put in some very solid performances and was usually in the top half of our performers.

Lyons stepped up every single time he got the opportunity to at the Crows and met the challenge. But we still just didn't value him.

Part of the issue is that we actively embrace 'acceptable' output. We don't look at our current 22 and identify players that we need to move past to attain the next level. It's why bog average players finish their careers in the 22 at our club. We don't have the patience or inclination to improve our best 22 that peaks at mid-table. Talented juniors need to wait for injury, trade or retirement. We don't omit seniors and then back in the kids underneath, if they do get in, they're back out as soon as they put in a poor one.

Watching Mackay accumulate his meaningless 14 touches which always include a kick out or 2 plus a couple of 1m 1/2 handballs ahead of backing in any of Sholl, Hamill or McPherson is the budgie in our coal mine. Whilst that philosophy/strategy remains in place, we'll never be anything more than what we've been the last decade. I'm convinced Neil, who's now added Suns to his impeccable resume of s**t outcomes for his labour, created a blueprint that we still use today. If a coach doesn't align, they don't get employed.

 

[John Who]

Yep, posted it on this board too.



Plenty of posts in this very thread of me defending Lyons in 2017. Here are a few more. If you want more please let me know because there are probably 100 posts on this thread alone of my defending Lyons in 2017.

I did a quick check, this thread went cold silent since July in round 15, 2017 when we were sitting 2nd on the ladder with 10 wins. Only to come back alive again in April 2018. We all seem to have conveniently forgotten about Lyons when we were heading for Finals at the pointy end. And when we beat Geelong in the 2017 PF, I wonder if anyone thought "damn, wish Lyons was in the GF makeup of the Crows squad"?

 

[John Who]

It is a real Sliding Doors scenario.


I think at Brisbane he has a coach who wants him and has a midfield built well that he is an important member of.

He never had that at Adelaide or GC.

For us the lack of identifying Lyons talent ahead of Crouchs and Sloane, is one decision of many over the last decade or so that leads us to having the worst midfield in the comp right now.


I was wrong in identifying Lyons talent. But I pay to watch the Crows play, not get paid to make them play better.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

But the thing is, we and the club can only make an opinion in that given year when Lyons departed. And the decision at the time, you can say was perhaps slightly wrong, but not an obvious blunder.
Looking at the 2016 stats, Lyons actually played 20 games of AFL that year. So it's probably more bewildering that we thought highly enough of him to play him as an AFL regular, but yet, alledgedly only offer him a relatively lowball offer for 2017. I get the feeling news of him being linked with a possible Gibbs trade at Carlton, Lyons was likely to have wanting to look elsewhere anyway.

 

[Vhaluus]

I did a quick check, this thread went cold silent since July in round 15, 2017 when we were sitting 2nd on the ladder with 10 wins. Only to come back alive again in April 2018. We all seem to have conveniently forgotten about Lyons when we were heading for Finals at the pointy end. And when we beat Geelong in the 2017 PF, I wonder if anyone thought "damn, wish Lyons was in the GF makeup of the Crows squad"?

So rather than admit that I had in fact been consistant on Lyons since the time you asked, 2017, you're moving the goal posts just because I din't post about it during finals?

 

[Sanders]

I did a quick check, this thread went cold silent since July in round 15, 2017 when we were sitting 2nd on the ladder with 10 wins. Only to come back alive again in April 2018. We all seem to have conveniently forgotten about Lyons when we were heading for Finals at the pointy end. And when we beat Geelong in the 2017 PF, I wonder if anyone thought "damn, wish Lyons was in the GF makeup of the Crows squad"?

That is entirely what you would expect

How on earth you think that supports your argument is baffling

 

[Sanders]

But the thing is, we and the club can only make an opinion in that given year when Lyons departed. And the decision at the time, you can say was perhaps slightly wrong, but not an obvious blunder.
Looking at the 2016 stats, Lyons actually played 20 games of AFL that year. So it's probably more bewildering that we thought highly enough of him to play him as an AFL regular, but yet, alledgedly only offer him a relatively lowball offer for 2017. I get the feeling news of him being linked with a possible Gibbs trade at Carlton, Lyons was likely to have wanting to look elsewhere anyway.

He finished 12th in the B&F and played 20 games

It was a ******* blunder. The end

 

[John Who]

So rather than admit that I had in fact been consistant on Lyons since the time you asked, 2017, you're moving the goal posts just because I din't post about it during finals?

I didn't change the goal posts, but you did. Here's what I asked previously:

Did you really think this out loud in 2017 when we were heading for the Finals?

And I already stated I was also one who was disappointed that Lyons had left. But I also could understand the decisions being made for both the club and Lyons (seeking more opportunities).

 

[Ramify]

He finished 12th in the B&F and played 20 games

It was a ******* blunder. The end

Yep, said it at the time, say it now and said he was mismanaged the whole damn time he was with us.

Hes not the only one unfortunately.

 

[Sanders]

Yep, said it at the time, say it now and said he was mismanaged the whole damn time he was with us.

Hes not the only one unfortunately.

If we didn’t know how good he was, then that is on us

If we did know how good he was,
Then that is on us

The gymnastics to pretend there wasn’t a blunder here is quite staggering

 

[skam85]

I did a quick check, this thread went cold silent since July in round 15, 2017 when we were sitting 2nd on the ladder with 10 wins. Only to come back alive again in April 2018. We all seem to have conveniently forgotten about Lyons when we were heading for Finals at the pointy end. And when we beat Geelong in the 2017 PF, I wonder if anyone thought "damn, wish Lyons was in the GF makeup of the Crows squad"?

It seems like the concept of "always looking to improve" is foreign to you.

 

[1970crow]

I didn't change the goal posts, but you did. Here's what I asked previously:

And I already stated I was also one who was disappointed that Lyons had left. But I also could understand the decisions being made for both the club and Lyons (seeking more opportunities).

Yeh and your understanding included a forced retiring VB, cooked Thommo who played SANFL bar 1 final gift, near done Douglas and 2 guys who weren't even on our list. And CEY. But you do happen across the issue. We saw Sloane, Gibbs and Crouch x 2 and say to ourselves there's our midfield for the next 3-5 years, that area is sorted. If we lose one, we've got Douglas and CEY to cover a few minutes. We don't run a deep midfield, we don't share the load, so our juniors become gun SANFL mids which isn't the same as a gun AFL mid. Our first choice mids play as mids, full stop. Everyone else that gets a go is just covering a couple of minutes here and there.

 

[Vhaluus]

I didn't change the goal posts, but you did. Here's what I asked previously:

And I already stated I was also one who was disappointed that Lyons had left. But I also could understand the decisions being made for both the club and Lyons (seeking more opportunities).

Heading for does not equal IN finals, they are two different things. So yes you're changing your argument.

I made a lot of those posts when we were midway through the season and top of the ladder, so very much HEADING for finals.

Do you really think you can get away with being this disingenuous when literally everything you've said is on the record here and can be referred back to?

 

[John Who]

Heading for does not equal IN finals, they are two different things. So yes you're changing your argument.

I made a lot of those posts when we were midway through the season and top of the ladder, so very much HEADING for finals.

Do you really think you can get away with being this disingenuous when literally everything you've said is on the record here and can be referred back to?

You're a tough cookie. "Heading into Finals" means "when you've consolidated a Finals spot", not when "already in the Finals". How have I changed my argument when I'm repeating the exact same question to you, and it still means the same? LOL

Anyway, let's just say we agree to disagree. And I don't wanna waste anymore time with you after this sentence.

 

[John Who]

It seems like the concept of "always looking to improve" is foreign to you.

2 years of continual put-downs from you. I think it's time you deserve to be on my ignore list. Congrats!