Have we botched the rebuild?

[Zondor]

This is what rebuilds look like.

 

[BigRedRoo]

No no its been great by all means lets get some more midfielders.

 

[Coach Bombay]

It seems like Clarko and co have created a good atmosphere around the club during the week. I think a few players would have left otherwise but no doubt we have very deep seeded issues that go back almost 10 years now.

In terms of Clarko era judging by his messaging it seems that things are A LOT worse than he was anticipating. I think he's realised he won't achieve what he was hoping in his 5 years and I think the players have a such a negative mindset towards game day. The mental toll of losing something like 97 games out of 113 would be huge.

My fear is that Clarko has resigned to mediocrity due to overestimating the list and the players are just kinda doing bare minimum to get through this as unscathed mentally as possible.

In terms of list management yeah absolutely mistakes have been made. You don't expect a 100% hit rate but ours is much too low given the # of picks at our disposal

 

[Cyber_punk]

My fear is that Clarko has resigned to mediocrity due to overestimating the list and the players are just kinda doing bare minimum to get through this as unscathed mentally as possible.

We also have to remember when Clarko was talking about how good our young list was before he came here, we still had TT and JHF in the team. I wonder if he would have been as enthused if they had left before he got here.

 

[Scallop Industry Thug]

We have drafted too many mids.

And...we're still getting smashed in the middle.

 

[shintemaster]

It seems like Clarko and co have created a good atmosphere around the club during the week. I think a few players would have left otherwise but no doubt we have very deep seeded issues that go back almost 10 years now.

In terms of Clarko era judging by his messaging it seems that things are A LOT worse than he was anticipating. I think he's realised he won't achieve what he was hoping in his 5 years and I think the players have a such a negative mindset towards game day. The mental toll of losing something like 97 games out of 113 would be huge.

My fear is that Clarko has resigned to mediocrity due to overestimating the list and the players are just kinda doing bare minimum to get through this as unscathed mentally as possible.

In terms of list management yeah absolutely mistakes have been made. You don't expect a 100% hit rate but ours is much too low given the # of picks at our disposal

Without mentioning too many specific names I will say that I was probably more willing than some - and definitely more willing than the club - to let some senior players go that had value. Not because I don't think these players can't be good in a decent team, but as a cultural reset to give us the ammunition to bring in enough new players that are ready for senior football and don't have the same baggage of years of losses. Not all of them but IMO players like Zurhaar, Powell, Scott probably had value 1-2 years back, even LDU this year. Not saying all of them and not saying any one individual is the issue either.

 

[FootySmartSimpson]

Neglecting the skeleton for 10 top 20 midfielders, when mids are fairly easy to find was madness. Always was. The “midfield first” mantra is bullshit.

We never were going to be Brisbane 01-04 or Geelong ‘07-11’.

Now we have find the picks to select KFs and wait 5 years for them to develop.

 

[DocSholl]

Mids drafted at the top end are usually the offensive ones too. We're an appalling defensive team

 

[Marstermind]

No. This rebuild is going super-duper!

 

[amaz199]

We botched it when we decided Petrie, Boomer, NDS and Firrito were deemed redundant.

 

[Cyber_punk]

We botched it when we decided Petrie, Boomer, NDS and Firrito were deemed redundant.

Boomer could still walk into the side today.

Firrito still could have gone on for another year.

The other 2 were well cooked.

 

[shintemaster]

We botched it when we decided Petrie, Boomer, NDS and Firrito were deemed redundant.

I'm sorry but I just can't stand this take. 4 delistings 10 years ago from 4 players of a combined age of around 140 isn't the reason we are in this mess. At best all four could argue they had maybe another year of journeyman football in them. Boomer I think was still performing best. Either way all four would be long gone by now.

The issue wasn't getting rid of them - it's what we did afterwards and I say that as someone that would happily have seen Boomer go round again - and again - until he had to be tapped on the shoulder.

 

[koshari]

It seems like Clarko and co have created a good atmosphere around the club during the week. I think a few players would have left otherwise but no doubt we have very deep seeded issues that go back almost 10 years now.

In terms of Clarko era judging by his messaging it seems that things are A LOT worse than he was anticipating. I think he's realised he won't achieve what he was hoping in his 5 years and I think the players have a such a negative mindset towards game day. The mental toll of losing something like 97 games out of 113 would be huge.

My fear is that Clarko has resigned to mediocrity due to overestimating the list and the players are just kinda doing bare minimum to get through this as unscathed mentally as possible.

In terms of list management yeah absolutely mistakes have been made. You don't expect a 100% hit rate but ours is much too low given the # of picks at our disposal

It could only be a good feeling round the club if your happy with being crap. Trust me i have played in such teams but in very lowly country leages as opposed to the pinnicle league. Sure we had a nice trip away at the end of the season and some pretty fun social events but it was crap for the most part. Turning up to training where 7 attendees was a good night. But we had no money, very few resources other than a couple of rusted on people who had been round the place in better times.

In the end i was getting dragged hung over out of bed to fill in the magoos.

 

[apollo_creed]

Yes.

The way this list has been constructed is clearly horrendous.

Drafting guys like Duursma and McKercher over other players at strategic/positional needs like Caddy/Watson/Curtin is one thing.

But then trading your future 1st for a developmental tall who is at minimum a year away from contributing...

Boggles the mind.

There's no 'one' person who deserves all the blame, but Rawlings deserves the lions-share.

The thing about that one is we don’t overpay for a 40 year old cooked Caleb Daniel and we have the pick for Whitlock and get our first pick this season.

Worst trade of all time.

 

[shintemaster]

The thing about that one is we don’t overpay for a 40 year old cooked Caleb Daniel and we have the pick for Whitlock and get our first pick this season.

Worst trade of all time.

Fair take and I say that as someone that was comfortable enough with picking up Daniel, just not necessarily at the price we paid. I just think you can't slot him into a team without other decent defenders, but that's not what we have. We undervalue true stingy defence (in all 3 areas of the ground to be honest) and the minute Archer went out we looked more flaky. That shouldn't be the case with a hail mary father son. There should be more than 1 player that is reliably aggressive 1 on 1 in a backline and indeed in other areas of the ground.

 

[R00StaR]

The thing about that one is we don’t overpay for a 40 year old cooked Caleb Daniel and we have the pick for Whitlock and get our first pick this season.

Worst trade of all time.

Close, but can think of worse. However, it at the stage we have to question spending draft capital in a one of the deepest drafts ever on 4 guys either almost out the door and/ or fringe. The experience has offered nothing.

I dont see how Hardeman, Archer, Goater, Bergman could be worse than Daniels and far better long term options. Phillips > Parker and Elmo/ Maley couldn't do much worse than Darling. I didnt see the value in Darling, but its the least worst one.

To make it worse we should have Gman as well as our first rounder.

 

[andana]

We are on track
Like this

 

[Epictetus]

Yes, the rebuild is ****ed. Which is some ****ing achievement.
Sad.

 

[Psicosis]

I’m as critical as anyone but to blame our issues because we drafted too many midfielders, is stupid.

It’s one small issue in a long list of issues. When it comes to recruiting a FAR bigger issue has been the type of players we’ve traded in. Expecting other clubs VFL players to come in and change our fortunes because they’re “more experienced” is just lunacy.

Another is our inability to nail a pick outside the top 5 (bar Curtis). The club selecting Brayden George (nothing against him) when they did kinda tells you everything you need to know.

If we were complimenting the mids we drafted early each year with KPPs, smalls, flankers, wingman etc. (and actually hitting some) every year, the list balance would be fine.

The key issue is we have recruited extremely poorly outside of the early picks (draft and trade), rather than because we’ve drafted mids early.

 

[Only Forwards]

For a hundred years the spine has been the most important part.

We have actively avoided spending any sort of real currency to build one.

If all the talls on our list who are unde 22 make it (they won’t). By the time Wil Dawson is 25 we may have righted ourselves.

It is a deep dark place where we are at.

By all means though we should draft more mids and medium forwards.

While having no one held to account for the Imbalance all the while trading out the currency we do have for less than it’s actually worth.

We are in a cycle of defeat every where.

 

[Loose_Cannon]

Short answer is "yes" with an "if", and the long answer is "no" with a "but".

If you consider when this all started with the culling of the four veterans in Boomer, NDS, Petrie, and Spud, then this has been one of the worst rebuilds of all time.

But... if you consider the rebuild started when Clarko walked through the door, the list balance is much better (still needs work), and the age profile has improved even if the results aren't showing yet. That's a hard thing to reconcile, as it feels like the team has perpetually been in rebuild mode and nothing is ever gained, but every time a new coach walked through the door the deck got shuffled and that's just the reality of the situation. The bad news is the one glaring issue with the side is the lack of tall timber available that is AFL ready won't really improve until some of the young KPP (W. Dawnson and M. Whitlock) are into year 3-4.

 

[Only Forwards]

There is no if.

This shit show started as aggressive reset and has gotten progressively worse with bad decision after bad decision.

 

[DocSholl]

Short answer is "yes" with an "if", and the long answer is "no" with a "but".

If you consider when this all started with the culling of the four veterans in Boomer, NDS, Petrie, and Spud, then this has been one of the worst rebuilds of all time.

But... if you consider the rebuild started when Clarko walked through the door, the list balance is much better (still needs work), and the age profile has improved even if the results aren't showing yet. That's a hard thing to reconcile, as it feels like the team has perpetually been in rebuild mode and nothing is ever gained, but every time a new coach walked through the door the deck got shuffled and that's just the reality of the situation. The bad news is the one glaring issue with the side is the lack of tall timber available that is AFL ready won't really improve until some of the young KPP (W. Dawnson and M. Whitlock) are into year 3-4.

I think the rebuild started at the end of 2020 and it has been mostly a disaster.

 

[Horizons_00]

We could have 20+ top 10 draft picks and good trades and it would make zero difference

The entire mentality of our club is weak and our environment is soft and cuddly. It is engrained and will not change under this administration (coaches, board, president, ceo)

 

[Mr north man]

We botched it when we decided Petrie, Boomer, NDS and Firrito were deemed redundant.

Harvey was the only one capable of playing AFL by then and could have played 2 more years as a forward pocket or Sub and got over 450 games.
It’s going be a Sad day next year when Pendlebury passes his record.
Mind you would have kept Petrie for insurance and play him when required.
The other 2 at that stage were VFL standard.