Is it better to not make the finals than to make it and get thrashed?

[GoodFootyNorth]

Not a troll directed at Essendon fans. Genuine question. Is it better to miss the finals than to make it and get thrashed in week one like the Bombers did tonight?

From a North perspective, I think recent finals debacles (particularly Geelong and Port in 2007) have scarred the players a little. The poor showing against a pretty ordinary Sydney side last year showed this. On the other hand, a young North got killed by WC in the 1993 elimination final and then went to to 6 years of finals and premiership success.

There must be examples from other clubs too. What do bombers fans think?

 

[bacon buster]

i see it as a postive.

you learn some hard lessons about your club, and some of the players playing.

i believe in the gameplan we are trying to implement, and i don't think tonight's result will change their way of thinking.

 

[OniAu]

Better to make it, you have a taste of it and you probably want it even more than ever. Experience is always a good thing, even though it was a hiding, they are still going to be better for it than any club like the tiges or dees who havent been in that situation for ages and still look a long way away.

Pies got a hiding in 06 and backed up the next year with a few wins.

 

[Kid A]

I'd prefer to make it and get thrashed because you learn about who can make it and who can't, from your club.

 

[bacon buster]

I'd prefer to make it and get thrashed because you learn about who can make it and who can't, from your club.

i agree. but the lessons are only useful if you put strong action into place.

if you do nothing with the lessons at all, then you go backwards.

 

[Snuka]

Lions lost by 80 points or so to Carlton in a semi in 2000 and the rest is history. Some knowledgeable supporters reckoned it steeled them and gave them extra motivation. You could prob find plenty of examples where it went the other way though.

 

[Thrawn]

Lions lost by 80 points or so to Carlton in a semi in 2000 and the rest is history. Some knowledgeable supporters reckoned it steeled them and gave them extra motivation. You could prob find plenty of examples where it went the other way though.

Actually, you should thank us for thrashing you at Princes Park the next year. That's where it all turned around, because prior to that you guys were struggling.

As a result, Essendon didn't win their 17th, and Collingwood were denied.

 

[The Panther]

Essendon have a lot of holes in their list.

 

[Damon_3388]

I'd like to think our belting at the hands of the Bulldogs in the '06 Elimination Final was a valuable experience for some of our younger brigade. Bloody disappointing at the time though.

 

[watermelonslice]

Always better to make the eight and get thrashed, I reckon. Let the players taste what it's like and let them learn from the experience.

 

[Broady Poker Tour]

Essendon have a lot of holes in their list.

I agree. I think however we have young players that may be able to fill the holes in the future. It is the great unknown.

If you were to ask me what it is that Essendon needs to draft or trade for there wouldn't be a straightforward answer.

Will Neagle make it? Will Gumbleton ever be fit?

We'd love a genuine gun-midfielder to help Jobe out, but which team wouldn't like another one of those? Could Prismall be that person with a full pre-season?

 

[Bomber32]

I would still prefer to make the eight and get pumped than not to make it at all. You have to experience these situations at some point in time and if a team does end up on the receiving end of a hiding, they learn some hard lessons and then have another crack at it.

 

[lethalselbow]

I'd prefer to make it and get thrashed because you learn about who can make it and who can't, from your club.

There's a long list of "can't" players on that Essadon list.

 

[adelaide_40]

It is always better to make it

 

[Zvim]

It is not a major problem if you go in and get thrashed IF you learn from it and make significant change so it doesn't happen again. If that loss starts a string of poor finals performances it is counter productive to make it.

People ignore the 9th team, no matter how many times they get thrashed during the year, if an elimination final team gets thrashed in the last game for the year I think it can create some mental scarring.

You just need to ensure you play a style of football that is conducive to holding up well in the finals, rather than a style that will win you H&A games.

I think the Dons are playing a good H&A style of football, you wouldn't want to rely on playing a lot of uncontested finals. 125 contested possessions to 89 is way off the mark. Also when you factor disposals after clangers you were effectively 3 to 4 guys short on the park in the middle, it isn't easy to win with that kind of variance.

 

[Don Muraco]

No , it is not.

 

[bacon buster]

yes, it is.

you guys have made finals nearly every year since 02, so you're used to it.

 

[Punchy Bassett]

Always better to make the finals when you can especially with a young list. Essendon will learn a lot from tonight that will hold them in good stead for the years to come.

 

[Big John]

Richmond finish 9th. I think its better to make the finals.

 

[Chicago1]

In the 1985 Qualifying Final, Hawthorn beat Footscray by 93 points. The next week in a Semi Final, Footscray beat North by 30 which sent them to the Preliminary Final where they lost to Hawthorn by only ten points(Damn you, Leigh Matthews! And you, too, Brad Hardie!). Looks like the Bulldogs learned a bit from their first huge loss to the Hawks, but just not enough.

 

[And_ROOS]

i agree. but the lessons are only useful if you put strong action into place.

if you do nothing with the lessons at all, then you go backwards.

And how do these young players learn to deal with playing under finals pressure at a hostile location against quality opposition if they finish 9th each season?

 

[Leather Poisoning]

This is going to sound like a troll but it isn't.

For this to be the learning experience it should be Essendon needed their captain out there, pulling the guys together, telling them to keep their heads up, making sure everyone was still doing what they were out there to do.

They were never going to win, but it's hard to see what they can get out of that spanking. Knights looked stunned, frustrated and really upset.

 

[hardway]

Always best to be a part of it. But like Clarkson said teams with 10 wins dont really deserve or belong to be there.

 

[Simon_Nesbit]

Yes and no.

There are plenty of negatives (mental scarring, the "we're not up to it" thinking), and individual players will probably need some mental management in coping with it - everything in AFL is about building up the finals, and you've just failed pretty majorly.

There are however quite a few positives out of it. Playing a young side, the Bombers got some vital experience on what it's like to play in a 'hostile' environment in front of a packed crowd. For them in particular it's probably not as important as for a smaller club like Bulldogs/Kangaroos/Demons/etc - as they get a couple of big games like that a year.

Missing half-a-dozen or more senior players puts added focus on the younger kids - it's a fact of AFL life that >50% kids u/21 aren't really up to it yet (some never will be). The senior players (who should have greater mental resilience) may use this as a motivational tool for their own pre-season - feeling they've let the club down (either through injury and/or suspension, or just general spudness.)

A lot also depends on the way you were beaten. In that regards, Essendon really were 'thrashed'. In the entire night, they only had maybe 10-15 good possession chains. Their contested efforts were very poor (though I thought Fletcher was good), and they were spanked around the contest. Not really suprising with no ruck.

My worry is when the coach has that 'shellshocked' look about him - AC was the same at times with us - when half your team isn't out there, it can be hard to 'pull a rabbit out'....but you have to exude confidence in yourself and your decisions - as others will feed off it.

If the media pounce on this (being so pro-essendon IMO unlikely), then it could also provide some "us vs them" motivation...plenty of time for things to simmer and push players through pre-season.

So in summary, kids get experience, older blokes get motivation, a few players shortcomings are shown up.

 

[blitzer]

It was ugly last night but i reckon the experience will have done some of the young blokes the world of good for the future. The vast majority of that list playing had never played a game of finals before and when we are really challenging (hopefully over the next couple of years), you really do need that finals experienced core. We won't know what effect this match really has (if any) until next year rolls around anyway, its all speculation.

Also as bad as we looked last night, there are quite a few ins that we can get back next year compared to the 22 that played last night.