Jack Anthony = Forward

[September Action]

Is it just me or do others too, wonder why everyone (particularly on this site) keeps expecting JA to go back eventually.

OK, so he was trained up for the back half, but the guy has done what no other Collingwood forward seems to be able to do - kick straight at goal! He has 24.3 from 11 matches this year. Compare that to A Rocca who has 16.10 from 8 matches, or Trav with 39.24 from 22. Why would we even consider sending JA back when he is showing so much?

People talk of Rusling, who I suspect will never get on the park, Reid and Dawes, who whilst full of potential, have showed only glimpses so far. JA might just be the one!

 

[smiddaz123]

Chances are you would've said the same thing about Clement too.

 

[September Action]

I see what you're getting at and maybe it's the the best move in the long term. It's just that we've had so many forwards who just can't slot goals. This guy seems a natural.

 

[mdc]

It's not just you. It seems that after reading "John Anthony is the next Clement" on his profile for 2 years, people had pidgeon-holed him before he ever played a game.

As long as he's kicking goals, he must stay up forward. It's not even a question imo.

Chances are you would've said the same thing about Clement too.

Clement's best effort in any season if 1.3/game, which was in his 3rd season. It's the only season where he actually played as a forward. Anthony's kicked 2/game in his debut season, and played every game as a forward.

Really, people need to put that comparison out of their mind. If anyone's going to be "the new Clement", it's Harry.

 

[smiddaz123]

I see what you're getting at and maybe it's the the best move in the long term. It's just that we've had so many forwards who just can't slot goals. This guy seems a natural.

IMO we've always lacked killer rebound from the backline too, since Clement left. Someone who could shut down an elite medium forward and collect 15-20 quality disposals and take our kick ins.

Heath Shaw's disposal isn't close to being as good as Clement's. Anthony's is. When we're using Toovey on medium forwards, it spells out to me that we need another player back there who can do a job.

Dawes' kicking style looks awkward, but lets face it, it gets the job done.
Cloke is improving, although he's still shaky, admittedly.
Medhurst, Davis, Dick are all superb finishers.

I think down back is the position for Anthony still.

I do concede it's refreshing to feel genuinely relaxed for once, when I see a Pies player walk back to have a shot from 40m out. Doesn't happen often

 

[September Action]

Chances are you would've said the same thing about Clement too.

Maybe if Clement had played up forward, we'd have had 2 premierships in '02 and '03!

Seriously though, Hines needs to address our lack of "superboots". Everyone here laments our lack of quality disposal (doesn't help when Dids drinks himself into oblivion). That's why I like JA up forward doing damage where it counts most...on the scoreboard.

 

[chunk_master]

Of course keep Jacky boy up forward, even though first thoughts were he'd fill the hole left with the departure of the great jimmy clement, but plans change!

get some other kid to fill that spot... its great to know the balls goin through the big stick when its in someone other than didaks hands!

or maybe joshy fraser

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

In 2002-3 we really struggled with predictability and total lack of versatility - Clement Presti and Wakes at the back, Rocca and Tarrant up front. You never saw any of them play at the other end of the ground. We paid the price for that in the 03 GF when, without Rocca, we were unwilling or unable to play Clement or Wakelin forward, so we started with Kinnear and J Cloke. Rocca played ruck occasionally and Fraser went forward occasionally - thats where our versatility started and ended.

Hopefully in 2008-9-10 we'll learn from those mistakes and not pigeon hole players too soon. Reid Brown Dawes Maxwell and Anthony in particular need to be able to play at both ends of the ground. I'd like Reid to develop into a back-up ruckman as well. With O'Brien and Rusling, I dont expect the same versatility. They are what they are.

 

[conodie05]

there is no reason why he can't play forward and back. Silvagni did it albeit he was predominately a backman. Bradshaw does it.

bearing in mind Warney was at the AIS as a batsman. JA could be the first backman to kick 100.

 

[well left]

I have always been an advocate of Anthony going back next year when we have a full list (fingers crossed). As others have mentioned, Anthony, Brown and O'Brien provide great flexibility and the rebound from Harry and skills of Anthony allows Heater to play the small pocket role if need be.

My other reason was that Jack still seems to be kicking goals in a non-KP type of way i.e opportunist type goals and he also seems to struggle sometimes within the structure and gets in the way of the other forwards. This is simply as he has never played as a forward.

That said, the question now needs to be asked - if he can kick 2 goals a game without really knowing what he is doing, what could he be capable of with some forward tuition?

The solution? I'm not really sure but I think we need to give Ben Reid some defensive tuition and experience at the same time as giving Jack forward tuition and see what the best result is. We may be able to mix and match these two to suit our needs.

 

[Sloth]

Totally agree with the OP. Leave him forward until he gets the yips. No-brainer really.

PS what does his old-man say on the matter?

 

[blackjack44]

For those of you that wern't aware: JA played his whole junior career as a forward, kicking bags and topping the goal kickers list. Even at the development squads for the Knights he played as a forward, and managed a couple of games as a 16 y.o playing U/18 TAC footy as a forward. In 2005, the Knights had Ben McKinley (WCE), Nick Lynch (VFL), Paul Currie (SYD Rookie) and Paul Colbert (VFL) all top age players that filled the spots up forward. JA as a bottom age player, was thrown down the back end for the first time to develope his game, had a fantastic season then went onto being drafted that year as we all know. Even though he has had the elite training of becoming a potential AFL backman for the past few seasons, he will always be a natural forward. Good to see him kicking a few too.

 

[3066]

For those of you that wern't aware: JA played his whole junior career as a forward, kicking bags and topping the goal kickers list. Even at the development squads for the Knights he played as a forward, and managed a couple of games as a 16 y.o playing U/18 TAC footy as a forward. In 2005, the Knights had Ben McKinley (WCE), Nick Lynch (VFL), Paul Currie (SYD Rookie) and Paul Colbert (VFL) all top age players that filled the spots up forward. JA as a bottom age player, was thrown down the back end for the first time to develope his game, had a fantastic season then went onto being drafted that year as we all know. Even though he has had the elite training of becoming a potential AFL backman for the past few seasons, he will always be a natural forward. Good to see him kicking a few too.

ED ZACHERY!! .... and thanks for extra info too. His old man actually mentions it http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/showthread.php?t=466831&highlight=forward so I dunno why people still want him down back next year?

For me it's simple. If someone's in the forward line kicking goals then don't move them! Add to the fact his junior history, it's his 1st year playing seniors and his amazing conversion rate he is no doubt a legend in the making. If you think I'm being far fetched just take a look at one of the bravest goals of the year when he gets kicked in the face by the ball, begins to go off but takes the mark and bangs it from 50 on a tight angle.... then goes off in pain. WOW!

It's easy to see why the Collingwood folk (aka MM) wanted to groom him as a Jimmy Clement type replacement. Physical size, great kick and from the interviews I've heard him in a very bright articulate young fella with loads of potential. But thats changed now. He has shown what he can do up front and to be fair to the kid let him crave his own path. I don't have any problems with him pitch kitting down back if need be. Cloke had to do it against the Eagles (05) when Wakes went off and did an awesome job helping us win that day so JA might do the same thing too..... but at the moment the reality is he is kicking goals!!! Move Rusling on the wing or something? Put Ben on the wing or down back?

 

[Quicky]

I have always been an advocate of Anthony going back next year when we have a full list (fingers crossed). As others have mentioned, Anthony, Brown and O'Brien provide great flexibility and the rebound from Harry and skills of Anthony allows Heater to play the small pocket role if need be.

My other reason was that Jack still seems to be kicking goals in a non-KP type of way i.e opportunist type goals and he also seems to struggle sometimes within the structure and gets in the way of the other forwards. This is simply as he has never played as a forward.

That said, the question now needs to be asked - if he can kick 2 goals a game without really knowing what he is doing, what could he be capable of with some forward tuition?

The solution? I'm not really sure but I think we need to give Ben Reid some defensive tuition and experience at the same time as giving Jack forward tuition and see what the best result is. We may be able to mix and match these two to suit our needs.

^^ Agree with this.

I think he'll be more value to us down back, but able to be swung forward.

 

[well left]

For those of you that wern't aware: JA played his whole junior career as a forward, kicking bags and topping the goal kickers list. Even at the development squads for the Knights he played as a forward, and managed a couple of games as a 16 y.o playing U/18 TAC footy as a forward. In 2005, the Knights had Ben McKinley (WCE), Nick Lynch (VFL), Paul Currie (SYD Rookie) and Paul Colbert (VFL) all top age players that filled the spots up forward. JA as a bottom age player, was thrown down the back end for the first time to develope his game, had a fantastic season then went onto being drafted that year as we all know. Even though he has had the elite training of becoming a potential AFL backman for the past few seasons, he will always be a natural forward. Good to see him kicking a few too.

Thanks for that! I did not know that.

I will amend my earlier post then to state that JA has not played or trained much as a forward in his time at Collingwood and would not be as aware of our forward line structure and where to run as other forwards. The fact he has played forward as a junior will have made the transition a little easier though.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

I think we should keep him as a designated swing man, so whether he's getting time up forward or down back, I'm still happy. JAJH sees his best position as a rebounding back flanker, so I don't think they're exactly up in arms about us "pigeon-holing" him as a backman. At any rate, while he's making the most of his opportunities up forward and the structure's working okay, I think he'll spend most of his time up there. He might spend more time down back in the preseason, who knows? Keep his versatility, I say.

 

[tess]

I don't care where he plays as long as he NEVER shaves his head again.......

 

[Magpies696]

Why change somthing when it is not broke

 

[shawthing09]

I'll say that as a foward he doesn't have what it takes to beat a defender often enough be a real power house. Once he gets the ball he uses it well. I am almost certain that a side would be happy putting a lesser defender to go one on one with JA and him kick 2 and 2 assist for the match whilst Cloke and whoever else is thrown foward has to deal with others zoning off. His great when he gets it and will be a great swing man but for a foward you need to have what it takes to A) get the ball enough to do real damage and B) keep the defence sweating on you and making sure they stick to you and don't zone off. It's not his fault his just a tad too short, not quick enough and not strong enough.

We are much shorter on KPB's and rebound out of defence then we are on foward prospects and JA is both a very versatile backmen and a great kick who can offer us great rebound. We won't lose much by having him go back and we will gain much more then we lose by having him in our defence.

 

[targett]

I see what you're getting at and maybe it's the the best move in the long term. It's just that we've had so many forwards who just can't slot goals. This guy seems a natural.

JA may have been our next big thing down back but my goodness can this bloke kick goals and straight.!! he is forward to stay and there is nothing better than watching a forward who can drill em from any where. JA our newest super boot

 

[BIG_H!]

Rusling & J.A are the two to watch imo. If Reid figures out how to kick during the brake that may help his chances. Dawes just hasnt been getting the footy enough, looks a bit nervous. ;]

 

[King Woodie]

I'll say that as a foward he doesn't have what it takes to beat a defender often enough be a real power house. Once he gets the ball he uses it well. I am almost certain that a side would be happy putting a lesser defender to go one on one with JA and him kick 2 and 2 assist for the match whilst Cloke and whoever else is thrown foward has to deal with others zoning off. His great when he gets it and will be a great swing man but for a foward you need to have what it takes to A) get the ball enough to do real damage and B) keep the defence sweating on you and making sure they stick to you and don't zone off. It's not his fault his just a tad too short, not quick enough and not strong enough.

We are much shorter on KPB's and rebound out of defence then we are on foward prospects and JA is both a very versatile backmen and a great kick who can offer us great rebound. We won't lose much by having him go back and we will gain much more then we lose by having him in our defence.

I agree with this post, and with Sampler's previously.

Anthony for mine isn't a good enough mark on the lead to become a lead-up forward (most of his goals have come from non-"lead straight and mark" situations - and hasn't shown enough of an ability to outmark one on one. Either of these (preferably both) are required to become a very good hey forward.

He is more valuable down back in a key role (where we will have a deficiency) than in a key forward role (where we have surplus). There can be little doubt that he presents as a terrific "Hunter style" swingman.

Having said all this, it is hard to argue with 24 goals 3 behinds from 11 games. One thing is for sure, no matter which end his future lies, he is fast becoming a critical part of the team.

 

[ClarkeM]

Jack is playing extremely well up forward. His accuracy this year is an amazing feat, 24-3 and 5 last games with 12 goals straight. Watch out for JA against the Saints. I feel a 4 goal+ game.

 

[Dave The Man]

Clement Kicked 5 Goal for Freo vs Essendon.

Video Here:

[youtube]teH8qxXHf5w[/youtube]