Jacob Surjan's status

[Peck]

Hmm. We might actually be able to get something half decent for Surjan if he is put up for trade.

Clubs like Carlton, or Hawthorn probably wouldn't mind a fantastic shutdown defender. Who knows maybe he would be able to get that elusive AA selection.

 

[Ford Fairlane]

Last year the Herald Sun claimed Port offered Surjan during the Walker trade negotiations.

 

[Peck]

Last year the Herald Sun claimed Port offered Surjan during the Walker trade negotiations.

Hmm. Doubt we would get anything good from Carlton in that case, as I suspected anyway of course.

Hawthorn are the club I'd be aiming at. They paid a pretty fair price it seems for Burgoyne. Maybe a little in our favour.

 

[Portmanteau]

No rumour or inside info, just observation - he might be finished at the PAFC.

I hope I am wrong.

Look I can't agree with that, at least I hope it's not the case.

We've put up with seasons of mediocrity with a lot of currently listed players. Surjan has probably been in our top 3 overall performers across 2009 and 2010 when not injured (he was out for an extended period last year, right?) If anyone is entitled to have a bit of a down patch, it would be him.

Part of managing a list is cutting the mediocity and getting the most out of the players who have shown something. And we know Surjan has got 'it'.

 

[reCOGnise]

Talk about a reactive call, the old saying, yo all know it. Form temporary. Class permanent.

Would be devo if he was traded, he bleeds for the club, he has barely been given a chance this year, plenty of the season left too!!

 

[C4[2]Yo`DooR]

So what sort of trade would be fair for Surjan?

 

[tealpower]

Re: Controversy Watch

Whether there is substance to the gist of his article is another matter. But none of those players was controversially cut from that squad, not even Surjan who doesn't look fit and whose performance on Yarran before the bye was awful.

Controversy or not why the coaches have persisted in playing an excellent defender with a questionable pre season returning from a knee operation as a forward doesn't seem to me like it's the smartest player management/player welfare. Despite whatever we're sold, Pittard and Logan aren't in the same class as Surj when it comes to defending. To compound that the staff have been sending a career forward in Motlop into a porous defence for questionable results (especially in light of Porthos rightfully identifying our flanker centric drafting). In my opinion our coaches are scratching the barrel for ideas and are already going down the path that most supporters chastised Mark Williams and his staff for post 2005.

It's interesting times ahead for our club and I dare say as much as the player list needs to be overhauled our administration and key football people namely the football operations department needs an AFL intervention to suit. That's where I see the great PAFC/SANFL/AFL controversy ahead.

 

[Ford Fairlane]

Re: Controversy Watch

Controversy or not why the coaches have persisted in playing an excellent defender with a questionable pre season returning from a knee operation as a forward doesn't seem to me like it's the smartest player management/player welfare. Despite whatever we're sold, Pittard and Logan aren't in the same class as Surj when it comes to defending. To compound that the staff have been sending a career forward in Motlop into a porous defence for questionable results (especially in light of Porthos rightfully identifying our flanker centric drafting). In my opinion our coaches are scratching the barrel for ideas and are already going down the path that most supporters chastised Mark Williams and his staff for post 2005.

It's interesting times ahead for our club and I dare say as much as the player list needs to be overhauled our administration and key football people namely the football operations department needs an AFL intervention to suit. That's where I see the great PAFC/SANFL/AFL controversy ahead.

This really is a discussion for another thread, so I'll move it here.

The thing that's bothered me with Surjan is that since he's returned to SANFL footy he's hardly made an impression at that level. I can understand him being played on ball to get the k's into his legs to prepare for the demands of AFL. When he played midfield a few years back after switching from Centrals he could get 40 possessions a game. Now he gets 20 and just lurks between lines waiting for the receive. The workrate just isn't there.

When a player comes back from surgery and rehab out of shape he has to demand selection and he simply hasn't done this. He did a solid job on Johncock in the showdown (for the 2.5 quarters he lasted) but was torched by Yarran two weeks ago. At the moment people are calling for his selection based on reputation. Didn't everyone complain when Choco did that?

 

[oporto]

Re: Controversy Watch

This really is a discussion for another thread, so I'll move it here.

The thing that's bothered me with Surjan is that since he's returned to SANFL footy he's hardly made an impression at that level. I can understand him being played on ball to get the k's into his legs to prepare for the demands of AFL. When he played midfield a few years back after switching from Centrals he could get 40 possessions a game. Now he gets 20 and just lurks between lines waiting for the receive. The workrate just isn't there.

When a player comes back from surgery and rehab out of shape he has to demand selection and he simply hasn't done this. He did a solid job on Johncock in the showdown (for the 2.5 quarters he lasted) but was torched by Yarran two weeks ago. At the moment people are calling for his selection based on reputation. Didn't everyone complain when Choco did that?

Been involved with elite sport for a while. Elite sportspeople dont go from elite to non elite without good reason. Throw in sala, ebo, pearce, bobby, both cornes (although one is ending his career) why are they all of a sudden, all not elite? Common theme here. Different messages to different individuals I suspect. Team disintegration rather than team building I fear. If i was a betting man, would have a rough idea of which players have been told they are no longer wanted.Often its not the direct communication rather the lack of any. Keep pushing negative messages on the individual and the workplace becomes tough. The level of money a player receive becomes irrelevent because the workplace becomes intolerable. We are in dire need of sports psychology support. For some, trade them. Removing them from the negativity of the environment will aide all parties.

 

[tealpower]

Re: Controversy Watch

This really is a discussion for another thread, so I'll move it here.

The thing that's bothered me with Surjan is that since he's returned to SANFL footy he's hardly made an impression at that level. I can understand him being played on ball to get the k's into his legs to prepare for the demands of AFL. When he played midfield a few years back after switching from Centrals he could get 40 possessions a game. Now he gets 20 and just lurks between lines waiting for the receive. The workrate just isn't there.

When a player comes back from surgery and rehab out of shape he has to demand selection and he simply hasn't done this. He did a solid job on Johncock in the showdown (for the 2.5 quarters he lasted) but was torched by Yarran two weeks ago. At the moment people are calling for his selection based on reputation. Didn't everyone complain when Choco did that?

I guess that all comes down to instructions and the opinion that Port Adelaide probably rushed him back earlier than he should have been from his knee operation. As we know running fitness and football fitness couldn't be further apart as polar opposites. I'd hazard the thought that most umpires are fitter and can run harder than AFL players but ask them to run like a footballer and they'd be out on their feet at half time. I have a sneaking suspicion that Surj is in that boat this season as well as being asked to play a different role, one which he isn't accustomed to playing. You're probably right with the work rate comment which is disappointing in a sense given we've seen what he is capable of.

Good players don't become average players in the prime of their career overnight. I'm sure his work rate needs to be improved but I'm also a little skeptical when it comes to our player management given the collective issues Port Adelaide has had in running out games in 2011.

Perhaps the lack of funding to direct into our medical services and player welfare has begun to rear it's ugly head. It'll be interesting to see how Captain Courageous Cassisi does in Perth over the weekend.

 

[Forzaport]

Re: Controversy Watch

I think you're painting with a too thick brush (Oporto). It's inconceivable that the likes of Bobby would not be wanted at the club. The likes of ebo, Pearce and Kane have been frustrating well before this year. The surprises are surj and sal however they have both had interrupted pre-seasons and have been nothing more than good SANFL players this year. The only one of the lot that was elite was Chad. If Daniel Motlop can get the message and adapt surely the others can as well, otherwise we'll just continue to paint over the cracks which was a key gripe with choco

 

[Ford Fairlane]

Those are all fair points for discussion - altho like Forza (above) I don't believe all those players belong in the same boat. I certainly don't think Surj has suddenly become an ordinary footballer. There are clearly issues that we can only mostly speculate about that have affected his output. How's the saying go form is temporary but class is permanent.

 

[b0ydman]

Re: Controversy Watch

Controversy or not why the coaches have persisted in playing an excellent defender with a questionable pre season returning from a knee operation as a forward doesn't seem to me like it's the smartest player management/player welfare. Despite whatever we're sold, Pittard and Logan aren't in the same class as Surj when it comes to defending. To compound that the staff have been sending a career forward in Motlop into a porous defence for questionable results (especially in light of Porthos rightfully identifying our flanker centric drafting). In my opinion our coaches are scratching the barrel for ideas and are already going down the path that most supporters chastised Mark Williams and his staff for post 2005.

It's interesting times ahead for our club and I dare say as much as the player list needs to be overhauled our administration and key football people namely the football operations department needs an AFL intervention to suit. That's where I see the great PAFC/SANFL/AFL controversy ahead.

A lot of good points in there

Havingt seen this in real time I can't help but think that the coaches are doing a choco and kicking the can down the road (making it up as they go along)

Big clean out needed.

 

[b0ydman]

Re: Controversy Watch

Been involved with elite sport for a while. Elite sportspeople dont go from elite to non elite without good reason. Throw in sala, ebo, pearce, bobby, both cornes (although one is ending his career) why are they all of a sudden, all not elite? Common theme here. Different messages to different individuals I suspect. Team disintegration rather than team building I fear. If i was a betting man, would have a rough idea of which players have been told they are no longer wanted.Often its not the direct communication rather the lack of any. Keep pushing negative messages on the individual and the workplace becomes tough. The level of money a player receive becomes irrelevent because the workplace becomes intolerable. We are in dire need of sports psychology support. For some, trade them. Removing them from the negativity of the environment will aide all parties.

Very good points, but I beg to differ.

I would suggest that if they can see their stock losing value in the eyes of the coach, they would be trying harder and harder each week, and NOT playing a team game, not playing to instruction (for this is the excuse we give so many underperformers "oh, the only reason Hartlett isn't chasing is becase he must have been told he can't stretch out" or "Pearce must be instructed to guard space not go in and tackle")

I would suggest that if they are picked and played at senior level they would be doing absolutely everything they possibly could to raise their own trade value in the market. 30 possession games a case in point. Tackles, Evading tackles, scoring goals, putting the body in

I'd proffer it may be precisely the opposite. They know they are contracted and believe they are safe.

For players plodding in the 2s like Marlon, quite possible he has lost motivation, as he isn't given a show on the AFL stage and see others walk in and get a gold card on the basis of their being given 50 games to show something? (ie has he_really_been given the opportunity Oshea Jacobs and Pittard have been given?) Marlon may have, but I can't help but think there are players not selected who if given 10 games might at least show something. Lobbe anyone?

But these others, no. If they feel alienated and pencilled, when they are/ were/ will be given game time, I'd expect to see a whole lot more that their output, if for no other reason than to spite the coaching and match selection committee

having seen the other teams lately, and north today etc, I just dont believe these are good players. I think our players are really quite ordinary apart from a couple of them and by and large they play to their physical and mental ability

plus they are naturally lazy burglars. dont work hard enough etc

 

[Macca19]

Re: Controversy Watch

Marlon has proven he is just SANFL reserves standard. Slow, poor decision making, poor skills, cant find the football and has zero defensive side to his game.

 

[oporto]

Re: Controversy Watch

Very good points, but I beg to differ.

I disagree with almost every point you have made but respect your right to an opinion.

 

[Doctor Feel]

Jacob didn't play for the Magpies today. I suggest he is a travelling emergency. Which is stupid if we arent gonna play him.

 

[PatientMental]

Blissid.... Where is he from?
We always take the WA boys home when we go over there as emergencies.