South Am Javier Milei. Here we go again.

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Satan said:
They need messi not milei

This nutter wants falklands too, last time went well
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Given the population overwhelmingly voted to stay with the UK, he has no legal or moral justification to invade and the Brits would easily best them so any sane leader would just talk rather than try anything

However he isn't sane, needs a distraction and relies on the same loan shark that has helped to fund and approved Putins and Hamas actions to try and weaken/distract Taiwan's potential Allies.


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randyzany said:
You could argue that Australia (currently being strong armed by China economically), even India prior to their independence from England are/were Banana Republics and as well as most tiny European countries that rely on the protection of the bigger European powers along with the US.
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Excellent post overall, I just don't know if the examples you're using in this paragraph are all that valid. You could argue that China did Australia a favour in some ways with the agricultural produce restrictions because it encouraged a diversification away from China as a market. They certainly don't have the dominant position on our economy or the military projection into our territory to make us a Banana Republic. India was a formal colony rather than a Banana Republic. And are those European countries economically dominated by Western multinationals? I suppose it could be argued that the EU is a vehicle for economic domination, but you could also say that the benefits have flowed two ways and it isn't outright exploitation.
 
Satan said:
Him and hollands election is a worry if trump gets up again the world is screwed
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Yes, fascism uber alles if the Trumpster gets in. World staring to look like the 1930's in Europe. Whose left to be the good guys this time?
 
geoffjennings79 said:
If Trump is re-elected next year (and reduced Western support for Ukraine, particularly from US, hands ascendency back to Russia in that conflict), and nutters like this are in control elsewhere - time to roll out the old doomsday clock again, dust it off, set it to a few minutes past midnight, and pack it all in.

And let's face it - for all the technological advances in recent decades, the human race hasn't progressed beyond killing each other, or at the least oppressing minorities, for no real reason. And there was a glimmer of hope there at times too... 😟

Edit: meant to say 'reduced' western support...
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Welcome to the black pill on human nature lol. TBH though we were f#$%^ either way. The establishment or populist types. Both f#ck the middle and lower classes and powerless over. The populist types will just do it faster.
 
rank and file said:
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Whilst everyone’s crying about the end of the world like it’s 2016 I think we need to have some perspective and realise that if you take some electoral results out of context it doesn’t represent some broader trend.

Argentina has a legislative system. After these elections Milei’s party doesn’t control the lower house, they’ll need support of parties that are very centrist. In the upper house the leftist Peronist opposition still has a majority so there won’t be radical change as he wants.

Germany - AfD may surge to about 20% but the Centre right (CDU) and centre left (SPD) have stated that under no circumstances will they go into coalition with them and will go into coalition with each other first. Do zero chance of the AfD getting any power

Spain - leftist parties won, albeit needed to go into coalition with the catalans but still could form government, the right couldn’t form government, the far right (Vox) dropped support. This pissed off Spanish nationalists and they protested but doesn’t seem to be a groundswell of support.

Netherlands - Wilders party has the highest number of seats but the centre right parties have said that he’ll need to become ‘Geert Mild-ers’ for them to agree to a coalition with him. Some of the centrist groups may align with the centre left over Wilders. So no ‘Nexit’.

USA - trump leads Biden, but let’s see after next year’s trials. In all mid term and special elections since Roe vs Wade was overturned Democrats have outperformed expected results.

Finland, Sweden - centre right coalitions with some far right elements. However in Finland the far right has caused controversy and friction within the coalition and analysts don’t expect it to last. The “right wing” Finnish government also produced this piece of anti racism legislation which could’ve been written by the Australian Greens:

www.politico.eu

Scandal-ridden Finnish government presents anti-racism agenda

The statement includes a series of measures to promote ‘equality, gender equality and non-discrimination,’ including the criminalization of Holocaust denial.
www.politico.eu www.politico.eu

In other parts of the world Poland just cast off a conservative right government for the centre left led by the ex EU head Tusk. Bulgaria elected centrist pro EU liberals. Brazil removed a far right populist for a socialist. Czechs elected a pro EU pro NATO President over one who was accused of being friendly to Russia.

Italy elected Meloni, who was described as ‘far right’ and excited a lot of populists. However she has governed as a pro EU moderate who hasn’t cracked down on migrants as much as she said which has upset a lot of right populists.

And the biggest certainty. The Tories in the UK will be obliterated by (now really a centrist) Labour Party in the next 12 months. So you can cherry pick some results to make it seem right populists are surging worldwide, in reality the results are more nuanced.
 
CD Xbow said:
Yes, fascism uber alles if the Trumpster gets in. World staring to look like the 1930's in Europe. Whose left to be the good guys this time?
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Very much like 1930s, world generally oblivious to the threat and worn out from an economic crisis (COVID/GFC); a damaging war (Iraq) creating a lot of resistance to war; significant internal group pushing for appeasemwnt at all costs: Isolationist US allowing hostile action; repeated acts of aggression ignored with threats of don't do that again not being matched with action (Bhutan, India, SCS Islands, Hong Kong, Xuighars, harassment of shipping including sinking civilian fishing vessels) multiple major dictatorships (one of which plans to backstab Russia after using them initially).

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To the people punching the air in ecstasy at Geert Wilders:

But if he is to become prime minister, he will have to convince potential coalition partners he is willing to compromise on long-standing calls to withdraw military support for Ukraine, slash spending on climate goals and scrap constitutionally-protected religious freedoms.

He needs backing from at least two more moderate parties to reach the required majority of 76 seats in the 150-seat parliament to form a right-wing government.
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Chief said:
To the people punching the air in ecstasy at Geert Wilders:
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Some have said he’ll need to become “Geert Mild-ers” to become PM.

Govern as a radical and the centrists remove support and align with the centre left. It’s happening in Finland. Which is why European governments with far fight elements generally don’t last long. We hear about them a lot in world media when they get elected, we don’t hear about them is they temper their rhetoric and become moderate, nor do we hear about them if their coalitions fragment and are replaced with moderates.
 

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This is what happens when a resources rich nation like Argentina has been almost destroyed by socialist left policies for years. The insanity is not coming from Milei, it was already there and the people have decided enough is enough. The country has the second-largest shale gas and fourth-largest shale oil reserves in the world, as well as abundant solar and wind energy resources. Argentina features the third-largest proven lithium reserves, after Chile and Australia, and is expected to become a leading exporter over the next decade. However, the country has been on its knees for decades. Argentina once stood among the world's 10 richest nations per capita. But since the 1950s, few countries have spent more years in recession. Today, more than four in 10 Argentines live in poverty. Their inflation rate is 143%. No wonder Milei is a little hot under the collar. The media will have a field ay with Milei, but who really is to blame for his landslide victory?
 
schneebly111 said:
Italy elected Meloni, who was described as ‘far right’ and excited a lot of populists. However she has governed as a pro EU moderate who hasn’t cracked down on migrants as much as she said which has upset a lot of right populists.

And the biggest certainty. The Tories in the UK will be obliterated by (now really a centrist) Labour Party in the next 12 months. So you can cherry pick some results to make it seem right populists are surging worldwide, in reality the results are more nuanced.
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Good post. I think the UK is actually a harbinger of what's to come for many conservative parties who will attain power. People like Boris Johnson campaigned on the promise of "taking back control", which was a dog-whistle to the public on lower immigration, and yet immigration numbers are actually higher now than they were before Brexit, because conservative politicians support money and big business above all else, and big business will not let them reduce immigration because it supports their business model of having more consumers and more competition for wages.

It's clear Meloni has similarly been co-opted by the forces of capital into being more moderate, it's like a right-wing counterpart to Syriza becoming significantly more moderate when they entered power. I see this same pattern being replicated in Sweden and wherever else the far-right get into power next.

For Milei though, correct me if I'm wrong but immigration isn't a serious issue for Argentina. He probably goes the Liz Truss route instead, but more slowly since he doesn't have enough parliamentary support. May not be too great a culture warrior since he's already declared he doesn't care one way or another about gay people, probably because global capital has realised gays can be a useful market for goods and services with their higher average spending power.
 
Chief said:
Yeah because socialism generally enriches a small elite at the expense of the poor.

Sure.
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You're being sarcastic but that is exactly what it does. It may not be the stated aim of socialism but has inevitably been the result every time it is implemented. Please don't make me slap you around with a history book chief.
 
JackFlash said:
This is what happens when a resources rich nation like Argentina has been almost destroyed by socialist left policies for years. The insanity is not coming from Milei, it was already there and the people have decided enough is enough. The country has the second-largest shale gas and fourth-largest shale oil reserves in the world, as well as abundant solar and wind energy resources. Argentina features the third-largest proven lithium reserves, after Chile and Australia, and is expected to become a leading exporter over the next decade. However, the country has been on its knees for decades. Argentina once stood among the world's 10 richest nations per capita. But since the 1950s, few countries have spent more years in recession. Today, more than four in 10 Argentines live in poverty. Their inflation rate is 143%. No wonder Milei is a little hot under the collar. The media will have a field ay with Milei, but who really is to blame for his landslide victory?
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The Peronists certainly contributed to Argentina's poor economic performance, but I'm not sure the right wing junta did any better, though it dropped tens of thousands of people into the South Atlantic for a bit of swim. The Peronists borrowed many of their economic ideas from Mussolini, sort of putting the national into socialism. I really think your socialism explanation is simplistic and biased through a political lens. Argentina's economic failures have often been compared to Australian success, as both countries shared many features - large, resource rich southern hemisphere countries, colonised by the major European power of the day. Both countries got rich quickly. The countries different trajectories have been of great interest to scholars and one factor seems fundamental, Spanish versus British institutional/cultural DNA. This has become a reasonably common opinion and is expressed in this article:
www.afr.com

Thank Britain for why Australia isn’t Argentina

Trying to understand Argentina’s failure should also make Australians think more deeply about the sources of this country’s success.
www.afr.com www.afr.com

British DNA brought political stability, rule of law, acceptance of democratic process, a certain respect for human rights etc. Spain was not even a democracy until 1977 and has had it's own battles with despots. No surprise Spain's colonies would follow the same route. The different colonial DNA led to very different outcomes. Yes, there are other factors, but that's the primary one. I would argue poor governance has been a feature of South American governments from the left & right, which would support this idea.
 
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FireKrakouer said:
You're being sarcastic but that is exactly what it does. It may not be the stated aim of socialism but has inevitably been the result every time it is implemented. Please don't make me slap you around with a history book chief.
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A tired trope

An example of an enriched elite class forming in every socialist state please?
 
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