"Lay Down" Kenny

[KUNG FU]

Never been a Kenny fan. He is an admirable footballer cos of his consistent effort and because he plays probably the hardest role in footy. But he seriously lacks the skills. I'd probably still have him in the team, but he's a fringe player imo.

 

[jenny61_99]

Never been a Kenny fan. He is an admirable footballer cos of his consistent effort and because he plays probably the hardest role in footy. But he seriously lacks the skills. I'd probably still have him in the team, but he's a fringe player imo.

But according to Craig, he's a fringe player that has a designated role to play every week. If he is still in the team, odds are he's doing what is asked of him.

 

[Mad Dog]

Kenny has his physical issues but it's too late to fix those now.

The biggest thing that Ken is suffereing from ATM is being the tallest fwd.

Ken is a great foil - focus he is not....

 

[KUNG FU]

But according to Craig, he's a fringe player that has a designated role to play every week. If he is still in the team, odds are he's doing what is asked of him.

I don't disagree that he's filling a designated role. But I think Craig would reasonably expect him to improve his disposal and take stronger marks.

 

[-WWJD-]

The worrying thing for me was in the final term when he had a shot from 40 out, he was more concerned about telling the rest of the boys to set up the zone than concentrating on kicking the goal. Jeez Kenny, a bit of confidence doesn't go astray.

 

[tribey]

The worrying thing for me was in the final term when he had a shot from 40 out, he was more concerned about telling the rest of the boys to set up the zone than concentrating on kicking the goal. Jeez Kenny, a bit of confidence doesn't go astray.

"What would Adam Gilchrist do?"

 

[-WWJD-]

Heh. He'd probably tell the umpire he infringed on Cloke and pay the free kick against himself.

 

[tribey]

haha quality.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Was this board around in 97-98? I remember Robran getting absolutely drilled by Crows fans and on talkback radio. Is it a case of not knowing what we've got until it's gone?

McGregor is no superstar but he provides a target and is rarely outmarked in what is without question the hardest position on the ground. He led the club in contested marks in 2004 and 2005.

If you have a look around the AFL there aren't a heap of quality CHF's. Drew Petrie? Jared Brennan? Travis Cloke? Henry Playfair? Brad Miller? Damon White? Adam Pattison? Not that he doesn't have room for some improvement but I think we are doing ok.

 

[CrowMagnum]

Was this board around in 97-98? I remember Robran getting absolutely drilled by Crows fans and on talkback radio. Is it a case of not knowing what we've got until it's gone?

McGregor is no superstar but he provides a target and is rarely outmarked in what is without question the hardest position on the ground. He led the club in contested marks in 2004 and 2005.

If you have a look around the AFL there aren't a heap of quality CHF's. Drew Petrie? Jared Brennan? Travis Cloke? Henry Playfair? Brad Miller? Damon White? Adam Pattison? Not that he doesn't have room for some improvement but I think we are doing ok.

You're right, he doesn't get outmarked but he does fall over regularly and is then out of the contest. The game nowadays is all about quick rebound from defence to beat the flood, and this is a lot easier to do if the CHF continually falls over near the 50.

 

[JohnK]

There have been some tough calls on Kenny in this thread.

I've always regarded him as having better defensive skills than offensive but, CHF is the most punishing spot to fill and someone has to do it.

I'd have him in this starting 18 because he can play both CHB and CHF at any time as and when the pattern of play demands it.
And we don't have too many players in the squad at the moment, capable of filling both of those positions.

Kenny's at his best when the team is clicking (as all players are). When the team is streaming from the backlines in a counterattack, Kenny is a valuable option in a current makeshift forward structure and has been all year.

When Adelaide's breakaway game collapses, as it has for the last two and half games, Kenny and Trent and Roo all look vulnerable.

We still lack a forward structure that looks capable of winning finals.

Roo to the centre or half back line, off the bench? Scotty Welsh the leading forward, Trent to stay in the square for the mark or opportunistic ground goal, Burton and Biglands floating back for the goalsquare hanger, Bode and Edwards to crumb, Ken to keep the ball in the area or to bring the ball to ground? Can all that work?

Could Stevens or Bock or even Rutten fill that CHF spot?
Is it too early to throw Jason Porplyzia into CHF?

Don't know. Don't know any of these things. But we do know now that if teams can close down Adelaide's easy runs from defence by having their own forwards exert defensive pressure, Adelaide has huge problems with its current front six. At the moment, there's not one matchwinner amongst them.

 

[RogerRabbit69]

I reckon Adelaide could have a forward line that included Brendan Fevola, Nick Riewoldt, Brad Johnson .... but they'd still struggle if the opposition puts 18 players in the Crows' forward 50.

 

[macca23]

Was this board around in 97-98? I remember Robran getting absolutely drilled by Crows fans and on talkback radio. Is it a case of not knowing what we've got until it's gone?

McGregor is no superstar but he provides a target and is rarely outmarked in what is without question the hardest position on the ground. He led the club in contested marks in 2004 and 2005.

If you have a look around the AFL there aren't a heap of quality CHF's. Drew Petrie? Jared Brennan? Travis Cloke? Henry Playfair? Brad Miller? Damon White? Adam Pattison? Not that he doesn't have room for some improvement but I think we are doing ok.

Nicely put.

And accurate.

 

[Jars458]

They certainly are DT.

IMO the Kenny critics do NOT understand the meaning of structure. He is performing the role that Neil Craig wants him to, which is the same role Robran did in our premiership years.

Robran used to cop the same ill-informed crap back in those days.

Take Kenny out of our forward line and we would be buggered IMO.

Thank god the coaching panel aren't going to listen to the pleas of the anti-Kenny cheer-leader WW and any of his followers.

Why? Because they would like to win a premiership.

Agreed. He contested very hard on Sat and with a bit more luck cold have have had 3 to four more marks.

I think we have four weeks to get it right and that's a huge luxury at the moment wiht a top two spot guranteed

Not worried in the slightest by our slight drop in form over the last two weeks.

Hopfully people start underestimating us.

 

[beartoo]

Kenny always gives a contest and brings the ball to ground if he can't mark it. With decent umpiring he would have had a few frees on Saturday and maybe a few goals.
His defensive skills are okay. Yeah, he's slipped over a few times, but not that often that it should be commented on.
IMO at the present time he is an essential player in the starting 18.

 

[dogs105]

Big part of the TEAM

 

[CrowMagnum]

Kenny always gives a contest and brings the ball to ground if he can't mark it. With decent umpiring he would have had a few frees on Saturday and maybe a few goals.
His defensive skills are okay. Yeah, he's slipped over a few times, but not that often that it should be commented on.
IMO at the present time he is an essential player in the starting 18.

Ken has his good points but keeping his feet isn't one of them. If someone feels strongly enough to dedicate a thread title to it, its got to be a problem and I hope Ken and the AFC aren't burying their heads in the sand about it like some of us are.

He has a high centre of gravity that predisposes him to fall. How does he stop it? Like the under-10 coach says " Keep your feet son!" Its mental.

 

[The Crows Truth]

~~~~

 

[The Crows Truth]

Ken has his good points but keeping his feet isn't one of them. If someone feels strongly enough to dedicate a thread title to it, its got to be a problem and I hope Ken and the AFC aren't burying their heads in the sand about it like some of us are.

.

 

[Kickin_Goals]

I reckon Adelaide could have a forward line that included Brendan Fevola, Nick Riewoldt, Brad Johnson .... but they'd still struggle if the opposition puts 18 players in the Crows' forward 50.

If we had Fevola He'd kick it over the top of the whole bunch for that matter we could have moved ricciuto down to the backlines would of had him kicking back and forth with rutten wouldn't of taken much to get within his range

McGregor dropped a couple he could of taken big deal, he looked a damn lot better then the other lads up there in actually taking some.
McGregor earning possession upfield however is horrible, he takes the set shot timer to kick the ball...... Could someone please run past him for the handball.....
He is out of sorts but pick a player who was truly 100% out there, you might have a handfull but you would be pushing it for that.

What is it Shirley is meant to be doing out there, is he a tagger or something else? He only seems to be able to restrict his own possession while his opponent runs all over him.
If he is playing some role in contests there appears not a lot of structure in them no real combining between rucks and rovers at all for most of the season. There must be some reason he is there surely....his tackle average is not great he has limited disposals and possession for that of a midfielder he has 2 decent games all season against poor opponents in Essendon and Hawthorn the essendon game you would be hard-pressed to find a player not having a decent day.
So really what is going on? He really does appear to be a passenger, hopefully he has a good game against Freo as we can't afford that in the midfield which is neccessary to be the driving force against tactics such as the superflood making it neccessary to win first possession and cover distance with the ball quickly if the team isn't to employ some type of effective scoring counter to such a tactic.

 

[lunacy]

I have heard a lot of talk lately about kenny going back into defence. WHY???????????
Our defence prides itself on making quick decisions, cool under pressure, fast, agile, with a lot of run. With all due respect to big Ken, he possesses very few of these qualities if any.
Why would we put Kenny at CHB over Bock or Stevens, both do a reasonable job in the air, but are exceptional at ground level and offensively (for their size).
I think Kenny in defence would not add to our defence but depreciate it.
Have we all been brain washed? Does Kenny have to be in the side regardless of form. Any other player would be dropped (ie Perrie, Stevens, Welsh) if they had the a season equivalent to Kenny's. Yet when he is playing bad we hear talk that not only should he keep his spot (when there are plenty of players waiting for a shot), but he should take the spot of Stevens or Bock who have done really well. If he is not good enough to play, he's not good enough to play. He shouldn't take the position of any player who deserves his position.

Crazy.....

 

[J-Train]

What is it Shirley is meant to be doing out there, is he a tagger or something else? He only seems to be able to restrict his own possession while his opponent runs all over him.
If he is playing some role in contests there appears not a lot of structure in them no real combining between rucks and rovers at all for most of the season. There must be some reason he is there surely....his tackle average is not great he has limited disposals and possession for that of a midfielder he has 2 decent games all season against poor opponents in Essendon and Hawthorn the essendon game you would be hard-pressed to find a player not having a decent day.
So really what is going on? He really does appear to be a passenger, hopefully he has a good game against Freo as we can't afford that in the midfield which is neccessary to be the driving force against tactics such as the superflood making it neccessary to win first possession and cover distance with the ball quickly if the team isn't to employ some type of effective scoring counter to such a tactic.

That is rough Kickn goals - Shirls has been quiet the last couple of games but I don't think anyone could run with the premier midfielders in the competition every single match and not fell heavy in the legs eventually. The lad takes on the best - Simon Black, Daniel Kerr, Dal Santo, Judd, Jude Bolton, Stevens, West....and more often than not breaks even. Someone might look at the stats and say - "gee shirls got 15 possies and West had 22, he got beaten today." But how many would West have got if Shirls didnt wear him like a glove for four quarters - plenty of good midfielders have had been pantsed when West or someone of his calibre racks up a 30 plus game. Its expected of them and more often than not they deliver. If you can keep an A grade follower to 20 and pick up 10-15 yourself you've done a good job.

The other thing i wanted to mention - is how often is Shirls the last one up from the bottom of the pack, the guy who applies the tackle or puts on a shepherd for his teammate? He also feeds out that sharp little handball that releases freewheelers like Goodwin and McLeod so they can do their thing.

I'm not 100% sure but I think last time the Crows played Freo, Rob kept Haselby under control and chipped in well himself. If he can do it again, then you guys should be happy.

Keep going Shirls you are doing well mate!

 

[CrowMagnum]

 

[beartoo]

That is rough Kickn goals - Shirls has been quiet the last couple of games but I don't think anyone could run with the premier midfielders in the competition every single match and not fell heavy in the legs eventually. The lad takes on the best - Simon Black, Daniel Kerr, Dal Santo, Judd, Jude Bolton, Stevens, West....and more often than not breaks even. Someone might look at the stats and say - "gee shirls got 15 possies and West had 22, he got beaten today." But how many would West have got if Shirls didnt wear him like a glove for four quarters - plenty of good midfielders have had been pantsed when West or someone of his calibre racks up a 30 plus game. Its expected of them and more often than not they deliver. If you can keep an A grade follower to 20 and pick up 10-15 yourself you've done a good job.

The other thing i wanted to mention - is how often is Shirls the last one up from the bottom of the pack, the guy who applies the tackle or puts on a shepherd for his teammate? He also feeds out that sharp little handball that releases freewheelers like Goodwin and McLeod so they can do their thing.

I'm not 100% sure but I think last time the Crows played Freo, Rob kept Haselby under control and chipped in well himself. If he can do it again, then you guys should be happy.

Keep going Shirls you are doing well mate!

Excellent analysis, J-Train

 

[JohnK]

I have heard a lot of talk lately about kenny going back into defence. WHY? Our defence prides itself on making quick decisions, cool under pressure, fast, agile, with a lot of run. With all due respect to big Ken, he possesses very few of these qualities if any.
...Have we all been brain washed? Does Kenny have to be in the side regardless of form? Any other player would be dropped...If he is not good enough to play, he's not good enough to play. He shouldn't take the position of any player who deserves his position.

Yes, OK. Hear the argument.

Therefore, who should play CHF for Adelaide?