Analysis Making the Top 4 and building to a flag. 4TH is IRRELEVANT, MAKE IT TOP 3

[TeeKray]

Call me pessimistic but after we went 3-0 I looked at our draw up to the Shanghai game and thought 'shit, we might not win in Australia again until after the bye'.

Essendon at Etihad was always going to be tough because it was against a decent team at a ground we play poorly. 3-1.

Geelong we never beat anywhere. 3-2.

North are nowhere near as bad as people think and play Etihad as well as we play it badly. 3-3?

West Coast at Optus, forget about it. 3-4?

The Crows. Hmm. 3-5?

I think we're pushing it uphill to play finals this year. The first two rounds were great but the Brisbane loss raised huge question marks and the last two weeks have really underlined those question marks. Just not feeling it unfortunately. We're a 10-12 at worst, 12-10 at best type team.

 

[RossFC]

So we haven't made the top 4 in a regular season in 11 years?

 

[philreich]

One wonders what Don Pyke could have done with this list. At the very least, I bet we wouldn't have the shambolic structure we see today!!!!!

 

[*PAF]

We dont have the talent. Look at the skills under pressure. Bloody hopeless. We dont have many smart footballers either. Marshall is almost top of the class and he has been at Alberton barely 18 months.

And Huston was top of the class 12 months ago as was Banner etc etc.

Once Marshall is asked to play a Westhoff type game and all of his kicks are under pressure or having set shots after 2 or 3 repeated 60m sprints his kicking will become less reliable.

I know everyone rates Wines but I am going to say Wines is the most underrated player in the AFL as we speak. The bloke is a freak and one of the few reasons we didn't lose the last 2 games by heaps.
We do have the talent and not that many injuries.

 

[Andre]

This is symptomatic of the players not understanding or believing in the gameplan.

We have heaps of talent. We have an incredibly talented list. The recruits should be helping us out in key areas. Rockliff should be shoring up our midfield defence by finding the ball when nobody else can. Watts should be shoring up our forward entry by providing another genuine mobile target up there. Motlop should be helping our run and carry and potency in front of goal.

None of those things are happening because we haven't actually recognised what's wrong.

It's like getting lap band surgery and continuing to eat a whole pizza for tea every night because the lap band should fix everything.

It’s a bullshit analogy, but Clarksons lose a soldier and replace them selection philosophy is a 4 times premiership winning proven one. Yes Hawks had some great talent, but also plenty of players fit for our spuds who tear us apart threads.

They all knew what to do though, when they came in. Our ‘system’ under Ken has always been a bastardised combination of relying on individual talent to win (the Schulz, Robbie or Wingard special) and a loose structure, that changes depending on player availability. With the bookends still expected to act as KPP’s, as we go smaller at first chance.

If we lose Ryder (or in previous years lost Schulz or Carlile/Trengove in Defense), we wouldn’t have expected their replacements to be as good, but everyone else would have still known how to run all the plays game day. Not the player confusion as all the pre-season and training goes out the window.

And so we roll to 2018 with a more talented list, but again by not replacing 1 position of 22 we confuse the minds of 21 other players as they have to adjust continually plans that were meant to become second nature over the pre-season.

 

[*PAF]

It’s a bullshit analogy, but Clarksons lose a soldier and replace them selection philosophy is a 4 times premiership winning proven one. Yes Hawks had some great talent, but also plenty of players fit for our spuds who tear us apart threads.

They all knew what to do though, when they came in. Our ‘system’ under Ken has always been a bastardised combination of relying on individual talent to win (the Schulz, Robbie or Wingard special) and a loose structure, that changes depending on player availability. With the bookends still expected to act as KPP’s, as we go smaller at first chance.

If we lose Ryder (or in previous years lost Schulz or Carlile/Trengove in Defense), we wouldn’t have expected their replacements to be as good, but everyone else would have still known how to run all the plays game day. Not the player confusion as all the pre-season and training goes out the window.

And so we roll to 2017 with a more talented list, but again by not replacing 1 position of 22 we confuse the minds of 21 other players as they have to adjust continually plans that were meant to become second nature over the pre-season.

1000 likes.

And he got picks by trading out some of those players at the end of the year.

However having said that the coaching is a combination of all coaches, Ken plus all assistants. They need to train, select players and plan as one.
It's not just Hinkley but he is the boss.
Then we have the off field people including KT and Kochie.

Would any of our assistants do a better job as a coaching boss? Question mark atm.

 

[OneGreatClub]

Can we change the title to:
"making bottom 4 and rebuilding to a flag maybe one day hopefully"?

 

[PA88]

1000 likes.

And he got picks by trading out some of those players at the end of the year.

However having said that the coaching is a combination of all coaches, Ken plus all assistants. They need to train, select players and plan as one.
It's not just Hinkley but he is the boss.
Then we have the off field people including KT and Kochie.

Would any of our assistants do a better job as a coaching boss? Question mark atm.

Hinkley and Nicks have been there throughout though.
The crows have Pyke become their default coach and I've not heard any criticism about Campo since.

 

[*PAF]

Hinkley and Nicks have been there throughout though.
The crows have Pyke become their default coach and I've not heard any criticism about Campo since.

Perhaps a good thread would be one that highlights the strengths of our coaches.

Hinkley - Man manager extraordinaire. Probably the best in the AFL currently.

Voss - Mr grunt. He has certainly added much needed grunt to our midfield.

Bassett - Mr Powerbot. He knows what he wants and which players he needs for the defence to function the way he demands and gets them. His way or the highway and takes no prisoners. Our defence is solid as.

 

[OneGreatClub]

Perhaps a good thread would be one that highlights the strengths of our coaches.

Hinkley - Man manager extraordinaire. Probably the best in the AFL currently.

Voss - Mr grunt. He has certainly added much needed grunt to our midfield.

Bassett - Mr Powerbot. He knows what he wants and which players he needs for the defence to function the way he demands and gets them. His way or the highway. Takes no prisoners. Our defence is solid as.

Just a cotton-pickin-minute, It's me who's usually the Pollyanna on this board.

 

[Visenfest]

The main thing which worries me about the future of the club is this:

In 2012 when the club was in dire straits, we had KT at the helm making the right decisions and appointments to put us on the right track, and he managed to do it.

Imagine a scenario in which Hinkley (say, in a few years time) leaves, and KT and Koch follow. Who at the club is then capable of doing a KT and making the right decisions and right appointments? Who will make sure we appoint the right CEO, President and coach? This is an issue which isn't really discussed, but one which could bite us badly.

 

[OneGreatClub]

The main thing which worries me about the future of the club is this:

In 2012 when the club was in dire straits, we had KT at the helm making the right decisions and appointments to put us on the right track, and he managed to do it.

Imagine a scenario in which Hinkley (say, in a few years time) leaves, and KT and Koch follow. Who at the club is then capable of doing a KT and making the right decisions and right appointments? Who will make sure we appoint the right CEO, President and coach? This is an issue which isn't really discussed, but one which could bite us badly.

I seriously think I'll forget about AFL altogether. They won't be getting my money or my interest. I'll follow another sport.

 

[PA88]

Perhaps a good thread would be one that highlights the strengths of our coaches.

Hinkley - Man manager extraordinaire. Probably the best in the AFL currently.

Voss - Mr grunt. He has certainly added much needed grunt to our midfield.

Bassett - Mr Powerbot. He knows what he wants and which players he needs for the defence to function the way he demands and gets them. His way or the highway and takes no prisoners. Our defence is solid as.

My point is that I still believe that the head coach is everything when measuring team success. A good head coach will identify how to account for a struggling assistant.

Highlighting the above is like trying to do it using a dried out highlighter pen.

 

[*PAF]

Just a cotton-pickin-minute, It's me who's usually the Pollyanna on this board.

Hehe.
Not sure how the post came out but imo the issue we have been having is one where all of our coaches have strengths, all of our players have strengths, yet we lack coordination.
Not as bad as a year or two ago when it looked as if we had 3 teams out there instead of one, but all it takes is one or two injuries for us to throw everything out the window.

Is looking at negatives or positives the best way to see what's causing as to be so spaz?

 

[*PAF]

My point is that I still believe that the head coach is everything when measuring team success. A good head coach will identify how to account for a struggling assistant.

Highlighting the above is like trying to do it using a dried out highlighter pen.

Yeah but the days where the coach was the one and only are long gone.

The Crows got Worsfold to do a review and reaped the rewards in a very short time.

Geelong did similar in 2006-7.

Yeah we are spaz but we are also very close. Is it Hinkley that should focus on a review type thing instead of concentrating on coaching or is it KT and Kochie.

 

[OneGreatClub]

Yeah we are spaz but we are also very close.

 

[PA88]

Yeah but the days where the coach was the one and only are long gone.

The Crows got Worsfold to do a review and reaped the rewards in a very short time.

Geelong did similar in 2006-7.

Yeah we are spaz but we are also very close. Is it Hinkley that should focus on a review type thing instead of concentrating on coaching or is it KT and Kochie.

I don't know ... but after 11 years Geelong are still out-sizing us and I can't believe my once tough club is owned by another so much.

 

[PA88]

View attachment 486462

Hinkley = Fola.

 

[VineValerian]

As we filed down from the western stand, there is a second balcony area at the bottom of that tier where Kochie, KT and the board sit.

Kochie was standing, hands in pockets, gazing with a dumbfounded look across the ground.

Cardone, Ransom, KT, Osborne were there too with long faces - the type that you see when someone has been told they just won X Lotto, then remembered they threw the ticket out in the trash last week!

Boy. Did they look totally disillusioned.

A penny for their thoughts............................................................................

 

[KenOath]

We dont have the talent. Look at the skills under pressure. Bloody hopeless. We dont have many smart footballers either. Marshall is almost top of the class and he has been at Alberton barely 18 months.

Our skills look poor because we are hesitant and unsure as a result of being overcoached.

The brain of an athlete is a funny thing and once an athlete starts questioning or fighting their instincts you're in trouble.

Wingard and Wines are cases in point. In their first couple of seasons they were both clutch performers because they relied on their natural instincts under pressure. Now when they get the ball in critical moments you can see they are processing a thousand things to work out what they're meant to do...with the last thought being "don't miss"!

I give Marshall two years before his natural instincts are gone under this regime!

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

We do have the talent and not that many injuries.

We dont have the talent - under pressure and against the top half of the ladder sides.

We have a bit of grunt but if we don't bring the grunt and the oppo coaches are smarter than our we are a mid pack team.

That's it. Who in our team has the talent to consistently execute at critical moments in big games time and time again.

Whilst Sam Gray is the picked in the firstt 12 or 15 players the coaches put up on the board you know we don't have the talent.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

Our skills look poor because we are hesitant and unsure as a result of being overcoached.

The brain of an athlete is a funny thing and once an athlete starts questioning or fighting their instincts you're in trouble.

Wingard and Wines are cases in point. In their first couple of seasons they were both clutch performers because they relied on their natural instincts under pressure. Now when they get the ball in critical moments you can see they are processing a thousand things to work out what they're meant to do...with the last thought being "don't miss"!

I give Marshall two years before his natural instincts are gone under this regime!

Marshall will be 21 when Ken goes. He won't be ruined for life. He is our long term hope to build a team around.

 

[*PAF]

I don't know ... but after 11 years Geelong are still out-sizing us and I can't believe my once tough club is owned by another so much.

It could also be that some clubs like Geelong, Hawthorn, Sydney and a couple of others have their poop together whether they have a coaching change or not. Whereas some other clubs are reliant on coaches and players.

We seem to be somewhere between the two.

 

[Robbie4PM]

My worry is that we hit the trade window hard again next year and the year after and then we will be ****ed for so long. Doesn't matter how good our team is you can't win a premiership with a coach with no tactical intelligence or balls

 

[*PAF]

We dont have the talent - under pressure and against the top half of the ladder sides.

We have a bit of grunt but if we don't bring the grunt and the oppo coaches are smarter than our we are a mid pack team.

That's it. Who in our team has the talent to consistently execute at critical moments in big games time and time again.

Whilst Sam Gray is the picked in the firstt 12 or 15 players the coaches put up on the board you know we don't have the talent.

Sam Gray is most certainly talented and premiership teams like Hawthorn have included less talented players.

It's just that we tend to muck up on mass way too often and that makes the **** ups stand out more than they should.