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Markfs Media Watch

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The Cloke booing was greeted with laughter in the MCC members, by both sides. A lot of it was tongue in cheek and was recognised as such.
 
What bothered me about the Cloke booing was that everyone puffed smoked up his arse as "one of the good guys" (yeah thanks for a year of protracted contract negotiations Trav) and how good it was to see him kick that goal as a confidence booster. Yet when the pressure was really on in Q4 for a set shot he nearly puts it OOBOTF and nobody says Jack. Every Pies fan would've looked at it and said "Yep, that's exactly what we had with Trav 2012-16 how has he got better?"
 
i'm sure a few people.... well a couple....have seen Mick Malthouse's article about Dale Thomas....
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/a...s/news-story/508ee131f6da9b4d132ace48cda56a47

In some ways, the article writes itself. There is nothing new here. You do have to wonder why a newspaper would pay a person to write on footy when that person seems to be fixated on proving himself to be right and spends every media minute trying to prove that.

Yes, yes, I know about Mick's famous loyalty to his players. Yes I know how he would never coach against his boys....well....let's just put that one to back of the cupboard.. But the question is, is this news? Is it relevant? Is anyone really interested?

As Mick himself says, Thomas was annointed by Ross Lyon as the best player in the league..... but that was 6 years ago. 6 years. Why are we discussing a guy who is a plodder in a plodding team? ok I will move on...

I have to refer to this quote..
"And I love to see my old boys doing well as coaches themselves — currently John Worsfold and Don Pyke."

Well guess who's name is missing from that list... Mick might say that Nathan is not one of the coaches doing well for themselves.... boom boom. Yes, I walked right into that one Mick. Bucks is struggling. Of course, he wouldn't be if he put his pride aside and called Mick and asked for advice.

Truthfully, is this vindictive or just is it just that Mick is in first stage of alzheimers? I would suggest that there are tens, maybe hundreds of footballers out there who wouldnt particularly want to talk to Mick again.... and it probably wouldn't enter into his mind.

I actually think that Mick's thinking has seeped into the culture of the club and has poisoned it in a small way. The fact that Malthouse continually stokes the flames of his bad relationship with Buckley does nothing for the club. Does he care? I doubt it. There's a number of people who believe that Buckley should never have been appointed coach. They might be right. I've felt this way about Malthouse for a few years and it gets stronger every time Mick opens his mouth.
 
The Sherriff said:
What bothered me about the Cloke booing was that everyone puffed smoked up his arse as "one of the good guys" (yeah thanks for a year of protracted contract negotiations Trav) and how good it was to see him kick that goal as a confidence booster. Yet when the pressure was really on in Q4 for a set shot he nearly puts it OOBOTF and nobody says Jack. Every Pies fan would've looked at it and said "Yep, that's exactly what we had with Trav 2012-16 how has he got better?"
Click to expand...

I had a close look at Rhyce Shaw a year or so after their premiership year and I noticed that he still packed his dacks when he was under extreme pressure. However, Swans lived with it and no one seemed to bother about it from the media. Pie players get harassed and I have to say that some of that comes from the easy way that the media makes money by selling stories to Pie supporters about Pie players making mistakes. When these players leave the club, they get treated pretty well. Prime example is Dale Thomas. Even Chris Dawes who had a failed career at Melb could do it in peace and without harassment. Heritier.....Seedsman.... almost totally off the radar, but they were analysed to the nth degree at the Pies.
 

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The Sherriff said:
What bothered me about the Cloke booing was that everyone puffed smoked up his arse as "one of the good guys" (yeah thanks for a year of protracted contract negotiations Trav) and how good it was to see him kick that goal as a confidence booster. Yet when the pressure was really on in Q4 for a set shot he nearly puts it OOBOTF and nobody says Jack. Every Pies fan would've looked at it and said "Yepco, that's exactly what we had with Trav 2012-16 how has he got better?"
Click to expand...

i just remembered that i went down the local coffee shop and read their sunday newspaper.... i will read them but i dont buy. anyway, karl langdon who has made a career post footy out of selling bogus roof restoration and crap articles in the sunday paper, wrote something about the players that coaches hate. He dredged up travis cloke......i laughed. If i didnt do any work, my employer would probably sack me after .....well at most a year. my employer is pretty stupid but not as stupid as the collingwood footy club who persisted with someone who was the key member of a dysfunctional forward line. I'm sure that the story going forward will be that travis wasnt given a chance to get his game together at the pies.....

in other news reformed.....is it reformed? alcoholic brendan fevola says that eade might lose his job.......which allows the media to say something that it was thinking but didnt have the guts to ask. Shouldnt the man who decided to give gold coast the licence take some responsibility?.....oh no....far too much power to take that gentleman on.
 
As far as I'm concerned, Caroline Wilson has been irrelevant for a long time in the scheme of things. She seems to be obsessed with her speciality which involves the various movements in the shadows by people who sit in those corporate boxes at the MCG.

I clicked on her column purely because I was interested to find out how Clarko had gone out of control.
http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/hawthorn-slow-steady-and-losing-the-race-20170403-gvcu1k.html

In the first instance, she didnt even bother to give reasons for her assessment. Later, she mentioned the "forced" departure of Lewis and Mitchell. Even then, she wouldnt commit to calling it an outright mistake because she knows that if she did, it might come back to bite her in the bum...(please excuse the sexist language. I dont know what came over me)

She blowing up a lot of hot air about the need for Hawthorn to get some strong people in administrative positions, when the Hawks have proved over the last decade that they have been able to change CEOs and Presidents at various times, and not let it get in the way of their football.

The reality is that Clarko has a pretty good hit rate in putting together premiership teams and I would prefer to back him than someone who appears to know about boardrooms but seems to be rather disinterested about what's happening on the actual field.

I suggest that the Age is in desperate need of a strong editor to rein her in. Either that or transfer her to the finance desk.
 
Markfs said:
As far as I'm concerned, Caroline Wilson has been irrelevant for a long time in the scheme of things. She seems to be obsessed with her speciality which involves the various movements in the shadows by people who sit in those corporate boxes at the MCG.

I clicked on her column purely because I was interested to find out how Clarko had gone out of control.
http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/hawthorn-slow-steady-and-losing-the-race-20170403-gvcu1k.html

In the first instance, she didnt even bother to give reasons for her assessment. Later, she mentioned the "forced" departure of Lewis and Mitchell. Even then, she wouldnt commit to calling it an outright mistake because she knows that if she did, it might come back to bite her in the bum...(please excuse the sexist language. I dont know what came over me)

She blowing up a lot of hot air about the need for Hawthorn to get some strong people in administrative positions, when the Hawks have proved over the last decade that they have been able to change CEOs and Presidents at various times, and not let it get in the way of their football.

The reality is that Clarko has a pretty good hit rate in putting together premiership teams and I would prefer to back him than someone who appears to know about boardrooms but seems to be rather disinterested about what's happening on the actual field.

I suggest that the Age is in desperate need of a strong editor to rein her in. Either that or transfer her to the finance desk.
Click to expand...

I will give her some credit, which is that she knows how to play to her strengths. She knew that she couldn't make a career in football journalism by talking about that pigskin thingy and the various and strange things which people do to it, and so she's been hiding herself under the boardroom table of footy clubs ever since. The crumbs from those tables are her supper.

But you're right, there is often a large 'disconnect' between those shadowy goings on and...football. And Caro's articles do seem increasingly irrelevant, as much as her writing has become increasingly shoddy. She's nearly as bad. As Rohan. Let's put a full stop. Where full stops don't belong. Connolly.
 
JB1975 said:
I will give her some credit, which is that she knows how to play to her strengths. She knew that she couldn't make a career in football journalism by talking about that pigskin thingy and the various and strange things which people do to it, and so she's been hiding herself under the boardroom table of footy clubs ever since. The crumbs from those tables are her supper.

But you're right, there is often a large 'disconnect' between those shadowy goings on and...football. And Caro's articles do seem increasingly irrelevant, as much as her writing has become increasingly shoddy. She's nearly as bad. As Rohan. Let's put a full stop. Where full stops don't belong. Connolly.
Click to expand...
The best example I've seen of the distance between Caro's stuff and the core business of footy was the recent one saying the AFL should come out in support of gay marriage. Without arguing the rights or wrongs... is this the AFL's role in society -- making social policy? If so, why stop there? Economic policy could do with a polish as well. Foreign policy. Support for the arts. There seem to be real issues with some aspects of the education sector. No need for a government -- just let the AFL fix it.
A key part of Caro's argument was that the AFL should campaign for gay marriage because it had campaigned against racism in football. As if stamping out an evil in your own backyard is the same as making social policy on an issue that you don't own but just have an opinion about...
 
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60 Yards Out said:
The best example I've seen of the distance between Caro's stuff and the core business of footy was the recent one saying the AFL should come out in support of gay marriage. Without arguing the rights or wrongs... is this the AFL's role in society -- making social policy? If so, why stop there? Economic policy could do with a polish as well. Foreign policy. Support for the arts. There seem to be real issues with some aspects of the education sector. No need for a government -- just let the AFL fix it.
A key part of Caro's argument was that the AFL should campaign for gay marriage because it had campaigned against racism in football. As if stamping out an evil in your own backyard is the same as making social policy on an issue that you don't own but just have an opinion about...
Click to expand...

well if people are taking notice of you then you seem to be an agent of change..... which explains why chefs on my kitchen rules are dictating about
methods of preventing infectious diseases
 
http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-ne...-spot-says-it-all-really-20170405-gvejsx.html

caroline decides to take a whack at Ablett. she needs to join the conga line....

i started off half understanding what she is getting at. gazza peddling his own bike at the footy show instead of promoting the club. Of course, you could argue that it's about time the Suns were able to wheel someone else out for a press conference but i'll give her the point...

but from there, she loses her mind...

she talks about his failed move to geelong. She talks about him having to take a pay cut....something that is pretty obvious. However, she makes the point "Could he justify $500,000 – half his current wage?" .....ummmm.... isn't that his decision? He actually would be having a conversation with himself. Maybe friends and managers might have an input but what the hell is she getting at?

If that seems strange, then she says "His marketing value alone in the romance of the return to Geelong is in his favour although – speculating – were Ablett to return to that mint fully fit condition following a pre-season back at Simonds Stadium, what does that say about current commitment up north?"

ummmm...so she speculates that he MIGHT be able to return to mint condition if he joined Geelong, then uses that speculation to have a whack at him..... is she going out drinking with Robinson these days?

She goes on to bash Gaz's management for blasting the club for its disintegration. Is Ablett supposed to take responsibility for that?

I accept that he seems a little disinterested at the moment, but he's not on his pat malone at the Suns.... and he wouldnt be the first player to bail out of a club that looks like it's going to sit at the nether regions of the ladder for the next few years.

There are some things within ablett's control and other things that no one player can fix. Caroline must be suffering from withdrawls from not having to slash her wrists from looking at Richmond games. She obviously picked the Tiges as her club when she was a little girl because it provided her with an endless supply of blunders for her to bitch about. Now, she seems to have transferred her support to the Suns to get her weekly fix....

I can smell a column on Buckley in the near future....
 
Countrypie said:
You can bet that it will have twin targets - Eddie being the main one. Buckley is just collateral damage in Caro's eyes
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yes you make a good point. i get the feeling that the things that most concern caroline are her personal jousts with various people in the industry. i suppose you could use the same analysis with clarko. she might be at his throat because he might have done her wrong in the past...

then again, she might be taking the attack dog pose purely because the Age has announced reductions in staff numbers in the last few days
 

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in the interests of balanced reporting, i present this item
http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/t...-quill-journalism-awards-20170317-gv0ytf.html

The judges said Caroline's "work over a long period has been ground-breaking and at times crusading ... She quickly developed a reputation as tough, fair, and never willing to take a backward step."

It makes me wonder why she doesnt get it every year for her toughness and fairness and unwillingness to acknowledge errors....oopps....unwillingness to take a backward step...

is there an award for remaining sober for more than 2 days? she might be the only candidate...
 
You gotta hand it to Perth media people, they live in a world of their own.... a true reflection of many of the people who live in the world's most isolated city.

At Luke Beveridge's press conference after the loss to Fremantle, he was asked whether he would consider bringing back Will Minson.

Luke must be a good poker player because he looked at the bloke and told him that it might be difficult to bring Will back because he had retired. He went on to tell the bewildered old reporter that Will had been a fine servant of the club but he had walked off into the sunset.

You have to forgive us Perth people. Half the population were born in Perth and have never been away from the capital except for the odd trip down south and the yearly pilgrimage to Bali. The other half were born in a damp run down cottage in Manchester or Liverpool and became life-long Beagle or Docker supporters the minute they walked out of the airport terminal on their government assisted journey from the motherland.

Both groups have no knowledge of any of the other team from over east, except that they are given more money and draft concessions than the two local teams and that the people who run the AFL do everything possible to undermine the chances of our local teams to win the AFL premiership...
 
I just watched 360 for the first time this year. I got a foxtel subscription 3 weeks ago and i forgot that there was something useful on fox other than the actual games.

Anyway, i wanted to see how the monday 360 went without buckley. The coaches segment went as I suspected. Chris Scott has cut loose. I had the feeling a number of times in the past that buckley has covered for scott when scott was entering territory that he shouldnt venture into. Now, he's the senior man to the newbie in alan richardson and he has been given the opportunity to "express himself".

I'm not saying that he's going to end up with egg on his face some time during the season but he has a tendency to put his mouth into gear before his brain has thought about the implications of what is about to say.....it might be interesting

richardson is about as interesting as a weekend in bali with your sister....

on a final note, whateley put aside 2 minutes at the end so robinson could talk about the tigers. robinson is suffering from delusions. he thinks he can speak off the cuff about a team and make sense..... mark, you are an idiot, do some preparation. The other problem is that his drinking is killing any brain cells that he has left. He excitedly said that he had gone to champion data and found out the one thing that richmond was the best in the league at....... but he had forgotten it.....

i suspect that his drinking mates will be getting him to shout a few dozen rounds on that mistake...
 
Markfs said:
He excitedly said that he had gone to champion data and found out the one thing that richmond was the best in the league at....... but he had forgotten it.....
Click to expand...
Behinds kicked by opposition sides?
 
Markfs said:
I just watched 360 for the first time this year. I got a foxtel subscription 3 weeks ago and i forgot that there was something useful on fox other than the actual games.

Anyway, i wanted to see how the monday 360 went without buckley. The coaches segment went as I suspected. Chris Scott has cut loose. I had the feeling a number of times in the past that buckley has covered for scott when scott was entering territory that he shouldnt venture into. Now, he's the senior man to the newbie in alan richardson and he has been given the opportunity to "express himself".

I'm not saying that he's going to end up with egg on his face some time during the season but he has a tendency to put his mouth into gear before his brain has thought about the implications of what is about to say.....it might be interesting

richardson is about as interesting as a weekend in bali with your sister....

on a final note, whateley put aside 2 minutes at the end so robinson could talk about the tigers. robinson is suffering from delusions. he thinks he can speak off the cuff about a team and make sense..... mark, you are an idiot, do some preparation. The other problem is that his drinking is killing any brain cells that he has left. He excitedly said that he had gone to champion data and found out the one thing that richmond was the best in the league at....... but he had forgotten it.....

i suspect that his drinking mates will be getting him to shout a few dozen rounds on that mistake...
Click to expand...

Alan Richardson is a poor choice as Buckley's replacement. I'm sure he has footy smarts, and may yet turn out a good coach, but he has no discernible personality. Shows little emotion and has a monotone voice. For superficial types like myself, I am quickly bored by him. Not good for ratings.
 
Vicky Park said:
Alan Richardson is a poor choice as Buckley's replacement. I'm sure he has footy smarts, and may yet turn out a good coach, but he has no discernible personality. Shows little emotion and has a monotone voice. For superficial types like myself, I am quickly bored by him. Not good for ratings.
Click to expand...
Ahh...but he is a Collingwood man. Should have been one of the 1990 immortals and for that reason alone I'll listen to his dull monotone for at least 1/2 a year
 

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Vicky Park said:
Alan Richardson is a poor choice as Buckley's replacement. I'm sure he has footy smarts, and may yet turn out a good coach, but he has no discernible personality. Shows little emotion and has a monotone voice. For superficial types like myself, I am quickly bored by him. Not good for ratings.
Click to expand...

it seems that he's being used as a counterpoint to the increasingly emotional chris scott. scott is the interesting one.... i still cant work out how a player who used a bullying strategy to deal with the opposition is not confronted with it now that he is a coach. You only have to see how he dealt with harry taylor at 3/4 time - used on the couch interview - to wonder how good his interpersonal skills are. However, no one talks about it. They will talk about buckley's past until the cows come home - about his intolerance of failure and figjam stuff - but no one is brave enough to ask chris scott if thinks he might intimidate players with his hyped up attitude. You get a toned down version of him on 360 but he's still confrontational.... he's a bit of a ticking bomb. As I said, I think buckley did him a great service last year protecting his ass......this year might be different.
 
I've probably made a 100 or so posts in this thread bitching about the media. I was thinking to myself that it might be time to say something positive about a medium that can promote the game and can inform people about what is going on.

Recently, I have read a few columns that have met some of the criteria that I set when I'm judging what is good and bad analysis on footy

http://www.theroar.com.au/2017/04/02/lesson-nathan-buckley-must-learn-chairman-mao/

I think this one is good for two reasons. Firstly, he bases his opinions on some facts, and not just what is considered to be "accepted facts" of all the idiots that write about footy in the media. I am sick to death of people writing the same old stuff without any basis for their opinions. Often, these online experts aren't credentialed enough to get into a press conference for an afl game, and chances are, they have never talked to the people involved. Often, they just regurgitate old opinions and "accepted facts" as if they were true. Donald Trump would call it fake news and like Donald, they will say something is true purely because a ton of other people online have said it already.

In contrast, this article makes a point about the 6 day break between games and provides the facts to support reasonable arguments. I'm not saying that the guy is 100% correct. I'm just saying that I'm more likely to agree with his argument, rather than some online self-professed journo who makes a couple of well-worn statements and then calls for a player to be dropped or a coach sacked.

The second reason that I like this article is that he has used this story about chairman mao to add a little interest to article. to show a bit of flair....to indicate that he has spent more than 2 minutes thinking about how he is going to present his case.

http://www.theroar.com.au/2017/03/14/changed-tune-nathan-buckley/

here's another pretty good example on the same subject.... and there are tons of examples of articles about buckley

http://www.theroar.com.au/2016/04/23/the-bust-that-buckley-built/

This example is slightly different. It looks like analysis but it's basically an opinion based on bar-room facts. If you read the article you will see just how short-sighted the writer is, and the article is only one year old. Players like Treloar and Howe who are dismissed by the writer, have proven to be pretty good players in the last year.....and there are others who have done pretty well. Making assessments on players that have just changed clubs or who are under 50 games played, might make good reading in 2016, but it makes an article look short-sighted in 2017.

The reality is the writer probably wrote the article in a half-hour or so and based his thinking on broad sweeping statements and "accepted facts". It might help pay off the mortgage for that week but it's basically a waste of time for the reader....

http://www.theroar.com.au/2017/03/18/collingwood-play-finals-theyve-got-buckleys-chance/

Here's another example by the same guy. He quotes the "accepted fact" that the Pies midfield is the best in the competition and then proceeds to destroy it..... forgetting that it was something put forward by champion data to promote their annual yearbook at the start of the season.... no one believed it, least of all the club itself.

How about this for a load of steaming crap.....

"It doesn’t help that Buckley has made such bold and controversial decisions in his tenure, reshaping a team that had won a premiership just a year before he took over and seemed primed for more success, into one stuck in the muck of mediocrity.

Perhaps he would’ve been better off following the example of Chris Scott, who in a similar situation made only a few minor tweaks and instead focused on revitalising his existing talent."

Who says so? Josh? Forget the fact that the guy has a name that parks him firmly into being a perennial stay at home hipster for the rest of his life....and just consider the basis of those two paragraphs....nada...

I started off saying that I would say something positive about the media....well i did at the start. It's just that there is so much crap around...so forgive me
 
Markfs said:
here's another pretty good example on the same subject.... and there are tons of examples of articles about buckley

http://www.theroar.com.au/2016/04/23/the-bust-that-buckley-built/
Click to expand...

I learnt something from this article, which doesn't happen often when reading footy journalism. It has, as you identify, assembled some information, maybe even some 'facts', undertaken analysis, and drawn some conclusions.

Interesting also that the Pies high performance team do not come up smelling of roses, which is a point often made on here.

The five day break before the Anzac Day game does not augur well.
 
Markfs said:
i'm sure a few people.... well a couple....have seen Mick Malthouse's article about Dale Thomas....
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/a...s/news-story/508ee131f6da9b4d132ace48cda56a47

In some ways, the article writes itself. There is nothing new here. You do have to wonder why a newspaper would pay a person to write on footy when that person seems to be fixated on proving himself to be right and spends every media minute trying to prove that.

Yes, yes, I know about Mick's famous loyalty to his players. Yes I know how he would never coach against his boys....well....let's just put that one to back of the cupboard.. But the question is, is this news? Is it relevant? Is anyone really interested?

As Mick himself says, Thomas was annointed by Ross Lyon as the best player in the league..... but that was 6 years ago. 6 years. Why are we discussing a guy who is a plodder in a plodding team? ok I will move on...

I have to refer to this quote..
"And I love to see my old boys doing well as coaches themselves — currently John Worsfold and Don Pyke."

Well guess who's name is missing from that list... Mick might say that Nathan is not one of the coaches doing well for themselves.... boom boom. Yes, I walked right into that one Mick. Bucks is struggling. Of course, he wouldn't be if he put his pride aside and called Mick and asked for advice.

Truthfully, is this vindictive or just is it just that Mick is in first stage of alzheimers? I would suggest that there are tens, maybe hundreds of footballers out there who wouldnt particularly want to talk to Mick again.... and it probably wouldn't enter into his mind.

I actually think that Mick's thinking has seeped into the culture of the club and has poisoned it in a small way. The fact that Malthouse continually stokes the flames of his bad relationship with Buckley does nothing for the club. Does he care? I doubt it. There's a number of people who believe that Buckley should never have been appointed coach. They might be right. I've felt this way about Malthouse for a few years and it gets stronger every time Mick opens his mouth.
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Mark YES it is vindictive - if you can dig out footage of Malthouse after game interviews where a reporter asks a question he doesn't like just watch Mick's eyes . . . nasty, bitterly vindictive man with an ego the size of a Zepplin.
 
jonbe54 said:
Mark YES it is vindictive - if you can dig out footage of Malthouse after game interviews where a reporter asks a question he doesn't like just watch Mick's eyes . . . nasty, bitterly vindictive man with an ego the size of a Zepplin.
Click to expand...

i'll save that task for a later time in life when i'm stuck in a bed dying and all i have is the internet to keep me company....and of course i'll need to be fixated on the past in a meaningless attempt to prove myself right
 
Vicky Park said:
I learnt something from this article, which doesn't happen often when reading footy journalism. It has, as you identify, assembled some information, maybe even some 'facts', undertaken analysis, and drawn some conclusions.

Interesting also that the Pies high performance team do not come up smelling of roses, which is a point often made on here.

The five day break before the Anzac Day game does not augur well.
Click to expand...

in defence of the moderate performance team, they are not alone in having problems getting the team up after a 6 day break..... a conclusion which the article's facts actually supports.

personally, i think the more a team talks about 6 day breaks and the chances of winning away from home, the less likely they are to win. I say the latter based on the fact that pommie round ball teams travel across a couple of sewers and a few rows of broken down houses, and end up losing away from home on a away ground that is exactly the size of their home ground and probably even consists of the same type of grass.... in short, the mindset appears to be the most important thing
 

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