Martin Hardie: I write the forms... I think Evans ran the program

[Sir Hugh Percy]

What's the email list? I'm still waiting for the explanation of why Geelong 'got off lightly' from this whole business, as Cozzad wrote yesterday. So far there's been a bunch of links about property purchases in Armstrong Creek, the requisite ALP dubiousness, and precious little that ties it all together, or suggests specific wrongdoing by the club.

I wouldn't be too concerned about wrongdoings of the Geelong FC coming to light. This is more about certain dubious connections filling their pockets from property development in and around Geelong, diversifying their interests into a wonderful new opportunity in biotech circa 2011.

 

[CozzaD]

The problem you have is that, on this Board there are some very intelligent people, who have an ability to think logically and see non sequitur stories .

Now, I'd recommend you take your theory to Bay 13 as I'm sure it will get far more traction there

No.

 

[FuManchu]

As one bloke pointed out here yeterday, there are two major things at play, the drug issue, but also the Corporate Governance/Conflict of Interest/Possible Corruption issue.

Before deciding to log on, all this website seemed to be locked onto, was the drugs. The Infraction Notices are not the be all and end all of this, there is still major Corporate Governance/Conflict of Interest/Possible Corruption issues the game needs to address.

Remove the blinkers crew, stop looking at the drugs as the be all and end all. The 'mechanics' as to why we even have an "ASADA issue" at all need to be worked out.

All I get from this is that you're inferring Evan's instigated the whole thing so he could test specific substances on players so he could determine marketability of these products. And that he has friends in high places that are doing their best to prevent this coming out and that Hird whilst complicit doesn't want to be the fall guy.

 

[CozzaD]

All I get from this is that you're inferring Evan's instigated the whole thing so he could test specific substances on players so he could determine marketability of these products. And that he has friends in high places that are doing their best to prevent this coming out and that Hird whilst complicit doesn't want to be the fall guy.

That's not a bad summation at all. Not perfect, but not bad at all...

 

[TerryWallet]

As one bloke pointed out here yeterday, there are two major things at play, the drug issue, but also the Corporate Governance/Conflict of Interest/Possible Corruption issue.

Before deciding to log on, all this website seemed to be locked onto, was the drugs. The Infraction Notices are not the be all and end all of this, there is still major Corporate Governance/Conflict of Interest/Possible Corruption issues the game needs to address.

Remove the blinkers crew, stop looking at the drugs as the be all and end all. The 'mechanics' as to why we even have an "ASADA issue" at all need to be worked out.

Stop looking at Hird folks................Look over there............and there

 

[Hinkley Power]

No I don't.... but ask yourself why the tape was made in the first place? It was made after Ratten cracked it after Ess-Carl in April/May 2012, when Ratten sent his fitness crew to work out how Ess got so bulked up. Ratten has largely kept his counsel since ASADA broke, he should be spoken to. it's a fair assumption to say thatBombers Carl, via Ratten, smelt a rat.

so the blues and Reimers know what the Essendon players were injected with, but nobody at the Bombers, including the players know anything about what was in the syringes?

and then the blues lost the tape

 

[morgoth]

No I don't.... but ask yourself why the tape was made in the first place? It was made after Ratten cracked it after Ess-Carl in April/May 2012, when Ratten sent his fitness crew to work out how Ess got so bulked up. Ratten has largely kept his counsel since ASADA broke, he should be spoken to. it's a fair assumption to say that Carl, via Ratten, smelt a rat.

That has been confirmed. What is not know is that Carlton went to the AFL with their concerns/findings. And I have got that from a very connected source at Carlton.

 

[TerryWallet]

The problem you have is that, on this Board there are some very intelligent people, who have an ability to think logically and see non sequitur stories .

Now, I'd recommend you take your theory to Bay 13 as I'm sure it will get far more traction there

Bay 13 has the great bulk of the smartest people on BigFooty.

If a somewhat cretin audience is the goal....the main board is more his destination.

Bay 13 would rip him apart.

 

[FuManchu]

No I don't.... but ask yourself why the tape was made in the first place? It was made after Ratten cracked it after Ess-Carl in April/May 2012, when Ratten sent his fitness crew to work out how Ess got so bulked up. Ratten has largely kept his counsel since ASADA broke, he should be spoken to. it's a fair assumption to say that Carl, via Ratten, smelt a rat.

Added to that, that the friends in high places have an interest in the investment financially

 

[CozzaD]

That has been confirmed. What is not known is that Carlton went to the AFL with their concerns/findings. And I have got that from a very connected source at Carlton.

Go on....

 

[CozzaD]

Added to that, that the friends in high places have an interest in the investment financially

A loose and broad statement.....but has some kick to it.

 

[morgoth]

Go on....

Noting more to really add that I consider to be factual.

But you can bet the AFL looked into it and it was not long after that Vlad made his comments regarding sports scientists being witch doctors.

The AFL knew all along it was Essendon in the gun by the ACC, hence why Vlad could want Evans. But it is correct to say the ACC did not tell him, they did not need, Vlad already knew.

 

[FuManchu]

A

A loose and broad statement.....but has some kick to it.

And that they knew that a bunch of footballers were unknowing lab rats for substances not yet approved.

 

[CozzaD]

There's nothing terribly odd about all that, Cozza. If you can connect it more solidly to obvious or apparent attempts to influence ASADA, from beyond the EFC, OK. And, I'm still interested.

I've long thought Kelty was heavily conflicted, and there were examples of him discarding his commissioner's hat, in favour of parochial and impassioned advocacy for the EFC and its coach. One or the other, Bill, one or the other.

I also know Wiley got bitch slapped for his attempts, by a very solidly principled citizen involved in the management ranks in the ACT sporting community (ASC, AIS and ASADSA). What's more, he hasn't said "boo" since the slapping, and the lesser mortals in the ACT were more than chuffed they no longer have to put up with Wiley's heavy handed and belligerent instructions to them, to look the other way.

But, like I said, if you firm up the connections you're pointing to, I'm all ears. I just want to understand what happened, in its entirety.

Interesting you raise ACT Sports Community, the data presented down the track does lead to the ACT (non Fed Parliament). But appreciate you're trying to join the links, and trying to read the data.

 

[CozzaD]

A
And that they knew that a bunch of footballers were unknowing lab rats for substances not yet approved.

I'm not doing yesterday's trick again.

 

[Gigantor]

View attachment 92120

Is Farrago still kicking?

 

[CozzaD]

Noting more to really add that I consider to be factual.

But you can bet the AFL looked into it and it was not long after that Vlad made his comments regarding sports scientists being witch doctors.

The AFL knew all along it was Essendon in the gun by the ACC, hence why Vlad could want Evans. But it is correct to say the ACC did not tell him, they did not need, Vlad already knew.

Did they? With Kelty an AFL Commissioner, and a Board Member of David Evans private company, it could have been shut down...... Just saying......

 

[morgoth]

Did they? With Kelty an AFL Commissioner, and a Board Member of David Evans private company, it could have been shut down...... Just saying......

Does not change the fact they knew.

 

[CozzaD]

Does not change the fact they knew.

No it doesn't, but the next question would be, how did they handle the data, once they had it?

 

[Gigantor]

As one bloke pointed out here yeterday, there are two major things at play, the drug issue, but also the Corporate Governance/Conflict of Interest/Possible Corruption issue.

Before deciding to log on, all this website seemed to be locked onto, was the drugs. The Infraction Notices are not the be all and end all of this, there is still major Corporate Governance/Conflict of Interest/Possible Corruption issues the game needs to address.

Remove the blinkers crew, stop looking at the drugs as the be all and end all. The 'mechanics' as to why we even have an "ASADA issue" at all need to be worked out.

Cozza mate, I can assure you (and I'm sure the majority will vouch for me on this one) I am as receptive as anyone to a yarn aiming to diverge from the "drugs" (because I don't really give a damn that the players may have been taking mickey mouse roids).

But, I still like to see a bit of a flow to the yarn, so to speak.

So, we have:
1. dodgy land deals and certain well connected individuals creaming super-profits from some good old fashioned clientelism, we can all see that and acknowledge it;
2. people of interest crop up at the start of the Essendon supplements scandal, PR firm closely connected to the ALP is involved, yeh, ok, we can see that;
3. but where is this yarn heading? I can't quite see that bit yet;
4. if it's heading towards the same side of politics putting undue pressure on ASADA to get a particular result, then that would close the loop nicely and we'd have an interesting, complete yarn worth talking about. Is that where you are heading with this?

 

[Gigantor]

Interesting you raise ACT Sports Community, the data presented down the track does lead to the ACT (non Fed Parliament). But appreciate you're trying to join the links, and trying to read the data.

The little ol' ACT Legislative Assembly is involved now?

 

[NikkiNoo]

No it doesn't, but the next question would be, how did they handle the data, once they had it?

They contacted ASADA to look more closely at a particular club. Which ASADA did do target testing of and found elevated levels but no positive tests (as the specific drugs suspected there are not tests available).

 

[morgoth]

No it doesn't, but the next question would be, how did they handle the data, once they had it?

My personal view is that they sought to manage it, get Dank out (which did happen) and sweep it under the carpet. From their point of view the matter had been fixed, the program had stopped the guy behind it was gone and no one knew and the brand/AFL was intact.

But then the ACC stepped in and it ended up being out of the AFL's control.

 

[morgoth]

I should add there is one other piece of the supps scandal that the media seems to have either over-looked or missed.

What would happen if a senior person at the club, with the operation of footy employees like Dank and Robinson under his supervision was not able to operate at 100% and this let them off the chain (so to speak).

 

[Gigantor]

They contacted ASADA to look more closely at a particular club. Which ASADA did do target testing of and found elevated levels but no positive tests (as the specific drugs suspected there are not tests available).

One small clarification: the club ASADA first tested on was not the EFC (that was in 2011). It was those tests which came back elevated, but still negative. ASADA then tested on the EFC the following year, and those tests came back negative.