I guess if we could find a keeper who could bat at six we could play marsh as a bowling allrounder who bats at seven, would primarily be on our flatter pitches and he would need to be judged more on his bowling than batting on those tracks.
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Mitchell Marsh
- Thread starter JG22
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- May 5, 2014
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He's a bowler. Not an allrounder. His batting technique is good for a no. 7 or 8, but not much better.
On his performances, he just doesn't have the ability to replace a batsmen and considering how poor our batsmen are, except for Labu and Smith, we need all the batsmen we can get.
On his performances, he just doesn't have the ability to replace a batsmen and considering how poor our batsmen are, except for Labu and Smith, we need all the batsmen we can get.
Boycott said that in 2015, said on TMS that Aus had read him wrong and that he's a frontline test bowler.
He would have been handy in the sides with gilly, bat him at 7 and gilly at 6 just treat him like handy lower order hitter and use him as a frontline 4th quick.
Unless we find that keeper who can bat 6 it's just hard to see how we pick marsh, is he really good enough to take a frontline quick like patto/starc/richardsons spot in a 4 man attack?
In this current side we just don't have the batting to pick him as a 5th bowling option not when he averages 25 after 5 years of test cricket.
Unless we find that keeper who can bat 6 it's just hard to see how we pick marsh, is he really good enough to take a frontline quick like patto/starc/richardsons spot in a 4 man attack?
In this current side we just don't have the batting to pick him as a 5th bowling option not when he averages 25 after 5 years of test cricket.
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Marsh is truly talented but better suited to the slap happy forms of the game.
Have you watched him bowl? His line and length is far better suited to test cricket.
- Jun 23, 2008
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I don't think it was me that made the original comment you're referring to from that long ago, but I have said in the past that I think the way forward for him would be to focus more on his bowling. His batting has largely been potential rather than output for nearly all of his career, at least in the long form of the game.
His Shield record with the ball is very overlooked, and his batting gets very over-rated and over-highlighted:
Batting - 28.44 average (4 hundreds, 11 fifties, 9 ducks)
Bowling - 29.51 average, 51.9 strike rate, 3.41 economy rate (1 5-fer)
To be fair, he hasn't and doesn't bowl in the volume of many other front-liners, but if he was used as a front-line bowler, or very much a bowling all-rounder, I reckon that might be the way forward for him.
I think he's been held back from bowling a lot due to injury fears, but I think it's time now to throw caution to the wind and go for broke career-wise, and perhaps explore being more of a bowler. I mean, looking at his Shield numbers with the bat, if there wasn't so much of a focus on him being an all-rounder, and our "need" for an all-rounder, would anyone really care less about his batting? I mean, someone like Moises Henriques has a batting average in Shield cricket that's genuinely a lot higher (35.95), while having a respectable bowling average (32.52), and he's not someone who has ever been given much of a go in that #6 bat/#5 bowler spot (despite probably being most suited to that type of role). Marsh's batting record in Shield cricket is more of the level of James Faulkner (29.47 batting average) and Jack Wildermuth (28.20 batting average), genuine #7-#8 all-rounder types, and nobody thinks they're realistic shots at the Test side due to their batting.
In general, it seems in the Australian "search for an all-rounder" over the past 15-20-odd years, their bowling is under-valued and under-utilised, and it's often about bringing their batting up to scratch. That's probably due to a lot of the all-round prospects being a bit injury-prone and us needing batsmen more than another bowler. We need to ask ourselves, in the long form, do we want a genuine all-rounder, or just a #6 batsman who can average 40+ with the willow and respectably keep the runs down with a few random overs as the 5th bowler?
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- Jun 23, 2008
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Couldn't we just try it? Would it really make any difference? Or just shift the focus/criticism to the #6 keeper, and make Marsh's output more palatable?
100% right, if that’s the case Henriques would be the better option.
We are trying to put a round peg in a square hole.
If we had even a haddin level batsmen, you could probably go with Marsh as a 7 or 8. He’d probably prosper more lower down the order.
Seems very strange to try and use a guy who can bowl 140km as a part timer to rest the quicks and a guy who averages less than 30 at first class level with the bat in the top 6.
Test cricket is a hard enough game trying to do one thing well, without trying to have something you are less good at being your main focus.
- Jun 23, 2008
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And that's the thing, for the role Marsh has previously been asked to play, Henriques would have been a much better bet over the past few years.
If we're actually going to use our all-rounder for their batting and bowling, then that changes things, and Marsh suddenly has more value and is more "worthy" of being in the side, particularly on the back of his performance in this ongoing match.
This guy could be a really good swing bowler. Gee he'd be dangerous with a new ball. Would certainly consider him as an opening bowler at T20 cricket and perhaps as an ODI bowler.
He's just not a batsman at test level. He's not an all rounder. He's a fast-medium outswing bowler who can bat/slog a bit.
It's time we re-labeled him and started playing him for what he is.
He's just not a batsman at test level. He's not an all rounder. He's a fast-medium outswing bowler who can bat/slog a bit.
It's time we re-labeled him and started playing him for what he is.
That's the rub of it really. We're desperate for batters to fit into the top 6, regardless of how well they can bowl. Marsh hasn't shown anything at Test level or at First Class to suggest he has what we need. If we're picking him for his bowling, he has to be put up against the likes of Cummins, Hazelwood, Pattinson etc.
yeah 100%. Ridiculous to pick him as an all-rounder considering we already have one in Labushange.
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TheBrownDog
He's always been a bowling allrounder, but not much more of an allrounder than Cummins/Starc. His batting has never been up to it.
Hope he can score some runs today.
We have Harris and Warner at the top of the order offering nothing with the bat or ball. Yet people are focused on M Marsh.
Australian batting is in disarray, we need to understand as a collective why we are struggling and stop focusing on individual players.
We have Harris and Warner at the top of the order offering nothing with the bat or ball. Yet people are focused on M Marsh.
Australian batting is in disarray, we need to understand as a collective why we are struggling and stop focusing on individual players.
There has been tons of talk about the openers and their poor form.
You can’t carry a batsman who averages 19 away just because he can take a wicket or two each game. Once again, farcical he’s in the team.
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I don’t care how well he bowls. He is not and will never be a Test 6. 30 Tests is a lot of time trying to work out the obvious.
- Jun 22, 2014
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Bloke needs to become a proper bowling all-rounder who can campaigner it around, and bat at no. 8. He absolutely cannot be in the top 6. You need 6 actual batsmen when we have about 2.5-3 if you give Wade and head 0.5 or so. Need to find some long-term openers and maybe blood pucovski or someone else for no. 5-6. Keeper is also an issue, is Carey the answer or is it someone like Phillipe? A lot of questions to be asked; with a long-term no. 3 and our pace bowling unit being the ones answered this series. 1, 2, 5?, 6?, 7 all up for grabs. Hopefully some young blokes stand up in the shield
- Jan 13, 2015
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surely a test all rounder gets picked purely on one skill set alone.
he's neither a top 6 test batsman nor in our best 4 bowlers.
32 tests is enough surely.
don't mind him in white ball cricket though.
he's neither a top 6 test batsman nor in our best 4 bowlers.
32 tests is enough surely.
don't mind him in white ball cricket though.
Disagree, he's the only one who can swing the ball. He's ahead of Siddle in the bowling department. There's no reason as a bowling allrounder he can't come in at 8 or even 7 behind a keeper-batsman who can actually score runs. That could be Wade.
- Jan 13, 2015
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i'm not sold on marsh playing #8 as a 3rd quick though.
he may well be ahead of siddle these days in the bowling department but not ahead of patto or starc (whose batting is actually compariable to marsh).