NRL charges the forgotten 5, Update 23/4- 3 take deal ban until sept. 2 plead guilty contest penalty

[Sir Hugh Percy]

They all got SCN's notices when the other 12 did and I think they have already been placed on the ROF.

I am pretty sure it was mentioned in ASADA's annual report

Err, ok then. Play on...

 

[Lavender Bushranger]

Yes it is.Once the players are placed on the register of findings then it is up to the NRL to issue the infraction notices.

But how long will the relevant anti-doping authority wait until they tap them on the shoulder?
It seems ridiculous that ASADA and/or WADA wouldn't have wanted to know WTF nothing had happened yet.

Ditto Bock and Robinson.

 

[imperial_oz]

I still cannot get over the fact Dank took Hird to meet a convicted drug dealer on the Gold Coast and absolutely nothing was done about it.

I dont believe this BS about him putting his trust in Dank.He was 100% complicit

Thats certainly a possibility but without real evidence that Hird actually intended and ran a program involving PEDs then all you can do is suppose. You certainly cannot take action based on a vibe.

 

[Lance Uppercut]

I still cannot get over the fact Dank took Hird to meet a convicted drug dealer on the Gold Coast and absolutely nothing was done about it.

I dont believe this BS about him putting his trust in Dank.He was 100% complicit

I can't see how anyone can argue with this. Whatever went down, be it accidentally crossing a line or wilfully cheating on the down low, Hird was undoubtedly completely aware of it and involved in its genesis. *shrugs* Even as a Bombers fan and one-time James groupie I can't really see how you can avoid coming to that conclusion if you dispassionately examine the facts, particularly if you're pragmatic and aware of concepts such as plausible deniability

 

[Laphroaig]

I can't see how anyone can argue with this. Whatever went down, be it accidentally crossing a line or wilfully cheating on the down low, Hird was undoubtedly completely aware of it and involved in its genesis. *shrugs* Even as a Bombers fan and one-time James groupie I can't really see how you can avoid coming to that conclusion if you dispassionately examine the facts, particularly if you're pragmatic and aware of concepts such as plausible deniability

Braveheart.

 

[Laphroaig]

Thats certainly a possibility but without real evidence that Hird actually intended and ran a program involving PEDs then all you can do is suppose. You certainly cannot take action based on a vibe.

There is an entitlement to form an opinion though.....

 

[Andrew Mc]

Agree with that for the most part but its not really that simple.

Yeah Dank is the biggest single factor, he's an established cheat and he's wrecked CLUBS for years to come but why didn't the players check. They had the chance, they had the opportunity and they had the obligation. Sure Dank is all you say he is and more but the players and club cannot walk away from their own failures. It would be good for all concerned if they could but it simply isn't possible.

Don't agree so much with that part of it. Cronulla are back on the way up, having made the finals last year (they even won one). It's pretty much back to normal for them after a few seasons. Essendon wrecked themselves by denying the obvious and dragging it out.

Just to note, the NRL players are:

Colin Best - age 37, retired 2012.
Paul Aiton - age 30, hasn't played in the NRL since 2011, currently playing in France.
Ben Pomeroy - age 32, hasn't played in the NRL since 2012, currently playing in France.
John Williams - age 27, retired 2012.
Stuart Flanagan - age 29, retired 2011.

So, they're gone, and the NRL probably don't care too much. Hard to know why they didn't take the deal with the others - at least it'd be over now for them.

 

[Andrew Mc]

Which begs the question just what has he got on him that makes him so damn teflon in the two major codes in the country?????

Complicity.

 

[imperial_oz]

There is an entitlement to form an opinion though.....

Hahaha we had this discussion a few days ago. That isn't always true

In this case however, I think that opinion would not be without justification. Its not enough to take it any further though was the point I was making but it would be a point worthy of thorough investigation

 

[threesixpio]

Don't agree so much with that part of it. Cronulla are back on the way up, having made the finals last year (they even won one). It's pretty much back to normal for them after a few seasons. Essendon wrecked themselves by denying the obvious and dragging it out.

Just to note, the NRL players are:

Colin Best - age 37, retired 2012.
Paul Aiton - age 30, hasn't played in the NRL since 2011, currently playing in France.
Ben Pomeroy - age 32, hasn't played in the NRL since 2012, currently playing in France.
John Williams - age 27, retired 2012.
Stuart Flanagan - age 29, retired 2011.

So, they're gone, and the NRL probably don't care too much. Hard to know why they didn't take the deal with the others - at least it'd be over now for them.

The two Frenchies might be banned. Is the equivalent code over there signed up to WADA?

Finding of guilt for doping can be relied upon to ban a player from playing (somewhere else).

Always wondered why that provision was there - a signatory may rely upon a finding of guilt. Seemed unnecessary

Der moment for me

 

[Andrew Mc]

The two Frenchies might be banned. Is the equivalent code over there signed up to WADA?

They are playing for Catalan, which I forgot is actually part of the UK Super League series. And yeah, that does fall under WADA.

 

[Armchair Critic]

Thats certainly a possibility but without real evidence that Hird actually intended and ran a program involving PEDs then all you can do is suppose. You certainly cannot take action based on a vibe.

My comment regarding nothing being done about it was relating to Hird not reporting it up the chain .

I realise it is not enough for action by ASADA but in reality if meeting a convicted drug importer on the GC isnt a red flag then you are either completely stupid or 100 % complicit

 

[andrewb]

I can't see how anyone can argue with this. Whatever went down, be it accidentally crossing a line or wilfully cheating on the down low, Hird was undoubtedly completely aware of it and involved in its genesis. *shrugs* Even as a Bombers fan and one-time James groupie I can't really see how you can avoid coming to that conclusion if you dispassionately examine the facts, particularly if you're pragmatic and aware of concepts such as plausible deniability

There's zero evidence that Hird wanted to willfully cheat on the down low, plenty of evidence that he, Evans and other key players wanted to go right to the edge of the rules (in everything they were doing).

Going to the edge is what elite sport is about. Identifying risks and doing proper mitigation is supposed to be what running an organisation is about.

The bare faced fact that people were aware of the practices and didn't acknowledge the catastrophic risks is an indictment on all involved.

 

[Cronos]

There's zero evidence that Hird wanted to willfully cheat on the down low, plenty of evidence that he, Evans and other key players wanted to go right to the edge of the rules (in everything they were doing).

So, Hird never spoke to a New York pharmacist about an undetectable steroid cream then?

 

[andrewb]

So, Hird never spoke to a New York pharmacist about an undetectable steroid cream then?

According to Robinson Hird also sank the titanic.

How the * Dean Robinson hasn't been suspended despite clear evidence that he injected Bock with a banned substance is completely beyond me.

 

[Cronos]

According to Robinson Hird also sank the titanic.

How the **** Dean Robinson hasn't been suspended despite clear evidence that he injected Bock with a banned substance is completely beyond me.

How the **** James Mother****ing Hird hasn't been suspended despite clear evidence that he signed up a guy who made his living doping sportspeople and convicted drug importers to dope his entire team is completely beyond me... But then again, this isn't finished yet.

 

[Lance Uppercut]

There's zero evidence that Hird wanted to willfully cheat on the down low, plenty of evidence that he, Evans and other key players wanted to go right to the edge of the rules (in everything they were doing).

Going to the edge is what elite sport is about. Identifying risks and doing proper mitigation is supposed to be what running an organisation is about.

The bare faced fact that people were aware of the practices and didn't acknowledge the catastrophic risks is an indictment on all involved.

I dunno man, I wouldn't say there's zero evidence, but there's certainly plausible deniability.

Look, Hird is one of the fiercest competitors of all time. He obviously burns inside to win. He believes other teams cheat, and he's probably right. It's not that big a leap

 

[andrewb]

I dunno man, I wouldn't say there's zero evidence, but there's certainly plausible deniability.

Look, Hird is one of the fiercest competitors of all time. He obviously burns inside to win. He believes other teams cheat, and he's probably right. It's not that big a leap

It's a huge leap. If they were setting out to cheat they wouldn't have ****ed around with TB4 when they had the means to source growth hormone. They were clearly trying to exploit the grey.

They failed.

I get the feeling that Dank still thinks that he didn't break the rules.

 

[Lance Uppercut]

It's a huge leap. If they were setting out to cheat they wouldn't have stuffed around with TB4 when they had the means to source growth hormone. They were clearly trying to exploit the grey.

They failed.

I get the feeling that Dank still thinks that he didn't break the rules.

well it depends whether you think using a loophole to get around S0 is cheating or exploiting a grey area I guess.

 

[andrewb]

well it depends whether you think using a loophole to get around S0 is cheating or exploiting a grey area I guess.

I put it in the same category as deliberately rushing behinds, handballing when you're about to be tackled, shepherding the man on the mark, guarding the protected area, tunnelling, blocking the defender on leads, etc.

The only difference is the moral outrage that people attach to injections and doping.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

About ******* time.

 

[imperial_oz]

According to Robinson Hird also sank the titanic.

How the **** Dean Robinson hasn't been suspended despite clear evidence that he injected Bock with a banned substance is completely beyond me.

There are a few things about all this that I'm having trouble understanding. Maybe there is insufficient evidence regarding Bock for ASADA to lodge the paperwork with the AFL. Maybe?

Its also odd that Dank is the only support person tackled by ASADA. Again, maybe its a lack of evidence.

But why hasn't anybody really gone after Dank. ASADA went with a bunch of charges but they also didn't use their coercive powers on him. At least, attempt to get him to respond. The club, the players, the AFL and AFLPA have all said Dank is the one behind it all but nobody has done anything to get information from him.

Has he got photos of everybody in the industry with a goat or something. To me, its just crazy not to at least try.

 

[Muggs]

There are a few things about all this that I'm having trouble understanding. Maybe there is insufficient evidence regarding Bock for ASADA to lodge the paperwork with the AFL. Maybe?

Its also odd that Dank is the only support person tackled by ASADA. Again, maybe its a lack of evidence.

But why hasn't anybody really gone after Dank. ASADA went with a bunch of charges but they also didn't use their coercive powers on him. At least, attempt to get him to respond. The club, the players, the AFL and AFLPA have all said Dank is the one behind it all but nobody has done anything to get information from him.

Has he got photos of everybody in the industry with a goat or something. To me, its just crazy not to at least try.

ASADA did try and go after Dank.

The start of the supreme court trial with Alavi and Charter was interesting, he was also named "as a support person" the court sheriff even went out the room to call out support person.

ASADA presented an affidavit outlining letters from different set of lawyers claiming they no longer represent Dank, they tried different email address to get hold of him, as well as different physical address for no response.

This news story makes reference to it

"Mr Star tendered an affidavit outlining ASADA’s attempts to serve notice of the court action on the support person - believed to be Stephen Dank - also facing tribunal action.

Mr Star said ASADA had not yet been successful in serving notice on Dank."

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/a...a/news-story/de97ed9d44fef60c638b673c8e03a665

Social litigator makes reference the Surpeme court case was to get 3 people to testify.
http://sociallitigator.com/2014/12/...lication-no-lay-down-misere-in-supreme-court/

ASADA tried to subpoena his companies records and were denied.

 

[Satan]

There are a few things about all this that I'm having trouble understanding. Maybe there is insufficient evidence regarding Bock for ASADA to lodge the paperwork with the AFL. Maybe?

Its also odd that Dank is the only support person tackled by ASADA. Again, maybe its a lack of evidence.

But why hasn't anybody really gone after Dank. ASADA went with a bunch of charges but they also didn't use their coercive powers on him. At least, attempt to get him to respond. The club, the players, the AFL and AFLPA have all said Dank is the one behind it all but nobody has done anything to get information from him.

Has he got photos of everybody in the industry with a goat or something. To me, its just crazy not to at least try.

One of the many unanswered questions , asada may have thought if they get him on a life ban on some charges , another 8 life bans are a waste of resources, bit like multiply fraud charges going down to one?

 

[ajb72]

There's zero evidence that Hird wanted to willfully cheat on the down low, plenty of evidence that he, Evans and other key players wanted to go right to the edge of the rules (in everything they were doing).

Going to the edge is what elite sport is about. Identifying risks and doing proper mitigation is supposed to be what running an organisation is about.

The bare faced fact that people were aware of the practices and didn't acknowledge the catastrophic risks is an indictment on all involved.

See there you have been brainwashed.

There is no edge. There is banned and there is not-banned.

The edge (line) is a bs story.