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Analysis Observation regarding Don Pyke

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tiggsy

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Whenever a new coach comes on the scene I like to try and work out some of their skills/attitudes/beliefs and what it might mean for the club. When Walshy ( :( ) joined the club, I noticed how he made really simple observations about the game where I'd think it was an obvious point but I'd never thought of it before. A sort of genius for making complex things into simple things. An example was when he said a long kicking team will tend to have a poorer disposal efficiency than a team that focusses on short kicks and handballs. So you would expect disposal efficiency to be affected by the game plan. With Walshy's focus on a long kicking game, our disposal efficiency was lower than other clubs. Comparing between clubs isn't really an apples to apples comparison as game style will influence disposal efficiency. Obvious when somebody says it but not something I'd realised before. Anyway, that was an example of Phil's thinking that I liked.

Now we have Don Pyke and I'm interested in what he brings to the table. A really interesting thing that I've heard him say a couple of times is that every player on an AFL list is very good at something. They wouldn't be there otherwise. So you need to work out what they are good at and how you can use that. It's a pretty different approach if you compare it to a coach developing a game plan and requiring the players to shape their skills to the plan. Don said some players can hit a target at 60 metres while others might only hit a target reliably at 40 metres. So the question that raises for me is why would you have game plan that requires players to hit targets at 40 metre or 60 metres when it would depend on which player had the ball? You reduce the effectiveness of long kicking players if you limit them to 40 metres and your disposal efficiency will suffer if your game plan requires players with shorter kicks to hit targets at long range.

Based on the above, Don Pyke's game plan would need to include flexibility to react to a situation depending on their unique skills. It was interesting to hear Brad Crouch say that Don encouraged flexibility in how players played and that was something Brad really liked. From a basic psychology point of view, people tend to be happy doing things that they are good at. Pyke has also said he wants the players to play what is ahead of them. This also seems to reflect a coach who encourages flexibility and creativity.

Anyway, given all of the above, it would be interesting to see what strengths people think some of our players have and how we might make better use of that strength. An example might be Jarryd Lyons who has beautiful hands in close and is great at clearances. But he isn't that fast which limits his ability to get to the contest and use his strength to best effect. So how do you shape his role so you get the best outcome from his strength? Do you put him in for centre bounces where you know his ability at the clearance is good? Do you then have him move into the forward line where you have players that aren't great contested marks but can bring the ball to ground so that you can again exploit JL's strengths? Anyway, interested in thoughts on my observations and any suggestions for how we might make better use of our players' strengths.

Sorry for the long post :)
 
Whenever a new coach comes on the scene I like to try and work out some of their skills/attitudes/beliefs and what it might mean for the club. When Walshy ( :( ) joined the club, I noticed how he made really simple observations about the game where I'd think it was an obvious point but I'd never thought of it before. A sort of genius for making complex things into simple things. An example was when he said a long kicking team will tend to have a poorer disposal efficiency than a team that focusses on short kicks and handballs. So you would expect disposal efficiency to be affected by the game plan. With Walshy's focus on a long kicking game, our disposal efficiency was lower than other clubs. Comparing between clubs isn't really an apples to apples comparison as game style will influence disposal efficiency. Obvious when somebody says it but not something I'd realised before. Anyway, that was an example of Phil's thinking that I liked.

Now we have Don Pyke and I'm interested in what he brings to the table. A really interesting thing that I've heard him say a couple of times is that every player on an AFL list is very good at something. They wouldn't be there otherwise. So you need to work out what they are good at and how you can use that. It's a pretty different approach if you compare it to a coach developing a game plan and requiring the players to shape their skills to the plan. Don said some players can hit a target at 60 metres while others might only hit a target reliably at 40 metres. So the question that raises for me is why would you have game plan that requires players to hit targets at 40 metre or 60 metres when it would depend on which player had the ball? You reduce the effectiveness of long kicking players if you limit them to 40 metres and your disposal efficiency will suffer if your game plan requires players with shorter kicks to hit targets at long range.

Based on the above, Don Pyke's game plan would need to include flexibility to react to a situation depending on their unique skills. It was interesting to hear Brad Crouch say that Don encouraged flexibility in how players played and that was something Brad really liked. From a basic psychology point of view, people tend to be happy doing things that they are good at. Pyke has also said he wants the players to play what is ahead of them. This also seems to reflect a coach who encourages flexibility and creativity.

Anyway, given all of the above, it would be interesting to see what strengths people think some of our players have and how we might make better use of that strength. An example might be Jarryd Lyons who has beautiful hands in close and is great at clearances. But he isn't that fast which limits his ability to get to the contest and use his strength to best effect. So how do you shape his role so you get the best outcome from his strength? Do you put him in for centre bounces where you know his ability at the clearance is good? Do you then have him move into the forward line where you have players that aren't great contested marks but can bring the ball to ground so that you can again exploit JL's strengths? Anyway, interested in thoughts on my observations and any suggestions for how we might make better use of our players' strengths.

Sorry for the long post :)

I play squash very regularly and one of the club owners who is an extremely good player and junior champ in his day told me once that every player of every level does one thing very well and he try's to adapt that one thing into his game. Maybe the ability to be able to see that and apply it to their game is what makes the difference between an amateur and professional.
 
I play squash very regularly and one of the club owners who is an extremely good player and junior champ in his day told me once that every player of every level does one thing very well and he try's to adapt that one thing into his game. Maybe the ability to be able to see that and apply it to their game is what makes the difference between an amateur and professional.

I think this is on the money

One of the hallmarks of an elite performer is that they make less mistakes than the average performer. In particular less unforced mistakes

Another way of saying that is rather than try to improve the things that you make mistakes at, focus on your strengths and don't do those things that you would make a mistake at

Good post OP
 
It's always an unknown account that actually sticks their head out on the chopping block with an opinion.

You're only as good as your worst training session.
 

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Seems like Don has also created a relaxed environment around the club and is an approachable guy which IMO also makes for a good coach. At the end of the day you want to bring out the best in every player. Empowering them to make their own decisions makes sense. Although some players probably need more guidance.
 
It's always an unknown account that actually sticks their head out on the chopping block with an opinion.

Over the 10 years I've been on BigFooty I've stuck my head out a couple of times with an opinion. They are usually too long so don't get many responses :)
 
Based on the above, Don Pyke's game plan would need to include flexibility to react to a situation depending on their unique skills. It was interesting to hear Brad Crouch say that Don encouraged flexibility in how players played and that was something Brad really liked. From a basic psychology point of view, people tend to be happy doing things that they are good at. Pyke has also said he wants the players to play what is ahead of them. This also seems to reflect a coach who encourages flexibility and creativity.
Is this why Mackay has suddenly got impetus... after all these yearso_O?
 
Seems like Don has also created a relaxed environment around the club and is an approachable guy which IMO also makes for a good coach. At the end of the day you want to bring out the best in every player. Empowering them to make their own decisions makes sense. Although some players probably need more guidance.

He's certainly giving us confidence to date.
Can we use it for 4 quarters today?
 
I feel like people have been reserved in their judgements on Pyke so far. Positive no doubt but in the fallout of Phil Walsh theres been this respect to Phil to not want to over embrace the new guy.

Maybe we don't want to fall in love again so soon/easily. Maybe we still feel like Phil was the best coach we could have and even if this bloke is good, its still a consolation prize.

Well now i feel like its time to move over that hump, or more to me time we can.

Pyke has done an outstanding job. Based on output of what we got from Phil and Pyke there is no real good reason to feel like our future will be less than what it would have been with Phil.

I loved Phil, still do. Whatever success this group of players have I have no doubt that Phil will have a huge part in it. The way he redirected not only the players but the club. (and also the way the tragedy also shaped the group unfortunately). But for the 1st time I don't feel like as a club our future is going to be worse because of the loss.

Over to you Pykie...
 
Pyke is one of the most mature, calm, rational coaches in the league at the moment. Now, that doesn't mean much given Clarkson is king at the moment and he's anything but these things.

However, I think he was the perfect replacement for this reason given the unfortunate circumstances. I just feel like he says the right things, even after our loss. Lots of water to go under the bridge but he feels like a safe pair of hands. It's about time this club grew a pair.
 
I think it is hard to praise Pyke for fear of looking like we are suggesting Walshy was not doing the right things as coach.
Walsh was doing his own thing, and it laid the foundations to a semi final. That'll be his legacy - it looked promising, but it was unfulfilled.

There's definitely an awkwardness about discussion of Pyke. I've said it before but I think we just have to acknowledge that Walsh was a part of where we are now. He was part of the change our club undertook. Pyke is another piece of that. When we praise Pyke it won't be that he's doing it better, it'll be that he's doing good things. Hope we can move on from this discomfort and embrace our coach for what he is and what he's doing, not for why he's here.

Ultimately, he is a part of the family now.
 
I think it is hard to praise Pyke for fear of looking like we are suggesting Walshy was not doing the right things as coach.
What? That's ridiculous.

Walsh was solid in his short reign. However, his biggest contribution will be the systems he put in place around the club and the team first ethos he instilled, both of which will endure. He wasn't perfect though and there's no harm admitting that.

For mine he placed too much emphasis on ground ball. I thought some of our best wins under Walsh were early doors, we looked most balanced inside and out and the press was ferocious, but we lost ground ball and Walshy grumbled about it.

I still love the guy and bow before the critical role he played in rebuilding us as a club. But praising Pyke does not equate to demeaning Walsh in any way.

Pyke is benefiting from the heavy lifting Walshy did when we were a rabble and has stated as much quite openly. He's walked into an outfit that was well oiled and ready to go.
 

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What? That's ridiculous.

Walsh was solid in his short reign. However, his biggest contribution will be the systems he put in place around the club and the team first ethos he instilled, both of which will endure. He wasn't perfect though and there's no harm admitting that.

For mine he placed too much emphasis on ground ball. I thought some of our best wins under Walsh were early doors, we looked most balanced inside and out and the press was ferocious, but we lost ground ball and Walshy grumbled about it.

I still love the guy and bow before the critical role he played in rebuilding us as a club. But praising Pyke does not equate to demeaning Walsh in any way.

Pyke is benefiting from the heavy lifting Walshy did when we were a rabble and has stated as much quite openly. He's walked into an outfit that was well oiled and ready to go.
I think you guys are on the same page (and the page I was on making my initial post).

Phil wasn't perfect. Pyle will be better in some (? many) ways.

But the commentary is laced with this feel on not wanting to look to talk negatively about Phil or not wanting ti accept/admit that Phil was anything less than the perfect coach for us.

The more we see of Pyke, the more it is obvious that while he will guide us differently it is ok to feel that we aren't necessarily worse off, or could even be better
 
I play squash very regularly and one of the club owners who is an extremely good player and junior champ in his day told me once that every player of every level does one thing very well and he try's to adapt that one thing into his game. Maybe the ability to be able to see that and apply it to their game is what makes the difference between an amateur and professional.

Wise men I know have often said that you don't win by improving your weaknesses, only by improving your strengths.

It's probably a bit more grey and complicated than that, but there's merit in that theory.

If you have a prized greyhound you don't spend your days trying to improve his endurance.
 
I think it is hard to praise Pyke for fear of looking like we are suggesting Walshy was not doing the right things as coach.

Nope. My call is that Pyke is a much better coach than Walsh - by a long shot.

Looking at the game plan and hearing Pyke speak you can see that Pyke has a much more balanced, sensible (winning?) game plan. Walsh cared about 2 or 3 stats to the detriment of everything else - like skill and disposal efficiency. Pyke's team is kicking just as long, but has disposal efficiency in the top handful as opposed to bottom 2 and you can see what it does to our scoring and speed. Player can run forward without fear! Pyke seems to have a different game plan based on the opposition strengths and weaknesses (our forwards played very high against Port and Tigers, but ran from the goal square against the Swans).

Our backline has had coaching (skillwise and decision wise) and is playing much better as a unit. Hartigan is looking like an AFL player who actually can hit targets and back himself.

I think with Walshy we would have been a good consistent 5-12 team. With Pyke we can be a consistent top 4 team!
 
Walsh cared about 2 or 3 stats to the detriment of everything else - like skill and disposal efficiency.

That's just not true. He gave the media a small snapshot of his philosophy. He talked about ground ball, but he did other things too. I wish I remember the game, we won a game but lost ground ball. Instead of praising how we won the game he focused on "needing to improve groundball ball" something Sando wasn't astute enough to do and proceeded to tell the opposition how to play against us. He out and out said he wasn't going give his secrets out in pressers. He gave the press enough without all his details.

I don't think it was to the detriment of everything else either. Disposal efficiency is tricky, because bombing long will instantly increase disposal efficiency but won't win games. Walsh had us set up team defence. He largely got that working.Walsh also had us playing 2 speed football, fast moving then switching to a possession game. I think he worried more about the execution of his game plan over everything.

I think Pyke has been able to build on foundations that Walsh laid down. Yes Pyke's flavour of football is slightly different than Walsh's but to say we could not have made it to top 4 under Walsh is very speculative.

And although we are playing good football right now, it is only Round 4. The football season is long.

Don't get me wrong. I love what Pyke has brought to the team. I just don't think Walsh was inferior, just different.
 
Walsh cared about 2 or 3 stats to the detriment of everything else - like skill and disposal efficiency.
absolute garbage!

skills were a huge focus over our preseason under Walsh, referenced frequently in pressers and was all over the limited clips that were released from some of the training sessions. Walsh stated several times that speed of ball movement is absolutely critical and to achieve that we would need to improve our disposal significantly, and that was from day one.

our skills revolution hasn't happened over night, we are now reaping the rewards of TWO preseasons spent focusing on skill development.

at this stage Pyke appears to be a more refined strategist, but don't say Walsh didn't value skills or disposal efficiency because you are just plain wrong.
 

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Don't forget our recruiting this year. We got players to fit our system,rather than trying to make players adapt to game plans, see Sando. PW started to change this but was hampered by not having the right cattle, a fact he readily stated. Don is a good,calm coach which has sat well with the squad. I'm happy with having Don as our coach.
 
Weather you adapt the gameplan to your players or have your players adapt to your gameplan is an argument that has been around for a while with no definitive answer in site.

Personally I think some coaches have been lucky and been made to look like geniuses because the gameplan they implemented just happened to suit the team.

So far I think the jury is out on Pyke. Our gameplan looks similar to WC and so far so good but can he continue to evolve it and stay ahead of the curve?
 
I think the main reason people have been reserved on Pyke (and this definitely includes me) is that he's just not inspiring to listen to in the media. Doesn't say much, sounds almost bored, and in the few clips I saw of him interacting with the players during the off-season he just didn't seem very dynamic.

At the time, I was quietly hoping that this was a positive sign - he's obviously been recruited for some reason, and being an inspiring figure in the media sure isn't it. Perhaps it's because he's a brilliant coach?

So far, so good :thumbsu:
 
I think the main reason people have been reserved on Pyke (and this definitely includes me) is that he's just not inspiring to listen to in the media. Doesn't say much, sounds almost bored, and in the few clips I saw of him interacting with the players during the off-season he just didn't seem very dynamic.

At the time, I was quietly hoping that this was a positive sign - he's obviously been recruited for some reason, and being an inspiring figure in the media sure isn't it. Perhaps it's because he's a brilliant coach?

So far, so good :thumbsu:

I think he's brought a lot of outcome independence and level-headedness with him, owing to the fact he doesn't really need the job (loaded by all reports).

He has managed expectations superbly so far and he seems to have the players very relaxed. That's half the battle in this city.
 
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I've said from the moment that we got Pyke that he was a tactical mastermind, but you also need to be a good manager of men to be a successful coach.

At the moment, his tactical nous has already had a marked effect on club, but in the medium to long term though it is keeping the players motivated and managing the egos which will be what will either make or break Pyke as a coach.
 
I think he's brought a lot of outcome independence and level-headedness with him, owing to the fact he doesn't really need the job (loaded by all reports).

He has managed expectations superbly so far and he seems to have the players very relaxed. That's half the battle in this city.
I've said this before but he clearly has top line people management skills. I've been so impressed with his ability to keep the players calm, instill confidence in them and have them firing every time they step onto the park. Even in pre-season we came out every single game raring to go. That's 7 games in a row so far where we haven't looked flat. 3 of those weren't for 4 premiership points either.

He also clearly has a very deep understanding of AFL footy and you can see from each of our games this year that we're not a one trick pony.
 

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