Our Ruck Division

[BacharHouli_43]

We all agree that Hille is our no.1, but there is some conjecture as who should be no.2 and whether we should pick someone up in the draft.

I think we would be better off adding a ruckmen through the rookie list, either a mature (mid 20s) age ruckem or a 17 yr old kid. We need 4-5 ruckmen on a list, but we have ryder who could also play in that role which gives us extra flexibility.

Imo, Bellchambers looks a very good prospect and will challenge Laycock over the next two years for the no 2 spot. Also think that Laycock has the ability to be a solid contributor at this level, contrary to what many ppl think, as he can take a mark and is decent around the ground.

I also believe we would be better off taking a mid/forward with our top few picks as ruckmen take a lot longer to develop, so the best 17 yr old ruckmen is not necessarily going to be the best 25 yr old ruckmen when all the ruckmen reach their peak. So, it would not be wise to waste a top pick on a ruckmen.

I think our ruck division is looking pretty good as it is. What do u guys reckon?

 

[warney7]

I got howled down for saying we should drop Laycock after about round 17.
I thought lets get Bellchambers in and give him a go.

Some responses were, 5 games isn't going to tell us anything....

Well from his last couple of games I think we can see that he is a brighter prospect than Laycock and that we should be looking for someone else as well.

Laycock is not AFL quality and should not be held any longer than the 2 years we gave him.

Hille and Bellchambers for 2009.......looks good!..........just don't get injured guys!

 

[Bomberlicious]

Got to agree with Bachar, I think the ruck division's looking ok at the moment - partly in hope of Laycock getting his shite together and playing some games of the Anzac '05 vintage.

Bellchambers seems a very good prospect, something I said of both Hille & Laycock, so let's all hope he follows Hilley's lead.

Still would like another ruck/forward taken early, or even a mature body if there are any around - solely to keep Paddy out of the ruck. IMO, he's a much better CHB/F, or even RR or wing, than to get slammed in the ruck.

 

[Ben the Gooner]

Hille is class.

Anyone who thinks Bellchambers can hold or even challenge for the second spot consistently all season is wrong.

We need another rookie (e.g. Redden (SA) or Browne (VC)).

A player like Griffen, Seaby or White who can pressure Laycock until Bellchambers is ready would be a good pick-up.

 

[Longy413]

Well from his last couple of games I think we can see that he is a brighter prospect than Laycock and that we should be looking for someone else as well.

Had Hille not been injured and Bellchambers played instead of Laycock, he wouldn't have played the minutes he did.

He would have played 30-40 minutes had a couple of kicks and a couple of hitouts and still not performed any better than Laycock.

Laycock's form when he has been number one ruckman is still better than anything Bellchambers gave us.

Laycock has a lot of shortcomings, Bellchambers looks a talent, but he hasn't done anything yet that should lead us to think he is a lock in the side.

 

[warney7]

I disagree.

The only way the kid is going to make the transition is by playing.

You don't see Carlton shying away from giving Kreuzer plenty of game time just because he's a kid.

And talent aside, at least Tom looks like he wants to be out there!

 

[Colin D'Cops]

Our ruck depth really does make me cringe and just hate it when Hille goes off for a much earned rest. Mainly because when he's off, we lose a lot of run and we get smashed at the clearances because we can't get first hands on the ball. If we can lure Warnock to our club, though unlikely, we can say it very loud and clear to Laycock that if he doesn't perform, he can go and start working in the workforce. Bellchambers is coming along nicely, just needs to build his fitness base up and then we can chuck him in the seniors for a period of time to give him a bit of a taste of AFL footy.
As people have previously mentioned, I would be all for grabbing a ruckman with a third round pick or later or a rookie pick, just need to add some depth in that department.
Talks of Ryder rucking at AFL level is a joke, sure he has a massive leap but that's not the be all and end all with rucking. Positioning and tapping the ball too advantage are the key areas and I don't think he is up to doing them key things consistantly.

 

[warney7]

I wouldn't bother with White but Seaby is a maybe...........a small maybe!

 

[Slattery_20]

Seriously what is the benefit of picking up a short term 2nd or 3rd ruck. Waste of a list spot. Knights is putting as much pressure on him as possible without kicking him out, Laycock will either come up or he won't. All for picking up a newbie in the draft though - just can't see the logic in us getting a stop-gap for such an insignificant gain over either Laycock or Belly.

 

[Essendonfc_4_lyfe]

I disagree.

The only way the kid is going to make the transition is by playing.

You don't see Carlton shying away from giving Kreuzer plenty of game time just because he's a kid.

And talent aside, at least Tom looks like he wants to be out there!

Yeh, and Bellchambers was pick Number 1 in the AFL Draft?

Some people hate Laycock so much they'll think anyone is better than him.

It may not look like it but he would probably try hard out on the field. People are so quick to burn players.

 

[Essendonfc_4_lyfe]

You cant tell me he's better than Laycock after...

3 games
7kicks
17 handballs
24 Disposals
24 Hitouts
6 Tackles
1 Free For and
3 Frees against

 

[The Dustbin]

The thing that annoyed me the most about Laycock was his lack of 2nd and 3rd efforts, his inability to put his body on the line, his chasing was non exisitent and his body language gave the indication that he didn't care.

He bludged of Hille and his team mates. We know he has talent, we've seen it before. Like Cupido, talent can only carry you so far. Laycock needs to improve his attitude and application. By round 20 he had lost the respect from the captain (Probably other team mates as well) he now needs to work his backside off to get that respect back and repay the faith shown in him by Knights (Offering him a 2 yr contract).

I agree B'chambers is nowhere near ready to be Hille's deputy, but at least you know he will give a contest and 110% all the time and can only benefit in the long term the more he is exposed at AFL level. As a member that's all I want, someone out there having a decent crack.

If we pick up a ready made ruckman in the draft I'd expect B'chambers to continue his development with Bendigo. If we go for an untried kid, Laycock will again just cruise through games. He needs someone putting pressure on him. I'm hoping B'chambers can step up in 09. Just have a look at Renouf.

Interesting times ahead...

 

[Darealrath]

I'm reasonably happy with it.

Hille has obviously taken a leap this year to be an A grade ruckman.

Laycock is talented...I still have hope. 2009 is just about make or break though.

Bellchambers looks promising.

I wouldn't want us to use one of our first 2, maybe even 3, picks on a ruckman when we already have the above three.

 

[warney7]

Yeh, and Bellchambers was pick Number 1 in the AFL Draft?

1999 Draft

#1 Pick - Josh Fraser

#40 Pick - David Hille

Great logic!



Good post by The Dustin.......the man speaks sense!

 

[warney7]

It doesn't matter where you get taken, if a club has a need for a 2nd ruckman which Essendon do, you need to give whoever you have every chance.

Of course Laycock will be the number 2 next year, and when he plays well, I'll commend him.

I don't dislike the guy, I just want the guy to look like he gives a damn just like you said TD. I'll be more than happy to put my hand up and say I was wrong, if he turns out to be decent. But Tom needs to know that he'll get his chance in the seniors if he performs and Jason doesn't!

 

[addog]

good to hear someone speak some sense for once, good on you warney7!

 

[bomberz08]

You cant tell me he's better than Laycock after...

3 games
7kicks
17 handballs
24 Disposals
24 Hitouts
6 Tackles
1 Free For and
3 Frees against

Wonder what Laycock's stats were for his first 3 games?

 

[AndyLesPaul]

Wonder what Laycock's stats were for his first 3 games?

7 kicks
5 handballs (explainable, cuz this was 2004.)
12 disposals
18 hitouts
1 tackle
4 Frees Against
1 goal
1 behind

but this is almsot definately because of the game time he got i bet.

 

[BigBomber09]

Laycocks a dud. We are relying on Bellchambers really. Should of got rid of Laycock after '08 and we couldve picked up a Seaby or a Warnock.

 

[The Dustbin]

Laycocks a dud. We are relying on Bellchambers really. Should of got rid of Laycock after '08 and we couldve picked up a Seaby or a Warnock.

Warnock, yes. Seaby, no.

 

[BigBomber09]

Is Seaby really that bad?


I recon we could reinvent him. Warnock has a too big a price tag on him.

 

[Bronze]

Maybe Vickery???

Your ruck stocks will be set for the next 5-10 years. (if Bellchambers becomes AFL standard)

 

[dave_27]

Maybe Vickery???

Your ruck stocks will be set for the next 5-10 years. (if Bellchambers becomes AFL standard)

We are not going to recruit a ruckman with our first pick and you can put your house on it.

 

[The Dustbin]

We are not going to recruit a ruckman with our first pick and you can put your house on it.

Now you sound like Ross McDonald.

 

[BigBomber09]

I think i'd prefer to keep my house.