Religion Pell Guilty!

[CheapCharlie]

The trouble is all these priests genuinely believe they are innocent as they’ve all gone to confession and been forgiven their sins of raping children, and all it took was a few Hail Marys.

Your average priest is not the sharpest tool in the shed

 

[skilts]

Why would the Police be involved?

Maintenance of public order might be one reason. Luckily, they were near-to-hand i.e. 5 metres away.

 

[FredLeDeux]

It’s not just media coverage at the time of the cathedral trial that can effect a jury, it has an accumulative effect. People remember the commission, how bad he came out of that and rightfully so. His reluctance to appear, the stories of protecting priests by moving them etc.

Actions that he should’ve been punished for but should not be relevant to this particular case. To assume all of that past coverage did not effect the jury is a little naive. Jury systems the world over have been shown to be impacted in higher profile cases

It would be equally naive to suggest that the flood of pre-trial virulent pro-Pell propagandising and its outright claims of conspiracies and lynch law in the mainstream media did not bias the jury in his favour.

 

[TheGreatBarryB]

It would be equally naive to suggest that the flood of pre-trial virulent pro-Pell propagandising and its outright claims of conspiracies and lynch law in the mainstream media did not bias the jury in his favour.

I don’t believe so, you overestimate Bolt and friends’ influence. Other wise Tony Abbott would still be PM. Pell’s name has been dragged through the mud and rightfully so for his role in covering disgusting behaviour by various priests.

 

[FredLeDeux]

I don’t believe so, you overestimate Bolt and friends’ influence. Other wise Tony Abbott would still be PM. Pell’s name has been dragged through the mud and rightfully so for his role in covering disgusting behaviour by various priests.

News Corp dominates the country’s media sector, with 58 per cent of daily newspaper circulation; a swathe of regional newspapers; the only national broadsheet, the Australian; the only pay TV network, Foxtel, which broadcasts the Murdoch-owned Sky News; and the most-viewed website, news.com.au.

And it wasn't just Bolt, it was, among others, Henderson, Kelly, Sheridan, Panahi, Devine and Shanahan*** in the majority of the east coast broadsheet and tabloid press, as well as a barrage on (both Murdoch and non-Murdoch) radio, tv and internet.

If I over-estimate the majority of the media, then it follows that you must be over-estimating the minority of the media.

As I said before, people who think media bias was the decisive (or even a decisive) driver of the jury's decision are just displaying their own pro-Pell bias.


*** why is The Australian called The Catholic Boys Daily when its most obnoxious dingbats include so many women?

 

[TheGreatBarryB]

News Corp dominates the country’s media sector, with 58 per cent of daily newspaper circulation; a swathe of regional newspapers; the only national broadsheet, the Australian; the only pay TV network, Foxtel, which broadcasts the Murdoch-owned Sky News; and the most-viewed website, news.com.au.

And it wasn't just Bolt, it was, among others, Henderson, Kelly, Sheridan, Panahi, Devine and Shanahan*** in the majority of the east coast broadsheet and tabloid press, as well as a barrage on (both Murdoch and non-Murdoch) radio, tv and internet.

If I over-estimate the majority of the media, then it follows that you must be over-estimating the minority of the media.

As I said before, people who think media bias was the decisive (or even a decisive) driver of the jury's decision are just displaying their own pro-Pell bias.


*** why is The Australian called The Catholic Boys Daily when its most obnoxious dingbats include so many women?

They reported on the case leading up, I’m talking about over last decade and there’s been far more negative press than positive on him.

I’m not even suggesting that there was a definite bias, just that it may have influenced either way. You on the other seem to imply there was no chance of negative press influencing jury calling it “fundamentally illogical”. I think you’re showing your bias.

 

[FredLeDeux]

They reported on the case leading up, I’m talking about over last decade and there’s been far more negative press than positive on him.

I’m not even suggesting that there was a definite bias, just that it may have influenced either way. You on the other seem to imply there was no chance of negative press influencing jury calling it “fundamentally illogical”. I think you’re showing your bias.

The reported on the case for at least the last decade and there was far more and far stronger pro-Pell press than there was negative, you're simply wrong about that.
They even went to town on the fact that there was even any investigation.
It's fundamentally illogical to say that the jury was biassed by the negative press, but not by the more extensive and stronger positive press.

 

[TheGreatBarryB]

The reported on the case for at least the last decade and there was far more and far stronger pro-Pell press than there was negative, you're simply wrong about that.
They even went to town on the fact that there was even any investigation.
It's fundamentally illogical to say that the jury was biassed by the negative press, but not by the more extensive and stronger positive press.

It’s your opinion not a fact so please refrain from implying so by saying it’s ‘fundamentally illogical’. I disagree with your opinion.

 

[CheapCharlie]

Maintenance of public order might be one reason. Luckily, they were near-to-hand i.e. 5 metres away.

There wasnt any disorder so they weren't needed

 

[western royboy]

It’s not just media coverage at the time of the cathedral trial that can effect a jury, it has an accumulative effect. People remember the commission, how bad he came out of that and rightfully so. His reluctance to appear, the stories of protecting priests by moving them etc.

Actions that he should’ve been punished for but should not be relevant to this particular case. To assume all of that past coverage did not effect the jury is a little naive. Jury systems the world over have been shown to be impacted in higher profile cases

Anything relating to Pell at the RC has been redacted for the same reasons the media ban was put in place. If you’re commenting on his performance when in front of the Commissioners as potential bias against him, I reckon he’s only got himself to blame. I’d be pretty confident when the redactions are removed he won’t look good at all and probably exposed for what he is.

 

[skilts]

There wasnt any disorder so they weren't needed

You seem to have missed the unseemly, all-in, rolling brawl on his journey to the court from his car and vice versa. It was on national TV news every day of the proceedings. Police made no attempt to intervene.

 

[CheapCharlie]

You seem to have missed the unseemly, all-in, rolling brawl on his journey to the court from his car and vice versa. It was on national TV news every day of the proceedings. Police made no attempt to intervene.

It wasnt an all in brawl.
If you consider that an all in brawl riot police will he needed on all peak hour train stations
There was no need for police to intervene.

 

[JoondalupJ]

Pell is a pathetic human being

Given a position of power he misused and abused it to the detriment of the people he was meant to be looking out for.

Its clear he is a chronic liar who has assumed he is untouchable in anything he does

As I said mate, thats fine and you may be ruight but unless you do know this for sure , then think about the law and how it is supposed to work and hope you aren't on the end of a terrible case where you are condemned before anything goes to trial.

On a Lighter note , that is you being hanged for double parking????

 

[kranky al]

You know him personally Chasa the cheap? Once again hate him all you like, I have no idea if he's an ******** or an innocent man. All I said was the trial was unfair with all the media bias that was on the streets, before during and after.
So like any one. I could ask you... do you know the bloke personally if you know that he is not a decent human being worth a fair trial. ?
Then you must know him, to make a comment like that.

So are you a victim of his? Or do you simply hate him because you think he is guilty no matter what.

That in fact is the only thing I have ever said about this ****, is that he was in trouble before the balances of the law ever were supposed to kick in.

Why? Because we all know the reputation of the Catholic church, and the odds were that he was guilty, according to public opinion before he ever went to trial, and I too thought , yeah he's got that look? What ever that look is , but a priest and a back to front collar , well that is now a badge of dishonour, and with reason, so he may be guilty as sin, but I think his trial was ruled by the media years before it ever wnet to trial , not just as iit was happening.

So if you hate that much , that's for you to deal with, but on the real question as to whether bias was even a tiny amount of the reason he was found guilty means that anyone charged with any thing any time anywhere can be condemned by media who create mind sets before a trial.
That is all I've ever frigging well said, Pell??? Who the hell is he??? Its about his case, not him, eff him, it should have been done outside in a neutral area!

So forget that and think about something else when discussing a trial . Ho can anything be fair when the media has set a thopught pattern and angry people hit the streets and want to kill him. This argument is turning int bulldust now.
And the worst thing is he will probably win his appeal because of how the trial was conducted , and THE BASTARD MIGHT BE GUILTY??????????????
Ever thought of that .

He knew ridsdale was a freak and kept moving him to new diocese

He belongs in jail for that alone

 

[Present Not Past]

He knew ridsdale was a freak and kept moving him to new diocese

He belongs in jail for that alone

This is correct under the Crimes Act of 1900.
However unless there is proof that he actively knew that Ridsale was commiting a crime then Pell can simply claim ignorance of the fact.
And unfortunately in Australia there have been many people who have walked the line between what is legal and illegal, and whilst being morally bankrupt, have gone on to be very succesful.

 

[western royboy]

This is correct under the Crimes Act of 1900.
However unless there is proof that he actively knew that Ridsale was commiting a crime then Pell can simply claim ignorance of the fact.
And unfortunately in Australia there have been many people who have walked the line between what is legal and illegal, and whilst being morally bankrupt, have gone on to be very succesful.

It’s ironic that an institution that professes to be of faith actually does not act in good faith

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

He knew ridsdale was a freak and kept moving him to new diocese

He belongs in jail for that alone

The only time Pell has been placed in a situation where a decision was made to move Ridsdale he was moved out of a parish and into a desk job.

 

[kranky al]

The only time Pell has been placed in a situation where a decision was made to move Ridsdale he was moved out of a parish and into a desk job.

If he knew ridsdale or anyone else was molesting children and he didnt report it to the authorities he is an accessory to a crime and possibly perverting the course of justice.

End of

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

If he knew ridsdale or anyone else was molesting children and he didnt report it to the authorities he is an accessory to a crime and possibly perverting the course of justice.

End of

Well no. Not end of. If that was the criteria all of the townnof Mortlake, half of Ballarat, most of Apollo Bay, and half of Edenhope would be similarly guilty.

As it happens, there is no direct evidence that Pell knew of any of them bar one Christian Brother who he did report to the head of the Christian Brothers.

 

[Cooldude]

Always curious how the religious types love to make claims about the existence of deities without sufficient proof or evidence. Then when they are caught doing crime, they need beyond reasonable doubt and absolute ironclad evidence before they'd admit to anything

How very convenient

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

Always curious how the religious types love to make claims about the existence of deities without sufficient proof or evidence. Then when they are caught doing crime, they need beyond reasonable doubt and absolute ironclad evidence before they'd admit to anything

How very convenient

Well it’s the difference between allowing people a belief system and throwing people in gaol for years.

It’s part of the justice system. The Judeo-Christian justice system.

 

[CheapCharlie]

In nearly all his dealings Pell came across as a slippery toad.
His lack of integrity and honesty hasnt done him favours

 

[Craven Morehead]

Well no. Not end of. If that was the criteria all of the townnof Mortlake, half of Ballarat, most of Apollo Bay, and half of Edenhope would be similarly guilty.

As it happens, there is no direct evidence that Pell knew of any of them bar one Christian Brother who he did report to the head of the Christian Brothers.

Wow, you are implicating the citizens of those towns being complicit in Risdale's awful crimes?
Really?
Weren't they the ones who raised hell about what was happening, and then the Church just moved the absolute peice of human excrement elsewhere?

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

Wow, you are implicating the citizens of those towns being complicit in Risdale's awful crimes?
Really?
Weren't they the ones who raised hell about what was happening, and then the Church just moved the absolute peice of human excrement elsewhere?

No I’m not. I’m not the one setting that standard. Kranky Al is. I’m just pointing out the corollary.

EDIT: Got the name wrong.

 

[Cooldude]

Well it’s the difference between allowing people a belief system and throwing people in gaol for years.

It’s part of the justice system. The Judeo-Christian justice system.

Whoooooosh, talk about missing the point.

No I’m not. I’m not the one setting that standard. Cooldude is. I’m just pointing out the corollary.

You are a very confused man, I did no such thing