Player Review vs Suns

[Snoop Dog]

I am not going to write a review this week as won't be really productive but let me give an assessment of where a few are at. And to be fair I don't know where we are at. We are missing so many such as Brown, Reid, Maxwell and Sinclair from your back half and then guys like Ball from the midfield group and Fas and Elliott from the fwd half. So many of these injuries appear to be soft tissue related which lends itself to a whole other series of frustrations and questions.

Crows and Dons are coming at us and our game against the Dons next week is probably our make or break. Only 2 lock in games for us (lions and gws) and we need to win 4.

Anyway my view;

Dwyer - No good and time to blood a kid or give Martin his position. The coach seems to love him but for a fwd he doesn't hurt scoreboard and his ball use is sloppy. Tries hard but he has stagnated and maybe regressed.

Caf - Had a good year and wasn't the worst tonight. He is one who has improved.

Grundy - Why you would play two rucks against the quickest team in the league is beyond me. Ineffectual as a fwd and needs more time in the VFL as has gone backwards but to be expected of a kid.

Goldsack - He is one that has gone fwd but he doesn't really do a lot offensively.

Kennedy - Shown enough for me to play him. Can play fwd pkt to and done well against men there for Glenelg. He needs a decent run at it. Ball use improved and has speed.

OBrien - After a good start to year has gone backwards and is going so rapidly.

Pendles - Getting better

Blair - Another who has gone backwards and to be fair has been for a few years. His spot is another that could be given to Martin or Kennedy more permanently. Gives nothing as a mid either. Big few weeks for him.

Adams - Cut him slack. New club and stiff comp for role he wants to play but he is going ok. Ball use is off and has been better at gws but will make it.

Young - Awful tonight and unfortunately his worst is pretty bad at times. Did some great things over last few weeks but some ordinary stuff to.

Beams - Going well and getting better and better

White - didn't play tonight but warrants a mention. new club new game plan but has faded as year gone on. has had a new bub and will cut him some slack.

Sidebottom - his dumb suspension may have been the difference in that Bulldogs game but look he has been terrific this year. Had some poor moments tonight but been real good.

Keefe - I think he has had a very good year but i think he has had some moments where has been caught out. He is a work in progress and long term keeper.

Thomas - Staggered still in side and Martin is not. I would have him on trade table personally. His footy has gone backwards.

Williams - I reckon he has gone backwards this year but not unsurprised. Long term keeper and will be good.

Cloke - Should have iced the game at half time and for a bloke on 800k who held club to ransom then he should be expected to hit them. Been getting better but gee he needs to start kicking 3-4 every week with the odd bag along the way. His opposition tonight was ordinary.

Tooves - Been good this year.

Swan - Something not right with him. He is not running as hard, not kicking goals like he use to, fumbling like he did tonight.

Seedsman - His best is very good but gee he is struggling to get a lot of it and really hurt sides. He has two wonderful weapons and we aint seeing them enough. Is it him or the coaches not creating it I don't know but could be so much better.

Langdon - Most improved on the list

Witts - Getting better all the time but so he should he is getting to that age where he should be on the cusp of dominating. Done some good work last 2 games.

Hopefully next week we do see Reid, Maxwell, Ball, Elliott and maybe just maybe even #37.

 

[TradeDraft]

Except for Witts,Pendles,Cloke,Adams and Kennedy. The rest where Shit

 

[TradeDraft]

Dwyer - No good and time to blood a kid or give Martin his position. The coach seems to love him but for a fwd he doesn't hurt scoreboard and his ball use is sloppy. Tries hard but he has stagnated and maybe regressed.

He is just a Depth Player. A Good side would not Carry Him

Adams - Cut him slack. New club and stiff comp for role he wants to play but he is going ok. Ball use is off and has been better at gws but will make it.

Agree - He is not the Worst we have.

Agree that Ball is not a Ton Better with the Ball at Time.

At least has a Real Crack, Hard to get ball to Better Users when they are just standing around

 

[Vicky Park]

I am not going to write a review this week as won't be really productive but let me give an assessment of where a few are at. And to be fair I don't know where we are at. We are missing so many such as Brown, Reid, Maxwell and Sinclair from your back half and then guys like Ball from the midfield group and Fas and Elliott from the fwd half. So many of these injuries appear to be soft tissue related which lends itself to a whole other series of frustrations and questions.

Crows and Dons are coming at us and our game against the Dons next week is probably our make or break. Only 2 lock in games for us (lions and gws) and we need to win 4.

Anyway my view;

Dwyer - No good and time to blood a kid or give Martin his position. The coach seems to love him but for a fwd he doesn't hurt scoreboard and his ball use is sloppy. Tries hard but he has stagnated and maybe regressed.

Caf - Had a good year and wasn't the worst tonight. He is one who has improved.

Grundy - Why you would play two rucks against the quickest team in the league is beyond me. Ineffectual as a fwd and needs more time in the VFL as has gone backwards but to be expected of a kid.

Goldsack - He is one that has gone fwd but he doesn't really do a lot offensively.

Kennedy - Shown enough for me to play him. Can play fwd pkt to and done well against men there for Glenelg. He needs a decent run at it. Ball use improved and has speed.

OBrien - After a good start to year has gone backwards and is going so rapidly.

Pendles - Getting better

Blair - Another who has gone backwards and to be fair has been for a few years. His spot is another that could be given to Martin or Kennedy more permanently. Gives nothing as a mid either. Big few weeks for him.

Adams - Cut him slack. New club and stiff comp for role he wants to play but he is going ok. Ball use is off and has been better at gws but will make it.

Young - Awful tonight and unfortunately his worst is pretty bad at times. Did some great things over last few weeks but some ordinary stuff to.

Beams - Going well and getting better and better

White - didn't play tonight but warrants a mention. new club new game plan but has faded as year gone on. has had a new bub and will cut him some slack.

Sidebottom - his dumb suspension may have been the difference in that Bulldogs game but look he has been terrific this year. Had some poor moments tonight but been real good.

Keefe - I think he has had a very good year but i think he has had some moments where has been caught out. He is a work in progress and long term keeper.

Thomas - Staggered still in side and Martin is not. I would have him on trade table personally. His footy has gone backwards.

Williams - I reckon he has gone backwards this year but not unsurprised. Long term keeper and will be good.

Cloke - Should have iced the game at half time and for a bloke on 800k who held club to ransom then he should be expected to hit them. Been getting better but gee he needs to start kicking 3-4 every week with the odd bag along the way. His opposition tonight was ordinary.

Tooves - Been good this year.

Swan - Something not right with him. He is not running as hard, not kicking goals like he use to, fumbling like he did tonight.

Seedsman - His best is very good but gee he is struggling to get a lot of it and really hurt sides. He has two wonderful weapons and we aint seeing them enough. Is it him or the coaches not creating it I don't know but could be so much better.

Langdon - Most improved on the list

Witts - Getting better all the time but so he should he is getting to that age where he should be on the cusp of dominating. Done some good work last 2 games.

Hopefully next week we do see Reid, Maxwell, Ball, Elliott and maybe just maybe even #37.

Thanks for making the effort to write this up. Hard on a night like this.

 

[Kilmo]

Thomas - Staggered still in side and Martin is not. I would have him on trade table personally. His footy has gone backwards.

Thomas was one of the few who could hold his head up after this game I thought...

 

[BEEG]

Witts kids becoming a real player

The rest apart from Cloke Pendlebury Kennedy Sidebottom and Beams can get ****ed

 

[TradeDraft]

Witts kids becoming a real player

The rest apart from Cloke Pendlebury Kennedy Sidebottom and Beams can get ******

Bit Harsh on Adams. He had a Crack and his bad Disposal well he had many Friends. Why not Knock Toovey for Kicking it straight to the Opposition when he gets the Ball?

 

[lenny20]

EDIT: It would appear Snoop's review has appeared during the time I wrote this; mods, please feel free to merge!

If there's one thing that remains constant in my support of Collingwood, it's passion. I'm passionately happy when we win, and I'm passionately angry when we lose. But this loss feels different. It was just so calamitous, so uncomposed, so unskilled, so diabolically terrible against a team that was out on its feet... I'm not angry at this, I'm just numb and depressed.

I don't like it. I want the passion back.

Game Overview

It's just so heartbreaking watching many of the players who won a premiership not such a long time ago melt away into a sea of fumbles, poor decisions, and even worse execution of skills.

We're an average side when it comes to using the football and our terrible decision-making compounds this to a ridiculous degree. We blaze away long when we're outnumbered, then we lower our eyes and kick to contests 15 metres away when there's a one-on-one option available long. We're constantly guilty of trying to over-possess with cute little handpasses which only serve to put the recipient under more pressure than the handpasser, when the quick clearance would have been far more beneficial. We commit alternately too many and too few to the contest; either too many attack the ball/aerial contest/tackle and we let the opposition out on the spread/crumb, or too few commit to the ball/aerial contest/tackle and we allow a clean win of the ball to the opposition. We seem incapable of playing the percentages, and on the rare occasions that we do, our skills let us down. We apply inordinate amounts of pressure on ourselves through poor disposal and even poorer choices. We're an average side in terrible form playing embarrassingly stupid football.

On top of that, we've dropped off so much in our intensity, tackling and contested football game that we don't look like winning a 50/50 ball more than about 10% of the time.

And finally, we conspired to turn out all of the above faults in a game where the opposition lost four players to injury, including their best forward, best running back, and the best player in the game. It's a season-defining game in light of this.

There's really just so much wrong with our game right now that it's difficult to know where to start fixing it. The only bright side I can see here is that whilst a lucky win might have papered over some of these cracks, a loss means they're on full view for all to see. I hope we get flogged by the media for this. I hope this hurts the team. And I hope we both learn and grow from it.

Player Review

BESTS

5: Ben Kennedy
4: Jarrod Witts
3: Scott Pendlebury
2: Paul Seedsman
1: Dayne Beams

Ben Kennedy - He and the Seed looked like the only Collingwood players not going in slow motion all night. He was fast, clean with his hands and neat by foot all night, and had something that almost none of his teammates showed on the evening - composure. If it weren't for his two quick last quarter goals and his hand in setting up a third, we wouldn't have been in a position to steal the game in the first place. Hopefully he's cemented his place now. Well done, Ben.

Jarrod Witts - Probably the best game he's played as the first ruck. And the first time in a long time I can remember a Collingwood ruckman so soundly beat his opponent - Witts had 33 hitouts to Smith's 14 and offered more around the ground than his opponent by a stretch. He was clean with his hands and his disposal; the sublime weighted pass to Goldsack on the quarter time siren was a highlight. Right now, he's so far ahead of Brodie that the young #4 might struggle to play seniors again this year.

Scott Pendlebury - Was well down on his usual output, and fumbled a lot to highlight his lack of touch; regardless, he was still our best mid by a fair margin, and some of his gorgeous touches just served to highlight how poor his teammates' disposal around him had been. Single handedly set up the Seedsman goal with a game-opening kick. Got some miraculous handballs out to teammates when he had no right to. Still, unable to impose himself as much as he would have liked and ultimately let down by his mates.

Paul Seedsman - On such a poor team night, those two bursts of play would have been enough to get him into the bests alone; the first, a dashing run through the middle followed by a lace-out pass to Cloke's left nipple ten metres out. Cloke missed. The second, a dashing run through the middle which he rightfully decided to finish off himself. Was one of the better users for the night and wasn't shown up defensively like in previous weeks; a couple of brave tackles saved GC goals when they got out the back.

Dayne Beams - Started like a house on fire with seven clearances in the first quarter, including one which hit Cloke's right nipple five metres out. Cloke missed. Dayne slowed down as the game progressed but still tried hard all night, clearly leading the way for contested ball and clearances for the team. Beams finished with 10 clearances. The next highest was Pendles. He had three.


WORSTS

-5: Lachie Keeffe
-4: Heritier Lumumba
-3: Clinton Young
-2: Brodie Grundy
-1: Alan Toovey, Sam Dwyer, Travis Cloke, pretty much everyone to be honest.

Lachie Keeffe - This young man is having some serious issues with playing interstate of late. Was torn to pieces by Jenkins when we played the Crows, and was torn to bits by Dixon and then Day tonight. He seems capable of turning in an absolute stinker, and those meltdown performances are not something you'd want to see in a centre half back. I'm still at a loss as to why he takes the kick ins; yes, he has decent skills, but surely his 200+cm frame would be more useful in a marking contest down the line than as the designated kicker?

Harry L - He's hit a serious form slump over the last month and I wouldn't be surprised to see him playing VFL soon as a result. Offered nothing in the way of run tonight and was regularly beaten in the contest by both smalls and talls. With a host of players returning via the VFL, and the obvious K Martin who continues to tear it up at VFL level, I think H's days might be numbered. In terms of dash and rebound, I think we're getting more out of Seedsman, Young and Williams anyway.

Clinton Young - You can't drop a mark like that and escape scrutiny. He started well but then got worse and worse as the game progressed. A stupid decision to handpass in the second was almost costly, but he got a 50m penalty - but missed a simple, crucial shot on goal. In the third, some hard running saw him get on the end of a chain of handballs, but he missed a simple, crucial shot on goal. Then in the last, some more gut running saw him free as a bird 25m out, directly in front, only to do his best Chris Dawes impersonation and drop the easiest of marks. The way his game was going he probably would have missed it anyway. I'm probably in the minority in thinking he still offers something to the side, but tonight would easily be his worst game for the club.

Brodie Grundy - He's got the second year blues in a big way, young Brodie. He'll get through it and be better for it and I still think he'll be a 10+ year player for us. But as of right now he gives us precisely nothing. White's been horrendously out of form but still has him covered comfortably as the second ruck/forward, and that's saying something.

Alan Toovey - As always, his defensive work was great, and that was a hell of a tackle in the second on Day. But his kicking was sub-VFL standard today and has been worryingly poor for much of the year. Unlike the rest of the team, his problem doesn't seem to be decision-based; he makes the right choices but then executes his skills terribly. He's been a rock in defence for years now, but unless his kicking improves markedly then he's on borrowed time, especially with the surplus of excellent small/medium defenders we've got coming through the ranks. It wouldn't be at all surprising to see Langdon, Seedsman, Williams and Scharenberg holding down the small/medium defensive posts as early as next year. Maybe even late this year, injuries permitting.

Sam Dwyer - Escapes harsher criticism largely due to the fact he was completely anonymous, rather than being an active detriment to the team, as many of the above were. He's got a nasty tendency of going completely missing in his poor games. And there have been quite a few more of them this year than last. Another who's on the very fringe of selection at the moment, because though I like his skills, he just isn't contributing enough offensively and his defensive game is non-existent.

Travis Cloke - So disappointing for Clokey. He was great all night, but just missed too many easy shots. Including two that were from less than 15m out from goal. That said, I still think he's turned the corner form-wise and he's looking super-dangerous again. Today, though, the missed goals were genuine momentum killers.

THE REST

Dane Swan - An in-between Swanny game today. Was clean with his hands and generally made the right choice; he stuck a couple of nice contested grabs too. But he missed a couple of shots that would have been very handy, and he just didn't get it enough. That being said, I think he provides a legitimate forward option that is preferable to his current midfield output, which, for the majority of the year, has been sub-standard. Wouldn't mind seeing him as a permanent forward pocket nowadays.

Jarryd Blair - Much improved on recent outings, but still not great. Today, though, he was clean with his hands and used it well under pressure; he set up Sack's goal against the run of play, he (strangely) held a couple of strong contested grabs, and it was his contest and handball that set up what should have been Young's winner at the death. Overall he was an effective player (he was our best user at 92% DE) and I'm happy with him holding his spot if he plays like that; the problem is that games like today's have been Blairy's expection this year, rather than his rule.

Steele Sidebottom - Accumulated all day and was particularly good in the first half but really struggled to impact with his possessions in the second. As did the rest of the team, I suppose. But when you play such an outside game (only one tackle and no clearances) you have to use the ball well; Steele was just average today.

Marley Williams - He had young Jack Martin for most of the day, and did the job on him comfortably. He also accumulated well and used it effectively enough. But I just get the feeling that Marley's lacking a bit of the "wow" factor about his game this year. Last year, there were multiple times when he'd just bulldoze his way through a pack and burst out the other side with the ball, and we haven't seen it at all this year. Still contributing, but he's capable of more.

Jack Frost - Beaten today. It wouldn't have helped having Lachie getting murdered right next to him. One of his worst games for the year.

Brent Macaffer - Was doing a really solid job on GAJ, and I thought the tackle that popped his shoulder was actually a technically excellent example of tackling; we should, as a team, be tackling fairly, but tackling to hurt. After Gary's injury, he drifted out of the game a little and struggled without a direct assignment.

Taylor Adams - Started very poorly with a shocking kick forward and the laziest handpass I've ever seen to Dane Swan in the first. Got a bit better but still struggled all day and was nowhere near his levels of the previous few weeks. We were smashed in the clinches all day, and only two clearances and five contested possessions is probably not enough to fill the shoes of Lukey Ball. He'll be disappointed, it was his biggest chance thus far to cement his place as #1 inside mid going forward. He didn't.

Tom Langdon - Solid, composed, probably our best defender over the course of the game - though that's not saying much. I thought he was slipping a bit the last few weeks but today was a solid return to form. I like him.

Tyson Goldsack - Largely ineffectual but still attacks the ball and man at 100%, whether forward or back. It was going into our forward line so rarely, and we were so outnumbered down there, that he didn't really stand too much of a chance. Not a great game, plenty worse though.

Josh Thomas - A much better effort than previous weeks. Ran hard, fast, and had sticky fingers again when most did not. Damningly, he had as many or more clearances than: Taylor Adams, Dane Swan, Harry L, Steele Sidebottom, Sam Dwyer and Brent Macaffer, and JT did this in less than 30% of game time. Finally broke the run of ten behinds with his solo effort in the last quarter, which was crucial but ultimately futile.

 

[BEEG]

Bit Harsh on Adams. He had a Crack and his bad Disposal well he had many Friends. Why not Knock Toovey for Kicking it straight to the Opposition when he gets the Ball?

I like Adams but he wasn't good tonight turned it over a few times still learning I won't give him a spray

I have had a crack at Toovey in 3 threads so far didn't bother doing it in this one

 

[TradeDraft]

Post it here:

Player Review vs Suns

 

[TradeDraft]

I like Adams but he wasn't good tonight turned it over a few times still learning I won't give him a spray

I have had a crack at Toovey in 3 threads so far didn't bother doing it in this one

I agree with that. Adams was not in the Best that is for sure but He has played well last 2 weeks

 

[BEEG]

Thomas was one of the few who could hold his head up after this game I thought...

He might actually be the impact super sub we have been looking for

 

[SpongePie]

Good review mate, thanks!

 

[BEEG]

I agree with that. Adams was not in the Best that is for sure but He has played well last 2 weeks

Yeah he has potential Toovey is dead weight

We carried Grundy tonight had to make up for Toovey's terrible disposal and Keefe got smashed by another athletic forward if they are not a dinasour Keefe can't go 1 on 1

 

[TradeDraft]

Taylor Adams - Started very poorly with a shocking kick forward and the laziest handpass I've ever seen to Dane Swan in the first. Got a bit better but still struggled all day and was nowhere near his levels of the previous few weeks. We were smashed in the clinches all day, and only two clearances and five contested possessions is probably not enough to fill the shoes of Lukey Ball. He'll be disappointed, it was his biggest chance thus far to cement his place as #1 inside mid going forward. He didn't.

Agree - That where the Game should be won. He went Missing Shows that he still needs Thomas or Ball in the side with him. Can’t do the lot at this young age

 

[ottoman]

I would just like to make one statement re Adams. I watched his game with interest today. What I noticed on quite a few occasions is that he had the ball and no player made options for him. He would be looking around for someone to kick it to but everyone was just flat footed. He does turn it over at times I agree but it is not always his fault. If the players around him gave him some options it would help.
If you watch the replay (I wouldn't advise anyone ever watch that game again) you will see what I mean.

 

[TradeDraft]

Yeah he has potential Toovey is dead weight

We carried Grundy tonight had to make up for Toovey's terrible disposal and Keefe got smashed by another athletic forward if they are not a dinasour Keefe can't go 1 on 1

Well the majority of the Side Sucked it up Tonight

 

[TradeDraft]

I would just like to make one statement re Adams. I watched his game with interest today. What I noticed on quite a few occasions is that he had the ball and no player made options for him. He would be looking around for someone to kick it to but everyone was just flat footed. He does turn it over at times I agree but it is not always his fault. If the players around him gave him some options it would help.
If you watch the replay (I wouldn't advise anyone ever watch that game again) you will see what I mean.

I seen that happen the last few weeks. He goes to Kick it and stops it as there was no one there. Then he just starts looking around for a Player

 

[BEEG]

I would just like to make one statement re Adams. I watched his game with interest today. What I noticed on quite a few occasions is that he had the ball and no player made options for him. He would be looking around for someone to kick it to but everyone was just flat footed. He does turn it over at times I agree but it is not always his fault. If the players around him gave him some options it would help.
If you watch the replay (I wouldn't advise anyone ever watch that game again) you will see what I mean.

Adams didn't have a man for a lot of the game can't tell you how many times I saw him by himself running on the wing

 

[magpie90]

Look forward to seeing Reid, Maxy, Elliot and Karnezis in this team. Broomhead needs to play and Martin needs a go. I would also like to see White play with Reid up forward giving Grundy time to develop in the 2s as he is just a 2nd year player. I hate the expectations we have placed on him this year.

 

[TradeDraft]

Adams didn't have a man for a lot of the game can't tell you how many times I saw him by himself running on the wing

Well he is like Swan. They don’t tag him because at the moment he has no Hurt Factor in his Kicking

 

[ottoman]

Adams didn't have a man for a lot of the game can't tell you how many times I saw him by himself running on the wing

Sorry BEEG I can't tell if you are,
Criticising Adams for being unacountable
Or praising him for making space and crating an option.

My comment above is not smart ass or sarcastic. Genuine comment

 

[BEEG]

Sorry BEEG I can't tell if you are,
Criticising Adams for being unacountable
Or praising him for making space and crating an option.

My comment above is not smart ass or sarcastic. Genuine comment

To be honest mate I don't really know just thought I would comment on it

I assumed he would get a lot more touches then he did being alone for huge chunks of the game

 

[FAIRANDBALANCED]

Young needs to be out of the side. You can't be a senior player and make the errors he did tonight and still be in the team. As a player, the effort in the second quarter summed him up. Got a mark with his back turned to goal, telecasted a handball so people on Mars could see, Swallow spoiled and he luckily received a 50m penalty. Then he missed the set shot from 30 metres out dead in front. He is an absolute liability.

Blair does some ok things, but it has gotten to the stage where we are not playing for a top 4 finish this year, and trying a guy like Martin in his role is a must. We have suprisingly few guys capable of a 30 possession game now. We need more ball winners.

Grundy should be playing in the VFL for a few weeks. White is a much better second ruckman anyway, and will definitely give more pressure around the ball when it hits the deck.

Dwyer was horrible today. Has played some decent games for us, but the question I'd like to ask Bucks is, can we go into a game with Blair and Dwyer, while still having Kennedy and Thomas in the team. I think not. Kennedy has gone past him now.

Toovey has never been able to kick. Its not what he is there to do. Still works hard defensivey.

I thought Williams and Seedsman were solid. Still under 30 games for these two, but I think they will both be very good players for us.

Goldsack can stay or go. Wouldn't offer him over 250k.

The talent level of this side has dropped dramatically from our team midway through 2011. But we do have some bright hopes. Keefe, Williams, Seedsman, Frost, Witts, Elliot and Kennedy will only get better from here.

 

[TradeDraft]

To be honest mate I don't really know just thought I would comment on it

I assumed he would get a lot more touches then he did being alone for huge chunks of the game

Well, Maybe the Ball did not get Kicked to him Much.