Players to Kick 700+ Goals in the VFL/AFL

[RonnieRaven]

Probably explains why he averages less than 2 goals a game.

when he was permanent forward in an average team he had 3 season ave 3+ goals 17+ disposals
Buddy did it twice roo boy once.
Pav 05-08 dominated.
He was that good he couldn’t be wasted forward the team was poor he had to go in the midfield because it was getting beaten likewise in defence.
If he played fwd in a good team with good delivery his whole career like buddy he would of kicked 1000

 

[Lunchtime]

It's a shame that 2020 was a shortened year otherwise Jack Riewoldt would have probably kicked 800+

In 2019 he missed quite a few games too due to injury. No doubt he gets to the 800 goal mark and then it's a matter of how far he would have gone.

 

[Lunchtime]

Also interesting to see that table that Sav Rocca appears to have won no All Australian awards either.

 

[Lunchtime]

Most Goals Kicked in the VFL/AFL Without Winning Coleman Medal

800: Matthew Richardson

Matthew Richardson

Age

49

Ht

195cm

Wt

104kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.0

4star

K

10.9

4star

HB

3.1

3star

M

8.0

5star

T

0.5

3star

No current season stats available

D

15.0

4star

K

9.2

4star

HB

5.8

4star

M

7.8

5star

T

0.8

3star

778: Kevin Bartlett
748: Saverio Rocca

Saverio Rocca

Age

50

Ht

195cm

Wt

112kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

9.3

2star

K

7.3

3star

HB

2.0

2star

M

5.2

5star

T

0.8

3star

G

2.9

5star

No current season stats available

D

10.8

3star

K

7.2

3star

HB

3.6

3star

M

5.4

5star

T

1.2

3star

G

2.6

5star

746: Barry Hall
738: Stephen Kernahan
727: Wayne Carey
718: Nick Riewoldt
700: Matthew Pavlich

Matthew Pavlich

Age

42

Ht

192cm

Wt

99kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

17.5

4star

K

11.3

4star

HB

6.3

4star

M

5.6

5star

T

2.6

4star

G

2.3

5star

No current season stats available

D

16.8

4star

K

12.8

5star

HB

4.0

3star

M

8.8

5star

T

1.2

3star

G

3.4

5star

 

[Guardian Hawk]

They don’t want to do that because the great Ken Farmer outshines them.
It’s a travesty he doesn’t have legend status but Dunstall does.
Kicked 100+ 11 years in a row
Kicked 81 in 17 games representing the state against the best VFL and Wafl players.

Agreed Ken Farmer should be in but no idea why you've called Dunstall out?

Dunstall kicked 1254 goals himself, with most of those coming in the AFL era. He was on track to beat the all time V/AFL record ahead of Lockett before succumbing to injury following multiple knees, broken collarbone, smashed cheekbones, etc.

Aside from kicking goals, he was famed as the ultimate team player, giving off many more goals than any of his contempories (Lockett, Ablett, etc) and pioneering forwards who would pressure and chase defenders.

He was also THE best player in what many consider to be the greatest team of all time, with him playing in 4 flags and winning back to back best and fairests in flag years when they were at their zenith ('88/'89).

He also won the league MVP and finished top 3 in the Brownlow 4 times (runner up twice as a full forward!). In 1992, he won the MVP, was favourite for the Brownlow (but finished runner up by 1 vote after some very unusual voting), won the Coleman and kicked a lazy 145 goals in the National comp (which remains the record). (He also holds the record for most goals in a game in the National comp (17))

He also captained his side (unusual for full forwards), was never suspended and was a big game player - having kicked the 2nd most goals in finals ever (and the most in the last 90 years).

You mention State games and there weren't as many in Dunstall's time but he still won the EJ Whitten and the Simpson medals for BOG performances in State matches.

Most published lists has Dunstall in the top 10 players of all time.

Off the field, Dunstall (who was captain at the time) was instrumental in saving Hawthorn from merging with Melbourne. He also voluntarily stepped onto the Hawthorn board at one of their lowest ebbs in 2004, cleared out the fighting factions, got the club back on track and then overruled the Board to appoint Alistair Clarkson (instead of Gary Ayers) as coach, who delivered another 4 flags.

I see no reason he shouldn't be a legend (and suspect Farmer will also be in time).

 

[Freomaniac]

He was also the first player to play 150 games at two clubs.

Makes it more remarkable too. Yes the VFL in the 1970s and 1980s had very good talented players. Sadly it was the one era with unprecedented violence

 

[Freomaniac]

Most Goals Kicked in the VFL/AFL Without Winning Coleman Medal

800: Matthew Richardson
778: Kevin Bartlett
748: Saverio Rocca
746: Barry Hall
738: Stephen Kernahan
727: Wayne Carey
718: Nick Riewoldt
700: Matthew Pavlich

Kevin Bartlett is the odd one out. He is the only person on that list not a key position forward. Rest of them are either full forwards or centre half forwards

 

[Lunchtime]

Kevin Bartlett is the odd one out. He is the only person on that list not a key position forward. Rest of them are either full forwards or centre half forwards

Yep that's right. He was a smaller player. Not a KPF.

Also, these players not winning a Coleman medal, do you think it's a "black mark" against them? Black mark probably isn't the right word but maybe more so...do they come down in people's rankings/assessments because they never won a Coleman medal?

 

[Freomaniac]

Yep that's right. He was a smaller player. Not a KPF.

Also, these players not winning a Coleman medal, do you think it's a "black mark" against them? Black mark probably isn't the right word but maybe more so...do they come down in people's rankings/assessments because they never won a Coleman medal?

Well you are a carlton fan. Sticks Kernahan Kicked over 700 goals, well 738 goals in his career with his 2 premierships?

does that make him an average player or an inferior player compared to Carey or Dunstall or Buddy franklin? no.

Brendan Fevola kicked 623 goals in his Career. 575 of them for your mob Carlton. Was he a good player? Yes he was. Fevola didnt win a coleman medal but on his day, he could do damage to the opposition side.

And yes I was gutted he was stuck on 99 goals in 2008. And yes that was a push in the back late in the 4th quarter. He should of got a set shot goal.

If it wasnt for injuries on the field and Problems off it, he would of easily kicked 800 or more goals .

 

[RonnieRaven]

Agreed Ken Farmer should be in but no idea why you've called Dunstall out?

Dunstall kicked 1254 goals himself, with most of those coming in the AFL era. He was on track to beat the all time V/AFL record ahead of Lockett before succumbing to injury following multiple knees, broken collarbone, smashed cheekbones, etc.

Aside from kicking goals, he was famed as the ultimate team player, giving off many more goals than any of his contempories (Lockett, Ablett, etc) and pioneering forwards who would pressure and chase defenders.

He was also THE best player in what many consider to be the greatest team of all time, with him playing in 4 flags and winning back to back best and fairests in flag years when they were at their zenith ('88/'89).

He also won the league MVP and finished top 3 in the Brownlow 4 times (runner up twice as a full forward!). In 1992, he won the MVP, was favourite for the Brownlow (but finished runner up by 1 vote after some very unusual voting), won the Coleman and kicked a lazy 145 goals in the National comp (which remains the record). (He also holds the record for most goals in a game in the National comp (17))

He also captained his side (unusual for full forwards), was never suspended and was a big game player - having kicked the 2nd most goals in finals ever (and the most in the last 90 years).

You mention State games and there weren't as many in Dunstall's time but he still won the EJ Whitten and the Simpson medals for BOG performances in State matches.

Most published lists has Dunstall in the top 10 players of all time.

Off the field, Dunstall (who was captain at the time) was instrumental in saving Hawthorn from merging with Melbourne. He also voluntarily stepped onto the Hawthorn board at one of their lowest ebbs in 2004, cleared out the fighting factions, got the club back on track and then overruled the Board to appoint Alistair Clarkson (instead of Gary Ayers) as coach, who delivered another 4 flags.

I see no reason he shouldn't be a legend (and suspect Farmer will also be in time).

Mentioned dunstall because he was most recent not because his bad.
Ken farmer is dead but will have to wait his turn.
Classic

 

[Mr Meow]

when he was permanent forward in an average team he had 3 season ave 3+ goals 17+ disposals
Buddy did it twice roo boy once.
Pav 05-08 dominated.
He was that good he couldn’t be wasted forward the team was poor he had to go in the midfield because it was getting beaten likewise in defence.
If he played fwd in a good team with good delivery his whole career like buddy he would of kicked 1000

First of all I'll preface this by saying Pav was an absolute star and a walk up into a merged AFL team of the century so far.

But this "in an average team" works both ways. Freo's other key forwards over the years weren't that special. They had some lively mediums like Medhurst who popped up. There's not really strong evidence that average teams with star forwards have those forwards kick less goals than the ones in top 4 sides. In fact they tend to heavily target and play around the few stars they have. Coleman medalist top 5 tallies this century reflect that. So you definitely can't just say if Freo won a few more games in 2007/2008 Pavlich would've had 100 goal seasons. That is silly.

Freo in 2012 weren't average either, they knocked the reigning premiers out of finals at the G and then got within 2 goals of doing the same to Adelaide at Football Park.

And your point doesn't really make hypothetical sense because getting the best out of Pavlich always involved positional versatility. Never mind which team it was. It wouldn't have made sense for him to be a career key forward (only) in any team.

So while I have him near top of the tree for players this century, I disagree that popping him at full forward in let's say Geelong over the same period would've automatically made him a 1000 goal forward or been the best use for him. Thus it's a bit of a silly hypothetical. He should be celebrated for what he was, rather than pointless speculation.

 

[Mr Meow]

Yep that's right. He was a smaller player. Not a KPF.

Also, these players not winning a Coleman medal, do you think it's a "black mark" against them? Black mark probably isn't the right word but maybe more so...do they come down in people's rankings/assessments because they never won a Coleman medal?

No. Some years you would've had to top Ablett and co kicking 120+. That wouldn't make your 90 less than getting 90 a few years later and winning the Coleman.

 

[RonnieRaven]

First of all I'll preface this by saying Pav was an absolute star and a walk up into a merged AFL team of the century so far.

But this "in an average team" works both ways. Freo's other key forwards over the years weren't that special. They had some lively mediums like Medhurst who popped up. There's not really strong evidence that average teams with star forwards have those forwards kick less goals than the ones in top 4 sides. In fact they tend to heavily target and play around the few stars they have. Coleman medalist top 5 tallies this century reflect that. So you definitely can't just say if Freo won a few more games in 2007/2008 Pavlich would've had 100 goal seasons. That is silly.

Freo in 2012 weren't average either, they knocked the reigning premiers out of finals at the G and then got within 2 goals of doing the same to Adelaide at Football Park.

And your point doesn't really make hypothetical sense because getting the best out of Pavlich always involved positional versatility. Never mind which team it was. It wouldn't have made sense for him to be a career key forward (only) in any team.

So while I have him near top of the tree for players this century, I disagree that popping him at full forward in let's say Geelong over the same period would've automatically made him a 1000 goal forward or been the best use for him. Thus it's a bit of a silly hypothetical. He should be celebrated for what he was, rather than pointless speculation.

Sorry for celebrating sir pav
I’ll start an AA FBs that have kicked 700+ goals thread.

 

[sobrave]

Agreed Ken Farmer should be in but no idea why you've called Dunstall out?

Dunstall kicked 1254 goals himself, with most of those coming in the AFL era. He was on track to beat the all time V/AFL record ahead of Lockett before succumbing to injury following multiple knees, broken collarbone, smashed cheekbones, etc.

Aside from kicking goals, he was famed as the ultimate team player, giving off many more goals than any of his contempories (Lockett, Ablett, etc) and pioneering forwards who would pressure and chase defenders.

He was also THE best player in what many consider to be the greatest team of all time, with him playing in 4 flags and winning back to back best and fairests in flag years when they were at their zenith ('88/'89).

He also won the league MVP and finished top 3 in the Brownlow 4 times (runner up twice as a full forward!). In 1992, he won the MVP, was favourite for the Brownlow (but finished runner up by 1 vote after some very unusual voting), won the Coleman and kicked a lazy 145 goals in the National comp (which remains the record). (He also holds the record for most goals in a game in the National comp (17))

He also captained his side (unusual for full forwards), was never suspended and was a big game player - having kicked the 2nd most goals in finals ever (and the most in the last 90 years).

You mention State games and there weren't as many in Dunstall's time but he still won the EJ Whitten and the Simpson medals for BOG performances in State matches.

Most published lists has Dunstall in the top 10 players of all time.

Off the field, Dunstall (who was captain at the time) was instrumental in saving Hawthorn from merging with Melbourne. He also voluntarily stepped onto the Hawthorn board at one of their lowest ebbs in 2004, cleared out the fighting factions, got the club back on track and then overruled the Board to appoint Alistair Clarkson (instead of Gary Ayers) as coach, who delivered another 4 flags.

I see no reason he shouldn't be a legend (and suspect Farmer will also be in time).

Lead out chest mark
Kick a goal, kick a goal
Lead out chest mark
Kick another goal

Ohhhhhhh I am the footy fan, I come from down your way, and I can plaaaaay
(what can you plaaaaay)

 

[Mr Meow]

Sorry for celebrating sir pav
I’ll start an AA FBs that have kicked 700+ goals thread.

I rate the hell out of the Pav. I just said he's one of my first picked in a merge team of the century for crying out loud...

But as a sidenote it's silly to say "Player X would've scored more goals in a strong team". Look at Fevola, Lockett and Ablett's tallies in some non finals seasons.

You always have to go over the top and sadly it ruins what are genuine celebrations of Freo's champions.

 

[Lunchtime]

No. Some years you would've had to top Ablett and co kicking 120+. That wouldn't make your 90 less than getting 90 a few years later and winning the Coleman.

Richardson's best year in terms of goals kicked was 91, in 1996. If he'd kicked that now (unlikely with how flooding etc is set up) he'd win a Coleman medal. Back in 1996 the top 5 goalkickers were:

1. Tony Lockett: 121
2. Jason Dunstall: 102
3. Matthew Richardson: 91
4. Stewart Loewe: 90
5. Wayne Carey: 82

 

[Lunchtime]

Well you are a carlton fan. Sticks Kernahan Kicked over 700 goals, well 738 goals in his career with his 2 premierships?

does that make him an average player or an inferior player compared to Carey or Dunstall or Buddy franklin? no.

Brendan Fevola kicked 623 goals in his Career. 575 of them for your mob Carlton. Was he a good player? Yes he was. Fevola didnt win a coleman medal but on his day, he could do damage to the opposition side.

And yes I was gutted he was stuck on 99 goals in 2008. And yes that was a push in the back late in the 4th quarter. He should of got a set shot goal.

If it wasnt for injuries on the field and Problems off it, he would of easily kicked 800 or more goals .

Can probably make a case for quite a few players to have kicked more goals. Richardson is another one, he kicked 800 goals, if he had played all games and not been injured and mainted his goal average per game, then he gets up to the 1,000 goal mark, as this screenshot shows. Swampy the stats person made a post on Twitter last year

 

[Mr Meow]

Richardson's best year in terms of goals kicked was 91, in 1996. If he'd kicked that now (unlikely with how flooding etc is set up) he'd win a Coleman medal. Back in 1996 the top 5 goalkickers were:

1. Tony Lockett: 121
2. Jason Dunstall: 102
3. Matthew Richardson: 91
4. Stewart Loewe: 90
5. Wayne Carey: 82

Yeah exactly and while I know goal kicking tallies have gone down in recent years, 91 even then was insanely good. He just happened to play alongside Lockett and Dunstall in his most prolific season for crying out loud. Pop him alongside Riewoldt and Hawkins and he could easily steal some Coleman's.

 

[Lunchtime]

Yeah exactly and while I know goal kicking tallies have gone down in recent years, 91 even then was insanely good. He just happened to play alongside Lockett and Dunstall in his most prolific season for crying out loud. Pop him alongside Riewoldt and Hawkins and he could easily steal some Coleman's.

Yeah you're right, 1996 was a year where Lockett and Dunstall absolutely fired.

In terms of modern times, he'd be competing against Jack Riewoldt in the forward line.

 

[Mr Meow]

Yeah you're right, 1996 was a year where Lockett and Dunstall absolutely fired.

In terms of modern times, he'd be competing against Jack Riewoldt in the forward line.

Who was better, Riewoldt or Richo? It's quite hard to split them. But Richardson was a hell of a player, right up until the end. In that dynasty side he's have been talked about a LOT more, similar to Martin I think.

 

[Lunchtime]

Who was better, Riewoldt or Richo? It's quite hard to split them. But Richardson was a hell of a player, right up until the end. In that dynasty side he's have been talked about a LOT more, similar to Martin I think.

Pure goal kicking (accuracy): Riewoldt

Athleticism: Richardson. He also had a massive tank - big endurance. Big motor/engine. Could run all day.

Goal Average: Richardson, although he played in eras with less congested Forward 50

Marking: Richardson, averaged 2.7 constested marks, the highest average for the stat since Contested Marks was recorded as a stat. Jack was good at marking, but Richardson was better.

Maybe Richardson the better all around player and could play at CHF and later on he played on the wing, nearly won a Brownlow. He won 13 club leading goal kicker awards so he was very consistent.

Riewoldt had the better career and he was a very good player as well. It's a close call, depends how people view their careers.

I think as the years have gone on, Richardson is more highly rated now than when he was just after retirement.

 

[lordbob]

Probably the most versatile player I've seen, (along with Goodes, who was more versatile as a tall midfielder who rucked and ran the flanks, whereas Pav was KPF, KPD, and could run in the middle). 700 goals as a genuine utility is freakish.

Goodes was pretty good forward as well. super talent.

 

[Roachy8]

Based on total kicked v number of games so average per game, Peter McKenna is probably under-rated, certainly has been by me and possibly many others.
Was a real gun!

 

[lordbob]

Based on total kicked v number of games so average per game, Peter McKenna is probably under-rated, certainly has been by me and possibly many others.
Was a real gun!

if you go by that metric then its hudson - daylight - jesus - dayligh - rest

 

[BF Tiger]

I do enjoy threads like this.

Initial thoughts and comments on posts in this thread (bit Richmond centric I have to confess so I'll put at the end) ...

Elevate Ken Farmer to Legend status ASAP, with an apology for not having done so sooner.

Did Hudson get to 700 quickest in just 122 games!

Jermey Cameron is the only current player who will be added to the list and will end up with 800+ goals. I think Tex would need to play into 2026 to make the list.

Players that didn't get to 700...
Simon Beasley was a fine player. I just looked up his stats and he really held his own. Averaged 3.7 goals/game and had season tallies of 60+ in every full season.
Fev could have had 800+ except he was (is) an idiot. 623 goals in 204 games. Last game at 29 years of age. Possibly had 4 more seasons ahead of him.
Bob Pratt ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Pratt ) was a phenomenal player by all accounts. He kicked 679 goals in 157 games. He wanted to transfer from South Melbourne to Carlton but wasn't allowed so moved to the VFA where he kicked a further 263 goals in 40 games. He ended his VFA career to join the war effort and then attempted a comeback post-war only to get injured in his first game back.
John Coleman - nothing needs to be said.

At the end of the 2023 season Jack Riewoldt and Tom Hawkins

26

Tom Hawkins

Age

35

Ht

197cm

Wt

105kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.2

3star

K

7.9

3star

HB

4.4

3star

M

5.5

5star

T

1.9

4star

G

2.1

5star

D

12.7

3star

K

8.6

3star

HB

4.1

3star

M

5.1

5star

T

2.1

3star

G

1.6

5star

D

7.8

2star

K

5.6

3star

HB

2.2

2star

M

4.2

4star

T

1.0

3star

G

2.2

5star

had played 347 games each and had tallies of 787 and 781 goals, in concurrent careers.

I'd pick Richo ahead of Riewoldt, but in my team he'd kick less goals and be played further up the ground. In reality there is space for both of them in a modern-day best Richmond team.

Also on Richo... his accuracy wasn't terribly below some of the greats. I'm not sure what the figure is but I've seen it discussed on other threads at other times. That said, he did miss some absolute sitters that stick in the memory and give the impression that he was wayward. I reckon if he kicked the sitters that he missed he very easily could have ended up with 900 career goals (approximately one extra goal in every three games).

KB kicked more behinds than goals! - 778 goals, 781 behinds. Was obviously a very skilled player, but must have been shockingly hungry at times (hence the nickname) and burning team-mates in better positions often. In 1968 he kicked 38.53, 1969 - 30.43, 1973 - 31.40, 1974 - 47.50, 1975 - 42.50, 1976 - 27.31, 1979 - 36.43, 1983 - 37.44

Jack Titus isn't celebrated enough within VFL/AFL history. 970 goals in 294 games. If we pored over stats 100 years ago as we do now I firmly believe Richmond would have kept him on for another season to reach 300 games (second player to do so) and 1000 goals. He possibly would have set a then VFL games record by surpassing Gordon Coventry's total of 306 games and be mentioned in the same company as Lockett, Coventry, Dunstall, Franklin, Wade and Ablett. As it was he joined Coburg in 1945 and kicked 119 goals.