Review Port roll over against an actual club

[Addy23]

Carr shouldn't take over now but we have to prioritise some of the kids through to the season. I'm talking Lorenz, Moraes, Berry, Lai.

Even Barrett, Whitlock and Charleson. Give them a game or 2 so they know what they need to work towards if they want to become AFL players. Rotate and rest through the others, we don't want another Achilles or ACL being done now.

 

[Harlott]

If Hinkley pulled the pin in the next few weeks, why would Carr taking over now be a negative? Even if they fired Hinkley, which they won’t.

 

[The Hobo]

Hes a ****ing turnover merchant. Never trust who is listed in the best.

The stats don't back this up

 

[Waspy79]

1Free Against, which was for a high contact in a marking contest, not HTB. 3 turnovers from 27 touches. 82% DE

8 score involvements, 2 assists

He played a strong game, but ppl only remember the few bad moments because of unconscious bias.

He was so far and away from our worst, and has been so far and away from our worst for nearly every game this season.

Can you forgive his 2024 prelim final performance? Whilst Hinkley must take most blame for inexplicably playing Boak behind the ball, Boak gifted the win to Sydney, and he has killed Port in many many games at crucial times with similar skill errors over his long career. I am sick of the sight of him - he's as tarnished as Hinkley.

 

[The Hobo]

Can you forgive his 2024 prelim final performance? Whilst Hinkley must take most blame for inexplicably playing Boak behind the ball, Boak gifted the win to Sydney, and he has killed Port in many many games at crucial times with similar skill errors over his long career. I am sick of the sight of him - he's as tarnished as Hinkley.

Yes - there is nothing to forgive. He gave his best, just like he always does. It was a really poor game by him, but it wasn't a pattern. His games before and after have all been up to standard.

One bad game does not undo many years of great service to the club.

Boak has done far more for the club than you or I have, he does not need our forgiveness for having a poor game, no matter the stakes. If it was a lack of effort or preparation or anything like that - then sure, you could perhaps argue something. This was not that. It was just a bad game, nothing more, nothing less.

 

[The Hobo]

Carr shouldn't take over now but we have to prioritise some of the kids through to the season. I'm talking Lorenz, Moraes, Berry, Lai.

Even Barrett, Whitlock and Charleson. Give them a game or 2 so they know what they need to work towards if they want to become AFL players. Rotate and rest through the others, we don't want another Achilles or ACL being done now.

Not a fan of gifting games just for the sake of it. Most of those on your list deserve a game so no issues (Lorenz, Moraes and Lai), but Berry has not done enough to warrant a place.

Whitlock can stake a claim purely through no viable alternative (though Fin and Lord with 5 each may have put that one aside for at least another week) -and Charleson's recent form means he probably can argue a spot for SPP.

And yes, I realise we've 'gifted' games to McEntee and others - doesn't mean we should continue to gift games to players that have not earnt it. It sets the wrong standards and sends the wrong message.

 

[Waspy79]

Yes - there is nothing to forgive. He gave his best, just like he always does. It was a really poor game by him, but it wasn't a pattern. His games before and after have all been up to standard.

One bad game does not undo many years of great service to the club.

Boak has done far more for the club than you or I have, he does not need our forgiveness for having a poor game, no matter the stakes. If it was a lack of effort or preparation or anything like that - then sure, you could perhaps argue something. This was not that. It was just a bad game, nothing more, nothing less.

I guess this is where we disagree. I think it is a pattern. Just like Hinkley can't coach in finals, Boak has let the club down in big games. If you can't coach in finals, you can't coach, and I would suggest a similar philosophy should apply to players that do not deliver when the heat is on.

 

[The Hobo]

I guess this is where we disagree. I think it is a pattern. Just like Hinkley can't coach in finals, Boak has let the club down in big games. If you can't coach in finals, you can't coach, and I would suggest a similar philosophy should apply to players that do not deliver when the heat is on.

His record in finals is overall pretty good. One bad game doesn't change that.

What other big games has he let the team down in? When you play nearly 400 games, you're bound to have some stinkers - I don't think his stinkers correlate with big games, but happy to be shown some evidence to suggest otherwise.

 

[Waspy79]

His record in finals is overall pretty good. One bad game doesn't change that.

What other big games has he let the team down in? When you play nearly 400 games, you're bound to have some stinkers - I don't think his stinkers correlate with big games, but happy to be shown some evidence to suggest otherwise.

I'd be interested in seeing his goal kicking statistics in finals and Showdowns. Perhaps it is just preconceived bias but post 2014 I have it in my mind he has missed countless shots for goal at crucial times for the club.

 

[Papa G]

His record in finals is overall pretty good. One bad game doesn't change that.

What other big games has he let the team down in? When you play nearly 400 games, you're bound to have some stinkers - I don't think his stinkers correlate with big games, but happy to be shown some evidence to suggest otherwise.

One bad game? Jesus. The guy is a serial pant pooper in big games on big occassions. Even Saturday night when he had the chance to put us back with in 13 points in the last quarter he missed form directly in front. Everybody said to themselves when he had that kick "he'll miss this". He is a part of this failed regime as anybody. I don't hate him like I hate the rest of the merry idiots running the club, he's just been cronically over rated his whole time here and it's time he left. He has given a lot to the club over the years but lets not forget he's also been fabulously financially rewarded for that. Lets not kid ourselves. Him going on is just selfish. It is not in the interests of the club or its future. Another chance to promote his Redbull Wellness schtick. He needs to leave and not remain at the club in any capacity.

 

[The Hobo]

I'd be interested in seeing his goal kicking statistics in finals and Showdowns. Perhaps it is just preconceived bias but post 2014 I have it in my mind he has missed countless shots for goal at crucial times for the club.

His goalkicking has been an issue for a while (regardless of importance of games) - however it's not really his primary role in the team, so even if it isn't great, I don't think it's a major issue. Yes, it can kill momentum at times and it's not ideal - I completely get it.

 

[Waspy79]

His goalkicking has been an issue for a while (regardless of importance of games) - however it's not really his primary role in the team, so even if it isn't great, I don't think it's a major issue. Yes, it can kill momentum at times and it's not ideal - I completely get it.

C'mon mate, every player has a responsibility to convert shots for goal, particularly a captain and leader, particularly when they aren't overly difficult. He's an anti-Gray, an anti-Pendlebury as some like to say. I will leave it to others to drag up the specific examples but he has definitely cost Showdown wins, and my sketchy memory recalls shocking misses in finals also.

 

[Willsy10]

People being like "Houston hasnt set the world on fire" is total cope. That actually has no bearing on what we should have received for him and our net gain or loss on it. He was a star for us and we got a pittance regardless of his form at Collingwood.

Well the same can be said about Berry, part of the deal was pick 13, the fact that who we selected with Pick 13 hasn't worked out so far shouldn't have any bearing if we are not going to take into consideration Houston's drop in form.

 

[The Hobo]

One bad game? Jesus. The guy is a serial pant pooper in big games on big occassions. Even Saturday night when he had the chance to put us back with in 13 points in the last quarter he missed form directly in front. Everybody said to themselves when he had that kick "he'll miss this". He is a part of this failed regime as anybody. I don't hate him like I hate the rest of the merry idiots running the club, he's just been cronically over rated his whole time here and it's time he left. He has given a lot to the club over the years but lets not forget he's also been fabulously financially rewarded for that. Lets not kid ourselves. Him going on is just selfish. It is not in the interests of the club or its future. Another chance to promote his Redbull Wellness schtick. He needs to leave and not remain at the club in any capacity.

Again - yes, his goalkicking is terrible. But he had a good game overall, so to suggest he didn't perform or anything of the sort is a joke.

He's not the first to miss a goal under pressure, and he won't be the last. And yes, I was one of those that expected him to miss the shot. If his main function in the team was to kick goals, this would be a huge problem - but it's not his main function.

 

[The Hobo]

Well the same can be said about Berry, part of the deal was pick 13, the fact that who we selected with Pick 13 hasn't worked out so far shouldn't have any bearing if we are not going to take into consideration Houston's drop in form.

It's the fact that we could have had Murphy Reid that irks me the most.

 

[Doctor Feel]

Well the same can be said about Berry, part of the deal was pick 13, the fact that who we selected with Pick 13 hasn't worked out so far shouldn't have any bearing if we are not going to take into consideration Houston's drop in form.

Mental gymnastics this, lmao

 

[Willsy10]

Mental gymnastics this, lmao

The form of Berry being a factor but not Houston's is also mental gymnastics.

If we selected Reid are we still having these conversations?

The facts are that he was a 27 now 28 year old half back flanker, what we received wasn't a pittance, even if we substract Luko out of the deal and say that he was the future first rounder we gave up we essentially got Berry, Whitlock, Moraes and Richards for Houston. It's not that bad, if we selected Reid it would've been a massive win for us.

Would you trade all of that out to have him back?

 

[Waspy79]

The form of Berry being a factor but not Houston's is also mental gymnastics.

If we selected Reid are we still having these conversations?

The facts are that he was a 27 now 28 year old half back flanker, what we received wasn't a pittance, even if we substract Luko out of the deal and say that he was the future first rounder we gave up we essentially got Berry, Whitlock, Moraes and Richards for Houston. It's not that bad, if we selected Reid it would've been a massive win for us.

Would you trade all of that out to have him back?

More mental gymnastics.

 

[Willsy10]

More mental gymnastics.

It's been widely recognised that it was likely the future first was the cost of Luko in the deal. Which i also don't think is as bad as most have made it out to be. Even without all the academy picks that blow things out, we are looking at a pick 8 or 9 in the draft. A tall forward that can roost goals from outside 50 like Luko did on saturday night is probably worth that in a poor draft.

 

[Waspy79]

It's been widely recognised that it was likely the future first was the cost of Luko in the deal. Which i also don't think is as bad as most have made it out to be. Even without all the academy picks that blow things out, we are looking at a pick 8 or 9 in the draft. A tall forward that can roost goals from outside 50 like Luko did on saturday night is probably worth that in a poor draft.

Port got pick 29 from the SUNS which was used to draft Jack Whitlock. Remove his name from your 'trade back for Houston' list and it becomes Berry, Richards and Moraes. Would I trade them back to Collingwood for Houston? At this point in time and prior to the start of season 2025, yes.

 

[The Hobo]

It's been widely recognised that it was likely the future first was the cost of Luko in the deal. Which i also don't think is as bad as most have made it out to be. Even without all the academy picks that blow things out, we are looking at a pick 8 or 9 in the draft. A tall forward that can roost goals from outside 50 like Luko did on saturday night is probably worth that in a poor draft.

I see him as an upgrade on Marshall - and that's assuming Marshall is able to play any significant number of games in the future. I fear he's one more head knock away from being retired.

We're still lacking the big gorilla forward to round out the 3 talls, hopefully Lord develops into that. MG and Luko are quite mobile, so I would see this as a very good front 3. The only issue that this brings in is that we're missing that forward ruck to help out.

So all in all, it's a good pick up IF he can build on what he showed last week.

 

[Willsy10]

Port got pick 29 from the SUNS which was used to draft Jack Whitlock. Remove his name from your 'trade back for Houston' list and it becomes Berry, Richards and Moraes. Would I trade them back to Collingwood for Houston? At this point in time and prior to the start of season 2025, yes.

why is pick 29 not part of the Houston deal?

 

[Waspy79]

why is pick 29 not part of the Houston deal?

You ruled Luko out, he was dealt to Port by the SUNS.

Port took on Luko, Atkins and pick 29 from the SUNS and gave up a future first.

That makes the Houston trade pick 13 (Berry), 36 (Moraes) and Richards.

 

[Willsy10]

You ruled Luko out, he was dealt to Port by the SUNS.

Port took on Luko, Atkins and pick 29 from the SUNS and gave up a future first.

That makes the Houston trade pick 13 (Berry), 36 (Moraes) and Richards.

Well that makes the luko part of the trade not even bad at all. I just assumed it was a future first and we got nothing else back besides Luko and Atkins, because no one seems to mention pick 29 when evaluating the Luko trade.

 

[Waspy79]

Well that makes the luko part of the trade not even bad at all. I just assumed it was a future first and we got nothing else back besides Luko and Atkins, because no one seems to mention pick 29 when evaluating the Luko trade.

It was the late addition of pick 29 to the deal that apparently led to Port agreeing to it. I also agree the Luko deal, if separated out from the Houston deal as I did, is not as bad as many suggest. I think many were worried it was going to cost a top 4 pick, it now looks unlikely to be a pick in the top 8 or so (famous last words).