Discussion Random Discussion

[pebblesofsand]

Where are you Pebbles? That looks apocalyptic. Stay safe man.

We're a few km's outside of Lakes Entrance heading towards Metung. These are all the spot fires that were starting ahead of the main fires (black areas) before the wind change took it away from our area.

It was a wild day - late afternoon the cloud columns from the two main fires joined up and started creating their own weather - wind direction spinning all round the compass, gusting up to 70 KM one minute then it would go completely still for a few minutes then come in from a completely different direction, then the lightning started - even had a bit of rain. Pretty scary if you haven't experienced it before.

When the evening came the column collapsed and then all the hot embers came down hence all the spot fires.

As I said we were pretty lucky because without the wind change it was headed for the more populated areas along the coast.

Some towns still in real danger though.

May need to spend the day washing the ash of the cars and the house though!!

 

[Kildonan]

Apparently something in the order of 15% of Victoria's population has been evacuated from their homes.
You might be able to help by offering a place of refuge where people can shower and have an ordinary meal. Maybe charge their phones or even sleep in a bed.
It can't hurt to check with anyone you know who has been affected - to see if you can help them or just to make sure they are safe.
If they have been evacuated, then it would be prudent for them to inform the authorities before leaving for an alternative shelter than they have provided.

 

[gringo2011]

Hard to see us doing this.

How Germany closed its coal industry without sacking a single miner

After Coal: Can Australia learn from Germany's efforts to end its coal era while protecting its workers and communities?

www.smh.com.au

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Hard to see us doing this.

How Germany closed its coal industry without sacking a single miner

After Coal: Can Australia learn from Germany's efforts to end its coal era while protecting its workers and communities?

www.smh.com.au

They are also at an advantage to us.
We can't just simply emulate Germany.
All of the countries in Europe import and export their power from neighboring countries to at least a small degree. Its an easy way of avoiding the S.A. style grid failures, ( and no Tesla Batteries are not a large scale viable solution ).
And if you think the "money" from one of the richest economy's in Europe isn't a factor....................

Right NOW as i type.

Germany is getting 50% of their power from Wind.
They are getting 15% from coal (20% of their installed capacity).
They are getting 13% from Nuclear
9% from Biomass.

Live 24/7 CO₂ emissions of electricity consumption

Electricity Maps is a live 24/7 visualization of where your electricity comes from and how much CO2 was emitted to produce it.

www.electricitymap.org

You need that base load buffer to avoid going down the path of brownouts. ( In Europe you can always buy some Nuclear electricity from the french.)

I disagree with that article.
Australia's coal industry can be closed, just like Hazelwood was closed.
BUT FIRST WE NEED AN ALTERNATIVE SOURCE OF POWER.

Right now at this time...France is using Nuclear for more than half of their energy.


If we end up a country with routine brownouts, we are going to be even more of a global backwater than we already were.

 

[gringo2011]

They are also at an advantage to us.
We can't just simply emulate Germany.
All of the countries in Europe import and export their power from neighboring countries to at least a small degree. Its an easy way of avoiding the S.A. style grid failures, ( and no Tesla Batteries are not a large scale viable solution ).
And if you think the "money" from one of the richest economy's in Europe isn't a factor....................

Right NOW as i type.

Germany is getting 50% of their power from Wind.
They are getting 15% from coal (20% of their installed capacity).
They are getting 13% from Nuclear
9% from Biomass.

Live 24/7 CO₂ emissions of electricity consumption

Electricity Maps is a live 24/7 visualization of where your electricity comes from and how much CO2 was emitted to produce it.

www.electricitymap.org

You need that base load buffer to avoid going down the path of brownouts. ( In Europe you can always buy some Nuclear electricity from the french.)

I disagree with that article.
Australia's coal industry can be closed, just like Hazelwood was closed.
BUT FIRST WE NEED AN ALTERNATIVE SOURCE OF POWER.

Right now at this time...France is using Nuclear for more than half of their energy.


If we end up a country with routine brownouts, we are going to be even more of a global backwater than we already were.

That's why it makes sense to have energy policy, my mate who now works for a power giant worked for a company that built and installed wind farms. They waited nearly a decade for a policy after they were on track to put in a lot under Kevin Rudd. Abbott promised them that he was going to put one in and then backed out of it under pressure from the mining lobby. They were in limbo with no one wanting to go hard and lots of government representatives making in principle agreements then backing out.

We can't emulate the Germans but we can have leadership and policy that suits us that makes the inevitable shift away from heavily polluting power production. Even the most strident anti-green must see it's like we are refusing to give up our wagon building operations in the age of the car. The power companies want policy. A lot of businesses want certainty as well.

It's 10 years of nothing at the moment and no-one is incentivised to invest and there is a Mexican stand off with the green lobby staring down coal fired power and the heavily minerals council backed federal government staring down any investment in renewables.

We could easily have wind and solar making up a huge percentage and have smaller base load gas turbines for backup like they are building in Dandenong.

 

[gringo2011]

They are also at an advantage to us.
We can't just simply emulate Germany.
All of the countries in Europe import and export their power from neighboring countries to at least a small degree. Its an easy way of avoiding the S.A. style grid failures, ( and no Tesla Batteries are not a large scale viable solution ).
And if you think the "money" from one of the richest economy's in Europe isn't a factor....................

Right NOW as i type.

Germany is getting 50% of their power from Wind.
They are getting 15% from coal (20% of their installed capacity).
They are getting 13% from Nuclear
9% from Biomass.

Live 24/7 CO₂ emissions of electricity consumption

Electricity Maps is a live 24/7 visualization of where your electricity comes from and how much CO2 was emitted to produce it.

www.electricitymap.org

You need that base load buffer to avoid going down the path of brownouts. ( In Europe you can always buy some Nuclear electricity from the french.)

I disagree with that article.
Australia's coal industry can be closed, just like Hazelwood was closed.
BUT FIRST WE NEED AN ALTERNATIVE SOURCE OF POWER.

Right now at this time...France is using Nuclear for more than half of their energy.


If we end up a country with routine brownouts, we are going to be even more of a global backwater than we already were.

Just on brown outs, we will get there regardless just because we aren't building coal and aren't rolling out green energy and we bring in a lot of immigrants and build massively consumptive housing. It's not a difficult equation. Our living standards drop if they don't build infrastructure to support the people moving to an area. Divesting in schools, roads and other essentials while making the population bigger makes us look like we have finial growth but makes life worse for the people long term. Not spending on that stuff is just shifting the problem don the road. Politicians have no interest in long term planning any more. It's always someone else problem in the future now.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Just on brown outs, we will get there regardless just because we aren't building coal and aren't rolling out green energy and we bring in a lot of immigrants and build massively consumptive housing. It's not a difficult equation. Our living standards drop if they don't build infrastructure to support the people moving to an area. Divesting in schools, roads and other essentials while making the population bigger makes us look like we have finial growth but makes life worse for the people long term. Not spending on that stuff is just shifting the problem don the road. Politicians have no interest in long term planning any more. It's always someone else problem in the future now.

Yep , third world here we come.

Politicians seem to think that if we suddenly need electricity we can build a large power station in a week.
In reality it can take a decade.
At least the old SEC used to have a plan, they were planning out decades ahead.

Watch them all blame each other when the s**t hits the fan, when in reality they both had opportunity to do something.

Even the greens are no help, telling us what power stations to shut down is not addressing the problem.

( My car is an unreliable polluting crap heap i can't afford a new one and i have no access to public tranport. Here's the number of a guy who will tow it away for nothing say the greens ).

 

[CursingFijian]

I love that electricityMap SaintsSeptember. What is API? Is that a public or private organisation? A couple of questions that arise out of that; why is hydro in Tasmania only at 18% of total capacity and would Tasmania have the capacity to export hydro energy to the mainland? I like Sweden's model with a 40-60% nuclear base complemented by strong renewables.

Again, (and I state for the record that I do not know a lot about this) but Bill Gates thinks he has done the grunt work to revolutionize nuclear energy for the future with his Travelling Wave Reactor (TWR). Essentially, he has developed a reactor that uses "depleted uranium, which is currently a waste byproduct of the uranium enrichment process. "Änother improvement: The reactors use a coolant liquid sodium, which is safer than water. And in an event like [the] earthquake and Tsunami in Japan, the reactors would automatically shut down and continue to cool."

TerraPower was on the verge of a pilot project near Beijing. But Trump's tariff war put in place new restrictions on handing nuclear technology to China, and it effectively put an end to that.

TWR TerraPower

TerraPower aims to develop a sustainable and economic nuclear energy system while greatly reducing proliferation risks and creating new options for converting low-level waste into vast energy resources.

terrapower.com

Big Ideas: John Gilleland, CEO of TerraPower

idea: turn a terrifying burden intoa valuable resource

www.inc.com

Trump’s Tech Battle With China Roils Bill Gates Nuclear Venture

Bill Gates said an effort to develop safer and cheaper nuclear reactors at a company he co-founded is now unlikely to proceed because of recent changes in U.S. policy toward China.

www.wsj.com

 

[prophetic1]

Hard to see us doing this.

How Germany closed its coal industry without sacking a single miner

After Coal: Can Australia learn from Germany's efforts to end its coal era while protecting its workers and communities?

www.smh.com.au

It a great effort on Germany's part. In Australia, maybe. If we can get the relationship among Government, Big Business, and Unions equitable. Well equitable in as much as it should favor the workers at the Coal Face. (like that's ever gonna happen here)
So long as that relation ship isn't based on 'Méthode du Titanic' the workers at the bottom locked in and unable to save themselves, while the rest sort out the only lifeboats available. Meanwhile this Govt fiddles while it all burns and sinks. Apparently the only version of mutual understanding and co operation this Govt understands. No they'll extract every last embered cent.

 

[Pakenhamsaint]

I know Batemans Bay well. That's just nuts.

Google Maps

Find local businesses, view maps and get driving directions in Google Maps.

www.google.com

 

[Pakenhamsaint]

Linsay Fox must be off to Portsea.

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

just thinking about the situation with Scomo and how seriously out of touch with the people he is at the moment .. hypothetically say when Turnbull got railroaded if the libs didnt pull the swifty on Julie Bishop to effectivly rule her out as an option do you think we would be in a better position today with her as PM or would it not make a single differance

 

[prophetic1]

Linsay Fox must be off to Portsea.

To think that Sorrento and Portsea were the first sites that were considered for the Settlement of Melbourne..but lack of abundant fresh water decided the location.. If things had of been different we would have had a harbor with skyscrapers viewing both front and back beaches ..ocean views and bays.. bridge bigger and more spectacular across the rip from Portsea to Queenscliffe A skyline and waterside to rival New York, Sydney and anywhere in the world. Ahh well i guess the MCG and Docklands at night are better than nothing...
It would have been something though..

 

[Pakenhamsaint]

Here's a live shot of all the people I'm spending new years with:

 

[MUFKilda]

Almost midnight here, so happy new year to all, particularly those affected by the fires just now. Stay safe.

 

[pebblesofsand]

A big shout out to all the fireys in East Gippsland. Amazing job done by the people on the ground and those managing the mammoth campaign of keeping communities safe.

Hopefully the 4 people currently unaccounted for are found alive and well.

The map below roughly shows the East Gippsland Shire Council area (21,000 sq kilometres in total) The black areas are those already burnt or fire affected.

The fire in the far eastern corner (Croajingalong NP - Mallacoota) started less than three days ago has now burnt over 100,000 hectares but miraculously the 4,000 people huddled on the foreshore at Mallacoota were spared the worst with a late wind change.

 

[gringo2011]

just thinking about the situation with Scomo and how seriously out of touch with the people he is at the moment .. hypothetically say when Turnbull got railroaded if the libs didnt pull the swifty on Julie Bishop to effectivly rule her out as an option do you think we would be in a better position today with her as PM or would it not make a single differance

I don't think she's a fan of Scomo.

Julie Bishop takes swipe at Scott Morrison over bushfire crisis

The former foreign minister has strongly criticised the Prime Minister in front of 150 Liberal supporters.

www.smh.com.au

 

[SaintsSeptember]

I love that electricityMap SaintsSeptember. What is API? Is that a public or private organisation? A couple of questions that arise out of that; why is hydro in Tasmania only at 18% of total capacity and would Tasmania have the capacity to export hydro energy to the mainland? I like Sweden's model with a 40-60% nuclear base complemented by strong renewables.

Again, (and I state for the record that I do not know a lot about this) but Bill Gates thinks he has done the grunt work to revolutionize nuclear energy for the future with his Travelling Wave Reactor (TWR). Essentially, he has developed a reactor that uses "depleted uranium, which is currently a waste byproduct of the uranium enrichment process. "Änother improvement: The reactors use a coolant liquid sodium, which is safer than water. And in an event like [the] earthquake and Tsunami in Japan, the reactors would automatically shut down and continue to cool."

TerraPower was on the verge of a pilot project near Beijing. But Trump's tariff war put in place new restrictions on handing nuclear technology to China, and it effectively put an end to that.

TWR TerraPower

TerraPower aims to develop a sustainable and economic nuclear energy system while greatly reducing proliferation risks and creating new options for converting low-level waste into vast energy resources.

terrapower.com

Big Ideas: John Gilleland, CEO of TerraPower

idea: turn a terrifying burden intoa valuable resource

www.inc.com

Trump’s Tech Battle With China Roils Bill Gates Nuclear Venture

Bill Gates said an effort to develop safer and cheaper nuclear reactors at a company he co-founded is now unlikely to proceed because of recent changes in U.S. policy toward China.

www.wsj.com

I don't know , but i'd assume that if your ran the hydro at 100% all the time, you'd run out of water.

 

[Pakenhamsaint]

I hope the person who gave me thier cold over Christmas steps on lego.

 

[Sir Skid]

Australia is rightly being judged harshly around the world for climate inaction.

Rudderless Ship under #scottyfrommarketing

 

[sammm]

I have plenty of Jewish friends who are against the way zionism is used as a colonial tool to silence dissent. You can be anti colonial and not anti-semitic. One of our friends who actually has an ultra orthodox sister who was a settler on Palestinian land wants to stop future mass migration and to settle on pre 1967 borders. One guy I know is orthodox and he's pretty right wing but the rest of the jewish people we know are pretty sympathetic to the Palestinians. I don't approve of the way Israel is operating but I'm certainly not anti semitic. I hate things the US does and don't hate all Americans either.

I don't believe in giving land for peace. It doesn't work. You would need both sides committed and there only has been one side.
My other issue is that if you go back to the pre 67 land it leaves Israel too vulnerable. It like a war with missiles occurring between Albury and Wodonga. Or a war in Frankston and the missiles coming to moorabbin. How is that a normal living situation for the people in Netyana etc

Anyway too difficult to answer

 

[gringo2011]

A big shout out to all the fireys in East Gippsland. Amazing job done by the people on the ground and those managing the mammoth campaign of keeping communities safe.

Hopefully the 4 people currently unaccounted for are found alive and well.

The map below roughly shows the East Gippsland Shire Council area (21,000 sq kilometres in total) The black areas are those already burnt or fire affected.

The fire in the far eastern corner (Croajingalong NP - Mallacoota) started less than three days ago has now burnt over 100,000 hectares but miraculously the 4,000 people huddled on the foreshore at Mallacoota were spared the worst with a late wind change.



View attachment 800245

There are heaps of smaller fires not being reported too. We have one coming towards our property up near Walhalla, it's heading back towards that front.

 

[gringo2011]

I don't believe in giving land for peace. It doesn't work. You would need both sides committed and there only has been one side.
My other issue is that if you go back to the pre 67 land it leaves Israel too vulnerable. It like a war with missiles occurring between Albury and Wodonga. Or a war in Frankston and the missiles coming to moorabbin. How is that a normal living situation for the people in Netyana etc

Anyway too difficult to answer

I don't think they should give anything back, just stop pushing into Palestinian territory .I'm not going pretend to be an expert on it though.

 

[gringo2011]

Jesus, the w***er from the army justifying not helping the CFA is a dick. He claims they are leaving it to the “experts”. My nephew is fighting fires in Gippsland and I can tell you, him and his mates who are crewing there are 20 yo apprentices tradies not highly trained experts. My nephews greatest achievement is growing an ironic mullet and finding creative ways to s**t his brother, his expertise isn’t in fire management, my sister is a senior CFA leader, she still has limited training but is experienced, they are still often isolated and with out communications. The army has better equipment and training. They should be in helping at the fronts. A lot of them were expecting help.

 

[Yawkey way]

Jesus, the w***er from the army justifying not helping the CFA is a dick. He claims they are leaving it to the “experts”. My nephew is fighting fires in Gippsland and I can tell you, him and his mates who are crewing there are 20 yo apprentices tradies not highly trained experts. My nephews greatest achievement is growing an ironic mullet and finding creative ways to s**t his brother, his expertise isn’t in fire management, my sister is a senior CFA leader, she still has limited training but is experienced, they are still often isolated and with out communications. The army has better equipment and training. They should be in helping at the fronts. A lot of them were expecting help.

I didn’t see it, was this on the news?.