Discussion Random Discussion

[Hubnester]

I've said it all along.

You can't stump the Trump.

 

[CursingFijian]

 

[gringo2011]

Time to buy shares in a bomb shelter business


I get the feeling they're going to be in demand when America realises what they've just done!

I was in England when the Brexit happened and it was like they woke up after a huge night on the piss with a face tattoo. The US might be the same I reckon.

 

[RoundCubic]

I was in England when the Brexit happened and it was like they woke up after a huge night on the piss with a face tattoo. The US might be the same I reckon.

Wait until they pass the welfare cuts and tax breaks thats when the ball will drop

 

[StFly]

I was in England when the Brexit happened and it was like they woke up after a huge night on the piss with a face tattoo. The US might be the same I reckon.

I was in in the lead up, it was split 50/50 and you generally had a lot of venom behind the reasons behind both sides of the argument unless you were Scottish, then you were firmly in the "what the shit England?" camp and voting to secede from them to stay with the EU.

This is different to a domestic charlatan gazumping ideological swings and roundabouts in a choice based "can I be bothered" democratic system where your vote counts; but only if you actually place it, otherwise you're free to effectively do whatever the shit you like so long as you're in the right state to do it in.

 

[gringo2011]

Wait until they pass the welfare cuts and tax breaks thats when the ball will drop

It was a real class thing in England, we had a railway guard telling us it was the best thing that England had ever done as he would prefer have ties with Aussies like us that "darkies" and Eastern European who he thought were vermin.....my wife's family are Croats so she was biting her tongue, lots of business owners and educated folk were in a state of depression. The neighbours next to were we stayed put a sign up in their window with "doomed" written on it.

 

[RoundCubic]

It was a real class thing in England, we had a railway guard telling us it was the best thing that England had ever done as he would prefer have ties with Aussies like us that "darkies" and Eastern European who he thought were vermin.....my wife's family are Croats so she was biting her tongue, lots of business owners and educated folk were in a state of depression. The neighbours next to were we stayed put a sign up in their window with "doomed" written on it.

As the old curse goes "may you live in interesting times"

 

[austinnn]

Pauline Hanson and Marine LePen must be kicking their lips.

To all the folks on here and SS who whinge about political correctness and "rabid lefties" etc, enjoy! This is your time - let's hope you guys don't do too much damage we can't mop up again.

 

[pebblesofsand]

Pauline Hanson and Marine LePen must be kicking their lips.

To all the folks on here and SS who whinge about political correctness and "rabid lefties" etc, enjoy! This is your time - let's hope you guys don't do too much damage we can't mop up again.

Well we all better hope that the scientists are wrong on tipping points in global warming because 4 years of a Republican President and a republican dominated senate and House of Reps will mean a massive unwinding of attempts to control carbon emissions.

The grand kids say thanks for nothing.

 

[Flandersss]

Suck on them apples Hillary

 

[RoundCubic]

It was a real class thing in England, we had a railway guard telling us it was the best thing that England had ever done as he would prefer have ties with Aussies like us that "darkies" and Eastern European who he thought were vermin.....my wife's family are Croats so she was biting her tongue, lots of business owners and educated folk were in a state of depression. The neighbours next to were we stayed put a sign up in their window with "doomed" written on it.

Brexit was really only a disaster for tthe UK's economy.
The concerning part was so many ignored experts and listened to the people who told them what they wanted to hear.
That the UK economy would be better after Brexit not worse that there would be extra government money available.
The same thing has now happened in the US where every educated commentator people who had never spoke out before said Trump can't deliver on his economic promises that he is a huckster snake oil sales man and now he is president.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Pauline Hanson and Marine LePen must be kicking their lips.

To all the folks on here and SS who whinge about political correctness and "rabid lefties" etc, enjoy! This is your time - let's hope you guys don't do too much damage we can't mop up again.

I think people in the USA are thinking its been **** for a long time, probably since the 1970's, and the Trump thing may be born of desperation that someone will do something different and get things on the right track again. Hillary WAS going to be same old same old.

Look at our own politics. Does it really make much difference which party gets elected. Australia is returning to Colonial days.
Trends are :
1. We dig minerals out of the ground and sell them unprocessed.
2. We raise animals and sell them unprocessed.
We use the money from the a/m to mow each other lawns and sell coffee and smashed avocado's to each other.

Wine ..... We are good at wine. So we have in fact caught up with ancient Roman technology.

 

[CALL ME SNAKE]

It was only a matter of time till all those Rednecks finally figured out how to vote

 

[Kildonan]

I think the result in America reflects a worldwide trend to the right. Psychological studies have shown that all else being equal, if you inject real fear into the environment then people who were in the middle tend to vote more right wing, and right wingers see the trend heading their way as justifying their racism / sexism / bigotry. The world becomes a worse place to live. Then the trend swings back to the left as the fears are realized to be unfounded or have been dealt with. The conservatives only need to successfully continue fear campaigns to keep power. The rise of ISIS has had a major factor in externally stoking a populations fear factor. Is this how we want to live?

 

[pebblesofsand]

I think people in the USA are thinking its been **** for a long time, probably since the 1970's, and the Trump thing may be born of desperation that someone will do something different and get things on the right track again. Hillary WAS going to be same old same old.

Look at our own politics. Does it really make much difference which party gets elected. Australia is returning to Colonial days.
Trends are :
1. We dig minerals out of the ground and sell them unprocessed.
2. We raise animals and sell them unprocessed.
We use the money from the a/m to mow each other lawns and sell coffee and smashed avocado's to each other.

Wine ..... We are good at wine. So we have in fact caught up with ancient Roman technology.

The only problem for the Trump supporters are that they also voted in the republican hacks who now control both the House of Reps and the Senate.

First thing that will happen will be tax cuts for the rich and welfare cuts for the poor.

I bet you every cent I have that by the end of 4 years of Trump/Republican rule the disenfranchised voters who supported Trump will be worse off and Trumpp and the top 10% will be better off.

Maybe then they will realise that Bernie Sanders was the "rebel" they should have voted for - but that would never happen because they reckon he's a commie socialist.

Go figure!!!

 

[SaintsSeptember]

The only problem for the Trump supporters are that they also voted in the republican hacks who now control both the House of Reps and the Senate.

First thing that will happen will be tax cuts for the rich and welfare cuts for the poor.

I bet you every cent I have that by the end of 4 years of Trump/Republican rule the disenfranchised voters who supported Trump will be worse off and Trumpp and the top 10% will be better off.

Maybe then they will realise that Bernie Sanders was the "rebel" they should have voted for - but that would never happen because they reckon he's a commie socialist.

Go figure!!!

Rich and poor can be simplistic though. And giving the poor more welfare is self defeating unless you find a money tree. There NEED's to be welfare cuts. The hard part is to make it so they don't need welfare, not to make their lives harder.

Take tax cuts for business for example. Yes a business may be making plenty of money and not paying its fair share compared to those on PAYE. But the alternative is for them to move head office to Northern Ireland or the Caymans and pay nothing. Or worse move their entire operations offshore. So its not about "fair" its about what will work best. Fair is not going to happen.

If they make it more difficult to bring in goods and services from outside the country then that MAY cost consumers more , but it will also encourage local goods and services and make more people who can consume. If goods are more expensive it encourages "repair" rather than "replace" so the repair industry grows ( and better for the environment - making heaps of short life product for nothing is absolutely horrible for the environment ). The USA are lucky they have enough existing manufacturing and industry that it will grow proportionally with any increase in import costs.
In Australia it has to be enough to trigger some investment - much harder.

I really despair for all the young kids i hear have aspirations for working in computer programming. They don't understand that no matter how good they are at it, someone can email the program from India at a cheaper rate than they can live on. So IT support is the best they can hope for. - Service industry.
Can a country like Australia exist with just Minerals, Agriculture and Service?

 

[phantom13]

I've proposed this theory a few times and I firmly believe its a huge cause for what were seeing, to fully disclose before I articulate this, Its not in line with my personal beliefs and I think its ridiculous to suggest but its what I think were seeing.

The privileged white middle/upper class (which makes up the overwhelming majority of the US and AUS) is getting to a point where the feel like they are being personally victimized by the extreme left (an example being my brother in law who grew up wealthy, white and privileged but who is now completely into blaming himself and all white people for any social issue) so they are rebelling. 30-40 year old white men saw their dads get pushed ahead of minorities and women all while slapping their secretaries on the ass and generally having a grand old time at everyone else expense and now they are disenfranchised because they feel they are being blamed everytime a black kid gets shot by a cop or a white guy gets a lenient sentence.

Trump, Abott or Pauline, The Australian Patriot Party etc. whilst I doubt anyone with any sense actually agrees with what they preach they represent a "simpler" "better" time for the majority of the population and of course we all want equality and harmony but if it means they have to give up that privilege and cop blame for every single social issue why would they. They also feed on fear and blame which is such an easy thing to do "sure everyone knows that white/social privilege exists but the REAL problem is the muslims/Mexicans/blacks".

I think we all need to take a breath, acknowledge the progress that has been made, quit throwing blame around, its doesn't help fix anything and I refer to this both ways. In order to break to privilege or the patriarchy or whatever it is that we have that is opposing harmony we need to do it with a handshake and a friendly word, not a slap and an insult.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

I've proposed this theory a few times and I firmly believe its a huge cause for what were seeing, to fully disclose before I articulate this, Its not in line with my personal beliefs and I think its ridiculous to suggest but its what I think were seeing.

The privileged white middle/upper class (which makes up the overwhelming majority of the US and AUS) is getting to a point where the feel like they are being personally victimized by the extreme left (an example being my brother in law who grew up wealthy, white and privileged but who is now completely into blaming himself and all white people for any social issue) so they are rebelling. 30-40 year old white men saw their dads get pushed ahead of minorities and women all while slapping their secretaries on the ass and generally having a grand old time at everyone else expense and now they are disenfranchised because they feel they are being blamed everytime a black kid gets shot by a cop or a white guy gets a lenient sentence.

Trump, Abott or Pauline, The Australian Patriot Party etc. whilst I doubt anyone with any sense actually agrees with what they preach they represent a "simpler" "better" time for the majority of the population and of course we all want equality and harmony but if it means they have to give up that privilege and cop blame for every single social issue why would they. They also feed on fear and blame which is such an easy thing to do "sure everyone knows that white/social privilege exists but the REAL problem is the muslims/Mexicans/blacks".

I think we all need to take a breath, acknowledge the progress that has been made, quit throwing blame around, its doesn't help fix anything and I refer to this both ways. In order to break to privilege or the patriarchy or whatever it is that we have that is opposing harmony we need to do it with a handshake and a friendly word, not a slap and an insult.

Wow there are some Stereotypes in there.
The real world is not so black and white if you pardon the pun.

 

[CALL ME SNAKE]

I really despair for all the young kids i hear have aspirations for working in computer programming. They don't understand that no matter how good they are at it, someone can email the program from India at a cheaper rate than they can live on. So IT support is the best they can hope for. - Service industry.
Can a country like Australia exist with just Minerals, Agriculture and Service?

Im just giving a much more basic take on your concerns here.
But when i was in high school a lot of friends or kids i knew had part time jobs on a weekend at some store like Kmart for example. And a lot of the girls worked at supermarkets on the registers (checkout chicks as they were known) on the weekends.
Go to Kmart on a Sunday morning now. Theres probably 1 person standing at all the 'self serve' checkouts and probably 1 kid in laybuy.
Besides from flipping greasy burgers at McChuckies there is stuff all part time jobs around for kids anymore.
Who needs 12 kids working on a Sat when 1 person can supervise the self serve registers.
It might sound like a simplistic view but id rather pay $10 for a t-shirt from somebody with a job serving me. Than pay $5 for a tshirt and use a self serve checkout.

I think im just too old fashioned

 

[phantom13]

Wow there are some Stereotypes in there.
The real world is not so black and white if you pardon the pun.

No its not and there is a stack of nuance and difference but Brexit, Trump, Abbott the general culture of fear descending on the world is coming from somewhere. Throwing my opinion out there about a small part of it.

 

[majortinkle]

I think the result in America reflects a worldwide trend to the right. Psychological studies have shown that all else being equal, if you inject real fear into the environment then people who were in the middle tend to vote more right wing, and right wingers see the trend heading their way as justifying their racism / sexism / bigotry. The world becomes a worse place to live. Then the trend swings back to the left as the fears are realized to be unfounded or have been dealt with. The conservatives only need to successfully continue fear campaigns to keep power. The rise of ISIS has had a major factor in externally stoking a populations fear factor. Is this how we want to live?

I don't think politics has caught up with the new social media order of the world. I think politicians are just as inadequate as they have always been, but that the media is much harder to control.

Voters that would have traditionally voted blind along their traditional party lines, without bothering to be informed on specifics are now being informed by reactionary social media posts from randoms who are barely more informed than they are.

It is leading to a shift to dramatic change as the traditional politicians keep to their platitudes and tactics of saying as little of substance as possible.

The drama from the newcomers is castigated in the press, but the voters aren't reading the press so the wild statements survive without the normal checks and balances of the traditional media filter.

Politicians on all sides need to start saying what they actually think rather than just trying to avoid offending sections of the electorate if they want to actually get any cut-through. That is incredibly foreign to them though and will take some time for them to adjust.

 

[Persevering Saint]

Following people like Michael Moore, my take is that people voted for Trump because of the three things people ultimately care about most: my job, my house, and my family. They want to know they can put food on the table, because they have money to buy the food, a house for the table to be in, and a family sitting around it.

In the wake of the GFC, a lot of the former middle class became the poor: they lost their jobs, their houses, and thus their families. And the Republicans with their trickle-down Reaganomics were part of the problem; and the Democrats who were supposed to be on their side were caring more about men being able to go into women's bathrooms than about getting them their jobs back - and the fixation of the left with those kinds of issues in itself seemed, in their mind, to threaten their families. They no longer had anybody in their corner. Instead, the career politicians and the media and the twittersphere are all stuck tight in their fat rich cities, screwing the little guy.

And that's where Trump comes in. He may have used the Republican ticket, but he's no Republican. He's not either party, because those parties are entrenched in city, Washington politics. Voting Trump was a vote against Washington itself. To those who say that Trump is rich, that's true, but to them he's Tony Stark rich (the best analogy I've heard!): Iron Man, who sneers at the bureaucrats as he breaks their rules and gets the job done for the little guy.

Now, he will inevitably let them down. Even if he wanted to be fighting for them (which I don't think he does), he will find the mechanisms of government would be too strong for him to do so - Washington is still too powerful a force, whether it's Republican or Democrat.

And hey, I'm not saying that I, in any way shape or form, agree with their positions on this stuff. I'm just listening to their perspective, in order to understand how this happened. Because it's precisely why Brexit happened, and why One Nation 2.0 happened. We all now have a choice: we can continue to sneer at them and ridicule them for being idiots, and keep shouting in the echo-chamber of our perspectives, and keep predicting what will happen out of an event none of us predicted would have happened; or we can shut up for a second, and listen to these people with the respect that should be afforded to human beings, especially those who don't feel very listened to, and who just freaking want their job, their house, and their family.

 

[Dr Spaceman]

Outrage in the USA where it was discovered that some voting machines were turning Trump votes into Clinton votes!

Later investigations revealed that the Federal Election Commission had identified a shortage of machines in the lead up to the election and had managed to obtain some additional technology from the AFL in Australia.

The Americans quickly adapted the "AFLFree Kick Adjudicators" by simply replacing "Hawthorn" with "Hillary" & "The Other Team" with "Trump".

Post election tests of the machines by the AFL's Director of Umpiring apparently failed to detect any anomoly.

 

[gringo2011]

Im just giving a much more basic take on your concerns here.
But when i was in high school a lot of friends or kids i knew had part time jobs on a weekend at some store like Kmart for example. And a lot of the girls worked at supermarkets on the registers (checkout chicks as they were known) on the weekends.
Go to Kmart on a Sunday morning now. Theres probably 1 person standing at all the 'self serve' checkouts and probably 1 kid in laybuy.
Besides from flipping greasy burgers at McChuckies there is stuff all part time jobs around for kids anymore.
Who needs 12 kids working on a Sat when 1 person can supervise the self serve registers.
It might sound like a simplistic view but id rather pay $10 for a t-shirt from somebody with a job serving me. Than pay $5 for a tshirt and use a self serve checkout.

I think im just too old fashioned

Na. I'm the same, someone told me that Coles lay off staff if people don't use check outs so I use them now even when it's quicker to do it yourself. I saw an article saying China hasn't stolen Americas manufacturing jobs, automation and processing robots and programmed machines have. They are still the second biggest manufacturer on earth but have much fewer employed. China still has elements of the old commy system where jobs are important and labour cheap so are manual labourers still. If you don't spend your money the way you like the world to run you are powerless.

Our spending is the only way we really can change the world. All the "disruptive" new businesses are the same, Uber is cheap but they have a head office in the US and don't employ all the secretaries, phone workers etc. They actually cost jobs -every time you stay in someones house instead of a hotel you are not supporting the staff. It's the perfect neocon model where people compete for the least money to get the work and the company has no responsibility for any external costs like maintenance and holiday pay etc.

 

[gringo2011]

Following people like Michael Moore, my take is that people voted for Trump because of the three things people ultimately care about most: my job, my house, and my family. They want to know they can put food on the table, because they have money to buy the food, a house for the table to be in, and a family sitting around it.

In the wake of the GFC, a lot of the former middle class became the poor: they lost their jobs, their houses, and thus their families. And the Republicans with their trickle-down Reaganomics were part of the problem; and the Democrats who were supposed to be on their side were caring more about men being able to go into women's bathrooms than about getting them their jobs back - and the fixation of the left with those kinds of issues in itself seemed, in their mind, to threaten their families. They no longer had anybody in their corner. Instead, the career politicians and the media and the twittersphere are all stuck tight in their fat rich cities, screwing the little guy.

And that's where Trump comes in. He may have used the Republican ticket, but he's no Republican. He's not either party, because those parties are entrenched in city, Washington politics. Voting Trump was a vote against Washington itself. To those who say that Trump is rich, that's true, but to them he's Tony Stark rich (the best analogy I've heard!): Iron Man, who sneers at the bureaucrats as he breaks their rules and gets the job done for the little guy.

Now, he will inevitably let them down. Even if he wanted to be fighting for them (which I don't think he does), he will find the mechanisms of government would be too strong for him to do so - Washington is still too powerful a force, whether it's Republican or Democrat.

And hey, I'm not saying that I, in any way shape or form, agree with their positions on this stuff. I'm just listening to their perspective, in order to understand how this happened. Because it's precisely why Brexit happened, and why One Nation 2.0 happened. We all now have a choice: we can continue to sneer at them and ridicule them for being idiots, and keep shouting in the echo-chamber of our perspectives, and keep predicting what will happen out of an event none of us predicted would have happened; or we can shut up for a second, and listen to these people with the respect that should be afforded to human beings, especially those who don't feel very listened to, and who just freaking want their job, their house, and their family.

He was good at picking up the vibe of the times. From the Federal reserve to the career politicians and their love of championing for big business for money. He is not going to be able to do anything of any real value and will probably end up a huge disappointment to the people he's promised so much to and probably will end up causing the US to fall to pieces. There are parts of the US that are third world with people working three jobs to get by. Sessional university lecturers are using food stamps just to eat while marking papers for free in their unpaid time. It's a train wreck through their own greed and lack of compassion for each other and I can't see any way out for them but full scale revolution to reboot.