Preview Round 7, 2023: St.Kilda v Port Adelaide - Marvel Stadium, Friday 28th April, 7:50PM AEST *WOOD 100TH*

[Browny2Carlisle]

So Max King starts at Sandy because nothing before rd1 this year matter when discussing players?

Football doesn't work that way. Ross has even mentioned when making selections in rd2 that he leans towards experience so sounds like he has at least checked what players have been capable of throughout their careers.

Billings has gone to Sandy and played well above that level. He will likely need another game there. But once he is declared fit enough, what he has shown at AFL level previously is relevant when looking at whose position he could take in the side and which players he can be an improvement on.

King is one of the top key forwards in the comp and an integral part of our team. Billings is a safe vanilla flanker. He’s more heading the Toby McLean route.

 

[gringo2011]

Honestly baffles me that some are petitioning for guys that are in their first few years to be rested after 6 games lmao.

Did we just gloss over the point I made the other day that Ross gives the group 2 days off after each game, something most of the league doesn't do, and the fact that he preserves players like Ro who plays one of the more physical roles.

I mean honestly, talk about getting ahead of ourselves. Put the best and fittest side on the park each week and handle the challenges as they come. It's borderline arrogance to suggest we can just rest players who are playing well. Yep we'll just roll over the top of Port and whoever else we come up against no worries. 6 games and we're the best side on the planet. Crazy hahaha

Bontempelli didn't need to develop in the VFL, they pumped games into him and in his third season he had a flag and contributed heavily towards it.

 

[BrutThough]

I don’t know about that. Billings has averaged about 18 touches and 0.7 goals a game the last three seasons not withstanding the shortened game time in covid.

In all honesty he hasn’t been a mid-high level performer for the team for four seasons. His latest contract reflects his standing amongst his peers.

I do however hope that he can return to his 2019 form. But he will need to reinvent himself because he has become a bit of a nothing player the past few years. We are all hoping he thrives in a RTB system but it’s not a given. I reckon those three you mentioned have a specific role in the team.

His start of the 2021 season was better than most remember, before injuries took over. If he can return to that, our best 22 will be even better. He had 1 or 2 howlers that last, but his general form matches or beats what Byrnes has been putting out but the standard he is held too means we aren't impressed by that compared to when Byrnes does it.

If he can repeat what he did at Sandy over a full game, I think he comes in. With us struggling to convert inside 50s to score, his strengths can improve the 22 we are currently fielding.

 

[LuckyBounce!]

As long as we don’t kick 4.19 again or whatever it was last year against this mob!

 

[George]

Bontempelli didn't need to develop in the VFL, they pumped games into him and in his third season he had a flag and contributed heavily towards it.

But we're the best team of all-time so we can afford to give players time off during the season because it doesn't matter who replaces them as we'll win anyway. I have us going 22-1.

 

[Browny2Carlisle]

His start of the 2021 season was better than most remember, before injuries took over. If he can return to that, our best 22 will be even better. He had 1 or 2 howlers that last, but his general form matches or beats what Byrnes has been putting out but the standard he is held too means we aren't impressed by that compared to when Byrnes does it.

If he can repeat what he did at Sandy over a full game, I think he comes in. With us struggling to convert inside 50s to score, his strengths can improve the 22 we are currently fielding.

How does Billings lobbing a high kick to a pack of players help us convert inside 50s

 

[gringo2011]

His start of the 2021 season was better than most remember, before injuries took over. If he can return to that, our best 22 will be even better. He had 1 or 2 howlers that last, but his general form matches what Byrnes has been putting out but the standard he is held too means we aren't impressed by that compared to when Byrnes does it.

If he can repeat what he did at Sandy over a full game, I think he comes in. With us struggling to convert inside 50s to score, his strengths can improve the 22 we are currently fielding.

This is where I think that you are going wrong, Byrnes is playing role that not many have the physical capacity to play. Billings in a skills contest would blow Byrnes away but Byrnes is playing like a classic Ross Lyon type. Plays defence, midfield, wing and forward pocket in one player while pressuring everywhere. He's a pack mule on amphetamines.

Billings has always been a soft outside drifter who offers some silk if someone can win him the ball. He's never got many awards or accolades because he tends to need others to do the hard work for him and he'll finish off with polish....sometimes unreliably if in front of goal.

Billings is going to have to reinvent the way he goes about his footy and become an ultra accountable two way runner. His only other option is to get super fit and see if he can play the Hill type running high HF wing role. Ross valeus what players bring to the team more than he values individual talent IMO.

 

[triggering bro]

His start of the 2021 season was better than most remember, before injuries took over. If he can return to that, our best 22 will be even better. He had 1 or 2 howlers that last, but his general form matches or beats what Byrnes has been putting out but the standard he is held too means we aren't impressed by that compared to when Byrnes does it.

If he can repeat what he did at Sandy over a full game, I think he comes in. With us struggling to convert inside 50s to score, his strengths can improve the 22 we are currently fielding.

You have to admit though that Billings form has been trending backwards the last few years where as Byrnes is trending upwards averaging 20 touches this year.

I also think you’re not giving Byrnes enough credit. RTBs system, which is working to great effect, is built around players like Byrnes that can run 100m interval beep tests all day to support defence and attack. Without exaggerating Byrnes would be in the top dozen runners in the league.

I don’t think his spot is up for much debate TBH but I could be wrong. Billings probably more a chance to come in for Pou, Higgins or Owens if they cop an injury or drastic drop in form.

 

[Browny2Carlisle]

You have to admit though that Billings form has been trending backwards the last few years where as Byrnes is trending upwards averaging 20 touches this year.

I also think you’re not giving Byrnes enough credit. RTBs system, which is working to great effect, is built around players like Byrnes that can run 100m interval beep tests all day to support defence and attack. Without exaggerating Byrnes would be in the top dozen runners in the league.

I don’t think his spot is up for much debate TBH but I could be wrong. Billings probably more a chance to come in for Pou, Higgins or Owens if they cop an injury or drastic drop in form.

 

[my name was taken]

I dont even know what position Ross will have Billings play, let alone figure out who he will replace. My best guess earlier was Windhager only because he was the sub.

Billings played a good game at sandy, but so did Bytel (39 disposals, lead the match for both clubs for clearances) - does he immediately leapfrog Bytel? what message does that send?

Don't want him in the backline as they are a solid unit that shouldnt be fiddled with.
Pinch hit on the wing? Hill, Byrnes, Wood have played the role structurally sound, the structure really depends on their repeat running and transitioning at speed.

Forward - we wont sacrafice Pous height, leap, marking, pack crashing and ablility to nail long bomb shots which is a massive point of difference if we are struggling to get the ball deep i50 (not at least until King returns)
Smalls - Butler and Higgins pressure game is elite, gresh still up and about but a bit flaky for the time being.

 

[malevu]

Honestly baffles me that some are petitioning for guys that are in their first few years to be rested after 6 games lmao.

Did we just gloss over the point I made the other day that Ross gives the group 2 days off after each game, something most of the league doesn't do, and the fact that he preserves players like Ro who plays one of the more physical roles.

I mean honestly, talk about getting ahead of ourselves. Put the best and fittest side on the park each week and handle the challenges as they come. It's borderline arrogance to suggest we can just rest players who are playing well. Yep we'll just roll over the top of Port and whoever else we come up against no worries. 6 games and we're the best side on the planet. Crazy hahaha

Agree. If anyone needs a rest then surely the following week against North would make more sense than the Port game.

 

[BrutThough]

This is where I think that you are going wrong, Byrnes is playing role that not many have the physical capacity to play. Billings in a skills contest would blow Byrnes away but Byrnes is playing like a classic Ross Lyon type. Plays defence, midfield, wing and forward pocket in one player while pressuring everywhere. He's a pack mule on amphetamines.

Billings has always been a soft outside drifter who offers some silk if someone can win him the ball. He's never got many awards or accolades because he tends to need others to do the hard work for him and he'll finish off with polish....sometimes unreliably if in front of goal.

Billings is going to have to reinvent the way he goes about his footy and become an ultra accountable two way runner. His only other option is to get super fit and see if he can play the Hill type running high HF wing role. Ross valeus what players bring to the team more than he values individual talent IMO.

You have to admit though that Billings form has been trending backwards the last few years where as Byrnes is trending upwards averaging 20 touches this year.

I also think you’re not giving Byrnes enough credit. RTBs system, which is working to great effect, is built around players like Byrnes that can run 100m interval beep tests all day to support defence and attack. Without exaggerating Byrnes would be in the top dozen runners in the league.

I don’t think his spot is up for much debate TBH but I could be wrong. Billings probably more a chance to come in for Pou, Higgins or Owens if they cop an injury or drastic drop in form.

Byrnes has improved this year but I think his role is being overstated a lot. He's still a bottom 4-5 player in our 22. I dont think he is this irreplaceable, central figure to the side some are making him out to be.

 

[Mowman]

Agree. If anyone needs a rest then surely the following week against North would make more sense than the Port game.

We are one of the fittest hardest running sides in the league and no one looks gassed yet

 

[OxSaint]

You have to admit though that Billings form has been trending backwards the last few years where as Byrnes is trending upwards averaging 20 touches this year.

I also think you’re not giving Byrnes enough credit. RTBs system, which is working to great effect, is built around players like Byrnes that can run 100m interval beep tests all day to support defence and attack. Without exaggerating Byrnes would be in the top dozen runners in the league.

I don’t think his spot is up for much debate TBH but I could be wrong. Billings probably more a chance to come in for Pou, Higgins or Owens if they cop an injury or drastic drop in form.

I am not sure Billings even played a full game so he won’t be coming in.

3 goals is flattering on his performance. His direct opponent gifted him a in contested mark 25m out by badly mis reading the drop of the kick, Billings just stood there and it landed in is chest. Second was a mark on the lead on 50 followed by a 50m penalty. 3rd was a cracking snap over the head in heavy traffic.

While we are winning you would need to be making a mockery of the vfl to get a call up unless your surname is King.

 

[Ducky Tie]

Wood had an interesting insight into running patterns in his post game. He was talking about how the game has moved away from players being able to run for long periods of time at a steady pace, to players who can run fast bursts repeatedly throughout a game.

I suspect Byrnes suits that perfectly with his pace/endurance. He can get up and down the wing all day at high pace. Billings, while a great endurance runner, has never had that burst. He works very hard all game, but I'd be pretty surprised if they changed the current wing set up at any stage.

He seemed to play permanently forward for Sandy. I think that for him to crack into the team, it will have to be for a forward, rather than Byrnes.

Anyway, injuries will come most likely. He'll be on the fringe and probably one of the first in. It'll just be a matter of how he goes with that chance.

 

[sunny3193]

Gresham contract situation is interesting…I dare say he’s on big money..maybe too much, which means the club needs to make a call on whether to let him trigger his free agency!
Interested to hear your thoughts on this?

Based solely on the fact he leads the song after the game, providing the deal is reasonable then he will stay. Besides, the Club looks like being successful. Why leave?

 

[DougalHoward]

Byrnes has improved this year but I think his role is being overstated a lot. He's still a bottom 4-5 player in our 22. I dont think he is this irreplaceable, central figure to the side some are making him out to be.

Billings wouldn't be replacing him though I'd think we'd play him forward

 

[moirae42]

I am not sure Billings even played a full game so he won’t be coming in.

3 goals is flattering on his performance. His direct opponent gifted him a in contested mark 25m out by badly mis reading the drop of the kick, Billings just stood there and it landed in is chest. Second was a mark on the lead on 50 followed by a 50m penalty. 3rd was a cracking snap over the head in heavy traffic.

While we are winning you would need to be making a mockery of the vfl to get a call up unless your surname is King.

He was rested in the last quarter.

 

[DougalHoward]

Based solely on the fact he leads the song after the game, providing the deal is reasonable then he will stay. Besides, the Club looks like being successful. Why leave?

Wilkie will do it if Jade is not there

 

[triggering bro]

Byrnes has improved this year but I think his role is being overstated a lot. He's still a bottom 4-5 player in our 22. I dont think he is this irreplaceable, central figure to the side some are making him out to be.

Maybe. But his position is not under threat by Billings is my point. Different players and different roles. RTB loves keeping to his system.

Anyone have insight into whether Billings has been training with the midfielders or forwards?

 

[gringo2011]

Byrnes has improved this year but I think his role is being overstated a lot. He's still a bottom 4-5 player in our 22. I dont think he is this irreplaceable, central figure to the side some are making him out to be.

I think that he is hard to push out though. He's probably the only guy on the list that could do what he does. Depends how much Ross rates a role over talent I guess. What is allowing us to be a consistent formidable side is that everyone is playing a role. Does taking that Byrnes role out make us worse more than Billings extra talent improve us?

 

[Sippa]

I want Billings in the team but who do we drop? Don't want pou dropped, windy could have a few games at Sandy I suppose

I don’t want phillipou dropped either and he’s been good .. BUT.. If we were down the bottom I’d say absolutely we have to pump games into him but I think the fact we are having a crack up the top we need our absolute best side and on current output I think billings would do more .. phillipou will have a better career than billings has had no question but right now billings is the better player .. people forget how good he was on a wing when we were s**t .. up forward in this side I think he’s the class we need

I can’t see any other obvious choices .. Byrnes and butler have cemented their spots and Gresham has the runs on the board to be given a longer run

 

[DougalHoward]

Has billings shown he can play a hard running wing role?

 

[malevu]

You have to admit though that Billings form has been trending backwards the last few years where as Byrnes is trending upwards averaging 20 touches this year.

I also think you’re not giving Byrnes enough credit. RTBs system, which is working to great effect, is built around players like Byrnes that can run 100m interval beep tests all day to support defence and attack. Without exaggerating Byrnes would be in the top dozen runners in the league.

I don’t think his spot is up for much debate TBH but I could be wrong. Billings probably more a chance to come in for Pou, Higgins or Owens if they cop an injury or drastic drop in form.

You can't underestimate the importance of a full preseason followed by an injury free season. Billings has had neither for a good two years. It's like those judging Hunter Clark on his output in the last two years. It was ridiculous and he's on the way to proving that now. You can include Gresham and to a lesser extent Jones in that package.

The best recent example is Cripps. In 2021 he looked like a cripple and people were almost retiring him. The fully fit version won the 2022 Brownlow.

Trouble with Billings though is he's now 27 and he really needs to get fit and pull his finger out otherwise time will pass him by.

 

[BrutThough]

Billings wouldn't be replacing him though I'd think we'd play him forward

If he came in for Byrnes, you'd have Hill play primarily wing with JB playing forward with smaller stints on the wing.

Maybe. But his position is not under threat by Billings is my point. Different players and different roles. RTB loves keeping to his system.

Anyone have insight into whether Billings has been training with the midfielders or forwards?

If JB was to replace anyone over the next few weeks, I think it's more likely to be Pou.

He played mainly forward, small time on the wing in the pre season match sim.