Autopsy Round 9, 2024: Hawthorn v St.Kilda

[phantom13]

Now you are reminding me of George,
And its a bit harsh calling me a Dick , practice what you preach

Dont take that as an insult.

 

[CaptainRisky]

Dont take that as an insult.

Well you tell me i was being a Dick and then you do the same thing, I'm pretty sure Gringo would give me a serve if he thought I was being a Dick

Anywho ,, Move on

 

[DougalHoward]

He was never coming good , now your just going off on one of your weird tangents

I think he was delisted because he was out of contract, we had other players less deserving of a list spot but still contracted.

 

[gringo2011]

He was never coming good , now your just going off on one of your weird tangents

He was one of our better performers in the VFL in his final year.

 

[gringo2011]

I think he was delisted because he was out of contract, we had other players less deserving of a list spot but still contracted.

Fair bit of that around that time.

 

[jumperfan]

Man if AFL had relegation we would absolutely dominate the VFL.... Wouldn't we?

We'd be Oldham Athletic

 

[DougalHoward]

Fair bit of that around that time.

Although he is still playing SANFL and hasn't gotten picked up...

Oscar Clavarino Player Profile

Oscar Clavarino Player Profile

www.safc.com.au

 

[gringo2011]

Although he is still playing SANFL and hasn't gotten picked up...

Oscar Clavarino Player Profile

Oscar Clavarino Player Profile

www.safc.com.au

Not many get a second chance.

 

[DougalHoward]

Not many get a second chance.

Paul Hunter got a second chance

 

[Saints43]

Hill is the only player we've given up a lot for in recent years yet we've brought in many starting 22 players who have played better than you'd expect for what we gave up for them.

IN terms of who we let go, Bruce is probably the only player we let go recently for unders but there is also players like Long and Gresham who we got better than you'd expect returns for which evens it out.

It's not that drastic either way.

Also need to take into account that Hill is going to end up playing for us for about a decade as well.

 

[phantom13]

Well you tell me i was being a Dick and then you do the same thing, I'm pretty sure Gringo would give me a serve if he thought I was being a Dick

Anywho ,, Move on

Not sure how you point out someone is being a dick without saying dont be a dick.

In any event the whole "your off on your tangeants" thing was just unnecessary. Gring watches and knows alot more about most of our players than most and i think you can say this is wrong without making some critique of his posting and style.

Anyway, its done.

 

[BrutThough]

Also need to take into account that Hill is going to end up playing for us for about a decade as well.

His work off field helping the young indigenous players is also invaluable. And a big reason why Liam Henry chose us.

 

[PJays]

Brad Hill would need to play another 3 or 4 years and win a couple of B&Fs to convince me that was a good deal for St Kilda.

As it stands, he's been our highest paid player for 5 years but never finished top 5 in our B&F. That creates opportunity costs- his oversized salary could've been used to try and recruit others in subsequent years.

And we gave up Blake Acres

13

Blake Acres

Age

28

Ht

193cm

Wt

92kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

17.5

4star

K

8.9

3star

HB

8.6

5star

M

3.7

4star

T

3.2

5star

CL

1.9

4star

D

12.7

3star

K

5.0

2star

HB

7.7

4star

M

4.0

4star

T

2.7

4star

CL

1.0

3star

D

8.2

2star

K

3.8

2star

HB

4.4

4star

M

1.2

2star

T

2.4

4star

CL

1.8

4star

and a first round draft pick that became Kosi Pickett.

 

[Banger9798]

Brad Hill would need to play another 3 or 4 years and win a couple of B&Fs to convince me that was a good deal for St Kilda.

As it stands, he's been our highest paid player for 5 years but never finished top 5 in our B&F. That creates opportunity costs- his oversized salary could've been used to try and recruit others in subsequent years.

And we gave up Blake Acres and a first round draft pick that became Kosi Pickett.

Wasn't it Serong?

 

[Sully111]

Love Hilly

Glad he's at the club

Yes, we overpaid. But it is what it is.

 

[Sully111]

I'm much more interested in what is happening now, with the players we have.

Until we look like we're getting the best (or at least something like it) out of the group, I'm not that interested in who we lost or who we are going to bring in.

This list is capable of better. Right now, something is up. We look like a shambles. We do not look like a well coached footy team. That's what needs to be fixed.

I'll say it again... Ross is a great game day coach. But what that does is it hides our flaws. Last year we played some shockingly ugly football too.

Of course some of our issues are personnel, but there's no way this list needs to be playing this badly. We can't score ffs.

Right now, our coaches are failing us. They're failing the playing group.

If I hear Robert Harvey said Owens get's lost in the midfield one more time I'll f*cking scream.

Someone please lay Brendan Goddard's coaching resume out in front of me. I want to see it.

Either Lyon has lost it or he needs to take control and stop being mr inclusive.

 

[CaptainRisky]

Not sure how you point out someone is being a dick without saying dont be a dick.

In any event the whole "your off on your tangeants" thing was just unnecessary. Gring watches and knows alot more about most of our players than most and i think you can say this is wrong without making some critique of his posting and style.

Anyway, its done.

You have said the same thing in two messages, just give it a rest can you please
Yep it's done

 

[narch41]

Brad Hill would need to play another 3 or 4 years and win a couple of B&Fs to convince me that was a good deal for St Kilda.

To be fair, he will probably win it this year.

 

[PJays]

To be fair, he will probably win it this year.

I'd have Marshall and Steele ahead of him.

Probably NWM, Wilkie and Sinclair too.

 

[BrutThough]

I'd have Marshall and Steele ahead of him.

Probably NWM, Wilkie and Sinclair too.

Judging him very harshly if thats the case.

Hill has been fair more consistent than almost everyone you've listed while still having best on ground performances they've all had.

 

[CaptainRisky]

He was one of our better performers in the VFL in his final year.

And we have seen a million blokes who are just great VFL players and never make the step to AFL

 

[gringo2011]

I'd have Marshall and Steele ahead of him.

Probably NWM, Wilkie and Sinclair too.

He's having his best year for us. His first 2 seasons were below average, this year he's been consistently good and playing the role we thought he'd play as that roaming overlap runner.

 

[gringo2011]

And we have seen a million blokes who are just great VFL players and never make the step to AFL

Of course but he looked injury plagued and then we culled him as soon as he showed something. Our list management did a few of those weird moves then. Cut guys that we would have kept because we had contracts on players we knew wouldn't make it.

For a side that was about to lose Brown and Carlisle already beaten up it was weird. Third year second round pick tall defenders usually get longer. Especially since he was injured so much early then covid hit so he couldn't play VFL.

Howard probably cost him his spot I guess.

 

[Dr Spaceman]

Of course but he looked injury plagued and then we culled him as soon as he showed something. Our list management did a few of those weird moves then. Cut guys that we would have kept because we had contracts on players we knew wouldn't make it.

For a side that was about to lose Brown and Carlisle already beaten up it was weird. Third year second round pick tall defenders usually get longer. Especially since he was injured so much early then covid hit so he couldn't play VFL.

Howard probably cost him his spot I guess.

I was a big fan when he was drafted and was rapt when he got a debut.

BUT

To me he just never had that senior look about him. A few touches in the games he played, however seemed to lack urgency and any aggression. Yes that may have eventually come, however he didn’t really show it at VFL level if we’re being honest about it.

As usual it’s telling that no one else picked him up.

We probably got excited by pre draft talk along the lines of “if you can’t trade in Jake Lever then just draft Oscar Clavavino”.

As I said, big fan when we took him. But not surprised or disappointed when we delisted him.

 

[gringo2011]

I was a big fan when he was drafted and was rapt when he got a debut.

BUT

To me he just never had that senior look about him. A few touches in the games he played, however seemed to lack urgency and any aggression. Yes that may have eventually come, however he didn’t really show it at VFL level if we’re being honest about it.

As usual it’s telling that no one else picked him up.

We probably got excited by pre draft talk along the lines of “if you can’t trade in Jake Lever then just draft Oscar Clavavino”.

As I said, big fan when we took him. But not surprised or disappointed when we delisted him.

Not really surprised either, but he couldn't even get on the field much early on with injury and Covid. Must have been a good predictor because after 3 years his stats would have looked pretty similar to most KPBs. From memory we kept Irish over him because he was contracted and then pissed him off too.

He cost a second round pick and as a 2 meter tall skinny defender that was never coming on quickly it was a weird list management call.

Players very rarely get a second chance and if you weren't even established before getting the chop it's even less likely.

If we cull Keeler at the end of the year we won't know what we had because talls take time.