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Round ball code talk

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philreich said:
Did Stephen Trigg vote twice? :)
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GScirea said:
The draw is farcical and unjust.
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What do you mean it is unjust?? High ranked teams stuffed up in the group phase and so they therefore ****ed up their chances in the knock out phase and moved to the tougher part of the draw. England should have won their group and been in the Wales slot in the top half of the draw. Spain should have won their group and been in the Croatia slot in the top half of the draw but they ****ed up. Portugal should have won their group not finished 3rd behind Hungary and Iceland. There was nothing unjust about the inefficency and stupidity of the top teams who didn't deliver in the group phase so they paid the price. Belgium were higher ranked than Italy but didnt beat them in the group stage. If they lived up to their ranking Italy would have been in the top half not the bottom half of the knockout phase.

Before you call something unjust you should actually understand how the draw done months ago works.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UEFA_Euro_2016_knockout_phase

upload_2016-6-29_14-21-40.png
Format
In the knockout stage, extra time and a penalty shoot-out are used to decide the winner if necessary.[3] In the round of 16, the match-ups are to take place as follows:[3]
  • Match 1: Runner-up Group A v Runner-up Group C
  • Match 2: Winner Group D v 3rd Place Group B/E/F
  • Match 3: Winner Group B v 3rd Place Group A/C/D
  • Match 4: Winner Group F v Runner-up Group E
  • Match 5: Winner Group C v 3rd Place Group A/B/F
  • Match 6: Winner Group E v Runner-up Group D
  • Match 7: Winner Group A v 3rd Place Group C/D/E
  • Match 8: Runner-up Group B v Runner-up Group F
The quarter-final match-ups are:[3]
  • Quarter-final 1: Winner Match 1 v Winner Match 2
  • Quarter-final 2: Winner Match 3 v Winner Match 4
  • Quarter-final 3: Winner Match 5 v Winner Match 6
  • Quarter-final 4: Winner Match 7 v Winner Match 8
The semi-final match-ups are:[3]
  • Semi-final 1: Winner Quarter-final 1 v Winner Quarter-final 2
  • Semi-final 2: Winner Quarter-final 3 v Winner Quarter-final 4
 
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RussellEbertHandball said:
What do you mean it is unjust?? High ranked teams stuffed up in the group phase and so they therefore stuffed up their chances in the knock out phase and moved to the tougher part of the draw. England should have won their group and been in the Wales slot in the top half of the draw. Spain should have won their group and been in the Croatia slot in the top half of the draw but they stuffed up. Portugal should have won their group not finished 3rd behind Hungary and Iceland. There was nothing unjust about the inefficency and stupidity of the top teams who didn't deliver in the group phase so they paid the price. Belgium were higher ranked than Italy but didnt beat them in the group stage. If they lived up to their ranking Italy would have been in the top half not the bottom half of the knockout phase.

Before you call something unjust you should actually understand how the draw done months ago works.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UEFA_Euro_2016_knockout_phase

View attachment 261562
Format
In the knockout stage, extra time and a penalty shoot-out are used to decide the winner if necessary.[3] In the round of 16, the match-ups are to take place as follows:[3]
  • Match 1: Runner-up Group A v Runner-up Group C
  • Match 2: Winner Group D v 3rd Place Group B/E/F
  • Match 3: Winner Group B v 3rd Place Group A/C/D
  • Match 4: Winner Group F v Runner-up Group E
  • Match 5: Winner Group C v 3rd Place Group A/B/F
  • Match 6: Winner Group E v Runner-up Group D
  • Match 7: Winner Group A v 3rd Place Group C/D/E
  • Match 8: Runner-up Group B v Runner-up Group F
The quarter-final match-ups are:[3]
  • Quarter-final 1: Winner Match 1 v Winner Match 2
  • Quarter-final 2: Winner Match 3 v Winner Match 4
  • Quarter-final 3: Winner Match 5 v Winner Match 6
  • Quarter-final 4: Winner Match 7 v Winner Match 8
The semi-final match-ups are:[3]
  • Semi-final 1: Winner Quarter-final 1 v Winner Quarter-final 2
  • Semi-final 2: Winner Quarter-final 3 v Winner Quarter-final 4
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Yes, luck of the draw, blah yada blah yada.

RusselEbertHandball, whilst your posts are often well informed, your comment about ‘actually understanding the draw’ is fairly condescending and disparaging and in all probability linked to an assumption you’ve made. I understood the draw prior to your thoughtfully provided Wikipedia link. In my opinion (and sorry that I didn’t include this in my previous post), the draw is farcical and unjust because [only] two group winners were forced to play the 2nd placed teams (this was also unfair for the runner-ups of those particular groups)... Nothing to do with your link (which I was already aware of) OR the higher ranked teams stuffing up or the unbalanced knockout ‘sides/paths’. The same rule does not apply for all teams and it is therefore unjust, even if one considers it ‘luck of the draw’... That’s fine, many would be inclined to think that way BUT it means the draw is flawed and 'the luck' of the draw is skewed.

+(Additional irritation) Not finishing bottom (i.e. finishing 3rd in a 4 team group) should not be rewarded; I’m not a fan of the 24-team system because it is rewards mediocrity and due to the aforementioned *anomalies.

I’d be more than happy to elaborate.
 
GScirea said:
Yes, luck of the draw, blah yada blah yada.

RusselEbertHandball, whilst your posts are often well informed, your comment about ‘actually understanding the draw’ is fairly condescending and disparaging and in all probability linked to an assumption you’ve made. I understood the draw prior to your thoughtfully provided Wikipedia link. In my opinion (and sorry that I didn’t include this in my previous post), the draw is farcical and unjust because [only] two group winners were forced to play the 2nd placed teams (this was also unfair for the runner-ups of those particular groups)... Nothing to do with your link (which I was already aware of) OR the higher ranked teams stuffing up or the unbalanced knockout ‘sides/paths’. The same rule does not apply for all teams and it is therefore unjust, even if one considers it ‘luck of the draw’... That’s fine, many would be inclined to think that way BUT it means the draw is flawed and 'the luck' of the draw is skewed.

+(Additional irritation) Not finishing bottom (i.e. finishing 3rd in a 4 team group) should not be rewarded; I’m not a fan of the 24-team system because it is rewards mediocrity and due to the aforementioned *anomalies.

I’d be more than happy to elaborate.
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And your comment of farcical and unjust is silly and implys incompetence and corruption by the organizers. Did you think about that ie what those 2 words actually mean?

No draw is perfect when you are going from 24 to 16 and you have only 6 groups. Someone is going to get an easier draw than a couple of other teams. Big deal it happens all the time in sports. Plus I can only respond to what you put down in your post and not what you were thinking.

Is it unjust that 8 extra teams get to play at a Euro competition and you get an Iceland qualify for the first time and cause one of the great Cinderella sporting stories of the last 50 years? How is that farcical and unjust unless you are an Austrian and English supporter? You get a Wales qualifying for the first time and making it thru to the knockout phase. Albania, Northern Island and Slovakia also made the Euro's for the first time, but that's a bad thing according to you because it doesn't fit your simple 16 into 8 into 4 into 2 criteria.

The majority of the lopsidedness is because of incompetence of the top teams not delivering their best, not the incompetence of the organizers which is what you implied in your 6 word post. See it took you more than 6 words to explain what you meant, which I still disagree with, but 6 words leaves you very open to people thinking you have no idea what your are talking about. I might be well informed, but I'm not a mind reader.
 
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RussellEbertHandball said:
And you comment of farcical and unjust is silly and implys incompetence and corruption by the organizers. Did you think about that ie what those 2 words actually mean?

No draw is perfect when you are going from 24 to 16 and you have only 6 groups. Someone is going to get an easier draw than a couple of other teams. Big deal it happens all the time in sports. Plus I can only respond to what you put down in your post and not what you were thinking.

Is it unjust that 8 extra teams get to play at a Euro competition and you get an Iceland qualify for the first time and cause one of the great Cinderella sporting stories of the last 50 years? How is that farcical and unjust unless you are an Austrian and English supporter? You get a Wales qualifying for the first time and making it thru to the knockout phase. Albania, Northern Island and Slovakia also made the Euro's for the first time, but that's a bad thing according to you because it doesn't fit your simple 16 into 8 into 4 into 2 criteria.

The majority of the lopsidedness is because of incompetence of the top teams not delivering their best, not the incompetence of the organizers which is what you implied in your 6 word post. See it took you more than 6 words to explain what you meant, which I still disagree with, but 6 words leaves you very open to people thinking you have no idea what your are talking about. I might be well informed, but I'm not a mind reader.
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You continue to write condescending and disparaging comments. I will respond when I have recovered from the shock of your discourteousness.
 
RussellEbertHandball said:
And your comment of farcical and unjust is silly and implys incompetence and corruption by the organizers. Did you think about that ie what those 2 words actually mean?

No draw is perfect when you are going from 24 to 16 and you have only 6 groups. Someone is going to get an easier draw than a couple of other teams. Big deal it happens all the time in sports. Plus I can only respond to what you put down in your post and not what you were thinking.

Is it unjust that 8 extra teams get to play at a Euro competition and you get an Iceland qualify for the first time and cause one of the great Cinderella sporting stories of the last 50 years? How is that farcical and unjust unless you are an Austrian and English supporter? You get a Wales qualifying for the first time and making it thru to the knockout phase. Albania, Northern Island and Slovakia also made the Euro's for the first time, but that's a bad thing according to you because it doesn't fit your simple 16 into 8 into 4 into 2 criteria.

The majority of the lopsidedness is because of incompetence of the top teams not delivering their best, not the incompetence of the organizers which is what you implied in your 6 word post. See it took you more than 6 words to explain what you meant, which I still disagree with, but 6 words leaves you very open to people thinking you have no idea what your are talking about. I might be well informed, but I'm not a mind reader.
Click to expand...
RussellEbertHandball said:
And your comment of farcical and unjust is silly and implys incompetence and corruption by the organizers. Did you think about that ie what those 2 words actually mean?

No draw is perfect when you are going from 24 to 16 and you have only 6 groups. Someone is going to get an easier draw than a couple of other teams. Big deal it happens all the time in sports. Plus I can only respond to what you put down in your post and not what you were thinking.

Is it unjust that 8 extra teams get to play at a Euro competition and you get an Iceland qualify for the first time and cause one of the great Cinderella sporting stories of the last 50 years? How is that farcical and unjust unless you are an Austrian and English supporter? You get a Wales qualifying for the first time and making it thru to the knockout phase. Albania, Northern Island and Slovakia also made the Euro's for the first time, but that's a bad thing according to you because it doesn't fit your simple 16 into 8 into 4 into 2 criteria.

The majority of the lopsidedness is because of incompetence of the top teams not delivering their best, not the incompetence of the organizers which is what you implied in your 6 word post. See it took you more than 6 words to explain what you meant, which I still disagree with, but 6 words leaves you very open to people thinking you have no idea what your are talking about. I might be well informed, but I'm not a mind reader.
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I stated that I would respond when I had recovered from the shock of your discourteousness. Whilst I haven’t completely recovered thus far, my psychiatrists said it would be best for me to respond before the arrival of Maitreya. One morning, as I was woke up from the anxious dreams that I have been constantly experiencing since your discourteous comments, I discovered that I had been changed into a monstrous verminous bug. I lay on my armour-hard back and saw, as I lifted my head up a little, my brown, arched abdomen divided up into rigid bow-like sections. My numerous legs, pitifully thin in comparison to the rest of my circumference, flickered helplessly before my eyes. ‘What’s happened to me,’ I thought. It was no dream… My transformed physique and this endless area of total blackness within my psyche is just a stage for the fight against discourtesy.
Once you have conquered the discourtesy from your soul you'll find a bonfire of love and Darkstalker Kaathe will appear, as long as you haven't placed the Lordvessel yet. This is when you will truly understand justice.


Just like the X-Man said, I'm for truth, no matter who tells it. I'm for justice, no matter who it's for or against. I spoke to Al-Khalil ibn Ahmad al-Farahidi who wrote a book on cryptography titled the "Book of Cryptographic Messages". I showed him your discourteous response – he was somewhat confused. He looked me in the eyes balls and then kissed them, he then said ‘whilst, your initial simplistic message was somewhat exaggerated due to the theatrical use of the word ‘farcical’ - the other man chose to ignore the most important point of your follow-up message, in fact he chose to concentrate on your supplementary afterthought/opinion instead of focusing on your main argument in a logical manner. All he said regarding your key point about the draw being unjust was - Someone is going to get an easier draw than a couple of other teams. Big deal it happens all the time in sports. That is not a good argumentent.’


Al-Khalil ibn Ahmad al-Farahidi went on to say, ‘In addition to this, if the man thought so little of your initial message why did he feel the need to reply?’ I told to Al-Khalil ibn Ahmad al-Farahidi who wrote a book on cryptography titled the "Book of Cryptographic Messages", that the man is a nice person and was most likely a great teacher, like Aristotle or Maria Montessori and was probably trying to educate me, as he believed that I had no idea what I was talking about. Which is fair enough, because I used the word farcical, which was admittedly a bit melodramatic, and I didn't supply a thesis with my initial 6-word comment.


So here is my thesis:

When my brother Jem was almost 13 he broke his arm, badly. Even though it healed, we always talked about what really caused the accident. I said the Ewells, but he said Dill and Boo Radley started it. But then he said if our ancestors, the Finches had never moved to Alabama, then none of this would have happened, and the rest is history.

We’re southerners. We think it’s a big deal who your family is, where you’ve come from, and what you’re known for. Our ancestor, Simon Finch, was a stingy and religious man. He saved up all his money to buy up Finch’s Landing, and for generations that’s where our family has lived. My Aunt Alexandra still lives here now with her quiet husband. My father Atticus Finch, went to Montgomery, Alabama to study law, and his brother Jack went to Boston to study to be a doctor. My father moved back to Maycomb once he finished law school.


Maycomb was a tired, old town back in those days. People moved slowly, ambling across the town square. Days seemed long, especially on hot summer days. People didn’t hurry, because there was nowhere to go, nothing to buy, no money to buy it with, and nothing to see.

We lived on the main street, Atticus, Jem, and I. Our father played with us, read to us, and treated us fine. We had a cook too, Calpurnia. She was strict with me. She always asked me why I didn’t behave as well as Jem. But he was older anyhow. She always won our battles; my father always took her side. Our mother died of a heart attack when I was two so I didn’t remember her. Jem seemed to miss her though.

One day during the summer when I was six and Jem was nine, we were playing in our neighborhood as usual. We heard something in Miss Rachel’s garden. We found a boy sitting looking at us.

He said, “I’m Charles Baker Harris. I can read.”

“So what?” I said.

Jem wanted to get a better look at him so he said, “Why don’t you come over, Charles Baker Harris.”

“Folks call me Dill, “ he said, struggling to fit under the fence. Dill told us he was from Mississippi, but was spending the summer with his aunt Rachel. He had seen a bunch of movies, so he described them to us, and we spent the next days acting them out. He was very creative, and always had good ideas. We eventually got tired of recreating Dracula and other stories. That’s when Dill’s fascination with the Radley house began.

The Radley house had sagging shingles, and a drooping porch. The grass was too high and the paint had turned gray and dingy. Even in the long, hot summer, the doors were shut up tight. There was a rumor that it was haunted. People said “Boo” Radley went out at night and peeped in people’s windows. That he breathed on flowers and they froze instantly. They said he committed little crimes in the night but not one ever saw him.

The history of the story is that Arthur, “Boo”, got into a bad crowd in high school. They swore, fought, and got into real trouble when they locked a court officer in the outhouse (bathroom). Boo’s father was so strict that the judge let him take Boo home, and no one had seen him since. Years later, the story goes, Boo was making a scrapbook out of articles from the Maycomb Tribune when he stabbed his father with a pair of scissors, and kept right on cutting.

Mr. Radley was not a nice man. He went to town each day but never spoke to us even if we said “Good Morning, Sir.”

When he died, Calpurnia said, “There goes the meanest man God ever blew breath into.” The neighborhood thought maybe Boo would come out, but his older brother Nathan moved in and he was just as mean. Atticus didn’t like us to talk about the Radleys much, but the more we told Dill about the Radleys, the more he wanted to know. He would stand there hugging the light pole.

“Wonder what he does in there,” he would murmur. “Wonder what he looks like?”

Jem said Boo was six and a half feet tall, ate squirrels and cats, his teeth were yellow, and he drooled most of the time.

“Let’s try to make him come out,” said Dill. Dill bet Jem to go up and knock on the door. Jem thought about it for three days.

“You’re scared,” Dill said.

“Ain’t scared, just trying to be respectful,” Jem said.

Three days later, after Dill had taunted him and called him scared repeatedly, Jem finally gave in. He walked slowly to the Radley yard, threw open the gate, sped to the house, slapped it with his hand, and sprinted back to us. When we were safe on our porch, we looked back at the old, droopy house. We thought we saw a slight movement inside.


I was really looking forward to starting school. I was going into the first grade. Finally! Atticus made Jem take me to school on the first day. I think Atticus even gave him some money as a bribe to let me tag along because I heard a jingle in Jem’s pocketson the way. Jem told me that during school I wasn’t supposed to bother him. We couldn’t play together because it would embarrass him since he was in fifth grade.

My teacher’s name was Miss Caroline Fisher. She was twenty-one years old and very pretty. She had bright auburn hair, pink cheeks, and wore crimson fingernail polish. Miss Caroline was from Winston County, which is in northern Alabama. She read us a story about cats on the first day. The cats had long conversations with one another, they wore cunning little clothes and lived in a warm house beneath a kitchen stove. By the time Mrs. Cat called the drugstore for an order of chocolate malted mice the class was wriggling in their seats. They thought this story was too immature for them. My classmates and I were very mature in a way because, even though they are young, they have had to chop cotton and feed hogs since they were very little.

Miss Caroline Fisher found out that I could already read, and this upset her. She wanted to teach me to read herself, I guess, and I think it disappointed her that I already knew how. So she got made at me!! How ridiculous! She told me that my father, Atticus, should not teach me anymore because he would do it all wrong. But I told her that he didn’t teach me! So Miss Caroline said, “Let’s not let our imaginations run away with us, dear. Now you tell your father not to teach you any more. It’s best to begin reading with a fresh mind. You tell him I’ll take over from here and try to undo the damage. Your father does not know how to teach.”

I guess I picked up reading from sitting in my father’s lap each night while he read the newspaper out loud and followed along underneath the words with his finger. Miss Caroline also got made at me for knowing how to write!! Calpurnia was to blame for that!! On rainy days she would have me sit and copy out a chapter of the Bible.


When lunchtime rolled around on ten first day of school, Miss Caroline noticed that Walter Cunningham had no lunch. She tried to loan him a quarter to buy lunch, but he was very embarrassed and kept saying no. The class expected ME to explain the situation to Miss Caroline, so I did. When I stood up, she asked, “What is it, Jean Louise?”

I replied, “Miss Caroline, he’s a Cunningham.”

But she didn’t understand what I meant. What I was trying to tell her was that the Cunninghams were very poor farmers, but they never took charity. They never took anything that they couldn’t pay back. And since Walter couldn’t pay Miss Caroline back, he wouldn’t take her money.

I remember one time when Atticus did some legal work for Walter Cunningham’s father, whose name is also Walter. Mr. Cunningham paid my father back not with money, but with a load of wood and a sack of hickory nuts.

Miss Caroline didn’t understand me though. She thought I was being rude and making jokes. So she told me to hold out my hand. I thought she was going to spit in my hand because in Maycomb, kids spit in each other’s hands to seal a promise. But instead she patted my hand twelve times with a ruler. All of the kids started laughing when they realized that Miss Caroline thought she was “whipping” me. Most kids were used to being REALLY whipped if they got in trouble, not patted lightly with a ruler! She sent me to the corner until the bell rang for lunch.

As I left I saw Miss Caroline bury her head in her arms because she was having a hard first day. She doesn’t understand the way we do things here in Maycomb, and she doesn’t understand how poor some of the kids are. I would have felt sorry for her if she had not been so mean to me!! She was a pretty little thing and she said: "The draw is farcical and unjust because [only] two group winners were forced to play the 2nd placed teams (this was also unfair for the runner-ups of those particular groups)... The same rule does not apply for all teams and it is therefore unjust, even if one considers it ‘luck of the draw’... That’s fine, many would be inclined to think that way BUT it means the draw is flawed and 'the luck' of the draw is skewed."
 

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United dumped on their backside by Qld state league club Redlands Utd in the FFA Cup

Embarrassing result, but Utd have no team
 
Matildas knocked out in a penalty shoot-out. They had multiple chances to make it to the medal round. First was when they led 6-0 after 65 minutes against Zimbabwe and one more goal would have put them on the easy side of the draw. They won 6-1 and faced Brazil in the quarters.
Second was when they hit the post in the 90th minute with scores tied.
Third was when they were tied 4-4 on spotkicks but Brazil had taken 5 and missed one, Australia had only taken 4. The referee was allowing more than a bit of encroachment here by the Brazilian goalkeeper but the penalty should still have been scored. The Brazilian goalkeeper had committed so much to the right that a goal should have been easy but Gorrie tried to blast it.
It's like Hawthorn winning three games in a row by three points. The better teams seem to find a way to win, even if they don't seem to be outplayed for most of the game.
 
mic59 said:
Matildas knocked out in a penalty shoot-out. They had multiple chances to make it to the medal round. First was when they led 6-0 after 65 minutes against Zimbabwe and one more goal would have put them on the easy side of the draw. They won 6-1 and faced Brazil in the quarters.
Second was when they hit the post in the 90th minute with scores tied.
Third was when they were tied 4-4 on spotkicks but Brazil had taken 5 and missed one, Australia had only taken 4. The referee was allowing more than a bit of encroachment here by the Brazilian goalkeeper but the penalty should still have been scored. The Brazilian goalkeeper had committed so much to the right that a goal should have been easy but Gorrie tried to blast it.
It's like Hawthorn winning three games in a row by three points. The better teams seem to find a way to win, even if they don't seem to be outplayed for most of the game.
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Yep they had their chances but given how much soccer means to Brazil I wasn't too cut up about it.
Insane atmosphere. See ya this arvo m8 ;)
 
After Newcastle's first relegation in the history of the Premier League only lasted one season in the Championship, it is starting to look like their second relegation may go the same way. After finishing 18th in the EPL and losing their first two games in the Championship 1-0 to Fulham(6th) and 2-1 to Huddersfield(1st) they have won five games out of five with a goal difference of 15-1.
 

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