Autopsy Saints v Dees

[Captain Paddy]

Perhaps something to do with the fact that we were led to believe that we'll be challenging the best sides this year, just lost to a team predicted to be bottom 4, we currently look and perform no better than sides under Ratten & Richo after completely overhauling all aspects of the foorball dept and going on a massive recruiting drive.

If you listened to anyone inside the tent and not the media, you would know that this is a 3-4+ year plan.

It's laying the foundations, bringing together a core group and moulding them together so that over the next 3-10+ years we can keep adding to it as we go, not spike for 2-3 years and then spend another 15 years between 10th and 18th.

Is the plan for 2026 to at least win a final? Yes

Should we be disappointed in not winning at least one of the matches so far? Yes

Should we have won both matches? Probably

Is the sky falling? No.

 

[mighty_sainters]

Wouldn’t mind some calming words from tony74.

 

[Saintos The ITK]

Can we get next weeks thread up. I’m keen to watch the ins and outs discussion. I’m fairly confident we’ll win for what it’s worth.

 

[Speck]

The way we have played the last two weeks, trying to take the game on at every opportunity, is quite a clear change from the majority of last year. Too often last year we'd get stuck coming out of defence. Having not talls down the line didn't help that too.

In past years under Lyon, I feel like we would have shut up shop and flooded the backline to stem the flow. It was interesting that we never tried to do that and kept going with the crazy attacking plan.

This left our defence very vulnerable, and mistakes become way more costly when you have a back 6 rather than a back 10 like we used to have, plus no midfield pressure on the ball coming in.

I genuinely think they're trying something different to kick a winning score compared to previous years, but it is failing miserably right now.

 

[kernelT]

If you listened to anyone inside the tent and not the media, you would know that this is a 3-4+ year plan.

It's laying the foundations, bringing together a core group and moulding them together so that over the next 3-10+ years we can keep adding to it as we go, not spike for 2-3 years and then spend another 15 years between 10th and 18th.

Is the plan for 2026 to at least win a final? Yes

Should we be disappointed in not winning at least one of the matches so far? Yes

Should we have won both matches? Probably

Is the sky falling? No.

3-4+ now? The never-ending expanse of excuses, gotta love it.

Better lock in rosco till 2030+

 

[StCicatriz]

Explains why he ran out of gas

St Kilda star Tom De Koning was put through a last-minute fitness test before the loss to Melbourne on Sunday after battling a virus late last week.
The Herald Sun can reveal the Saints were unsure he was going to play until about one hour before the game started after battling flu-like symptoms on Friday and Saturday.
The Saints’ ruckman failed to complete training on Friday and was sent home from Moorabbin in a bid to recover in time for the clash against Melbourne at the MCG.

thats explains it.

we didnt really have another option to bring in either. a partially fit TDK is better than keeler and dodson combined.

 

[StCicatriz]

There’s no way he’s on a million a year. More likely a million dollars for both seasons, which Tom took to mean a million for each.

correct i suspect there a bunch of pay it fwd going on too

 

[gringo2011]

Sure, but fixing "conversion" is not so simple. It is coming from pure panic and lack of composure. We do not have the list profile to handle the pressure that is being applied externally and internally "be the best saints ever". I see what they are trying, but it is not working.

If 66 weren't the best saints ever, then 09-10 were and if this current mob is trying to claim to pass: Roo, Lenny, Dal, Joey, BJ, Fisher, Gram, Milne, Ball and Gilbert... well, think again.

Ross loves relying on stats to say how much we were in it, and how close it was. The facts are Melbourne are ain full rebuild, have a pretty average list and blokes like 33yo Miochek made us look 3rd rate.

I am glad he backed Caminiti in, I'm sure he will feel warm and fuzzy but after the 3rd goal, you shift. Teach him during training, not in games we need to win. IDGAF what he did on him in the 2nd half, the damage was well and truly done.

Carrol/Box/Keeler (does he know how tall he is??) McRae OUT
Stocker (has a damn crack whihc is what we need), Banfield, hunter and Ro in

and pray.

I'm down on them as **** but Melbourne is not in full rebuild and have kept adding quality to their list since the flag. They have moved on some of the more negative forces in the club and are now playing a lot of the players who have been developed.

Their list is probably better on paper as far as age profiles go. We are very old and very young with that Battle and Long generation gone and replaced by ring ins. We need organic growth and a few to be stars beyond their age and luck to be a very good side. We have a couple of guns and some good older talent then a pool of kids and journeymen.

 

[gringo2011]

How many wins makes finals this year?

Ive just done OUR predictor for the year (yeh yeh im getting ahead of myself, whatever it took 2 minutes) and have us on 12 wins and i wasnt being uber conservative (ive got us beating Carlton twice which on current form is a coin toss).

Probably 10 to 13 IMO. The top 10 should allow a couple of sides to scrape in a bit under the usual amount and a very even competition should share wins around.

 

[Saintos The ITK]

If we play Hally as that link up mid/high fwd we’ll kill it. He’s like a half back in that his ball distribution is elite. Scans and Picks out his player in an instant and bullets the pass to them. None of this long bomb shit.
If worse comes to worse he just kicks it himself and can kick a decent long range goal. Maxy is the player with ball in hand I’d trust with my left nut.
In Maxy we trust.

 

[SaintersUnite]

Bloody hell I couldn’t get past the first four pages of this thread, the overreacting is nuts.

Am I worried? Absolutely. But we’ve lost two games by two goals, and the things to fix are obvious. Simple dropped marks and set shot misses have killed us in both matches.

 

[PJays]

This is true.
I just don’t thinking quoting what happened in 1996! Is at all relevant.

It's relevant and interesting, but in the broad sense that, albeit a smallish sample size it demonstrates the chaotic, unpredictable nature of the early stages of the season, and that most teams nab an early win relatively quickly before things settle.

 

[Donflicted]

My misses is a Saints supporter so i tend to watch your games and have a soft spot got loads of players i like especially the flying Viking

While disappointing its two games in the season and you have guys that have never shared a footy field together give it a little bit it will gel once it does you will improve

 

[jwikked]

and the things to fix are obvious. Simple dropped marks and set shot misses have killed us

Yeah, which has been the case for over a decade.

That’s why there’s a level of frustration. Another year, same shit

 

[ThomasR]

Stat of the day:

Inside 50s tackles:

v Collingwood: 25
v Melbourne: 2

in isolation it doesn't make for good reading, but it's also worth noting Collingwood laid 18 D50 tackles compared to Melbourne's 4, so the nature of the two games was very different. the ball was on the deck and in dispute a lot more in the Pies game, likely as a result of us bombing it long for contest and chaos

vs Collingwood - 63 entries for 6 marks and 21 scoring shots
vs Melbourne - 53 entries for 20 marks and 32 scoring shots

I would take the second stat line every day of the week - provided we can stop it from going back the other way

forward efficiency was said to be a focus after torching so many opportunities the week before, and it's positive that the players were able to respond. perhaps it exposed us on turnover and we are still finding the right balance. not dropping simple marks and kicking straight would help too

 

[gringo2011]

Surely you give posters more credit than that! I am disappointed with his lack of transparency and honesty over more recent times. What does it hurt to say Nas has been restricted if that's the case.

He never wants to answer the obvious questions re his decisions - like not tagging Daicos the week before. The members and supporters deserve more than the drivel he has been trotting out.

Its like he will do any and everything to not answer a question and it's making him look like an absolute flog.

I don't really consume much footy media except for listening to SEN and often don't watch the pressers. You get more on here than from either.

 

[Saintos The ITK]

So tdk had the remnants of a virus on Sunday. He did well.

 

[Hayes4PM]

Explains why he ran out of gas

St Kilda star Tom De Koning was put through a last-minute fitness test before the loss to Melbourne on Sunday after battling a virus late last week.
The Herald Sun can reveal the Saints were unsure he was going to play until about one hour before the game started after battling flu-like symptoms on Friday and Saturday.
The Saints’ ruckman failed to complete training on Friday and was sent home from Moorabbin in a bid to recover in time for the clash against Melbourne at the MCG.

Hmmmm maybe, or, we tell the media our star ruckman was ill after he got pantsed by a 35 year old in running and work rate.

I sure as **** hope he actually was ill…

 

[Mowman]

There’s no way he’s on a million a year. More likely a million dollars for both seasons, which Tom took to mean a million for each.

Morris understands that fellow youngster Mattaes Phillipou is also set to earn big bucks in the red, white and black, with his new deal set to earn him around $1 million a year.
Phillipou inked his new deal last August, and as he was already contracted until 2026, the contract with improved money was tabled for 2027 and 2028.
Morris questioned whether Phillipou had done enough to earn such a deal, even if St Kilda were wary of another young player performing so well in a contract year like Wanganeen-Milera, who they ultimately had to pay full freight for.
“I’ll leave you with this, Matteas Philippou re-signed halfway through last year, a two-year extension for 2027 and 2028,” Morris said on SEN Breakfast.

 

[Nomis2933]

Who gave Steele the coaches vote???? Surely that was a King backhander. By his own admission Steele said he could have been better. Surprised they didnt squeeze Viney in there too.

 

[gringo2011]

If we play Hally as that link up mid/high fwd we’ll kill it. He’s like a half back in that his ball distribution is elite. Scans and Picks out his player in an instant and bullets the pass to them. None of this long bomb shit.
If worse comes to worse he just kicks it himself and can kick a decent long range goal. Maxy is the player with ball in hand I’d trust with my left nut.
In Maxy we trust.

He's my favourite player these days. The Montrose Mauler just gets it done, he's an absolute weapon.

 

[sauce_head]

thats explains it.

we didnt really have another option to bring in either. a partially fit TDK is better than keeler and dodson combined.

Bloody hell. And he gave it to everybody except Hall!

(Sorry not fun I know but I could not resist)

 

[sauce_head]

Morris understands that fellow youngster Mattaes Phillipou is also set to earn big bucks in the red, white and black, with his new deal set to earn him around $1 million a year.
Phillipou inked his new deal last August, and as he was already contracted until 2026, the contract with improved money was tabled for 2027 and 2028.
Morris questioned whether Phillipou had done enough to earn such a deal, even if St Kilda were wary of another young player performing so well in a contract year like Wanganeen-Milera, who they ultimately had to pay full freight for.
“I’ll leave you with this, Matteas Philippou re-signed halfway through last year, a two-year extension for 2027 and 2028,” Morris said on SEN Breakfast.

“I’ll leave you with this. Nobody knows if NAS has resigned or not and if they do they are lying”.

Seconds later it’s broken by Toomey after being told earlier by NAS.

Tom Morris is such a try hard geek.

 

[Diehard Saint]

Perhaps something to do with the fact that we were led to believe that we'll be challenging the best sides this year, just lost to a team predicted to be bottom 4, we currently look and perform no better than sides under Ratten & Richo after completely overhauling all aspects of the foorball dept and going on a massive recruiting drive.

It’s what we do.
Last year beat one of the grand finalists….and lost to the wooden spooner

 

[Diehard Saint]

I'm down on them as **** but Melbourne is not in full rebuild and have kept adding quality to their list since the flag. They have moved on some of the more negative forces in the club and are now playing a lot of the players who have been developed.

Their list is probably better on paper as far as age profiles go. We are very old and very young with that Battle and Long generation gone and replaced by ring ins. We need organic growth and a few to be stars beyond their age and luck to be a very good side. We have a couple of guns and some good older talent then a pool of kids and journeymen.

Did everyone forget how crap we were against the Dees for the first three quarters of THAT game?